GW2 is looking promising but it depends if you like it's fantasy element too.

Right now, the only other contenders are The Secret World for being a different type of sub-genre then the usual fantasy medieval element, and Eve Online for sandbox. Of course, there are pleanty more that are still decent to good.

Simple math,EQ2/Wow were 20-30 million dollar games to design,costs have sky rocketed since then.

Now i bet it would be tough to build a game for under 125 million that would meet my standards.

There are so many corners being cut by developers.

Many are using automated mapping like SpeedTree.Making of buildings are just static mesh with no insides.

Devs do not want to spend the time to develop rich classes,just throw a bunch of ideas out there and tell players to pick which ones they want to use.No housing,no mounts all to save cost of not only design but cost of running the game.Instances ,we still see a lot of that going around.

Archeage is going to be the most complete game ever launched as a MMO,we will see everything we expect and more.Even still this takes a developer in the richest gaming area in the world [Korea]to back it up.I still fully expect to see lots of corners being cut.Example the class design will be using tons of presets,i imagine will be more of the static buildings,with no movers/doors ect ect.Korean games are known for having a VERY lack UI,although i have heard rumblings the yare working on that already.

No matter a MEGA nation like Korea and tons of money and we will still see a lack of depth in several areas,i expect it.The defining moment for this game will be how the developer reacts when it turns a profit,does it invest back into the game to keep it alive and growing,instead of the usual game design we see in cheap xpacks,involving a few maps,not much more.

Originally posted by zakin
All the games out currently and those releasing soon are either f2p or look like cartoons for 10 year olds. When can we get a good game for adults that is not a wow theme park wanna be clone.

Enjoy our quality collection of free adult games. Get it on hardcore with adult action games...

Scary stuff.

Originally posted by Tokken
when WOW 2 and Archeage comes out....

WoW 2 (or whatever it will be called) will be interesting in which demographic they cater to. I think many WoW players have grown up by now (hard to believe, I know) and they will want a slightly different experience I would assume.

Originally posted by zakin
All the games out currently and those releasing soon are either f2p or look like cartoons for 10 year olds. When can we get a good game for adults that is not a wow theme park wanna be clone.

Define worth paying for

Originally posted by Tokken
when WOW 2 and Archeage comes out....

He said not cartoony.

Originally posted by Wizardry

Simple math,EQ2/Wow were 20-30 million dollar games to design,costs have sky rocketed since then.

Now i bet it would be tough to build a game for under 125 million that would meet my standards.

There are so many corners being cut by developers.

Many are using automated mapping like SpeedTree.Making of buildings are just static mesh with no insides.

Devs do not want to spend the time to develop rich classes,just throw a bunch of ideas out there and tell players to pick which ones they want to use.No housing,no mounts all to save cost of not only design but cost of running the game.Instances ,we still see a lot of that going around.

Archeage is going to be the most complete game ever launched as a MMO,we will see everything we expect and more.Even still this takes a developer in the richest gaming area in the world [Korea]to back it up.I still fully expect to see lots of corners being cut.Example the class design will be using tons of presets,i imagine will be more of the static buildings,with no movers/doors ect ect.Korean games are known for having a VERY lack UI,although i have heard rumblings the yare working on that already.

No matter a MEGA nation like Korea and tons of money and we will still see a lack of depth in several areas,i expect it.The defining moment for this game will be how the developer reacts when it turns a profit,does it invest back into the game to keep it alive and growing,instead of the usual game design we see in cheap xpacks,involving a few maps,not much more.

Why the hell would a game need to spend 125 million to meet your standards? These companies need to stop spending money on stupid shit like voice overs and CGI trailers that cost a fortune. Plenty of indie companies make good games with core elements for A LOT cheaper. No reason someone like Blizzard couldn't.

They spend their money all on marketing, cgi, voice overs, more marketing, little more marketing. Yeah, let's pay some actor to voice over our game that we could really care less about.

Problem is a lot of company's don't care about it being "worth it", they just have to make it seem like it is. 

Im sure most games with both a box price and sub fee make their money on the box alone, sub fees cover the maint from there.

if a game was truly worth a sub fee, they could let you dl the game free and pay monthly. ( without a p2w cash shop )

Originally posted by zakin
All the games out currently and those releasing soon are either f2p or look like cartoons for 10 year olds. When can we get a good game for adults that is not a wow theme park wanna be clone.

The more you want cutting edge graphics and large games the more this serves the big companies like EA and Bliz.  I know a lot of people spend crazy money on GPUs and demand great graphics otherwise they look foolish for spending all that money but we should be trying to get more small developers in business by not requiring big bucks as the bottom line of games.

Originally posted by Wizardry

Simple math,EQ2/Wow were 20-30 million dollar games to design,costs have sky rocketed since then.

Now i bet it would be tough to build a game for under 125 million that would meet my standards.

There are so many corners being cut by developers.

Many are using automated mapping like SpeedTree.Making of buildings are just static mesh with no insides.

Devs do not want to spend the time to develop rich classes,just throw a bunch of ideas out there and tell players to pick which ones they want to use.No housing,no mounts all to save cost of not only design but cost of running the game.Instances ,we still see a lot of that going around.

Archeage is going to be the most complete game ever launched as a MMO,we will see everything we expect and more.Even still this takes a developer in the richest gaming area in the world [Korea]to back it up.I still fully expect to see lots of corners being cut.Example the class design will be using tons of presets,i imagine will be more of the static buildings,with no movers/doors ect ect.Korean games are known for having a VERY lack UI,although i have heard rumblings the yare working on that already.

No matter a MEGA nation like Korea and tons of money and we will still see a lack of depth in several areas,i expect it.The defining moment for this game will be how the developer reacts when it turns a profit,does it invest back into the game to keep it alive and growing,instead of the usual game design we see in cheap xpacks,involving a few maps,not much more.

Wait for a MMO that you agree with .. go MMO-less for awhile if necessary.

My next MMO might be ArcheAge .. because it seems perfect for my playstyle.  Pick a stance and stop supporting crap games / crap companies.

Originally posted by zakin
All the games out currently and those releasing soon are either f2p or look like cartoons for 10 year olds. When can we get a good game for adults that is not a wow theme park wanna be clone.

The Secret World is what you seek. Well worth the price