A lot of the OP's post is subjective, which is fine, but #5 is sort of a ridiculous claim. GW2 has cutting-edge graphics, and they run great when stacked up against other cutting-edge graphics. WoW's graphics are dated, but they will run on a toaster. DCUO's performance is absolutely amazing, and I won't even mention DAOC or CoH.

As far as DE's, you only really notice their repetitveness when you're in an area witha lot of DE's, for a long time. I spent 2 hours near the Inquest lab in Metrica, and it really is jarring to see the same group escorting the same golem 15 times, or the same plant failure spawning the same Fire Elemental.

Speaking of the Fire Elemental... /grovel.

Originally posted by IrishChai

Originally posted by Raven

Originally posted by Gravarg

Originally posted by DMKano

Sorry but the mechanics of Rifts invasions are FAR better - the rifts do not appear in fixed locations and the invasions can take over entire zones.

 

In GW2 dynamic events are a misnomer - they should be called SE's - scripted/static events - always happen in the same places have no impact on the world (some have minimal impact).

So from this point forth I am calling them SEs 

In Rift there are periods when you can relax - lulls between rifts and invasions - this feels more natural. GW2 is non stop same scripted events that happen around the clock repeatedly - its way too forced and annoying.

 

Also Rifts invasions can encompass entire zones - needing multiple groups of players working in different areas of the zone simultaneously. GW2 scripted events happen in small concentrated areas 

Anet should be ashamed for such blatant lying - there is nothing dynamic about running a triggerd script!!

 

+1

 

I haven't played 1 second of GW2, but i have seen my friend play it.  Even he agreed that the invasions in Rift were multitudes better than GW2 Dynamic Events.  We've come to the conclusion all DE's are is questing without NPCs.

I dont know about Rift events cause I never really played it for more than a couple of hours, but the comment about scripted events is spot on, they happen exactly in the same place around the clock, sure there are some fail conditions where you loose some outpost but no one cares about it to begin with, the outposts that can be taken back by mobs are not the area critical ones, they usually have a couple of vendors and are just artificially created just for the event.

One example to support your theory are the dragons, people already know that dragon events spawn roughly every 3h so come that time people start going into the zone where the dragon is and spamming "When is the dragon event starting?" and sure enough it does start at around every 3h. Nothing wrong with these events they are still fun, but they are exactly the same every time, with the exact same objectives and conditions at the exact same place and time.

 

Honestly, I prefer GW2 events a LOT more over Rifts. I'm not sure what it is exactly. It might be as simple as finding everything else about Rift boring, and everything else about GW2 more fun, but I don't see any inherit benefit to true dynamic events instead of scripted events. I'll agree they shouldn't be called DEs, but I like how it's designed regardless of false advertising. I have fun every time so far mainly because the group makeup is always different, and I can swap skills in or out to be more or less helpful depending on that variable. Rift didn't feel like that to me even with 3 'souls' worth of different skills per character. Every rift felt nearly the same as the last, just like all the invasions. Maybe all that is just personal preference rather than one being 'FAR better' over another.

I sort of agree with you, not with the Rift bit cause i havent played enough of that game to have any relevant opinion, but the events in GW2 are fun, after you get passed the mindless lower level ones, there is nothing wrong with them not being truly dynamic, but I wouldnt say they are better than truly dynamic events, mainly because we never really truly had dynamic events, I wouldnt even consider Rifts events dynamic they are area wide but they are not dynamic they serve the same purpose every time and they play almost exactly the same every time.

What Rift introduces that GW2 should introduce and I am sure they will in the future is fuzzy logic, which is a small deviation that leads to the same end, so much like Rifts spawning everyehwere and randomly on a zone, you can have a dragon attack different parts of an area, its not dynamic still you still kill the dragon just in a different part of the area, but it adds some variation. Even having different preparation events would add a bit of variation that creates an illusion of changing world, but its fine as it is, I am sure this kind of logic will be in future events they introduce.

True dynamic events triggered by actual world changes are the way to go in my opinion, but we are still far away from that, and I can't see any game actually pulling this off anytime soon.

Originally posted by Meridion

 2. Exploration and down-leveling - And no. I DO know that this game is not free roam columbus style like Dark and Light or Star Wars Galaxies. It even has zoning. But it REWARDs people for exploring, not with crap, but with actual progression related stuff. And downleveling guarantees that no matter how epic you think you are, a level 5 drake CAN kill you. Love it. 

That's the thing that I hate most about the game, to be honest. It totally kills any sense of character progression and getting better equipment. You never feel powerful, you never feel like all that time you spent playing and leveling made a difference.

When four level 10 mosquitos can kill your level 60 character, there's a problem.

Originally posted by GrayGhost79

Originally posted by DMKano

Originally posted by Smitt3k

Originally posted by DMKano

Sorry but the mechanics of Rifts invasions are FAR better - the rifts do not appear in fixed locations and the invasions can take over entire zones.

 

In GW2 dynamic events are a misnomer - they should be called SE's - scripted/static events - always happen in the same places have no impact on the world (some have minimal impact).

Anet should be ashamed for such blatant lying - there is nothing dynamic about running a triggerd script!!

So from this point forth I am calling them SEs 

I am not sure you are playing GW2. There are alot of dynamic and sweeping changes that events have on the landscape.

I just hit 72 - so tell me a single event in GW2 where the entire zone gets taken over by an event and needs multiple groups in each part of the zone working together.....

There is nothing that even comes close to large epic Rift invasions in GW2, it's small crap where a portion of the map gets impacted for a short time before the scripted event gets triggered again 5 min later.

 

Theres an event in the Sylvari lands that takes over the whole zone. Several DE's go off at once where you must fight these huge creatures as a smaller version of the creature. This leads to another DE if successful where you have to fight this frog chick that randomly turns you into different creatures. 

GW2 DE's are a great improvement over the static Rifts and invasions in Rift. Rift simply doesn't compare. The chains that spread out from the DE's that you find if you listen to the NPC's and follow them are awsome. Getting the full story of an area is also a wonderful thing for me. All these different things are going on but if you listen and read you get to see how it all ties in. One event leads to another. 

No GW2's DEs aren't completely dynamic, they are scripted after all. But they change up within set number of outcomes. Rifts are truly static and got boring very quick. 

 

Maybe you got GW2 and Rift mixed up? Because what you posted was simply flat out wrong and the big events start to happen in the second zone that you get too lol. Being 72 it's hard to believe you missed them all unless you simply bought mats and crafted to 72 like others or simply stayed in the first zone and never left. 

This^^^^ And then some. There are single events that occupy as much space as an entire zone in Rift. Comparing the DE's in GW2 with rift invasions is well, it is silly, and led to my earlier statement that we must not be playing the same game. You can not like the game and that is okay but your info is just wrong.

Originally posted by Slythe

Originally posted by Meridion

 2. Exploration and down-leveling - And no. I DO know that this game is not free roam columbus style like Dark and Light or Star Wars Galaxies. It even has zoning. But it REWARDs people for exploring, not with crap, but with actual progression related stuff. And downleveling guarantees that no matter how epic you think you are, a level 5 drake CAN kill you. Love it. 

That's the thing that I hate most about the game, to be honest. It totally kills any sense of character progression and getting better equipment. You never feel powerful, you never feel like all that time you spent playing and leveling made a difference.

When four level 10 mosquitos can kill your level 60 character, there's a problem.

When every zone that isn't for max level content becomes obsolete and you get no xp, have no reason to ever set foot in it again, can't group with lower level friends, and have zero chance of dying there's a problem.

Originally posted by ShakyMo
Slythe:
Stick to wow type games then, gw2 is not the game for you, it is not a loot grinder.

I'm sorry for being this offensive, but, really, get off your high horse.

He didn't say anything about gear grinding or wow type games. And he IS right, to some extent.

It's not just GW2, but in almost every mmo, rpg and general video game. As we progress further, we become more powerfull allowing us to face stronger challenges.

If i start out week, and keep getting stronger to the point i can face the most powerfull enemies in Tyria face to face and keep strong, it' somewhat stupid if, when facing a farm worm with my legendary gear and weapons, i get killed in 3 shots.

Look, i'm not saying i hate sidekicking. I do like it because, when at 80, all the map becomes equal. Before there's stil level gated content, which i don't like, but after it's all endgame.

But i can still understand what Slythe is talking about when it can feel very weird. The solution is not optional scaling, IMHO since jerks can ruin DE's for the "lolz", but it's still a valid way of looking at things. To me, GW2 progression systems feels bad in many areas from what i tried in beta.

Attacking him with that kind of phrasing only makes you look bad. There's good and bad points to side-kicking.

Originally posted by MMOwanderer

Originally posted by ShakyMo
Slythe:
Stick to wow type games then, gw2 is not the game for you, it is not a loot grinder.

I'm sorry for being this offensive, but, really, get off your high horse.

He didn't say anything about gear grinding or wow type games. And he IS right, to some extent.

It's not just GW2, but in almost every mmo, rpg and general video game. As we progress further, we become more powerfull allowing us to face stronger challenges.

If i start out week, and keep getting stronger to the point i can face the most powerfull enemies in Tyria face to face and keep strong, it' somewhat stupid if, when facing a farm worm with my legendary gear and weapons, i get killed in 3 shots.

Look, i'm not saying i hate sidekicking. I do like it because, when at 80, all the map becomes equal. Before there's stil level gated content, which i don't like, but after it's all endgame.

But i can still understand what Slythe is talking about when it can feel very weird. The solution is not optional scaling, IMHO since jerks can ruin DE's for the "lolz", but it's still a valid way of looking at things. To me, GW2 progression systems feels bad in many areas from what i tried in beta.

Attacking him with that kind of phrasing only makes you look bad. There's good and bad points to side-kicking.

Just want to add that the person you quoted is also wrong, GW2 is a loot grinder game, I am currently grinding to get my first legendary, you need to grind to get better looking gear from instances and you need to grind karma to buy better gear, you even need to grind money or materials to craft gear.

So yeah he is wrong in that respect, what GW2 isnt, is a game where loot is absolutely tied to character progression.

Originally posted by DMKano

Sorry but the mechanics of Rifts invasions are FAR better - the rifts do not appear in fixed locations and the invasions can take over entire zones.

 

In GW2 dynamic events are a misnomer - they should be called SE's - scripted/static events - always happen in the same places have no impact on the world (some have minimal impact).

So from this point forth I am calling them SEs 

In Rift there are periods when you can relax - lulls between rifts and invasions - this feels more natural. GW2 is non stop same scripted events that happen around the clock repeatedly - its way too forced and annoying.

 

Also Rifts invasions can encompass entire zones - needing multiple groups of players working in different areas of the zone simultaneously. GW2 scripted events happen in small concentrated areas 

Anet should be ashamed for such blatant lying - there is nothing dynamic about running a triggerd script!!

 

To each their own. Rifts to me were the most boring, reperitive and annoying thing ever conceived in a game.

With the Gorfang and later on Badlands merges we've had 200+ vs 300+ keep sieges/defences in Warhammer with no lag. I doubt GW2 can handle this kind of stuff.

Also for your info, not a flame here, none cares about PVE anymore in warhammer as it's all PvP (scenarios) and RvR (lakes) from level 1 up till rr100.

GW2 is a niche game and I'm enjoying my time, but for the RvR it's still war. I still play both.

Originally posted by ShakyMo
One thing I would like is for some of the hearts to be multi stage - like tsws quests or wars pqs. I like the way the big quests in tsw took like half an hour, you could log in and do one as a mini adventure and still get a sense of accomplishment if you didn't have much time. There should be some hearts that work like that, with say 8 stages and take half an hour to complete.

So basically turn the Hearts into Dynamic Events? Remember Dynamic Events are not single events but a series of smaller events that form a chain where each Event is affected by the one that preceeded it, and its this fluidity and change, that is based on player outcomes that makes them 'Dynamic'. It many ways I would compare the Dynamic Events to these 'multi-stage' quests that you speak of. Actually much of what you suggest is already fulfilled by the Dynamic Events, where entire chains can take an hour to compete, effect the enfiroment around you, and may end in an epic boss battle. Remember people the Hearts were added not to replace traditional questing but to help guide players in their progressions, vary up the gameplay a bit, and if you talk to the scouts that direct you to the hearts - add a bit of depth and context to the world as you explore.

Also to the people complaining that the Dynamic Events seem 'static' have you ever failed a Dynamic Event?

The success and failure of an event can completely change the area around it. Fail to destroy/stop the rebuilding that bridge? Monster spawns double and the area behind it gets saturated by Centaurs. Fail to build/defend that ice sculpture? Those neutral Ice Elementals become hostile and the craftsment and merchants that were in that cave go away till you neutralize the Elementalists again. The water supply gets poisoned? Toxic blobs will keep overruning that area until someone develops a cure. Its also these success/failure states that determine what other events are available to you. Get on at an odd time at night, or an underpopulated map and fail some events and you will begin to see exactly why Dynamic Events are called 'Dynamic'.

Originally posted by ShakyMo
It's not a grind if you're not forced to do it to be competative. Sure you can grind for better looking gear in gw2, but its a personal choice. Not doing it won't lead to getting 1 shot in pvp or falling behind the pve progression curve.

So its not really a grind.

No thats bullshit, its a grind if you want to achieve something and the only way to achieve that something you want is to "grind" which is widely defined as a repetitive task, your definition of grind is your own and its not the widely accepted definition. 

It has nothing to do with progression curve or being 1 shot in pvp, I have seen you making these strawman arguments constantly.

The end result does not come until later in the equation the grind is simply in the act of attaining something you want, it could be getting a pet rock, if it requires you to kill 1000s of mobs to get it its a grind, the only thing I would argue is that if you like to kill mobs over and over to get a pet rock you might not consider a grind something you enjoy doing.

Originally posted by Raven

No thats bullshit, its a grind if you want to achieve something and the only way to achieve that something you want is to "grind" which is widely defined as a repetitive task, your definition of grind is your own and its not the widely accepted definition. 

It has nothing to do with progression curve or being 1 shot in pvp, I have seen you making these strawman arguments constantly.

The end result does not come until later in the equation the grind is simply in the act of attaining something you want, it could be getting a pet rock, if it requires you to kill 1000s of mobs to get it its a grind, the only thing I would argue is that if you like to kill mobs over and over to get a pet rock you might not consider a grind something you enjoy doing.

You are misrepresenting his point. He is saying it is not a grind because it is entirely optional.

Unlike other games Guild Wars has always followed a 'Horizontal' rather than 'Vertical' gear progression model. Once you reach a level of gear, all gear will have the same base stats (minus slotted sigils, runes, inscriptions), and the only reason to grind is for cosmetic ones.

In his case I would agree, you don't have to grind to remain competative, and the grinding there is totally optional and is done for vanity, rather than progression purposes.

Originally posted by Ariolander

Originally posted by Raven

No thats bullshit, its a grind if you want to achieve something and the only way to achieve that something you want is to "grind" which is widely defined as a repetitive task, your definition of grind is your own and its not the widely accepted definition. 

It has nothing to do with progression curve or being 1 shot in pvp, I have seen you making these strawman arguments constantly.

The end result does not come until later in the equation the grind is simply in the act of attaining something you want, it could be getting a pet rock, if it requires you to kill 1000s of mobs to get it its a grind, the only thing I would argue is that if you like to kill mobs over and over to get a pet rock you might not consider a grind something you enjoy doing.

You are misrepresenting his point. He is saying it is not a grind because it is entirely optional.

Unlike other games Guild Wars has always followed a 'Horizontal' rather than 'Vertical' gear progression model. Once you reach a level of gear, all gear will have the same base stats (minus slotted sigils, runes, inscriptions), and the only reason to grind is for cosmetic ones.

In his case I would agree, you don't have to grind to remain competative, and the grinding there is totally optional and is done for vanity, rather than progression purposes.

His point was very clear, he states that you dont have to grind to stay competitive -> TRUE 

He states that you can grind for cosmetic gear -> TRUE

He states that because its optional its not a grind ( right there the end of his post ) -> UNTRUE

If you want to attain cosmetic gear you need to grind, it doesnt matter if its to stay competitive or not, there is a gear grind in GW2 for cosmetic gear. So if you want any of those you will have to grind. My point was quite clear the end goal of the item does not come into the equation at all, saying something is optional doesnt remove the grind needed to acquire it.

He and you now apparently are arrogantly assuming that people wont want to play the game to acquire the legendary cosmetic gear and the dungeon gear which plenty will, those people have a grind waiting for them when they reach maximum level, optional or not, its a grind to acquire the items.

Edit: Actually even reading his statement out loud, it doesnt make sense.

"There is a grind for cosmetic gear, but because its optional its not a grind" 

Originally posted by DMKano

Sorry but the mechanics of Rifts invasions are FAR better - the rifts do not appear in fixed locations and the invasions can take over entire zones.

 

In GW2 dynamic events are a misnomer - they should be called SE's - scripted/static events - always happen in the same places have no impact on the world (some have minimal impact).

So from this point forth I am calling them SEs 

In Rift there are periods when you can relax - lulls between rifts and invasions - this feels more natural. GW2 is non stop same scripted events that happen around the clock repeatedly - its way too forced and annoying.

 

Also Rifts invasions can encompass entire zones - needing multiple groups of players working in different areas of the zone simultaneously. GW2 scripted events happen in small concentrated areas 

Anet should be ashamed for such blatant lying - there is nothing dynamic about running a triggerd script!!

 

agree 100%....resubbed back to Rift yesterday