For a while now, there has been a lot of talk about endgame aspects of certain games.  One of the things that is talked about most is the lack of raiding for gear, etc. in some games and how disappointed some people are in not having raids to do.  The people who complain about lack of raiding also seem to want people to think that the majority of gamers like raiding (because the most populated MMOs have it in their endgame).

This leads me to the question:   If raiding was so awesome for so many people, why aren't there highly popluar games out there that are only about raiding?  Instead of having to go through all the lame story and leveling to get to the fun part, why not just have games that skip all that?  Where the only thing you do is raid for better gear, in order to progress your character, and maybe have some crafting, etc. on the side for during the "down time" or queue time.

Would you play a game that was set up properly (in your opinion), that only included raiding for gearpower progression, possibly skill progression, and a few side options for the down time?

Edit:  This idea of raid only game doesn't necessarily preclude PvP style gaming.  I didn't consider it a necessary component to the question as not everyone who likes raiding likes PvP.

Originally posted by stayBlind
If you didn't have to go through all the game to get to end game how would they get your monthly subscription money...

The same way they currently get your money.   Charge you a subscription to play a raid only game.  A company doesn't necessarily need a story line in order to charge you money to play a game.

assuming there were various kinds of raids, and tons of them, yes I would. absolutely.

but no I wouldn't play Rift it all it had were the raids that Rift has. Of course .. I don't play Rift .. but you get the idea.

Originally posted by Xenogos
50/50 as I am posting this. The slaying of an epic monster as a group is fun. Killing players is more fun. Leveling up is lame most of the time. I think games should have Pve Raids but It should be a part of the game and not the game.

I agree, but you don't need raiding at all for that.

I don't disagree with that statement at all.  In fact, putting raids in throughout the storyline of the game would probably be pretty cool.  The problem seems to be that once you get through the leveling process, all you have left in most games (besides PvP) are raids.

I also agree that leveling up is lame....if the whole purpose of leveling in the game is so you can run raids.  Hence, my raid only question.

Roll a character and go straight into endgame.  Voted yes, but in thinking about it... I'd have to say maybe.

I like progression.  I'm not in love with gear progression as the sole means for developing a character.

I think that if casual pvp players just want to go pvp in arenas directly, they should stop playing themeparks and go play CoD or Battlefield where you just skip the single player campaign if you want and play the multiplayer content, the only difference between CoD-BF multiplayer and themepark pvp is that you control solders, the rest is the same: instanced pvp with no consequences just for fun. You don't need to complete the single player campaing as you need to do in themeparks, following quests and and only reaching the level cap 3 days later to be able to enjoy your arenas.

I'm going to say, negative. I can only raid so many times without beating my head open like an egg. Especially as a tank.

It is possible that a game like that actually could work, I don´t see it as the next potential Wow but maybe the next LOTRO...

But the reason that raids is fun is because they are social content. Social content is fun because the reason most people play MMOs is to play together with others.

The bad thing about raids on the other hand is that it is very repetetive content. And it doesn´t help the least that a raidboss is very predictable to anyone who fought him before, there is a right way and you win by doing it.

So while raids is a possible endgame in regular MMOs I think a 100% raid game would need bosses that acts more random and smarter or people would tire pretty fast.

Originally posted by evolver1972

This leads me to the question:   If raiding was so awesome for so many people, why aren't there highly popluar games out there that are only about raiding?  Instead of having to go through all the lame story and leveling to get to the fun part, why not just have games that skip all that?  Where the only thing you do is raid for better gear, in order to progress your character, and maybe have some crafting, etc. on the side for during the "down time" or queue time.

So, sort of like GW1 with more people in each group?  Sounds insanely boring.

Originally posted by evolver1972

Originally posted by stayBlind
If you didn't have to go through all the game to get to end game how would they get your monthly subscription money...

The same way they currently get your money.   Charge you a subscription to play a raid only game.  A company doesn't necessarily need a story line in order to charge you money to play a game.

What sub? More and more MMOs are F2P. I don't expect any sub games in a year or so, except may be WOW.

Originally posted by Prenho

I think that if casual pvp players just want to go pvp in arenas directly, they should stop playing themeparks and go play CoD or Battlefield where you just skip the single player campaign if you want and play the multiplayer content, the only difference between CoD-BF multiplayer and themepark pvp is that you control solders, the rest is the same: instanced pvp with no consequences just for fun. You don't need to complete the single player campaing as you need to do in themeparks, following quests and and only reaching the level cap 3 days later to be able to enjoy your arenas.

Well, the combat mechanics is totally difference .. that is the draw of the game. Otherwise, COD will be the same game as LOL.

But you suggestion is good, have many classes, with similar tactical RPG combat mechanics, and get rid of the themepark. That is why LOL is so popular.

The thing is why can't a game have everything.

Why does it have to be limited by only "xxx".

Originally posted by laokoko

The thing is why can't a game have everything.

Why does it have to be limited by only "xxx".

Most MMO developers stink at creating everything. It's either half-assed/half heartedly added in to placate the people looking for the perfect MMO, or just has nothing to do with the original vision of the game. Now if they were any good at adding it in, or started off small and expanded outwards, then it probably wouldn't be an issue.

Originally posted by laokoko

The thing is why can't a game have everything.

Why does it have to be limited by only "xxx".

There can be both. There are already several games that have everything, personally I wouldn't play a game that had only raiding and not leveling to go with it, but I bet there are people that would. There's room for both everything and limited to one thing kind of games

Heck, look at the MOBA games. Real Time Strategy games had been around for a while, even with heroes, and someone decided to do a more limited version with only the heroes, no base building or unit creation... and turned out to be succesful enough that it's now considered its own genre with lots of games on that style.