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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » I am SICK and TIRED of the "more difficult" crowd

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320 posts found
  Pumuckl71

Novice Member

Joined: 5/24/12
Posts: 127

9/11/12 2:23:39 PM#301

A  note on "Raids":

If youre in a guild/clan full of asshats  things  can get difficult indeed . Selfish , selfcentered  and lootgreedy  knuckleheads

gathered up together often result in stress  and frustration.

On the other hand a good oiled machine  of laid back  relaxed people  who respect each other are  more likely  to chew up

all content a game can throw at them.

================================================================================================

 

 

  AlBQuirky

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 1/24/05
Posts: 2901

Tomorrow's just a future yesterday...

9/11/12 6:24:43 PM#302


Originally posted by Pumuckl71
@Elikal

and iam sick and tired  of people who want to 1-2-3  hit  R.I.P.  everything. Too lazy to take a challenge  and inpatient. You dont observe your encounters , you dont learn from your dirtnaps. In fact most likely you just jump with the same tactics into an encounter  over and over again till you get frustrated.

And now your pointing your finger at us , the ones  who enjoy a challenge ...who study  encounters  to create  builds  that are more  effective and most likely result in success. And trust me  there a  90% solution to all ingame encounters.

Without the crowd youre so tired of , youd  play silly dumbed down  sesamee street  level  encounters ..think bout it



I think this is the crux of it all, right here.

RPGs have you playing the role of a character. This character is NOT me. He has no idea what a computer is or what a car does. On the other hand, I have no clue how to wield a sword or throw spells.

In old time RPGs, one's character was the character in the game, not in real life. Many of the gamers today think that they are the ones in the game. They think that their manual dexterity is their character's ability. They believe with all their heart that they, themselves, are wielding that sword, throwing that spell. That is how they enjoy the game.

Ever role play a dumb fighter? How about an overconfident mage? Won't get you into many groups, let me tell you. My character in game does not understand "game mechanics." He understands what he understands. In a dumb fighter, that isn't much :) That overconfident mage thinks he can take on anything, many times to his party's detriment.

No, the games made today are geared towards players who think that they are the character in real life. What they know and can do, their character knows and can do. Their character in game apparently has access to wikis, YouTube, and Google. That is what most players want, so I cannot blame the game makers.

Remember when games used to have places to write up your own biography?

PS: Wow... 7 pages of posts @ 50 posts/page.

- Al

Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
- FARGIN_WAR

  bone12

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/08
Posts: 33

9/12/12 2:47:18 AM#303

Just Guild wars 2 Love it no comments on that one....

Guild wars 2 is awesome, yesterday took  a  dungeon with guild mates/clan and we took about 2hours to clear lvl 30 dungeon..

  kadepsyson

Novice Member

Joined: 5/15/06
Posts: 1964

The doctors say his chances are 50/50...but there's only a 10% chance of that.

9/12/12 2:49:22 AM#304
Originally posted by Elikal

Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

Grrrr

Yeah man, me too. I'm so sick of people that think differently than me and have opinions that aren't exactly like mine.  I mean, why can't everyone just be exactly like me?  Then the world would be a better place, because that's what I think.

El Psy Congroo

  Pilnkplonk

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/02/10
Posts: 1565

9/12/12 3:09:47 AM#305

Gee Eli, why are you playing a thief then?

I'm also a more thoughtful, tactical gamer and that's the reason why I never play Scout in TF2, for example - I know I would suck badly while I excell at more tactical types like engis and pyros. Scouts, thieves and classes like that are played for twitchy adrenaline rush. Some people enjoy that and excell at it while some enjoy a more leisurely pace. Imo a good game should offer options to different playstyles and TF2's success is directly attributable to that. GW2 offers a similar range of choice, so why are you gimping yourself when it is quite obvious thief's playstyle is not for you?

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16412

9/12/12 3:22:40 AM#306
Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

Gee Eli, why are you playing a thief then?

I'm also a more thoughtful, tactical gamer and that's the reason why I never play Scout in TF2, for example - I know I would suck badly while I excell at more tactical types like engis and pyros. Scouts, thieves and classes like that are played for twitchy adrenaline rush. Some people enjoy that and excell at it while some enjoy a more leisurely pace. Imo a good game should offer options to different playstyles and TF2's success is directly attributable to that. GW2 offers a similar range of choice, so why are you gimping yourself when it is quite obvious thief's playstyle is not for you?

That is a good question, while thieves are easier than mesmers they are still not the perfect class for someone that thinks hard is bad.

A Guardian or a warrior is easier to play, or a necro for that matter.

I like the thief because I live as long as  move, but if I stop up for a moment I go down. A warrior can be lot slower and move less while still surviving, at least if you specc right.

  Pilnkplonk

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/02/10
Posts: 1565

9/12/12 3:58:14 AM#307
Originally posted by Loke666
Originally posted by Pilnkplonk

Gee Eli, why are you playing a thief then?

I'm also a more thoughtful, tactical gamer and that's the reason why I never play Scout in TF2, for example - I know I would suck badly while I excell at more tactical types like engis and pyros. Scouts, thieves and classes like that are played for twitchy adrenaline rush. Some people enjoy that and excell at it while some enjoy a more leisurely pace. Imo a good game should offer options to different playstyles and TF2's success is directly attributable to that. GW2 offers a similar range of choice, so why are you gimping yourself when it is quite obvious thief's playstyle is not for you?

That is a good question, while thieves are easier than mesmers they are still not the perfect class for someone that thinks hard is bad.

A Guardian or a warrior is easier to play, or a necro for that matter.

I like the thief because I live as long as  move, but if I stop up for a moment I go down. A warrior can be lot slower and move less while still surviving, at least if you specc right.

Oh, I wouldn't say "easier", just "different." Different classes utilize different player skills and capabilities - and every person in the world is different. Imo it's just a matter of knowing yourself, where your strengths and weaknesses are and using this for your benefit rather than trying to go through a brick wall. Imo thief is not "harder" to play than other classes, it just uses more of the actiony, twitchy type of skill rather than deliberate, tactical one. It all depends on whether you are playing the role that is best suited for you as an individual.

Imo, from all I've read Eli would be better off with a ranged class that would give him breathing space to control the situation at some distance. Maybe a ranger or a properly specced engineer?

  xpiher

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/22/08
Posts: 3297

9/12/12 4:03:27 AM#308
Originally posted by Elikal

Seriously, I so HAVE it had with those people always yelling "MORE DIFFICULT" please. Why are the devs always listen to them? I am really pissed. First The Secret World, which I quit because I died 2000 times. And now with GW2 it is the same again. The difficulty was just right in the late beta, but a few people whined with Esports mentality, some 16 year old action zergers asked for more hardcore, and now beyond level 16 both my Mesmer and my Thief are unplayable. I HATE those people. Why must they always cater THEM? While the world is fully crowded you get along, but play on irregular times, and those classes are a DAMN CHORE. And worse, the story instances are nightmares! I even took a friend along, and we died several times, even had to just ignore some instances, because even with two we simply could not do it, and to hell with levelling, because the DAMN GAME levels you down again, no matter.

I am so fed up with developers always listen to this hardcore crowd who ruin every game because they need games to be a dick size contest to PROVE themselves!

Grrrr

I hope this is a troll because GW2 and TOR are probably the easiest MMOs to come out as of late. The battles individually may be easy sometimes, but thats not the point of those arguments. The point of those arguments is that AI is too simple, the leveling curve doesn't exist or is a slight hill, the learning curve is non-existent. People long for a game with the complexity of EvE, but in a fantasy setting and maybe not a full sandbox


Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher

  Scot

Elite Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5095

9/12/12 5:10:24 AM#309

Give the guy a break if he wants to play a thief.

I had a mate who would always play some sort of thief or assassin. In the early days of MMO’s being a different class meant you could have a different PvE experience, a thief was tough to level. I can remember him complaining about his sequences being interrupted and having a glass body rather than a glass jaw. :)

These days you can play what you like for style, in PvE and often PvP it makes hardly any difference. So style over substance in ezMMO’s once again, but at least my mate is happy!

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19124

9/12/12 10:46:02 AM#310
Originally posted by RefMinor
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Pumuckl71

And now your pointing your finger at us , the ones  who enjoy a challenge ...who study  encounters  to create  builds  that are more  effective and most likely result in success. And trust me  there a  90% solution to all ingame encounters.

 

 

 

That is obviously not true. No amount of thinking can get pass hard mode raiding without hours of wiping to practice maneuvers.

Spending 2 hours to learn a fight .. sure .. that is over-coming a challenging.

Spending 2 months to get through a boss .. please .. that is overkill.

No, that is a challenge you are not up for

.. and 98% of the player population .. such as in Sunwell. It is pointless to make it so difficult so only 2% of the players can do it.

Can YOU?

  Daneril

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/22/07
Posts: 39

9/13/12 10:35:20 AM#311
I couldn't disagree more. I want things i've done in a game to feel like an achievement, not that i just pushed some buttons. Anyone can master something thats easy and dumbed down. And besides, almost every game these days are easy and dumbed down compared to older Mmorpgs. Gaming companies never listen to people who want harder games.

  Scot

Elite Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5095

9/13/12 11:59:18 AM#312

These two pics are from the Xbox Live homepage. This is where they want the market to expand too. Look at the Social section of the site, this is part of their stratergy to will expand into a family market.

Now most gamers do not fit the family demographic, we are a subset of that. But gaming companies do not want a subset they want to sell to everyone. That means the more difficult games you love have been phased out over the years and are still being dumbed down. As the CEO of EA said “our games will be so easy to play your mum could play them”. He said that because he wants your mum to play, your eight year old brother to play and if your dog could pay for the game then your pooch as well.

Hardcore gamers started the gaming genre, but casual gamers have inherited it. The irony is the casual gamers think it stops here, where they want it too. But mum can’t play everything yet so the process of dumbing down is set to continue. Today’s casual gamer will look back in five years time and ask himself what happened?

Well you helped let the genie out of the bottle mate and it is not going back in. If old school games can be remade for a larger player base casual school, do you think they will stop there? If 80 million people on a social network will play Farmville then social networks have a lot of people who can be persuaded to play the next game from EA. It just needs more dumbing down and good marketing.

 

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19124

9/13/12 8:11:13 PM#313
Originally posted by Daneril
I couldn't disagree more. I want things i've done in a game to feel like an achievement, not that i just pushed some buttons. Anyone can master something thats easy and dumbed down. And besides, almost every game these days are easy and dumbed down compared to older Mmorpgs. Gaming companies never listen to people who want harder games.

You are confusing "takes lot of time" and "hard".

Hard mode raiding is hard. Diablo 3 is hard out of the gate (nerfed now but hard core inferno is still hard).

There are still challenging games. Now if leveling the first 10 level in WOW is not hard .. well .. that is true. But you can't claim there is no hard game out there.

  Astralglide

Novice Member

Joined: 9/03/07
Posts: 695

"Nothing says combat instancing like cleavage, nipples, and leather"
-Sanya Weathers, 2009

9/13/12 8:52:58 PM#314

It's not a "Dick Sized Thing" as you say. Difficult=challenging=fun.  I enjoyed wow's raiding a lot- because it was more challenging and I think TSW is a great game because its new, innovative, and challenging. There are several parts of that game that i have to come back to after I get some better gear and fiddle with my spec because their too challening.  If it was easy, then I would quickly become bored ... and so would hundreds of thousands of people. These games are made as difficult as they are because having some difficulty to it makes it more fun. How do I know that? Because because of the shear number of people who play MMO's. Think about it. Zynga Games, the creator of many many popular FB games, is in a lot of financial trouble because they made very simple games that people didn't feel were worth paying any money for. If making these games retarded simple (the hardcore players will say they already are) made the companies more money- they would do it in an instant. I think that, considering you are having a lot of difficulty in themepark mmo's, you might want to try something a little simpler:

http://mmohuts.com/browser-games/family-guy-online

http://mmohuts.com/browser-games/the-sims-social

http://www.hellokittyonline.com/

https://apps.facebook.com/inthemafia/

https://apps.facebook.com/ab_in_adventure/

A witty saying proves nothing.
-Voltaire

  dustyhayes

Novice Member

Joined: 5/19/11
Posts: 174

9/14/12 12:17:46 AM#315
The "more difficult crowd" have been around since the days of the ZX Spectrum 128 & Commodore 64 when they used to take games back to the store and ask "tell Ocean make the game more difficult please" plus refund, their just part and parcel of gaming world like haters and fanboys.
  Yaoiman

Novice Member

Joined: 8/16/12
Posts: 55

We will always remember your sacrifice, Louisoux! RIP

9/14/12 12:28:30 AM#316
I'm sick and tired of people that want everything handed to them without putting in any effort. Back in my day games required hard work and thinking, but Blizz has introduced so many lazy and mindless people into MMO gaming that other MMO's end up having to dumb down their games because people that play WoW can't handle playing a game hat reqyuires thinking and work.

A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies, the man who never reads lives only one.

We will always remember your sacrifice, Louisoux!

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19124

9/15/12 7:21:38 PM#317
Originally posted by Yaoiman
I'm sick and tired of people that want everything handed to them without putting in any effort. Back in my day games required hard work and thinking, but Blizz has introduced so many lazy and mindless people into MMO gaming that other MMO's end up having to dumb down their games because people that play WoW can't handle playing a game hat reqyuires thinking and work.

Really?

The reason i quit WOW raiding is because it is too much like work. For god sake, a commited weekly schedule just to play a game. LFR solves that problem.

  rutaq

Elite Member

Joined: 8/08/06
Posts: 412

9/15/12 8:58:49 PM#318
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Yaoiman
I'm sick and tired of people that want everything handed to them without putting in any effort. Back in my day games required hard work and thinking, but Blizz has introduced so many lazy and mindless people into MMO gaming that other MMO's end up having to dumb down their games because people that play WoW can't handle playing a game hat reqyuires thinking and work.

Really?

The reason i quit WOW raiding is because it is too much like work. For god sake, a commited weekly schedule just to play a game. LFR solves that problem.

 

I don't want a good discussion to drop of the front page  :)

 

So you quit WOW raiding becuase it was too much like work due to a committed weekly schedule to play a game ???

So I assume you have never tried to play any other group games that involved lots of other people ?

 

Like a  Bowling League,  Softball League, Dart League, Poker night the guys, etc ????

 

Why do you find it so shocking that it takes a schedule to bring together lots of people a the same time to play together ?

 

 

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19124

9/17/12 11:51:17 AM#319
Originally posted by rutaq
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Yaoiman
I'm sick and tired of people that want everything handed to them without putting in any effort. Back in my day games required hard work and thinking, but Blizz has introduced so many lazy and mindless people into MMO gaming that other MMO's end up having to dumb down their games because people that play WoW can't handle playing a game hat reqyuires thinking and work.

Really?

The reason i quit WOW raiding is because it is too much like work. For god sake, a commited weekly schedule just to play a game. LFR solves that problem.

 

I don't want a good discussion to drop of the front page  :)

 

So you quit WOW raiding becuase it was too much like work due to a committed weekly schedule to play a game ???

So I assume you have never tried to play any other group games that involved lots of other people ?

 

Like a  Bowling League,  Softball League, Dart League, Poker night the guys, etc ????

 

Why do you find it so shocking that it takes a schedule to bring together lots of people a the same time to play together ?

 

 

The point of a computer online is that you do NOT need to have a comitted weekly schedule. Not shocking .. just not my thing.

And no i don't play bowling, any sports, or poker night. If i want to play poker (which i don't), it is MUCH easier to do it online without the hassle of actually getting people together.

When i can find someone to play with at any time through LFD, why should i bound myself by a schedule? It is not like i want to make friends online. I have more than enough in RL.

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19124

9/17/12 12:30:06 PM#320
Originally posted by TruthXHurts
 

So because you lack social skills an industry built around socializing in the game needs to go away? Maybe you need to go get some time around other people, and emerge from yoru basement once in awhile.

You got it opposite. I have too many friends/family that i simply don't have time for online people.

I don't want more time with people .. i want to play games. If i want to spend time with people, i will go out ...

And btw, i have no complain when game devs understand this, and make games that cater to my needs.

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