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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Are MMO burnouts bad for the genre?

17 posts found
  Rivalen

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 509

 
OP  9/05/12 5:13:28 PM#1

I'm writing this in GW2 forums but it actually applies to all new games.

Are MMO burnouts destroying the genre?

In my opinion, yes.

 

On the 1st MMOs players actually looked for fun activities, finding new things, learning and overall having a fun free time activity.

In the last years alot more players have learned MMO mechanics and playing stopped being about having fun and became an endless job to "beat the game", "be the l33t" and so on.

People power gamer to maximum level in for 4 or 5 days, trying at all times to get "faster better points" instead of a better gaming experience, people would rather lose in pvp if it gives them more points, people would rather bypass fun content if grinding gives them more experience or loot, exploit rather then earning, complain instead of trying harder...

 

In the last few days i've read all of the above and it made me quite sad, not for playing GW2 (i'm having a blast with the game) but with the MMO community.

 

Todays games are better designed (for the most part), it's just the community and players that are worst.

 

There's just too many burnouts, people that hate MMOs now but play them to either "beat the game" or try to find the initial rush their 1st mmo gave them.

 

/flame away.

 

 

  Lorkii

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/04/12
Posts: 90

9/05/12 5:15:36 PM#2
When I read "today's games are better" thats all it took to realize this is a joke thread.
  Rivalen

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 509

 
OP  9/05/12 5:23:18 PM#3
Originally posted by Lorkii
When I read "today's games are better" thats all it took to realize this is a joke thread.

Imagine that your favorite games are released today and played by todays community, do you really believe it would be the same experience?

 

  jpnole

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/13/10
Posts: 1654

9/05/12 5:27:28 PM#4
Originally posted by Rivalen

I'm writing this in GW2 forums but it actually applies to all new games.

Are MMO burnouts destroying the genre?

In my opinion, yes.

 

On the 1st MMOs players actually looked for fun activities, finding new things, learning and overall having a fun free time activity.

In the last years alot more players have learned MMO mechanics and playing stopped being about having fun and became an endless job to "beat the game", "be the l33t" and so on.

People power gamer to maximum level in for 4 or 5 days, trying at all times to get "faster better points" instead of a better gaming experience, people would rather lose in pvp if it gives them more points, people would rather bypass fun content if grinding gives them more experience or loot, exploit rather then earning, complain instead of trying harder...

 

In the last few days i've read all of the above and it made me quite sad, not for playing GW2 (i'm having a blast with the game) but with the MMO community.

 

Todays games are better designed (for the most part), it's just the community and players that are worst.

 

There's just too many burnouts, people that hate MMOs now but play them to either "beat the game" or try to find the initial rush their 1st mmo gave them.

 

/flame away.

 

 

Not sure why this is in the GW2 forums. Should be in General. But I guess if you want to sneak a negative themed thread topic into the GW2 forum then congrats.

  Rivalen

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 509

 
OP  9/05/12 5:32:50 PM#5

It's in the GW2 forums because i'm playing GW2 and i see it everytime i log on or check a forum.

There's a dude in my guild that leveled to 80 in 4 days, all he does is whine that glory should be faster to earn, that there's no content for him and so on.

Like my 1st paragraph states, this is about all new mmo and i'm ok if you report it to get changed to general.

 

What really baffles me is that no one is actually answering to the thread...just bypassing the idea and attacking it in other ways.

  Krytycal

Novice Member

Joined: 4/17/06
Posts: 527

9/05/12 5:46:26 PM#6
Burning out in a game for playing it too much and rushing to the level cap (which is what you refer to in your post), is not the same as MMO burnout. The latter refers to players who are burned on the endless list of all-too-familar generic fantasy MMOs that have plagued the industry for the last decade. This group of players often don't even make it past the low levels before they quit.
  Rivalen

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 509

 
OP  9/05/12 5:49:41 PM#7
Originally posted by Krytycal
Burning out in a game for playing it too much and rushing to the level cap (which is what you refer to in your post), is not the same as MMO burnout. The latter refers to players who are burned on the endless list of all-too-familar generic fantasy MMOs that have plagued the industry for the last decade. This group of players often don't even make it past the low levels before they quit.

But isn't the new generation of players that rush to max level and complain about whatever features the game have, also a type of burnouts?

If you're rushing everything in order to try to find some kind of thrill, isn't that a sympton of being burned out?

 

It rather not discuss semantics though, definitions of burnout are not important to this debate, what's important is the effect of burned out players / rushers / carrot on the stick addicts a problem to genre?

  User Deleted
9/05/12 5:56:40 PM#8

Dont hate the player hate the game :)

  Wickedjelly

Novice Member

Joined: 4/19/09
Posts: 5064

The Dude abides

9/05/12 6:00:04 PM#9

No they aren't

If they simply left the genre completely there would be less overall sales. So if anything companies want the burnouts and the long termers. Really don't get your logic.

What is bad for the genre are companies thinking they can be the next WoW, trying to copy other mmos too much, not listening to their fanbase, or learning from past mistakes made by companies.

Those are some things that have been bad for the genre.

1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  Krytycal

Novice Member

Joined: 4/17/06
Posts: 527

9/05/12 6:06:55 PM#10
Originally posted by Rivalen
Originally posted by Krytycal
Burning out in a game for playing it too much and rushing to the level cap (which is what you refer to in your post), is not the same as MMO burnout. The latter refers to players who are burned on the endless list of all-too-familar generic fantasy MMOs that have plagued the industry for the last decade. This group of players often don't even make it past the low levels before they quit.

But isn't the new generation of players that rush to max level and complain about whatever features the game have, also a type of burnouts?

If you're rushing everything in order to try to find some kind of thrill, isn't that a sympton of being burned out?

 

It rather not discuss semantics though, definitions of burnout are not important to this debate, what's important is the effect of burned out players / rushers / carrot on the stick addicts a problem to genre?

You can't pile both groups of players under the same banner though. Ultimately both types of players quit, but they do so for different reasons. The burn outs who quit because they play 30 hours a day for a week and then realize there's nothing left to do simply have unrealistic expectations. No brand new game will release with enough content to satisfy this type of playstyle, especially when they choose to ignore a lot of content on the way to the top.

 

In the case of these players, yes, I believe they're hurting the genre because they have unrealistic expectations of just how much content a game can realistically deliver. I mean, just look at single player games. You'd be lucky to get 100 hrs worth of content in one playthrough, and those are the good ones.

 

The other type of burnouts are players who have played a lot of MMOs, and are burned out of MMOs in general. Not because they play MMOs for 30 hours a day, but because they feel (with a few exceptions I'm sure) that MMOs have become stale in the last decade. Same crap on different wrappers. I don't think these types of players are hurting the genre, if anything, it's those players who will eventually push for true innovation in MMOs. Only after enough people get burned out on generic fantasy MMO #582045 and stop buying whichever newest one is out will develovers re-evaluate their tried (tired?)-and-true formula and once again start getting creative with their MMOs.

  User Deleted
9/05/12 6:09:53 PM#11

Hello

Or should I say hell no!

MMOs should not and actually in my opinion no longer exist because people tend to play them in a dumped down single player style.

I guess it is because of all those artificial extensions of their psyche like facepalm and dicker. The way simple people or those with commercial targets communicate "socially" nowadays is anonymous, dumped down - just sick. So how can You expect for a massive multiplayer game to exist in such a lonely world. Not to mention that most of the people demand simplicity in video games as their learning curve is the same of the "xxx idol".

Be afraid of us veterans, be afraid of complicity and social skills.

Regards

  Tardcore

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/13/09
Posts: 2370

"A strange game. The only winning move is not to post."

9/05/12 6:11:46 PM#12
Originally posted by Rivalen

I'm writing this in GW2 forums but it actually applies to all new games.

Are MMO burnouts destroying the genre?

In my opinion, yes.

 

On the 1st MMOs players actually looked for fun activities, finding new things, learning and overall having a fun free time activity.

In the last years alot more players have learned MMO mechanics and playing stopped being about having fun and became an endless job to "beat the game", "be the l33t" and so on.

People power gamer to maximum level in for 4 or 5 days, trying at all times to get "faster better points" instead of a better gaming experience, people would rather lose in pvp if it gives them more points, people would rather bypass fun content if grinding gives them more experience or loot, exploit rather then earning, complain instead of trying harder...

 

In the last few days i've read all of the above and it made me quite sad, not for playing GW2 (i'm having a blast with the game) but with the MMO community.

 

Todays games are better designed (for the most part), it's just the community and players that are worst.

 

There's just too many burnouts, people that hate MMOs now but play them to either "beat the game" or try to find the initial rush their 1st mmo gave them.

 

/flame away.

 

 

Well let me start by saying I agree with you. I feel that MMO burnouts that continue to pounce on every new MMO like a swarm of locusts in the vain hope they can recapture a sense of fun, only to quickly leave the game in disgust when it fails to warm their jaded and bitter hearts, and then go on a forum rampage decrying how much Game X sucks, are INDEED bad for the MMO genere.

However I have to add a contrary viewpoint since I'm a jerk like that.

Is it truly the gamers fault when AAA companies continue to only release superficial, casual friendly, instant gratification, mental masturbation simulators, instead of living breathing game worlds with some sense of meaning and consequence?

Its not suprising that these people are bored and burnt out considering they have grown older while their hobby has continued to become a more and more watered down version of "Dick and Jane" or "Biggles Learns to Fly".

To sum up I feel that both the gamer and game maker are at fault.

The jaded gamer for continuing to throw money at games that don't apeal to them because they don't have the self discipline to NOT play.

And the lazy game maker for just distiling the same damn game formula down into less and less interesting products.

 

"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "

  Lorkii

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/04/12
Posts: 90

9/06/12 5:51:19 AM#13
Originally posted by Rivalen
Originally posted by Lorkii
When I read "today's games are better" thats all it took to realize this is a joke thread.

Imagine that your favorite games are released today and played by todays community, do you really believe it would be the same experience?

 

It s not the same thing. Most games nowadays, you don t need to rely on anyone, hence community sucks. Back in the day, you needed each other, so you can t compare them.

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16773

9/06/12 6:00:02 AM#14

I been playing MMOs since MEridian 59 came out in 1996. The powergamers you are talking about are not really burnouts, they showed up in MMOs around 2005 and every time since then they run through a game in a few days, complain about it for a few weeks and then start over again.

Burnouts kinda makes it sound like they played normally before.

Whenever a Wow expansion comes out they are the ones getting max level in 3 days, or whenever a new game comes out the same. 

I think they should go back to "Lineage 2". See if you can beat that in 3 days.

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19249

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

9/06/12 6:12:07 AM#15

I dunno, I actually play very casually, and I've been burning out on MMO's pretty quickly, usually lasting no more than a month or three with titles such as LoTRO, Rift, Tera, SWTOR and TSW just to name a few. 

In my case, its not because the content is too limited, its because the opportunities for socialization are too limited, the game designs weak and unispiring, and I find myself playing largely solo and therefore the titles have as much longevity as a typical single player RPG, a couple of months at best.

Yeah, sure, the power gamers the OP talks about will never be happy, they probably quit DAOC back in the day too after just a few months, but I hung in there (on and off) for almost 2.75 years)

 

Arrogant, Condescending, Dismissive, Elitist, "Meany", you speak as if these are bad things?
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  slowpoke68

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/19/08
Posts: 350

9/06/12 6:14:38 AM#16
Originally posted by Rivalen
Originally posted by Lorkii
When I read "today's games are better" thats all it took to realize this is a joke thread.

Imagine that your favorite games are released today and played by todays community, do you really believe it would be the same experience?

 

Now that is insightful.

  Odinthedark1

Novice Member

Joined: 10/06/11
Posts: 338

"A fool learns from his own mistakes, a wise man learns from the mistakes of others."

9/06/12 6:24:15 AM#17
Originally posted by Krytycal
Originally posted by Rivalen
Originally posted by Krytycal
Burning out in a game for playing it too much and rushing to the level cap (which is what you refer to in your post), is not the same as MMO burnout. The latter refers to players who are burned on the endless list of all-too-familar generic fantasy MMOs that have plagued the industry for the last decade. This group of players often don't even make it past the low levels before they quit.

But isn't the new generation of players that rush to max level and complain about whatever features the game have, also a type of burnouts?

If you're rushing everything in order to try to find some kind of thrill, isn't that a sympton of being burned out?

 

It rather not discuss semantics though, definitions of burnout are not important to this debate, what's important is the effect of burned out players / rushers / carrot on the stick addicts a problem to genre?

You can't pile both groups of players under the same banner though. Ultimately both types of players quit, but they do so for different reasons. The burn outs who quit because they play 30 hours a day for a week and then realize there's nothing left to do simply have unrealistic expectations. No brand new game will release with enough content to satisfy this type of playstyle, especially when they choose to ignore a lot of content on the way to the top.

 

In the case of these players, yes, I believe they're hurting the genre because they have unrealistic expectations of just how much content a game can realistically deliver. I mean, just look at single player games. You'd be lucky to get 100 hrs worth of content in one playthrough, and those are the good ones.

 

The other type of burnouts are players who have played a lot of MMOs, and are burned out of MMOs in general. Not because they play MMOs for 30 hours a day, but because they feel (with a few exceptions I'm sure) that MMOs have become stale in the last decade. Same crap on different wrappers. I don't think these types of players are hurting the genre, if anything, it's those players who will eventually push for true innovation in MMOs. Only after enough people get burned out on generic fantasy MMO #582045 and stop buying whichever newest one is out will develovers re-evaluate their tried (tired?)-and-true formula and once again start getting creative with their MMOs.

Its already happening many games have died cause of this or are dying....from aion, to swtor, to tera (or TSW), and now to gw2....the entire population keeps jumping ship and leaving dead games in their wake with thousands who enjoyed the game but cant play it cause other players are few and far between. i loved Tera...the combat was awesome but like people said there just wasnt enough content to keep peoples interest...i never even made it to 60 cause after taking a couple week break from games in general i came back to a dead server...and now im back to WoW for MoP....

Edit: this isnt to say that some of them are still dying, Aion has made quite a comeback in terms of population due to F2P, and im sure SWTOR will jump back up a bit....