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News & Features Discussion  » [Column] Guild Wars 2: Getting Rid of the Grind

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127 posts found
  SBFord

Associate Editor - News Manager

Joined: 6/28/10
Posts: 12845

 
OP  9/10/12 4:54:54 PM#1

Players often complain about the grind in most MMOs today. It's not totally without reason either. Guild Wars 2 seemed to be ready to remove the grind. How has ArenaNet succeeded in this department? Read our latest Guild Wars 2 column to see what we think before adding your ideas in the comments.

I’m not the only player that hates, and fears, the grind. I’m also not the only player that has made my opinion vocal.  ArenaNet has heard the angry growls of the players, and tried to find a way to fix this issue in Guild Wars 2.  So have they taken the grind out of the picture?

The answer is yes, and no.  While playing since launch, I’ve taken a lot of notes about this subject, as it’s one of the major factors that can just drain the fun right out of a game.  It seems that ArenaNet has tackled the grind, taking steps to see what causes grinding, and taking actions to weaken its strong grasp on the leveling process.

Read more of David North's Guild Wars 2: Getting Rid of the Grind.


You really do need a good reason to go around picking up explosives off the ground.

Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

  Vannor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 2972

9/11/12 7:15:10 AM#2

They havn't removed the grind at all. To get the most desired items in the game you have to XP grind (for 100 skill points for EACH item) and/or dungeon grind (50+ runs). They removed the need to grind to be competitive, they did not remove the grind. To get those desired items, the grind is worse than in most other MMOs.

Level grind is gone.. but that's only because they throw experience at you every chance they get. <-- Which I prefer over the old ways. However, it's not because the tasks are more stimulating, you wouldn't keep toasting at tables, collecting the eggs or killing things once the hearts or DE is finished, it's just as boring as any other grind. Lack of linking quest based storylines make almost every heart and every event kinda mundane as well, purposeless. Now we are grinding with even less reasons to grind.

I want the legendary and armor sets grind gone though, it's just too high.. it ruins the game for me and is the reason I'm not loggin in every day anymore.

  Zeus.CM

Novice Member

Joined: 6/13/10
Posts: 1790

www.croatian-maniacs.com

9/11/12 7:16:26 AM#3
People think of hearts as normal grindy quests where you need to kill few centarus. In some way it is true but they forget that killing 10 centaurs is not the only way Arenanet offers to complete certain heart quest. Most of the time you are given a choice, 2-3 or even more different objectives that can be done within the same heart quest. Doing any of those will grant progression in that heart quest and you can complete it by, for instance, kill 3 centaurs, feeding 4 cows and reviving 2 villagers. You don't need to do just the killing. That's why grinding is set to minimum in quests such as this.
  User Deleted
9/11/12 7:23:45 AM#4
Actually no matter which way you slice it, the goal for me is to get to level cap and then play the game. I'm really only interested in wvw. Now to gain every advantage even with scaling, I need to be level capped. So right now yes I am grinding my way to 80 and it very much feels like a grind. That's not to say it is a grind for everyone, but for me it feels like a grind. The problem I'm running into right now as well is that even in wvw I feel like I'm grinding for exp to gain the next level. That might not be the most efficient way to level but that's really all I want to do. I don't want to collect pieces and parts, I don't want to water the corn and feed cows, I don't want to play chess, I want to kill stuff, so for me its a grind.
  sleepr27

Novice Member

Joined: 11/11/11
Posts: 102

9/11/12 7:27:10 AM#5
Getting rid of the grind?! this game to me felt more grindy than WoW or SWTOR. And please don't come with your crap argument of "you have to play this game differently".
  Fadedbomb

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/19/06
Posts: 2149

9/11/12 7:28:22 AM#6

Sorry but the grind was NOT removed whatsoever in GuildWars 2, and is even the worst i've seen than some done previously. You see this pretty well with an alt trying to level it.

Trying to go from 20 to 30 last night on my alt was like pulling teeth. I had already done all that content before on my main (I explored every low tier end area for each race), and it was a literal grind finding xp to level off.

 

Hearts,

Events (they aren't dynamic),

Scripted Boss Fights,

Scripted Champion Fights,

Hidden # of bear-butts to obtain by a Progress Bar,

 

 

Horribly grindy so far, but then again the game is so easy who cares right?

The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.

  Leethe

Novice Member

Joined: 3/12/09
Posts: 876

9/11/12 7:32:38 AM#7

So have they taken the grind out of the picture?

The answer is yes, and no.

and...

 

While Guild Wars 2 isn’t completely grind free, it’s the first MMO I’ve played that doesn’t force the player to go through painful and mind numbing tasks.  Just be giving the player options, they achieved a lot.

None of you actually read this bit at all, did you?

There is NO miracle patch.

95% of what you see in beta won't change by launch.

Hope is not a stategy.
______________________________
"This kind of topic is like one of those little cartoon boxes held up by a stick on a string, with a piece of meat under it. In other words, bait."

  Vannor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 2972

9/11/12 7:34:44 AM#8
Originally posted by Leethe

So have they taken the grind out of the picture?

The answer is yes, and no.

and...

 

While Guild Wars 2 isn’t completely grind free, it’s the first MMO I’ve played that doesn’t force the player to go through painful and mind numbing tasks.  Just be giving the player options, they achieved a lot.

None of you actually read this bit at all, did you?

Yes, I did. I don't agree with it.

  JeroKane

Elite Member

Joined: 2/21/06
Posts: 4823

9/11/12 7:35:57 AM#9
Originally posted by Fadedbomb

Sorry but the grind was NOT removed whatsoever in GuildWars 2, and is even the worst i've seen than some done previously. You see this pretty well with an alt trying to level it.

Trying to go from 20 to 30 last night on my alt was like pulling teeth. I had already done all that content before on my main (I explored every low tier end area for each race), and it was a literal grind finding xp to level off.

 

Hearts,

Events (they aren't dynamic),

Scripted Boss Fights,

Scripted Champion Fights,

Hidden # of bear-butts to obtain by a Progress Bar,

 

 

Horribly grindy so far, but then again the game is so easy who cares right?

This! Sorry OP, but this game is as much grinding as any other MMO.

They just removed quests and replaced them with Events (aka Mythic's WAR public quest system, which Trion copied for their game RIFT as well).

In fact, this game feels more grindy than any other game, as all these events start becoming stale and repetitive after you've gone through a few zones.

I actually started missing some good old Storyline quests like in LOTRO and Everquest 2. :-(

GW2 only has a personal storyline quest series and that's it. :-/

  Indrome

Novice Member

Joined: 5/03/12
Posts: 294

This is like trying to drive straight through Schroedinger's minefield!

9/11/12 7:36:34 AM#10

The innovation from "single-objective tasks" to "multiple-objective tasks" (note: task as a synonym for quest) is simple yet effective and works well in GW2.

 

And at the end of the day when I just feel like killing things I can still resort to filling the hearts by slaughtering 10 to 15 mobs... often 4 at a time without it getting dull.

 

Giving choices to players is a dangerous but rewarding - when well done - feat for a developer. You may not love ANet for not completely doing away with what little leftover grind there is but I myself love them and this game for at least TRYING. (which is more than can be said of f.e. WoW:MoP or SWToR)

 

 

  User Deleted
9/11/12 7:40:11 AM#11

Theyve reduced the grind, but the havent removed it. Crafting is a huge grind, and youre still basically going from quest to quest to level up, though theres plenty of variety to level. To a point, you still have to repeat in order to level. COmbat is grindy as you still end up killing thousands upon thousands of mobs. And I havent yet gotten to the grind for certain gear, requiring tons of karma or gold or tokens.

WvW is also a grind as you just move from castle to castle, and there isnt enough people allowed in to really develope a map wide strategy. Thats after the queue grind of waiting 3 hours to get in.

  Zeus.CM

Novice Member

Joined: 6/13/10
Posts: 1790

www.croatian-maniacs.com

9/11/12 7:55:21 AM#12
Got to level 80 in 150 hours, world completition is 50%. Hard to say I had to repeat something..
  nhat

Novice Member

Joined: 6/26/09
Posts: 67

9/11/12 7:56:48 AM#13

Any game that you play for an extended amount of time going to have some type of grind. FPS you're going to be playing round after round of games playing the same 5 maps over and over again like in CoD.

Sports games you're going to be playing the same game over and over again.

 

  Doomgrin

Novice Member

Joined: 3/21/12
Posts: 2

9/11/12 8:01:52 AM#14

Seems to me that most people that complain about grindy-ness are arguing to just give'em whatever they want....

I want the super-exclusive legendaries... but don't want to work for them....

I wanna be max level to WvW.... but I don't want to level....

I played all the low-level content for every race.... then I was bored when I had to repeat on an alt

I want to become a master at a craft... but I don't want to have to earned it

I picked a high-pop server... but I do not want to qait in a queue to WvW

You know what folks, I am exploring, working on zone completions, crafting to level equivalent gear, and enjoying the game.  Its a game, name a single game where you never repeat the same action!  I have fun because I go around the game looking at every nook and cranny.  When an event pops up or a POI is near-by, this game gives a great sense of "OOO shiny!"

  Butch808

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/16/09
Posts: 319

9/11/12 8:06:03 AM#15
There is no grind, only your perception of it.
  gravesworn

Novice Member

Joined: 6/15/12
Posts: 325

9/11/12 8:07:59 AM#16
How did it get rid of the grind? You still have to preform repetitive tasks to advance
  Vannor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 2972

9/11/12 8:09:12 AM#17
Originally posted by Doomgrin

I want the super-exclusive legendaries... but don't want to work for them....

There's working for them and then there's wasting most of your life on them. I'll grind for them, that's not a problem because I know that grind can't ever be removed from MMOs. But grinding like 100 hours or more for about one item is just unreasonable, it's not just unreasonable... it's madness. Anyone arguing otherwise really need to get over the false sense of achievement they get from MMOs because no matter how you look at it the reality is that you just wasted a hell of a lot of time.

  MMOwanderer

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/23/12
Posts: 417

9/11/12 8:14:17 AM#18
Originally posted by Butch808
There is no grind, only your perception of it.

This. What some can find grindy as hell, some may not. Many raid like crazy and "grind" the best gear until their eyes bleed, but, they may enjoy themselves so much that it doesn't feel like tha for them.

From the BWE, GW2 didn't feel grindy at all to me. Most mmorpgs nowadays give you xp and money left an right, so big deal. I do hear that at 80 the "grind" becomes insane to pay for armor, repairs, waypoint costs, etc. Regardless of it beign optional or not, that's the kind of useless and pointless grinding i don't like.

  User Deleted
9/11/12 8:25:46 AM#19
I hate to come across as the just give me something free type, I'm just saying what I want and anything in the way of what I want and is something I need to do to get there is grinding to me. I just wanted to wvw, this is the one thing this game has over others. That is simply my opinion and my perception. Pretty simple the game is a grind to level cap so I can have the best stats in wvw. I can't help how I feel when I'm playing, and right now I've just begun to associate GW2 more and more with grinding.
  ubermut

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/03/06
Posts: 175

9/11/12 8:40:32 AM#20
Originally posted by Rockniss
I hate to come across as the just give me something free type, I'm just saying what I want and anything in the way of what I want and is something I need to do to get there is grinding to me. I just wanted to wvw, this is the one thing this game has over others. That is simply my opinion and my perception. Pretty simple the game is a grind to level cap so I can have the best stats in wvw. I can't help how I feel when I'm playing, and right now I've just begun to associate GW2 more and more with grinding.

they level you to 80 instantly.  I'm 45 and kicking ass, I have a great group of friends that I roll with and buy siege weapons with.  ya you get an advantage being 80 but at least you get to still kick ass in WvW on the way there.  best of both worlds in my opinion.  I can enjoy WvW now and have something to work for slowly.  I don't feel like I'm grinding, I get about 1.5 levels every time I go into WvW.  It's better than waiting to get to max level to even experience it (alterac valley, etc)

but that is just my opinion.

 
 
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