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News & Features Discussion  » [Column] Guild Wars 2: Is Guild Wars 2 The MMO Savior?

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195 posts found

Novice Member

Joined: 8/25/12
Posts: 42

8/29/12 7:44:55 PM#141
Originally posted by fundayz

The problem with Azuriel's blog post is that he completely ignores the fact that even though Dynamic Events, WvW and the End-game maybe not be perfect they are still leaps and bounds better than the current alternative.


He commits the Nirvana Fallacy: "the logical error of comparing actual things with unrealistic, idealized alternatives."


For example, Azuriel claims that Dynamic Events are boring if there are no other players around to do them with but he ignores the fact that every single themepark MMO has the same questing mechanics yet are extremely restrictive in how you may play with others. How is regular questing better in any way when it is the same thing but with annoying and arbitrary quest givers, zero consequence on the world and no player scaling?

The same goes for WvW. Sure, it may be a zergfest some of the time or require you to bash on doors for a while, but where is this fabled game that has mass-scale PvP that doesn't have the exact same flaws?


Long story short, you don't have to be perfect to still be the best. GW2 is obviously not perfect but it is still the best option when you compare it to its competition (varying with personal taste of course). 


Dude completely agree, ppl say that this features are bad. Does any other game have something new that is better ? I dont think so. This is a new concepts ppls the game just started officially like any other launch, except d3 that was the worst of them all. This game need to run a little bit give it a month of 2 and than just maybe another discussion can be done regarding this game and about how much time will last.


Novice Member

Joined: 1/05/04
Posts: 5057

Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were. But without it we go nowhere. -Carl Sagan

8/29/12 7:49:36 PM#142
Originally posted by Tibernicus
Originally posted by Channce
With this or any other game, i could care less if its the "savior" to anything.  If its fun, ill play, if its not, I wont.  All these threads about it being great or terrible are like when I see someone in any game say "im bored"...really, and you cant think of anything else to do?

You clearly don't think about the industry as a whole...

What constitutes a savior of MMOs anyway? Is it not enough for a game to just be good and fun? How do you even judge if a game lives up to this idealized notion of a "savior of MMOs?" A notion that is not only impossible to really define but one that is also unique to each individual?


Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/25/12
Posts: 1110

I'm only playing the role chosen for me. Who you supposed to be?

8/29/12 7:51:03 PM#143

Dont believe in ANY MMO being any type of savior.  At the end of the day they are just games.  GW2 is far from perfect, but its the most fun I have had in an MMO for a loong time.  Thats enough to keep me interested and invest in the game.

Innovation is a funny concept because mostly everything comes from something else.  I dont see GW2 innovating the genre, but I DO see it innovating how to execute what we already know and love in the genre.  Thats important because no one else has done it (this well) for years.  

To me its the simple things like no node stealing, ability to send mats to the bank without leaving. Everyone having the ability to heal.  What I have found is these simple changes allow me to shift my focus from 'game' management to having fun.  I dont need to check my map for the next quest hub because there isnt one.  I find things to do just by walking around.  They may sound mundane to most but it elevates the experience for me to something most enjoyable.

I hope its hear to stay.


Novice Member

Joined: 3/27/07
Posts: 16

Every virgin at heart a Witch the Devil is an angel too.

8/29/12 8:26:41 PM#144
The story mentions GW2 possible slumping due to not having a cash shop... GW1 really didnt ever suffer from not having a cash shop, every year they would release an update (box) everyone bought. Population was always there  because the game was fun to play... I have yet to play GW2 (i suck I know) GW2 doesnt need a cash shop or a pay to play model set up . D3  doesnt feel very solid of a game with their RMAH, why ruin a good thing

Novice Member

Joined: 8/16/12
Posts: 55

We will always remember your sacrifice, Louisoux! RIP

8/29/12 9:48:02 PM#145

I didn't know MMO's needed saving, I thought they just needed change from the same old stale outdated formula.

GW2 is change. It is the evolution on questing, combat, lasting artstyle, community, enemy NPC AI (they fight each other!!), and the scale of the world of an MMO.


I do think these fans who defend these game like religious fanatics are hurting the games industry though.

Just imagine if the SWTOR fans were outraged at the clearly garbage gamethat was shown in all the trailers and info released up to its release instead of blindly defeding that aweful game. BioWare might have gone back to the drawig board and attempted to fix it the same way Square Enix is fixing FFXIV.


I've been planning on buying GW2 stuff from the item shop but they're making it hard for me to want to put money in their game because I feel like they're trying to rip me off. I don't want to pay real money for consumable items, I want to buy apperence armor that I can ware all the time like I did in GW1, defiitly not an armor skin thst forces me to buy more stuff from the item store to even use it. (Yes, I know I can just buy everything with in game money, but if that's what you think then you're missing my point. I want to spend real money to help support the game)

This is the main reason I hate the F2P model and want a subscription.


A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies, the man who never reads lives only one.

We will always remember your sacrifice, Louisoux!

  User Deleted
8/29/12 10:10:18 PM#146
I do have to ask, where is the article on how wrong the haters have been? We're waiting. All we've seen is how wrong the fanbois supposedly are. Proof positive? none. Still waiting on how the haters and naysayers are the ones in the right.... Guess we'll never see that article.

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/29/12
Posts: 339

8/29/12 10:42:17 PM#147
Originally posted by itgrowls
I do have to ask, where is the article on how wrong the haters have been? We're waiting. All we've seen is how wrong the fanbois supposedly are. Proof positive? none. Still waiting on how the haters and naysayers are the ones in the right.... Guess we'll never see that article.

MMORPG has written a plethora of fluff pieces promoting gw2. 


Novice Member

Joined: 5/13/07
Posts: 70

The word cornucopia comes to mind.

8/29/12 11:07:55 PM#148
Best writer on staff?I would argue so.  I am guilty of some of the same things as well but I always do support the game I choose with my purchase and sub. I've said before the downfall of the games some of  us older mmo vets wish for is simply due to a lack of subs in the market when those games come out.My own fantacism has probably turned off a few the same as I have been by others. Bravo Mr Victor Barreiro.



Novice Member

Joined: 2/19/09
Posts: 7

8/29/12 11:11:50 PM#149
Dinamic Event is the best feature in GW2. So, people will group for the same cause at the same time without waiting and form formal group. It is very exciting. I think SWTOR and TSW must do the same to keep people playing, afterall it is MMO, player interaction is essential for game life time. Expansions and stories telling will not keep player for long.

Novice Member

Joined: 7/14/10
Posts: 183

8/29/12 11:26:51 PM#150
Originally posted by WhiteLantern
Originally posted by sadeyx

Just as Blizzard started the trend of selling expensive pets to people for cash,  which made it OK foreveryone else to do it....   Guildwars2 will set the trend that its 'ok' to charge a premium price for a F2P MMO.

So no, your right.  GW2 isnt the savior of MMO's,  if anything this pushes MMO's even more into the realms of 'cash machine product' than it ever was.


Thats why I wont buy GW2, not because its a good or bad game, but because it sets a standard for a disturbing and worrying future of online games.


I guess you could say I dont support what ANET are trying to do, under the disguise of a game and massive hype.

Correct me if I'm wrong (groggy from a morning of meetings), but are you saying that an MMO must charge a sub to be worth a box price?

I think he's actually just saying that he doesn't want to pay for anything and that developers should be happy that people are playing their games.

Little does he know, the world doesn't work like that.



Joined: 6/27/09
Posts: 965

8/30/12 12:36:31 AM#151

what exactly is a Savior of MMO? how can a MMO be crowned the savior? it's really a gamble, and it's an endless debate

sure, while i already said since the beginning that GW2 will not be a saviour, and it proves me right, but again, it is definitely the best MMO to come out within the last 8 years since the dominance of WoW started

and i agree that Dynamic Events, unless keep updated, it will become a bit stale, very much agreed


even after 4 days of playing, i started to see the point, it's all the same thing again and again, up till the point that i dont even care to join some of the DEs anymore

So What Now?


Novice Member

Joined: 11/19/09
Posts: 17

8/30/12 12:41:52 AM#152
The only true savior to mmos will be an actual visor viewed Immersive .hack// mmo. That will topple the king known as blizzard, that will rally the masses, it will revolutionize gaming but until someone actually gets around to making it there will be many false prophets.

Novice Member

Joined: 3/18/07
Posts: 3066

You make, you buy, you die!

8/30/12 1:18:50 AM#153

It's a sad state when people needs education on behaviour.


But, hey, it's internet.

I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"


Novice Member

Joined: 8/20/05
Posts: 462

8/30/12 2:03:57 AM#154

The short answer is no, its only a game.

The longer anwser is the new DE type mechanics are a vast improvement over quest hubs and could help the genre immensly if other devs follow suit by getting rid of quest hubs and replacing them with something a lot more fun.


I would like to add too that Arenanet will not depend solely on cashshop purchases to future fund the game. As in GW1 they will release expansions and quite likely DLC's of various types to keep the game fresh and the revenue coming in. They will not lower the price of the original game for a very long time either. People are enticed to pay the full price due to the lack of a sub fee. The Cash shop though will add additional revenue, how much is anyones guess at this point.

On a side note - anyone know what they spent to develop the game? With 1 million boxes sold I would say they are off to a good start but thats still only $50 or $60 Million. They may need another million or so boxes sold to turn a decent profit.


Novice Member

Joined: 1/11/11
Posts: 181

8/30/12 2:09:10 AM#155
no game has died from rabid fanboyism. They die on their own merits. All  you need to do is play a game to tell if it is bad or not. I think this article places a bit too much importance on fanboys forum posting habits contributing to anything relating to a games success or failure.

Elite Member

Joined: 2/08/08
Posts: 487

Try not!Do or do notThere is no try.

8/30/12 2:10:54 AM#156
First off ArenaNet has never once said they plan to rival WoW nor have they said their game is the end all of MMOs. Anet has maintained the fact that they have and will make a game that people like to play and is fun. Now that said.... coming from one who has played every beta and now the headstart and launch of the game... it is one heck of a fun game to play! There is NO ! to be found. The dynamic events are unlike anything you have seen in other games. Sometimes you might be heading down a path and near a town, a child runs up to you "Help, there is fighting on the bridge" the child says. Head to the bridge and Bam an event starts or is in progress. The random npc conversations alone has more time put into them than what most MMO companies put into 80% of their game. It takes some getting use to because much about the game is unlike what you have seen or played in other MMOs, but once you get use to the play style it IS a super fun game to play! So far this game has changed what I expect from MMOs in the future.
  User Deleted
8/30/12 2:43:28 AM#157

I love the game, but the way they are handling communication between dev and player is pretty horrible.

Those that say they use twitter and facebook, that is not communication. Those are 'extras', that those of you that decide to subscribe to may use. Not everyone in the world wished to open their privacy to FB and twit.

ANet has a game site, it has been closed since release, nothing goes there of any worth other to sell the game because they don't want bad news to hurt sales currently, let's keep it real. And that fact has now got me worried, they haven't released any valid form of communication with their stamp on it, because they don't want to be held accountable for some reason. Why?

Fix the forums, and start communicationg like a reputable company and not a bunch of teenagers texting. Total fail for a company that has put out such a great product.


Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5280

8/30/12 3:15:36 AM#158

If you start touting a game as a MMO saviour you are setting yourself up for a very big fall. Take the game for what it is and enjoy it, trying to set it up as some paragon of the genre is a fruitless exercise.

Games have died from Fanboyism I am afraid, AC2 players had a lot to do with that games demise for example. You can listern to the fanbase too much. Giving players what they want assumes they know what they want, most do not.

Those who are talking about dev communication, you do realise that once a MMO is launched major changes are not going to happen over the space of a few days just because you posted on Twitter?


Novice Member

Joined: 2/26/06
Posts: 308

8/30/12 3:34:56 AM#159
Originally posted by Rider071

I love the game, but the way they are handling communication between dev and player is pretty horrible.

Those that say they use twitter and facebook, that is not communication. Those are 'extras', that those of you that decide to subscribe to may use. Not everyone in the world wished to open their privacy to FB and twit.

ANet has a game site, it has been closed since release, nothing goes there of any worth other to sell the game because they don't want bad news to hurt sales currently, let's keep it real. And that fact has now got me worried, they haven't released any valid form of communication with their stamp on it, because they don't want to be held accountable for some reason. Why?

Fix the forums, and start communicationg like a reputable company and not a bunch of teenagers texting. Total fail for a company that has put out such a great product.

Jesus man give them time, they've ended up with a hit on their hands and its probably bedlam over at Anets offices with all hands on deck keeping the servers floating, killing bugs & making sure people get access to the game.. i for one couldnt access on release day with a continous error but the following day was in no problems.. so getting the forums up and running with all the problems and infrastructure that those entail can wait until the you know game is stable and running perfect for everyone


Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/05/03
Posts: 6521

"I fight so you don't have to."

8/30/12 4:38:07 AM#160
Originally posted by GrumpyCharr

I can't speak for an entire genre - but for ME, It was the MMO savior.  

I had given up on MMO's.  I truly had.  I was burned out by the same game with different lore and skins.  The names were changed and the places the same.  Some were more sandboxy, but just weren't for me.

I played EQ, EQ2, WoW, Warhammer Online, Lotro, EvE, Aion and RIFT.  My poor friends and family followed me from game to game after I promised that each of them were goning to be "it".  

I felt like such a fool.  No more, I had given up and figured that the genre had just stagnated and there was nothing left for me.

Guild Wars 2 was my MMO savior.  

Maybe you can say exactly what features is making the game stand out and be the savior of MMORPGs for you? Because I keep playing it, an altough a solid ThemePark MMO, it doesn't seem that special.

Dynamic Events are nice but not revolutionary, they feel quite similar to Rifts and Public Quests. Same with the heart quest.

Game is class and strictly level based with the twist of weapon based skills. Altough interesting, really not revolutionary.

Crafting is pretty much as in other games.

Game does not have a subscription fee but does have a cash shop like any F2P game.

Story quests are nothing new and quite juvenile, the one's in SW:TOR were far better.

Combat is fast paced but still TAB target based. TERA's combat is more innovative and even DCU had better combat.

WvWvW is nice but I would prefer faction based because that would make more sense.

So all in all the game is nice but I am just not seeing what all the fuss is about.

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