Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

 

 

NO, wait a month, then everyone will be talking about how we need more P2P games and less B2P with cash shop MMOs. GW2 is new, wait till the honeymoon is over, probably a few days after the launch of MoP. 

Originally posted by Eletheryl

Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

 

 

NO, wait a month, then everyone will be talking about how we need more P2P games and less B2P with cash shop MMOs. GW2 is new, wait till the honeymoon is over, probably a few days after the launch of MoP. 

LO L @ MoP. I am sure all the 12 year old girls wil want to go make a cutesy lil panda... with a pink hair ribbon ROFLMAO. That has to be one of the dumbest ideas anyone ever had

Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

 

 

I doubt it. As time goes by, people will start to see the flaws of GW2 more clearly. 

GW2 is a good game, but it's lacking in some things that P2P games have that's important to some, if not, many people.

1. A community. I've asked for help countless times through /map in PvE and WvWvW and have been greeted with only silence.  I've encouraged communication, made suggestions in WvWvW, and still silence, while people are being dumb using no tactics and just wasting time and feeding the enemy realms glory. I'm on Jade Quarry, so maybe it's just my server. 

2. Lack of progression. Some people, like myself, LOVE progression. The journey is more fun than the destination, and growing more powerful, and learning new abilities is what drives us. Since leveling is autoscaled to content, you never feel more powerful, so the drive to earn a new level isn't there nearly as much as in other MMO's. All core abilities are learned by lvl 7, and in normal zerg event play, and hearts play, you don't need to use most of the core abilities you have. Seems like dungeons is the only real way to test yourself. PvP is a zergfest. The side with more aoe, ranged, and numbers will win. HoD server, especially the guild DIE from that server seems to understand how to transcend that.

3. Lack of endgame. I'm not bothered by this, but some people may be. I'm content with exploration dungeons and WvWvW, but others like progression raids, and new raid releases every so many months. Repeating exploration dungeons may not be something they want to do, maybe they want new scenery at lvl 80, something they haven't done while leveling up.

These are just some points I've seen brought up in forums, or have experienced myself. So while GW2 remains a good game and will entertain for a while, I doubt it'll hold anyones attention for years like old MMORPG's did. Thus, game hopping will ressume, and developers will get away with charging a monthly fee.

MMO price's should've drop'ed from the $15 a month by now anyways,

even signing extended plans only saves a couple bucks.

I'd like to play multible MMO's having fun exploring all the world's and

different class playstyle's but I can't afford it, so I pick one  and try and stick it out.

Depending on how good G2 is in long run, I may not have to pay a sub for a while,

till expansion which I assume will be sooner than later from the normal

MMO release of new content. Then they'll get a few bucks here and there

Originally posted by Lorkii

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Lorkii

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by zellmer

Are GW2 players in denial with all its massive problems and the giant # of people speaking out against the horrendous/worthless end game..?

 

 

 Are you kidding me?

 

 

Massive problems? Giant number speaking out? What is a giant number to you? Obviously your idea of a giant number is not the same as mine, but then again haters look for anything to try and pounce on. Logic and reason never coming into the equation.

There are alot leaving to come back later. My guild was 200+ active first few days, now it s 2-3 lol. It really is a game of cya in 2-3 months. That will not help community down the road. My guild isn t the only one, I ve heard numerous people claim this.

 I hear people claim things all the time. People are notorious for lying and making up facts as needed. Not really reliable sources in general.

Goes both ways, jusy going on what I see and read/hear in game. it s not all rosey,

 But I am not making claims. I am not saying the game is without and issues and all is rosey. You can make any claim you want, the current server stats say you are in the minority or your guild is anyway.

Originally posted by Lorkii
Heres a thought, maybe you re in a guild that actually likes GW2. Many people obviously don t as my guild proves. Before you say, you re just saying that, I guess I could say the same. The game is healthy, I still say, it will have many many people leave for months at a time.

 Yet many more obviously are enjoying the game. All MMos have people leave. No game has 100% retention.

Your posts have never seemed to be on the side of liking this game anyway. If you go in negatively you tend to come out that way.

Originally posted by Eletheryl

Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

 

 

NO, wait a month, then everyone will be talking about how we need more P2P games and less B2P with cash shop MMOs. GW2 is new, wait till the honeymoon is over, probably a few days after the launch of MoP. 

 Personally I like the P2P method as it keeps certain people out for the most part. That said and personal preference aside cash shop is the way to go financially for MMOs. Saying in a month we will hear what you claim has ZERO chance of happening.

Originally posted by nate1980

Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

 

 

I doubt it. As time goes by, people will start to see the flaws of GW2 more clearly. 

GW2 is a good game, but it's lacking in some things that P2P games have that's important to some, if not, many people.

1. A community. I've asked for help countless times through /map in PvE and WvWvW and have been greeted with only silence.  I've encouraged communication, made suggestions in WvWvW, and still silence, while people are being dumb using no tactics and just wasting time and feeding the enemy realms glory. I'm on Jade Quarry, so maybe it's just my server. 

2. Lack of progression. Some people, like myself, LOVE progression. The journey is more fun than the destination, and growing more powerful, and learning new abilities is what drives us. Since leveling is autoscaled to content, you never feel more powerful, so the drive to earn a new level isn't there nearly as much as in other MMO's. All core abilities are learned by lvl 7, and in normal zerg event play, and hearts play, you don't need to use most of the core abilities you have. Seems like dungeons is the only real way to test yourself. PvP is a zergfest. The side with more aoe, ranged, and numbers will win. HoD server, especially the guild DIE from that server seems to understand how to transcend that.

3. Lack of endgame. I'm not bothered by this, but some people may be. I'm content with exploration dungeons and WvWvW, but others like progression raids, and new raid releases every so many months. Repeating exploration dungeons may not be something they want to do, maybe they want new scenery at lvl 80, something they haven't done while leveling up.

These are just some points I've seen brought up in forums, or have experienced myself. So while GW2 remains a good game and will entertain for a while, I doubt it'll hold anyones attention for years like old MMORPG's did. Thus, game hopping will ressume, and developers will get away with charging a monthly fee.

 But the three things you listed have nothing to do with pay to play VS free or buy to play so your debate points do not mean subscription based gaming is the wave of the future. The fact is most developers are not getting away with it, too many games are either free to play or changing that way after failing as sub based. Yes some games will always have the playerbase to go that method, but many others clearly cant support it that way.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Lorkii

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Lorkii

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by zellmer

Are GW2 players in denial with all its massive problems and the giant # of people speaking out against the horrendous/worthless end game..?

 

 

 Are you kidding me?

 

 

Massive problems? Giant number speaking out? What is a giant number to you? Obviously your idea of a giant number is not the same as mine, but then again haters look for anything to try and pounce on. Logic and reason never coming into the equation.

There are alot leaving to come back later. My guild was 200+ active first few days, now it s 2-3 lol. It really is a game of cya in 2-3 months. That will not help community down the road. My guild isn t the only one, I ve heard numerous people claim this.

 I hear people claim things all the time. People are notorious for lying and making up facts as needed. Not really reliable sources in general.

Goes both ways, jusy going on what I see and read/hear in game. it s not all rosey,

 But I am not making claims. I am not saying the game is without and issues and all is rosey. You can make any claim you want, the current server stats say you are in the minority or your guild is anyway.

Not to mention that players in his guild may have chose to represent a different guild, making it seem like they're inactive. Just a thought.

Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

Hopefully.  Good luck to future non Blizzard themeparks getting people to pay a sub.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by nate1980

Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

 

 

I doubt it. As time goes by, people will start to see the flaws of GW2 more clearly. 

GW2 is a good game, but it's lacking in some things that P2P games have that's important to some, if not, many people.

1. A community. I've asked for help countless times through /map in PvE and WvWvW and have been greeted with only silence.  I've encouraged communication, made suggestions in WvWvW, and still silence, while people are being dumb using no tactics and just wasting time and feeding the enemy realms glory. I'm on Jade Quarry, so maybe it's just my server. 

2. Lack of progression. Some people, like myself, LOVE progression. The journey is more fun than the destination, and growing more powerful, and learning new abilities is what drives us. Since leveling is autoscaled to content, you never feel more powerful, so the drive to earn a new level isn't there nearly as much as in other MMO's. All core abilities are learned by lvl 7, and in normal zerg event play, and hearts play, you don't need to use most of the core abilities you have. Seems like dungeons is the only real way to test yourself. PvP is a zergfest. The side with more aoe, ranged, and numbers will win. HoD server, especially the guild DIE from that server seems to understand how to transcend that.

3. Lack of endgame. I'm not bothered by this, but some people may be. I'm content with exploration dungeons and WvWvW, but others like progression raids, and new raid releases every so many months. Repeating exploration dungeons may not be something they want to do, maybe they want new scenery at lvl 80, something they haven't done while leveling up.

These are just some points I've seen brought up in forums, or have experienced myself. So while GW2 remains a good game and will entertain for a while, I doubt it'll hold anyones attention for years like old MMORPG's did. Thus, game hopping will ressume, and developers will get away with charging a monthly fee.

 But the three things you listed have nothing to do with pay to play VS free or buy to play so your debate points do not mean subscription based gaming is the wave of the future. The fact is most developers are not getting away with it, too many games are either free to play or changing that way after failing as sub based. Yes some games will always have the playerbase to go that method, but many others clearly cant support it that way.

If I'm not mistaken, the OP claims that GW2's success will be the final nail in the coffin of subsriptions. My points dispute that by saying, in summary, that GW2 is not a several year permanent home game like people spent in pre-WoW MMORPG's and WoW itself, thus companies will still be selling games, lots of copies, and still charge a subscription. GW2 won't change that, although it may open developers eyes to alternative payment models originally scoffed at or put on the back burner.

Originally posted by cylon8
i started playing tonight and was amwed by the art direction i was never impressed with gw1. That being said getting used to not being given a linear path is jarring but welcome. But lets not kid ourselves, the kill ten rats...still there....it's just presented more seamlessly. The environments alone will keep me compelled to log in, the non recurring subscription fact..eh I have subs to two other games, i'm letting tera lapse and i'm holding onto TOR only to see if being a sub is sweetened more before it's f2p relaunce commences......gw2 tho so far is best mmo for 2012 i think the only thing that will tear me away is wildstar..only because it reminds me SO much of free realms...and well free realms is been on a vanguardish content life support now for 3 years and sunstone valley might not be big enough to lasy me :)

The highlighted text brings up a good point you probably didn't realize you made. Since there's no real progression in the game, the only reason to continue to play (PvE-wise), is because you WANT to explore the environment. This means that developers need to create zones that people want to explore, not avoid. This came to my mind when several people were complaining about hating particular zones in the game, because they were either not appealing or were hard ot navigate.

Originally posted by nate1980

Originally posted by lordpenquin

Is GW2 the final nail in the coffin of the western $15/month mmorpg?  Will there be any company that releases a game post GW2 that isn't free to play or buy to play?  Is any company foolish to attempt to charge a monthly fee for a new MMORGP?

 

 

I doubt it. As time goes by, people will start to see the flaws of GW2 more clearly. 

GW2 is a good game, but it's lacking in some things that P2P games have that's important to some, if not, many people.

1. A community. I've asked for help countless times through /map in PvE and WvWvW and have been greeted with only silence.  I've encouraged communication, made suggestions in WvWvW, and still silence, while people are being dumb using no tactics and just wasting time and feeding the enemy realms glory. I'm on Jade Quarry, so maybe it's just my server. 

2. Lack of progression. Some people, like myself, LOVE progression. The journey is more fun than the destination, and growing more powerful, and learning new abilities is what drives us. Since leveling is autoscaled to content, you never feel more powerful, so the drive to earn a new level isn't there nearly as much as in other MMO's. All core abilities are learned by lvl 7, and in normal zerg event play, and hearts play, you don't need to use most of the core abilities you have. Seems like dungeons is the only real way to test yourself. PvP is a zergfest. The side with more aoe, ranged, and numbers will win. HoD server, especially the guild DIE from that server seems to understand how to transcend that.

3. Lack of endgame. I'm not bothered by this, but some people may be. I'm content with exploration dungeons and WvWvW, but others like progression raids, and new raid releases every so many months. Repeating exploration dungeons may not be something they want to do, maybe they want new scenery at lvl 80, something they haven't done while leveling up.

These are just some points I've seen brought up in forums, or have experienced myself. So while GW2 remains a good game and will entertain for a while, I doubt it'll hold anyones attention for years like old MMORPG's did. Thus, game hopping will ressume, and developers will get away with charging a monthly fee.

gw2 has the best community ive ever seen in an MMO. people are helping each other all the time from my experience. in fact, it pays to help others. ANet designed it that way. 

some people, like myself, LOVE progression also. i feel at home in GW2. the only progression GW2 is missing is the stats grind. it contains everything else as, say, WoW, plus more (like exploration and legendary crafting). 

there's too much endgame. i dont even know where to begin. some DE's are bugged and unbalanced, but this will get fixed in a matter of weeks. 

community-based play, and variety in endgame progression are reasons why i love GW2. these pillars will only get stronger as time passes because the foundation is very strong. GW2 is lightyears beyond EVERY MMO when comparing the launch period. 

---

Originally posted by Odinthedark1
SWTOR although sucked as a sub game would be an awesome F2P.

---

http://www.swtor.com/free/features

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Originally posted by sonoggi

some people, like myself, LOVE progression also. i feel at home in GW2. the only progression GW2 is missing is the stats grind. it contains everything else as, say, WoW, plus more (like exploration and legendary crafting). 

---

It's about time a game like GW2 did away with grinding for gear, that shit got old quick in SWTOR.

Originally posted by eggy08

Originally posted by GeezerGamer
After GW2 shuts down all the sub based games, we'll come back and say "OP was right"

I got an A on my test. Thanks GW2. You the best.

Coming back to GW2 and stating that it killed sub based games is like us coming back and stating that Madden did the same.

Even if the genre of B2P games flourishes, the only downfall to sub based games would be the actual fall of current ones. Theres no doubt in anyones mind that a B2P game that looks fun will be bought, but it will never be even a thumbtack in the coffin of the sub based genre. They are burying themselves, not other genres burying them.

I probably should have put something line 

/sarcasm off 

in my post.