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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » Love the game, but ability progression is the weakest part

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143 posts found
  grimal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/11/05
Posts: 2665

9/13/12 9:11:46 AM#81
Originally posted by Adiaris
 

Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Because we like it?  Why should we have to explain in detail the reasons for why we enjoy certain things?  Maybe different people like things you don't; respect that.

"I'm sorry, if you were right, I'd agree with you." - Robin Williams

  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

9/13/12 9:11:51 AM#82
Originally posted by Adiaris
Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Is it stopping me from playing? nope. But does it make me go 'meh' every now and then? yes. But since i have always been more of an explorer kind i am dealing with it as tme passes by.

Maybe if i never played GW1 i wouldn't even feel that GW2 skills are very limited and controlled for players by Anet. It is like they took 3 steps backward in skill system and 2 steps ahead in everything else.


Bite Me

  TeknoBug

Novice Member

Joined: 10/13/07
Posts: 2166

9/13/12 9:13:47 AM#83

I don't recommend getting all the utility skills by level 40, and you still need to gather skill challenges to be able to use exotics when you hit 80, it doesn't end at 40.


IMO this game isn't about progress, I haven't really bothered looking at what level I am in a while, I just roam around kiling and gathering stuff and queuing for WvW (which you level up in as well). If you're worried about progress, stop playing GW2 now.


  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

9/13/12 9:15:05 AM#84
Originally posted by sookster54

I don't recommend getting all the utility skills by level 40, and you still need to gather skill challenges to be able to use exotics when you hit 80, it doesn't end at 40.


IMO this game isn't about progress, I haven't really bothered looking at what level I am in a while, I just roam around kiling and gathering stuff and queuing for WvW (which you level up in as well). If you're worried about progress, stop playing GW2 now.

In other words play like i do or stop playing.

Do we really have to start this again?


Bite Me

  grimal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/11/05
Posts: 2665

9/13/12 9:15:50 AM#85
Originally posted by Adiaris

No, I'm pretty sure we get that. I think a number of us have issue understanding why this is, in fact, an issue at all. I use more skills actively in GW2 than any other game I've ever played, it doesn't really matter to me when I got them tbh. I don't need a fake active skill progression system to keep me going, I need an interesting and varied skill set to keep playing, amongst other things. Which GW2 has, if people don't see that... well then.. not much can be done!

That said, I'm sure they'll add more wpns, elites and utilities, though I doubt they'll add alternative skills to current sets, but who knows. 

But really, like most of these very specific threads, one change - even one you really want - is not going to change the outlook of the game for you, or it might for 5 seconds. You either pretty much like the whole package and whatever details you don't like u can live with, or you don't. (and yes this goes for any game). 

Funnily enough, none of the things I have an issue with have been brought up on these forums, but they're prevalent in threads on official forums and my guild.

I don't agree with this.  We all have said we like this game and are just offering up criticism; why does the game's features have to be set in stone?  MMOs have always been a work in progress so to speak...this black or white issue with game's features is really just a defense mechanism to deflect the issue at hand.


You didn't really get what I'm saying, and I couldn't be less interested in deflecting anything tbh. 

Ok, let me be very clear to you:

"But really, like most of these very specific threads, one change - even one you really want - is not going to change the outlook of the game for you, or it might for 5 seconds."

You are making a conclusion based on an inaccurate assumption. 

 

"I'm sorry, if you were right, I'd agree with you." - Robin Williams

  xpiher

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/22/08
Posts: 3309

9/13/12 9:16:11 AM#86
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by Adiaris
Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Is it stopping me from playing? nope. But does it make me go 'meh' every now and then? yes. But since i have always been more of an explorer kind i am dealing with it as tme passes by.

Maybe if i never played GW1 i wouldn't even feel that GW2 skills are very limited and controlled for players by Anet. It is like they took 3 steps backward in skill system and 2 steps ahead in everything else.

I disagree with this one. Hunting eliete skills made the game feel like there was more content then there actually was, and while builds were many, there were many skills that were simply useless. Does skill progression need improvement, sure. Do we need more weapon skills or the ones we have take longer to learn to make it better. Not IMO. While more would be nice, I don't see it as necessary as adding more utility skills with more varried affects.


Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
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Warhammer - Xpiher

  Robsolf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/06
Posts: 4048

Let go of my ears, I know what I'm doing!

9/13/12 9:17:17 AM#87
Originally posted by jondifool

to call traits passive is missing what they do. The do change the playstyle possible to you, depending on what  you chosse, the way you use your skills change accordingly. Their is alot of variation in that. If missing that  i can understand i can understand you find ability progression the weakest part.

I will give you that i find it unneeded limiting that you have to pay for retraiting your progression in the lines.

/agree.

Almost all of them either alter or enhance your current abilities.  For example, Thieves have one that throws caltrops whenever  they dodge.  Or sets an ambush trap when they're reviving someone, which summons a henchman to aggro the mob(s) while you work.  Yet another one cuts your fall damage and blinds mobs wherever you land, allowing you to drop down onto mobs from above.

It's basically a system that allows you to customize your character to fit the abilities/tactics you use most.

The stat bonuses are secondary.

  Adiaris

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/08
Posts: 386

9/13/12 9:17:53 AM#88
Originally posted by grimal
Originally posted by Adiaris
 

Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Because we like it?  Why should we have to explain in detail the reasons for why we enjoy certain things?  Maybe different people like things you don't; respect that.

I don't think you understand the meaning of the word RESPECT, so don't bandy it about.

Did i type *OMG YOU SUX YOU IIHD)PADUU" No. I'm trying to understand what it is that you enjoy so much of a weak mechanic that is there just to act as a carrot instead of enjoying the gameplay. 

More power to you if you like it, I'm not contesting that at all. 

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 7678

9/13/12 9:19:31 AM#89
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by bcbully
Perfect example; I just hit 54. You know what I got? 1% increase to boon duration and 40 toughness... That's weaksauce.

You think that's weak? OK... tell me what you're going to get at level 55.

1% increase to boon duration, 40 toughness and a chance to summon a jagged horror after killing an enemy... For thouse who don't know a horror is similar to a blood worm, or a very weak passive dot. Yes that's weaksauce.

  Adiaris

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/08
Posts: 386

9/13/12 9:19:51 AM#90
Originally posted by grimal
Originally posted by Adiaris

No, I'm pretty sure we get that. I think a number of us have issue understanding why this is, in fact, an issue at all. I use more skills actively in GW2 than any other game I've ever played, it doesn't really matter to me when I got them tbh. I don't need a fake active skill progression system to keep me going, I need an interesting and varied skill set to keep playing, amongst other things. Which GW2 has, if people don't see that... well then.. not much can be done!

That said, I'm sure they'll add more wpns, elites and utilities, though I doubt they'll add alternative skills to current sets, but who knows. 

But really, like most of these very specific threads, one change - even one you really want - is not going to change the outlook of the game for you, or it might for 5 seconds. You either pretty much like the whole package and whatever details you don't like u can live with, or you don't. (and yes this goes for any game). 

Funnily enough, none of the things I have an issue with have been brought up on these forums, but they're prevalent in threads on official forums and my guild.

I don't agree with this.  We all have said we like this game and are just offering up criticism; why does the game's features have to be set in stone?  MMOs have always been a work in progress so to speak...this black or white issue with game's features is really just a defense mechanism to deflect the issue at hand.


You didn't really get what I'm saying, and I couldn't be less interested in deflecting anything tbh. 

Ok, let me be very clear to you:

"But really, like most of these very specific threads, one change - even one you really want - is not going to change the outlook of the game for you, or it might for 5 seconds."

You are making a conclusion based on an inaccurate assumption. 

 

Maybe you should simply not assume everythign is directed at you? I'm not saying you're not enjoying the game, my statement  is general conclusion to these kind of topic, take it or leave it.

Also "making a conclusion based on inaccurate assumptions" seems to be your life motto. 

  Adiaris

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/08
Posts: 386

9/13/12 9:21:15 AM#91
Originally posted by xpiher
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by Adiaris
Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Is it stopping me from playing? nope. But does it make me go 'meh' every now and then? yes. But since i have always been more of an explorer kind i am dealing with it as tme passes by.

Maybe if i never played GW1 i wouldn't even feel that GW2 skills are very limited and controlled for players by Anet. It is like they took 3 steps backward in skill system and 2 steps ahead in everything else.

I disagree with this one. Hunting eliete skills made the game feel like there was more content then there actually was, and while builds were many, there were many skills that were simply useless. Does skill progression need improvement, sure. Do we need more weapon skills or the ones we have take longer to learn to make it better. Not IMO. While more would be nice, I don't see it as necessary as adding more utility skills with more varried affects.

Agreed. Hunting elites was fun. 

In general though, the GW1 system felt gimmicky to me and I didn't enjoy it.

  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

9/13/12 9:22:54 AM#92
Originally posted by xpiher
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by Adiaris
Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Is it stopping me from playing? nope. But does it make me go 'meh' every now and then? yes. But since i have always been more of an explorer kind i am dealing with it as tme passes by.

Maybe if i never played GW1 i wouldn't even feel that GW2 skills are very limited and controlled for players by Anet. It is like they took 3 steps backward in skill system and 2 steps ahead in everything else.

I disagree with this one. Hunting eliete skills made the game feel like there was more content then there actually was, and while builds were many, there were many skills that were simply useless. Does skill progression need improvement, sure. Do we need more weapon skills or the ones we have take longer to learn to make it better. Not IMO. While more would be nice, I don't see it as necessary as adding more utility skills with more varried affects.

I am not holding my breathe on weapon skills. I am also talking about utility / slot skills. I hope they add those lot more in future.

Even TSW gave one extra slot on hotbar and added new skills in three months. I am sure GW2 can expand on it too.


Bite Me

  grimal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/11/05
Posts: 2665

9/13/12 9:24:02 AM#93
Originally posted by Adiaris

I don't think you understand the meaning of the word RESPECT, so don't bandy it about.

Did i type *OMG YOU SUX YOU IIHD)PADUU" No. I'm trying to understand what it is that you enjoy so much of a weak mechanic that is there just to act as a carrot instead of enjoying the gameplay. 

More power to you if you like it, I'm not contesting that at all. 

Much like others have already stated, it has always been a fundamental part of RPGs since pen and paper.  Leveling always granted the increase of abilities, power and customization.  Removing that sort of makes the leveling pointless.

For me, that is part of the gameplay.  So when that is taken out, that is removing part of what I enjoy.

Also, I don't know why you are getting so defensive with the "respect" thing.  People have explained in numerous replies before this one why we enjoy that progression.  Please go back and reread those posts.

"I'm sorry, if you were right, I'd agree with you." - Robin Williams

  grimal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/11/05
Posts: 2665

9/13/12 9:25:59 AM#94
Originally posted by Adiaris

Maybe you should simply not assume everythign is directed at you? I'm not saying you're not enjoying the game, my statement  is general conclusion to these kind of topic, take it or leave it.

Also "making a conclusion based on inaccurate assumptions" seems to be your life motto. 

Wow, project much?

"I'm sorry, if you were right, I'd agree with you." - Robin Williams

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 7678

9/13/12 9:26:59 AM#95
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by xpiher
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by Adiaris
Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Is it stopping me from playing? nope. But does it make me go 'meh' every now and then? yes. But since i have always been more of an explorer kind i am dealing with it as tme passes by.

Maybe if i never played GW1 i wouldn't even feel that GW2 skills are very limited and controlled for players by Anet. It is like they took 3 steps backward in skill system and 2 steps ahead in everything else.

I disagree with this one. Hunting eliete skills made the game feel like there was more content then there actually was, and while builds were many, there were many skills that were simply useless. Does skill progression need improvement, sure. Do we need more weapon skills or the ones we have take longer to learn to make it better. Not IMO. While more would be nice, I don't see it as necessary as adding more utility skills with more varried affects.

I am not holding my breathe on weapon skills. I am also talking about utility / slot skills. I hope they add those lot more in future.

Even TSW gave one extra slot on hotbar and added new skills in three months. I am sure GW2 can expand on it too.

Such a shame FC had so many finacial troubles before and after release. The Ability Wheel blows away the GW2 skill/trait system. 

 

If TSW had an urban equivalent to WvW it would have been game over along time ago, but it does not and probably will not anytime soon :(

  Adiaris

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/08
Posts: 386

9/13/12 9:28:33 AM#96
Originally posted by grimal
Originally posted by Adiaris

I don't think you understand the meaning of the word RESPECT, so don't bandy it about.

Did i type *OMG YOU SUX YOU IIHD)PADUU" No. I'm trying to understand what it is that you enjoy so much of a weak mechanic that is there just to act as a carrot instead of enjoying the gameplay. 

More power to you if you like it, I'm not contesting that at all. 

Much like others have already stated, it has always been a fundamental part of RPGs since pen and paper.  Leveling always granted the increase of abilities, power and customization.  Removing that sort of makes the leveling pointless.

For me, that is part of the gameplay.  So when that is taken out, that is removing part of what I enjoy.

Also, I don't know why you are getting so defensive with the "respect" thing.  People have explained in numerous replies before this one why we enjoy that progression.  Please go back and reread those posts.

Because you use words without knowing what they mean (or maybe how to use them - such as defensive). I reserve telling peeps to respect other people's tastes when they're flaming and such, not when they are simply trying to understand what the deal is.

I read it, and what I get is "I need it to level, it helps me get to the end." If that's the case, ok then, got it.

Different strokes for different folks. 

  TheIronLegion

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/06/12
Posts: 270

Act with wisdom, but act.

9/13/12 9:28:34 AM#97
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by sookster54

I don't recommend getting all the utility skills by level 40, and you still need to gather skill challenges to be able to use exotics when you hit 80, it doesn't end at 40.


IMO this game isn't about progress, I haven't really bothered looking at what level I am in a while, I just roam around kiling and gathering stuff and queuing for WvW (which you level up in as well). If you're worried about progress, stop playing GW2 now.

In other words play like i do or stop playing.

Do we really have to start this again?

Wait wait! *scans sookster54's post* where does it say "play like I do"? Can you underline it for me? sookster is just providing a frame of reference. It's like saying "I had no problem installing this harddrive. I just did x, y, and z and it was fine." Though telling him to stop playing isn't helping much either.

  UtukuMoon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/03/11
Posts: 1109

9/13/12 9:30:36 AM#98
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by xpiher
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by Adiaris
Clearly. My real question is, why is this progression such a big deal to you people? Is it really changing your enjoyment of the game? I really don't get what it is that's being said, sorry, but I'm the person that dinged 80 thinking he was dinging 79, that's how hard I look at the levels. 

Is it stopping me from playing? nope. But does it make me go 'meh' every now and then? yes. But since i have always been more of an explorer kind i am dealing with it as tme passes by.

Maybe if i never played GW1 i wouldn't even feel that GW2 skills are very limited and controlled for players by Anet. It is like they took 3 steps backward in skill system and 2 steps ahead in everything else.

I disagree with this one. Hunting eliete skills made the game feel like there was more content then there actually was, and while builds were many, there were many skills that were simply useless. Does skill progression need improvement, sure. Do we need more weapon skills or the ones we have take longer to learn to make it better. Not IMO. While more would be nice, I don't see it as necessary as adding more utility skills with more varried affects.

I am not holding my breathe on weapon skills. I am also talking about utility / slot skills. I hope they add those lot more in future.

Even TSW gave one extra slot on hotbar and added new skills in three months. I am sure GW2 can expand on it too.

Such a shame FC had so many finacial troubles before and after release. The Ability Wheel blows away the GW2 skill/trait system. 

 

If TSW had an urban equivalent to WvW it would have been game over along time ago, but it does not and probably will not anytime soon :(

Yeah,the ability wheel in TSW does blow away gw2 skill/trait system,it's like night & day to be honest.It's a pity really because i actually like some parts of the game but the it's going to be short lived for me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8ymgFyzbDo

  Adiaris

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/08
Posts: 386

9/13/12 9:30:38 AM#99
Originally posted by grimal
Originally posted by Adiaris

Maybe you should simply not assume everythign is directed at you? I'm not saying you're not enjoying the game, my statement  is general conclusion to these kind of topic, take it or leave it.

Also "making a conclusion based on inaccurate assumptions" seems to be your life motto. 

Wow, project much?

Reread your posts, unless it's someone else typing them for you you should be able to figure it out.

Blocking you btw, there's no point carrying on a conversation with someone that insists on reading things that aren't there and then proceeds to ignore replies in favour of picking on something else.

  Harttz

Novice Member

Joined: 6/17/12
Posts: 92

9/13/12 9:32:08 AM#100

I agree that I wish there were more abilities or that some abilities took longer to unlock. I would also love to see trait lines unlock certain abilities only for that line. I am pretty bored with combat right now on my Ele because it is always the exact same thing repeated over and over and I know that at level 45 I have already unlocked everything I will ever want. 

My personal idea would be to add weapon elite skills that take a lot more time to unlock. They should have more requirement to unlock than just "be using that weapon when an enemy dies." I would also like to see traits that unlock new abilities. They could be unlocked after putting 30 points in a line to make them only available to higher level players.

I also would like to take issue with the idea that you only ever use 3-4 abilities in WoW. That is just false. If you tried that you would be pretty terrible. What I loved about WoW was that while you had a set of core abilities that you used a lot, you also had a bunch of situational abilities that often did really cool things. There was nothing more satisfying than shackling a Death Knight's pet when he was going for his burst or landing a perfectly timed interrupt or landing a perfect CC chain or soothing an enraged Warrior or mob or any number of other cool situational abilities. I think GW2 lacks a bit in this area.

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