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Guild Wars 2

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PvP  » Eternal battlegrounds, am I in the wrong place?

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  xpiher

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/22/08
Posts: 3304

9/11/12 9:04:32 PM#21

Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP

As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.


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  adam_nox

Elite Member

Joined: 7/31/06
Posts: 2086

 
OP  9/11/12 9:21:42 PM#22
Originally posted by xpiher

Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP

As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.

I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80.

 

There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.

  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

9/11/12 9:24:58 PM#23
Originally posted by colddog04

You can tell if someone is 80 by looking at the number next to their name. If there is an arrow, they are below 80. If there is no arrow, it is a legit 80.

 

But yeah, there are a solid amount of legit 80s rolling around already. I am level 80 and full exotic already and people that are lower level don't really stand a chance 1v1.

 

That said, there are way, way more people that are under level 80 right now. I'd recommend either going in with some other people (guildies or friends for instance) or finding the zerg and rolling around with them. It's not a very solo friendly place to be and finding 1v1s isn't all that common.

 

 

I thought in GW2 a low lvl when gets adjusted to lvl 80 in PVP there is no difference because gear doesn't matter? was that incorrect?

I must have read it thousands of time here that a lower level is at even footing with level 80. 


Bite Me

  Bad.dog

Elite Member

Joined: 5/20/10
Posts: 1135

9/11/12 9:31:30 PM#24
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by colddog04

You can tell if someone is 80 by looking at the number next to their name. If there is an arrow, they are below 80. If there is no arrow, it is a legit 80.

 

But yeah, there are a solid amount of legit 80s rolling around already. I am level 80 and full exotic already and people that are lower level don't really stand a chance 1v1.

 

That said, there are way, way more people that are under level 80 right now. I'd recommend either going in with some other people (guildies or friends for instance) or finding the zerg and rolling around with them. It's not a very solo friendly place to be and finding 1v1s isn't all that common.

 

 

I thought in GW2 a low lvl when gets adjusted to lvl 80 in PVP there is no difference because gear doesn't matter? was that incorrect?

I must have read it thousands of time here that a lower level is at even footing with level 80. 

I'm not saying you read it wrong but ....you didn't understand what you read.You may have read that all level 80 gear is about the same ...but nobody ever said level 20 gear was the same as level 80 gear

  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

9/11/12 9:36:32 PM#25
Originally posted by Bad.dog
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by colddog04

You can tell if someone is 80 by looking at the number next to their name. If there is an arrow, they are below 80. If there is no arrow, it is a legit 80.

 

But yeah, there are a solid amount of legit 80s rolling around already. I am level 80 and full exotic already and people that are lower level don't really stand a chance 1v1.

 

That said, there are way, way more people that are under level 80 right now. I'd recommend either going in with some other people (guildies or friends for instance) or finding the zerg and rolling around with them. It's not a very solo friendly place to be and finding 1v1s isn't all that common.

 

 

I thought in GW2 a low lvl when gets adjusted to lvl 80 in PVP there is no difference because gear doesn't matter? was that incorrect?

I must have read it thousands of time here that a lower level is at even footing with level 80. 

I'm not saying you read it wrong but ....you didn't understand what you read.You may have read that all level 80 gear is about the same ...but nobody ever said level 20 gear was the same as level 80 gear

Infact i remember reading it many times that one can start doing PVP from level 1 and since everyone gets boosted to lvl 80 and gear is non existant so there is nothing to worry about. That was before open beta.

After open beta i read many times where people claimed to beat lvl 80 on their lvl 10 or lvl 20 characters. So i am wondering what changed from OB to release? during all these claims one thing was constant that gear is meaningless and everyone is on equal footing and that lvl 80 have no advantage over low level players. I am pretty sure it wasn't about the comparison between lvl 80 players but between low lvls and 80's.

So i guess it was exaggeration by the fans?


Bite Me

  Bad.dog

Elite Member

Joined: 5/20/10
Posts: 1135

9/11/12 9:48:05 PM#26
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by Bad.dog
Originally posted by Nikkita
Originally posted by colddog04

You can tell if someone is 80 by looking at the number next to their name. If there is an arrow, they are below 80. If there is no arrow, it is a legit 80.

 

But yeah, there are a solid amount of legit 80s rolling around already. I am level 80 and full exotic already and people that are lower level don't really stand a chance 1v1.

 

That said, there are way, way more people that are under level 80 right now. I'd recommend either going in with some other people (guildies or friends for instance) or finding the zerg and rolling around with them. It's not a very solo friendly place to be and finding 1v1s isn't all that common.

 

 

I thought in GW2 a low lvl when gets adjusted to lvl 80 in PVP there is no difference because gear doesn't matter? was that incorrect?

I must have read it thousands of time here that a lower level is at even footing with level 80. 

I'm not saying you read it wrong but ....you didn't understand what you read.You may have read that all level 80 gear is about the same ...but nobody ever said level 20 gear was the same as level 80 gear

Infact i remember reading it many times that one can start doing PVP from level 1 and since everyone gets boosted to lvl 80 and gear is non existant so there is nothing to worry about. That was before open beta.

After open beta i read many times where people claimed to beat lvl 80 on their lvl 10 or lvl 20 characters. So i am wondering what changed from OB to release? during all these claims one thing was constant that gear is meaningless and everyone is on equal footing and that lvl 80 have no advantage over low level players. I am pretty sure it wasn't about the comparison between lvl 80 players but between low lvls and 80's.

So i guess it was exaggeration by the fans?.

All gear is the same in spvp ....nobody ever claimed all gear was the same in WVWVW .Not saying it doesn't happen but an equally skilled true 80 geared toon is going to tear an equally skilled 20 level  toon apart

  Atlan99

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/07/08
Posts: 1355

9/11/12 9:54:07 PM#27
Originally posted by adam_nox
Originally posted by xpiher

Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP

As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.

I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80.

 

There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.

What you say is true. The gear gap is going to be huge despite bolstering. Level 80 yellows have an extra stat on them. Which gives a huge edge.

You can still be helpful by doing the things nobody likes to do. For instance you can form a group to take supply camps or you can repair gates after a successful defense.

  Fdzzaigl

Elite Member

Joined: 8/22/09
Posts: 2155

9/11/12 10:02:49 PM#28
Originally posted by adam_nox
Originally posted by xpiher

Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP

As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.

I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80.

 

There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.

I am level 71 atm, today I had the most obnoxious experience with a guild full of obviously extremely geared 80's assaulting our borderlands en masse.

They basically just took our entire map in about 45 minutes, each and every one of them amounted for about 4 non-80's.

I got 2 shot by a level 80 thief in full exotic, knocked him back immediately, but first hit crit for 13k (!!!) and then it was just a matter of getting another little hit in.

Fighting them was impossible 1vs1. Irritating thing was that they weren't even that great, just a bunch of dudes jumping into the middle of crowds using aoe and facerolling their DPS keys while blowing up low-levels.

 

ArenaNet will need to think about rebalancing the way non-80's are bolstered in WvW, otherwise this will turn into another TOR 1-50 bracket with max levels that are unassailable gods.

Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!

  Atlan99

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/07/08
Posts: 1355

9/11/12 10:06:43 PM#29
Originally posted by Fdzzaigl
Originally posted by adam_nox
Originally posted by xpiher

Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP

As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.

I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80.

 

There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.

I got 2 shot by a level 80 thief in full exotic, knocked him back immediately, but first hit crit for 13k (!!!) and then it was just a matter of getting another little hit in.

That's just thieves. I got 4 shot by a thief and I'm 80 in full yellows. He popped haste which meant the time it took me to die was similiar to being 2 shot. Did I mention I was 80 in full yellows with 22k+ health.

Go play some sPvP and you can see how broken the PvP is currently.

  Thornz2000

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/25/12
Posts: 139

9/11/12 10:12:38 PM#30

I get 3 shotted many times cause I'm lvl 29 out there.

1st I thought someone was hacking, but did more thought and realized they are alot higher lvl with much better gear.

I avoid 1v1 crap out there.

The world we know is going away http://www.graystatemovie.com/
Look up Agenda 21 as well.

  xpiher

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/22/08
Posts: 3304

9/12/12 4:36:01 AM#31


Originally posted by Nikkita

Originally posted by colddog04 You can tell if someone is 80 by looking at the number next to their name. If there is an arrow, they are below 80. If there is no arrow, it is a legit 80. But yeah, there are a solid amount of legit 80s rolling around already. I am level 80 and full exotic already and people that are lower level don't really stand a chance 1v1. That said, there are way, way more people that are under level 80 right now. I'd recommend either going in with some other people (guildies or friends for instance) or finding the zerg and rolling around with them. It's not a very solo friendly place to be and finding 1v1s isn't all that common.
I thought in GW2 a low lvl when gets adjusted to lvl 80 in PVP there is no difference because gear doesn't matter? was that incorrect? I must have read it thousands of time here that a lower level is at even footing with level 80.
 

 

Either you read it wrong, or they didn't know the difference between sPvP and WvW.

 


Originally posted by adam_nox

Originally posted by xpiher Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.
I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80. There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.
 

 

There is some serious class balance issues. That said, a group of sub 80s can destroy uncoordinated zergs, and turn the tide of the war by being strategic. Which is why I really enjoy WvW

 


Originally posted by Fdzzaigl

Originally posted by adam_nox

Originally posted by xpiher Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.
I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80. There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.
I am level 71 atm, today I had the most obnoxious experience with a guild full of obviously extremely geared 80's assaulting our borderlands en masse. They basically just took our entire map in about 45 minutes, each and every one of them amounted for about 4 non-80's. I got 2 shot by a level 80 thief in full exotic, knocked him back immediately, but first hit crit for 13k (!!!) and then it was just a matter of getting another little hit in. Fighting them was impossible 1vs1. Irritating thing was that they weren't even that great, just a bunch of dudes jumping into the middle of crowds using aoe and facerolling their DPS keys while blowing up low-levels. ArenaNet will need to think about rebalancing the way non-80's are bolstered in WvW, otherwise this will turn into another TOR 1-50 bracket with max levels that are unassailable gods.
 

 

 

HMM, if this is true then maybe there does need to be something done about gear. IMO, the easiest fix is to allow people to have a set of WvW only armor. Make it worse than full set of exotics (to make getting exotics actually meaningful) but as good as say full set of greens?

 


Originally posted by Atlan99

Originally posted by adam_nox

Originally posted by xpiher Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.
I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80. There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.
What you say is true. The gear gap is going to be huge despite bolstering. Level 80 yellows have an extra stat on them. Which gives a huge edge. You can still be helpful by doing the things nobody likes to do. For instance you can form a group to take supply camps or you can repair gates after a successful defense.
 

 

The fact that no one likes to do those things is exactly the reason why only a handful of servers do well in WvW. Taking supply camps can be the difference between gaining the point advantage or losing it. Small groups going out and distracting the zerg, or setting up strategically placed siege equipment can turn the tide of battle easily. If the small group is coordinated, they can win even when out numbered and out geared (with in reason, 10 people aren't going to win against 100)


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  Fdzzaigl

Elite Member

Joined: 8/22/09
Posts: 2155

9/12/12 5:28:34 AM#32
Originally posted by Atlan99
Originally posted by Fdzzaigl
Originally posted by adam_nox
Originally posted by xpiher

Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP

As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.

I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80.

 

There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.

I got 2 shot by a level 80 thief in full exotic, knocked him back immediately, but first hit crit for 13k (!!!) and then it was just a matter of getting another little hit in.

That's just thieves. I got 4 shot by a thief and I'm 80 in full yellows. He popped haste which meant the time it took me to die was similiar to being 2 shot. Did I mention I was 80 in full yellows with 22k+ health.

Go play some sPvP and you can see how broken the PvP is currently.

I did a significant amount of sPvP, so I know how ridiculous thief burst is atm, mostly the fact that it can be set up while stealthing and that it is pretty much uncounterable sometimes will need to be looked at, not the burst itself. The rest of the classes are kind of fine.

But it wasn't just the thief, it was every one of them: rangers, thiefs, warriors and guardians seemed to be the extend of their class range, all were pretty much immortal in 1vs1. 

 

Tbh, I expected this, endgame gear usually scales far more favourably with these bolster systems.

Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!

  Kuppa

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9/12/12 12:02:22 PM#33
Originally posted by Atlan99
Originally posted by Fdzzaigl
Originally posted by adam_nox
Originally posted by xpiher

Eternal Battle grounds is WvW. If you want an Even playing field, go to sPvP

As others mentioned, more people are below 80 than are at 80. IMO though, there isn't a point to do WvW until you are level 30.  The difference between a level 30 and a level 80 isn't unsurmountable, and you get access to your elitet skill slot at 30, which means you can have a fully functioning build.

I am 31, and I assure you, the difference was insurmountable.  It might be fun to run with a zerg and hope you have numbers and PRETEND you are one of the ones making a difference, but that's pretty much a zerg illusion, unless you are fighting a total scrub 80.

 

There's no way I should be doing 90% of the successful hits and still get someone down only 25% before they destroy me, or there's some serious class imbalances.

I got 2 shot by a level 80 thief in full exotic, knocked him back immediately, but first hit crit for 13k (!!!) and then it was just a matter of getting another little hit in.

That's just thieves. I got 4 shot by a thief and I'm 80 in full yellows. He popped haste which meant the time it took me to die was similiar to being 2 shot. Did I mention I was 80 in full yellows with 22k+ health.

Go play some sPvP and you can see how broken the PvP is currently.

Broken?! not really. As a matter of fact the most usefull and maybe OP class right now in spvp is the Guardian. Dealing with thiefs can be absurdly simple, the problem is in wvw its a bundh of pve folks and wvw folks that don't really get the same experience a spvp person gets.


  Creslin321

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/27/09
Posts: 5424

9/12/12 12:09:46 PM#34

You are definitely correct that fully decked out uber 80's have an advantage in WvW.  But for WvW...I don't have a problem with this.  It means that there is a PvP arena where your PvE accomplishments matter, which is kind of fun.  You have sPvP for the real skill based competition.  And really, the advantage isn't so extreme that 2 lower levels can't take out an 80.

Also, there are PLENTY of things you can do in WvW to support your team even if you aren't as good as an 80 1v1....

1.  Fight in a group.  You will make a difference, just because an 80 can beat you 1v1, doesn't mean that all that damage, support, and control you are doing is useless.

2.  Run supply for siege weapons.  No brainer here...siege weapons win battles.

3.  Man a siege weapon.  I don't care what gear an 80 has...a ballista wins ;).

4.  Run the sanctums for blueprints.  At the end of each sanctum you get two siege blueprints (can even be a golem!), badges of honor, and other loot.  Not bad!

5.  Communicate.  Really, this is the biggest thing in WvW.  So many people don't talk...and then you have players running around randomly because no one told them where the main force is.  Organization is probably the #1 factor that decides winners and losers in WvW.

For the record, my highest char is 36 and I spend MUCH more time in WvW than anything else.

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  NaughtyP

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/11
Posts: 795

9/12/12 12:14:40 PM#35

The "bolster" (not sure what they actually call it in GW2) in this game isn't as generous as say something like Warhammer (when I played WAR at least). You are still at a significant disadvantage here.

It's a bit sucky at first, but I think it gives me something to strive towards.

Enter a whole new realm of challenge and adventure.

  adam_nox

Elite Member

Joined: 7/31/06
Posts: 2086

 
OP  9/12/12 3:40:30 PM#36
It's good to know, but just look at some of the contrary posts in this topic.  the misinformation surrounding this game is massive.
  eoloe

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/15/12
Posts: 6

9/12/12 7:15:34 PM#37

WvWvW is not a place for a fair fight, even with a real lvl 80 character. It's a place of chaos where numbers matter... In Wvw you're a soldier in a squad or in an army. You're not the hero anymore unless you play exceptionnally well. You are part of a group and every arrow, every butlet, every strike counts even if it's not the decisive one.

Of course stats can make a difference but not the whole difference... And at some point most of people will be lvl 80...

What I cannot wait to see is full organized zerg spiking people or pressuring them cleverly like we saw in GW1... I love the WvW irrational chaos of sheep zerging, but I think that an organized guild or zerg will really make the difference (even if they not lvl 80).

 

  Rhoklaw

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9/12/12 7:27:02 PM#38
I could have sworn GW2 wasn't going to be a gear dependent game, but that is obviously a false statement. WvW is no longer a safe place for low levels to try soloing in. Since a fully geared level 80 can easily take on 3 or 4 lower level undergeared enemies. Yes, we're all 80 in WvW but thats only in health and core stats. You don't have the skills or traits, let alone gear to compete with someone who has all of that.

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