Originally posted by Sovrath

I get wrapped up in our genre's culture, and expect everyone to know every MMO that's coming out like I do. When in reality, despite recent high-profile releases and the phenom known as WoW, we're just a gaming subculture.

That and the MMO community at large is very hateful, vengeful and disrespectful.  Don't get me wrong, for every bad egg.... there is probably 5-10 good ones.... but who screams the loudest?

If a player doesn't like the game.... what do they do?  He/she runs to the forums and posts some pretty awful stuff about the game, about the developers, and about the fans.  Rarely do you ever see, "It just wasn't for me, kthx bye, and oh, here's my stuff!" 

When the genre was still young, forums were usually places to discuss, theorycraft and ultimately enjoy the game and its community outside the game.  Now-a-days, you shouldn't forget to bring your kevlar, riot gear, and mace with you.  The tantrums are just awful.

I did not even know TSW launched until after it launched.

The questing and lore in this game outshines most other games out there. The combat though leaves something to be desired. The loot feels very meh. Need good loot to keep the hamster wheel turning.

I am of the belief the lack of advertising is what is dooming this game.

The MMO player will lose good game in the future. How fun will it be to play wow v12 or GW 6 and so on. No one will develope big MMO when the player are just like fotballsfans and stick to one game.

TSW have one still change, and that is at the far east marked over the year. Then pandabear and GW player probebly are getting bored by doing the same thing again and again.

the game is great, but is new and therefore it will take time before the game will rise.

stay on track FC

Originally posted by BadSpock

I really don't understand all these "ahead of its time" comments - if anything TSW appeared to me as being a game stuck in the past.

Linear, story-driven, grind quest-hub to max level, sandwich hit-point-swapping combat, whack a mole Trinity, and grind instanced end-game PvP and PvE.

You know what would have happened if TSW had the IP recognition/popularity and marketing/hype of TOR? The exact same thing that has happened to TOR. Burn brightly, then burned out.

+1 

the only innovative or different thing for me was the IDEA of the setting (yes, yes skill wheel and google quests) however whether you think it's special or yawn I'm surprised at how low sales were given that you would form an opinion after playing it, and thus having purchased it. I expected more of a TOR effect similar to what BadSpock describes. I would be curious to know how many people tried their betas and weekends and how many endedup buying.

Originally posted by Harttz
Another thing I think that really hurt them was that they used their beta tests for testing rather than for advertisement. I think a lot of people who played the beta weekends to try the game came out very unimpressed. I first played the 2nd beta weekend and didn't really like the game very much. I managed to pick up a closed beta key and decided to give the game another try and really started to like it much more after they started polishing it and I had more time in the world. For most people you only get one chance at a first impression and I think TSW's first impression wasn't very strong during those open beta's.

I'd agree with this. I was in the early beta and some first impressions were pretty awful. They got fixed before launch, but anyone reviewing the game from beta only would have had a terribad impression. I didn't realize until the last BWE that they were using it for marketing, and then I was just confused. Even Suzie's very first, preliminary review mentioned some of those terrible first impressions. I was really happy she stuck with it and came back to see it with the fixes in place.

TSW is the first game to really grab and hold my attention since SWG. I'm really enjoying playing in my own world, wearing clothes that reflect what I could take out of my own wardrobe, discovering new aspects of "real" history while I explore and trying to figure out how to defeat the dungeons with my friends :)

Yes it's buggy, every MMO I've ever played has been, they've all come with bug fixes listed every patch day! Yes it's subscription based but that's cheaper than buying a new game every month or two and the ingame cash shop sells cosmetic items ONLY. I've bought lifetime and I really hope TSW survives to allow me to enjoy it's unique offering for many years to come.

Originally posted by Alalala
Wanted this game to succeed, if only because they were trying some new things.

Pre-ordered. Got screwed on Day 1 on pre-order bonuses. Still have no resolution from Funcom Customer Service.

Fun com screwed me once on Age of Conan's launch. I gave them another chance. They messed it up again.

Stay away from Funcom and their games.

Thanks for reading.

Frankly if you got "screwed" it was probably something you did because Funcom support in TSW is stellar.  I've had them do everything from restore lost items to advance broken quests.  Not once could they not help me with a legitimate problem with the game.

To the poster mentioning Beta weekends I totally agree.  The game wasn't the same at release as it was even during the last Beta Weekend.  Too many people used the beta as a preview/trial instead of a BETA.  I blame the industry on this.. using their BETA tests as "previews" instead of what a BETA actually IS.. a TEST of the game.

Any game that comes along and tries to use BETA tests for TESTING are going to be screwed in the current climate because everyone expect Beta to be a finished product (which isn't even the definition of BETA in the first place).

TSW deserved better.  It doesn't deserve trolls who hate Funcom and make it their daily mission to rip apart the game.  Yes they do exist, no it isn't fair.  Hate AoC if you want but it was done 5 years ago with a different team in a different time.

This rabid hate is an absolutely silly.  I have friends who won't go near MMOs because of the reputation that MMO players have of being elitist asses, trolls and jerks because that's what they see on forums.

The real problem with MMOs today is turning out to be the players.. the ones who are so jaded they make it a personal mission to destroy a company and the actual ability of other humans to feed their families.

For me it was lack of content mostly, I have finished every mission in the game in just over a month and thats not playing hardcore.  There were days I didn't even play!  Not to mention I did Solomon Island like 3 times twice on one character (ran my wifes char through and then she rerolled templays and we did it again) and a 4th time on a second character.

I have been playing MMO's since UO came out and ever since the quest/mission system became popular in EQ I have never "finished" an MMO, I just don't play enough.  So when I finished TSW it was like, huh, ok now what?

They were not ready for release, 6 months more would have been good gave them a chance for more content .

Originally posted by Dakirn

Originally posted by Alalala
Wanted this game to succeed, if only because they were trying some new things.

Pre-ordered. Got screwed on Day 1 on pre-order bonuses. Still have no resolution from Funcom Customer Service.

Fun com screwed me once on Age of Conan's launch. I gave them another chance. They messed it up again.

Stay away from Funcom and their games.

Thanks for reading.

Frankly if you got "screwed" it was probably something you did because Funcom support in TSW is stellar.  I've had them do everything from restore lost items to advance broken quests.  Not once could they not help me with a legitimate problem with the game.

 

To the poster mentioning Beta weekends I totally agree.  The game wasn't the same at release as it was even during the last Beta Weekend.  Too many people used the beta as a preview/trial instead of a BETA.  I blame the industry on this.. using their BETA tests as "previews" instead of what a BETA actually IS.. a TEST of the game.

 

Any game that comes along and tries to use BETA tests for TESTING are going to be screwed in the current climate because everyone expect Beta to be a finished product (which isn't even the definition of BETA in the first place).

 

TSW deserved better.  It doesn't deserve trolls who hate Funcom and make it their daily mission to rip apart the game.  Yes they do exist, no it isn't fair.  Hate AoC if you want but it was done 5 years ago with a different team in a different time.

 

This rabid hate is an absolutely silly.  I have friends who won't go near MMOs because of the reputation that MMO players have of being elitist asses, trolls and jerks because that's what they see on forums.

 

The real problem with MMOs today is turning out to be the players.. the ones who are so jaded they make it a personal mission to destroy a company and the actual ability of other humans to feed their families.

So, the blame is on this guy for his problem with preorder stuff. The blame is on the industry for beta testing impressions. The blame is on the players for destroying the genre, driving away other prospective players and TSWs bad start......

I think you should look at this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSuiK2QnQlg&list=UUUzj5q3v-6umt_NOCR709Ng&index=1&feature=plcp

I liked Age of Conan once they got it fixed up and things worked.  I always liked the realm of Hyboria.  I'm somewhat of a Conan nut.  I have almost every 275 Conan the Barbarian Comics and I'll probably never sell them, even if they are worth a ton.  I grew up reading Conan, and my parents never knew what it was (thankfully lol).  I was extremely upset with the state that Age of Conan was when it launched, and I don't know how they could even think of launching something so unprepared.  I stuck with it for a couple of years, and I even Rise of the Godslayer, but the lore wasn't Conanish enough.  I expected to die a thousand deaths everywhere I went in the brutal world of "wild west" law.  You hacked off thier heads, then asked questions later (literally).  I left when Free to play was announced.  I didn't want a bunch of tweens coming in and ruining the Conanic Atmosphere, and bear witness to it.

 TSW, I have to be honest, I never really liked.  Really the only thing I liked about the game was it had 3 factions and there's lots of zombie killing.  After you get over those two, it's kind of bland for my tastes.  As mentioned before, I think most people want in thier MMO something they can't get in the real world.  Albeit dragons, magical swords, magic, demons, etc. are too common place in MMOs, but that's what people flock to.

I said it in another article on TSW, but I'll repeat it here. TSW was a game I very much WANTED to like...and I was very excited about it...right up until I tried out Beta. After that I KNEW I wouldn't be playing it. Here are the 3 main reasons...

1) Same old boring vanilla MMO fantasy combat dressed up in a modern skin. Vanilla MMO combat mechanics are servicable for a fantasy MMO (if unexciting) but they just don't translate well into modern/sci-fi based MMO's. I'm holding a freakin assault rifle....let me feel like I'm actualy using one...not just a bow or wand of magic missles with the graphics replaced. Combat in TSW was pretty much like playing any fantasy based MMO with the graphics replaced. When you are dealing with fire-arms and other modern weapons you need a combat system that actualy reflects those dynamics. TSW would have been much better off trying to go with something like the combat system in Fallen Earth. I want to deal with recoil and steadying my aim...supression fire, cover, flanking fire...gun jams, reloading, limited ammo, overwatch, flash-bangs, etc....Not hit hotbar key 3 to initiate the "Shotgun Mega-Blast of Doom" combat manuver when it comes off global cool-down. IMO, combat has absolutely no style or substance in TSW and it doesn't fit the subject matter.

2) The Horror/Sci-Fi factor SHOULD have been a big draw in TSW. Instead it was more like "Attack of the Killer Tomatoes meets Freddy Kruger." If you look at any of the great works of horror, it's all about building up a sense of suspense and mystery...it's about subtlety...and the odd little thing out of place here that doesn't quite fit. It's more about the things you are NEVER SHOWN that lurk just out of sight, beyond visual range. It's all fog and shadows. It's most definately NOT hitting you with pyrotechnics and inky black tenticals all over the place in the opening scenes and subway stations floating off into space. Quite frankly they took what should have been a real strength for the concept and completely blew it in execution. They took Frodo and the Ring to Mt Doom in chapter one.  Furthermore they should have gone with a 1st person perspective. The immediacy of the experience and the limited periphrial vision of that are perfect for this sort of subject....players should be feeling creeped out not knowing or being able to see what's just behind them. If they had given us Stoker or Shelly or Lovecraft, I would have been thrilled.... Instead we got something that would have made Ed Wood cringe...and been spotlighted on Mystery Science Theatre 3000. Thanks Prof Bobo.

3) Where's the grouping? This game/genre screams out as the perfect venue for a social experience. It SHOULD have been one of the game's strengths. What we got instead fealt mostly like a solo experience. The game should have been driving us together and trying to get us to coordinate from the getgo. It should have been the bunch of random travelers thrown stranded in the creepy castle, needing to work together to survive the night. The game completely neglected to even give a nod to that concept. Again, something that should have been a strength of the game completey missed.

For me TSW was a disappointment....not because of the timing of release...or level of advertisement or anything silly like that. It was the game itself. I LOVED the concept, it was brilliant.  I wanted to be excited about the game. As far as I was concerned, they completely astro-turfed the execution.