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General Discussion

General Discussion 

News & Features Discussion  » World of Warcraft: Subscription Numbers Dip Below 10M

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150 posts found


Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11863

8/06/12 4:18:46 PM#121
Originally posted by Illyssia

 Remember folks now Diablo 3 is launched there isn't really any new game on the near horizon again for the company.

incorrect - COD: Black Ops II launches Nov 13


COD franchise gave Activision / Blizzard good profits, when wow was losing subs last year


Why Activision May Come Roaring Back






Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/08/11
Posts: 521

8/07/12 12:35:11 AM#122
Originally posted by NBlitz
Originally posted by Valua
Originally posted by NBlitz
Originally posted by Valua
Originally posted by sammandar
Originally posted by Slampig
OH NO! Only 9.1 million... You know how many a million is, right?

I would not be surprised if we keep hearing this kind of reaction all the way back down to 1 million subs.


True, because even at 1 million subs it would still be the largest subscription based MMORPG. You realise that yeah?



In the West...In the WESTERN world.

I get tired of repeating this...but I'll never give up.


IF and only IF WoW ever dipped to as low as 1 million subscribers it would only be a matter of time for the next MMO to snatch WoW's the West.

We've seen many P2P titles sell over 1 million units in no time flat...retention kicking in afterwards but that's beside the point.

WoW +/- 1 million subs, new kid on the block sells +1 million copies with great retention rate...bam, the true end of WoW's era in the West.


But in the eastern world aren't most MMO's free to play? Especially the large ones, where they rely on their cash shops?

If thats the case, then actually, WoW has more active subscibers than any MMO in the world. (I define a subscriber the same as Blizzard, as someone who has paid to play WoW in the month.)

Also, no MMO in the entire world makes even close to the money Blizzard makes from WoW.

Also, it's not easy for any MMO to keep retention, I can't actually think of any that has kept it's players for long other than WoW in the west. 

So I still believe that even at 1 million subs WoW would still be the largest MMO in the west, possibly in the world.

I don't know about most, but just looking at the ones in the top list currently in South-Korea ( the MMOs (Blade & Soul, Aion, TERA) listed there are P2P. 

"Since commercialization, B&S has been taking the lead of the online player number."

Keep in mind before B&S, Aion was the most played P2P MMO in South-Korea until B&S launched. Aion sat at an easy 3.5 million subs (most of it in S-Korea).

B&S has yet to launch in the rest of the world...just wow. 


I don't know about that.


Not big but steady: EvE.





I can't think of a single MMO, or game for that matter, which even has the potential to make as much money as WoW, Call of Duty maybe if it released paid content evey month, but other than that can't think of anything.


Eve didn't keep the amount of players that purchased the game, it steadied out when it was around 200-400k players, but it sold close to 3 million in its lifetime. So I wouldn't even consider that as retention.


I honestly don't think WoW will get down to 1 million subs, by the time it's even nearing that number it will go F2P, but still have a sub for those who want one, WoW will stay above 5 million players for at least the next 5 years. The only MMO I can see hurting WoW is Titan, but Blizzard have said that both games can co-exist.



Novice Member

Joined: 8/10/09
Posts: 1525

8/07/12 2:12:22 AM#123
The smaller WoW model of say a few million subs would mean a major shake-up at Activision Blizzard. That have an online gaming system designed to support 15-20 million players. To make money that would have to shrink back to where they were in terms of scale a few years ago. Remember, folks Blizzard are back to releasing expansions for the next few years now that Diablo 3 has shipped. 10 million don't log into play Diablo 3, its a much smaller number. 

Novice Member

Joined: 7/28/10
Posts: 1

8/07/12 6:40:16 AM#124

Well i didn't play this game for about 4 years now but the last expension Mists of panda-something with a pandas race and the ninja what ever new class, come on this is the most uncreative thing Blizzard ever made, and WoW as a the most successful game with a monthly payment system should always be creative to be able satisfay the players, after all this game is aging.



Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/08
Posts: 33

8/07/12 7:18:54 AM#125
Originally posted by AzurePrower

This game is dying. Guild Wars 2 is going to beat them in subscriptions. etc. etc.

funny dude.. GW 2 is dead already.. not that many bought the game.. only about 1-2million and 30% of the players who buy it will quit... cause Gw2 is to boring


Novice Member

Joined: 7/07/04
Posts: 225

8/07/12 8:19:42 AM#126

Agree that GW2 is boring, I pre-ordered and played in the beta, not impressed at all in fact wish I could get my money back.

Can't believe that Blizz think that the downturn is purely due to the expansion cycle and DIII? Surely they aren't that naive, like DIII is the only game out there. They've taken a great game and progressively ruined it with their obsession with class balancing and simplifying the whole game down. I cancelled my sub the second the fleshed out the detail on MoP, it's just another step further away from the game I want to play, the game I feel nostalgic about and a step too far for me.

I have a lot of good memories of my time in WoW and I was going to say that it's time to move on but in fact it's the game that's moved on - if they wound the clock back I would still subscribe.

You can walk the walk but can you talk the talk?


Advanced Member

Joined: 9/21/06
Posts: 219

"Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall." - Confucius

8/07/12 8:49:46 AM#127
Originally posted by angzt

9.100.000users x 13€ = 118.300.000€ per month...


poor bastards ^^

You forgot to figure in the cost to run the game, which includes any Server Farm rent, Wages, HQ upkeep, marketing, and those tournaments they do...all cost money. I believe in the end they make about  50mill A QUARTER in profit.

"Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall." - Confucius


Novice Member

Joined: 7/07/04
Posts: 225

8/07/12 9:03:16 AM#128
Originally posted by angzt

bottom line:


The company reported an operating profit of $371 million, up 175% from a year ago.

This doesn't necessarily mean that they are making more revenue, It could be they are not spending enough! i.e. They need to get more games out of the door, specifically new IP.

You can walk the walk but can you talk the talk?


Novice Member

Joined: 10/06/11
Posts: 338

"A fool learns from his own mistakes, a wise man learns from the mistakes of others."

8/07/12 9:04:03 AM#129
Originally posted by Dyner
Originally posted by angzt

9.100.000users x 13€ = 118.300.000€ per month...


poor bastards ^^

You forgot to figure in the cost to run the game, which includes any Server Farm rent, Wages, HQ upkeep, marketing, and those tournaments they do...all cost money. I believe in the end they make about  50mill A QUARTER in profit.

i highly doubt they lose that much, cause if they do theyre wasting money left n right when smaller games can afford to do all the same stuff. except most mmo's market on the web, blizz takes it to the Tv...but even then.


Novice Member

Joined: 9/29/06
Posts: 108

Don''t cry if you don''t like a game. Find another and have fun!
It''s a more healthy tactic :)

8/07/12 12:03:33 PM#130



10 million players means dead?

With that analogy, every other MMO never existed.

I don't play WoW much anymore and I hate the community, but you can't be silly and say things like "WoW is dead" with millions upon millions of players.  This is also before a major expansion and that always has lower numbers.  They will rocket a bit once it's released and then the cycle continues.


Advanced Member

Joined: 5/14/12
Posts: 211

“Experience: that most brutal of teachers. But you learn, my God do you learn.” –C.S. Lewis

8/07/12 12:41:49 PM#131

And then the pandas arrive and it goes back over 10 million. Theres usually a dip before an expansion. 

9 million is still way way more than any other subbed mmo, whether you love or hate this game it was a massive success and still is.


Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/14/09
Posts: 1432

8/07/12 1:35:06 PM#132
Originally posted by psychobgr

And then the pandas arrive and it goes back over 10 million. Theres usually a dip before an expansion. 

Cata gained them back -600.000 subs the first quarter after launch.

Lets see how many zeros the cheap Panda kungfu knockoff will gain them back.


Advanced Member

Joined: 11/05/08
Posts: 207

8/07/12 2:59:00 PM#133

Lets face it had to happen at some point, 7 years of the same play model, and if you ad eq for which wow is cloned off of, people have been playing this play model for along time, and just getting bored, I think thats why alllot of new games do not do well, the wow play model is getting old.  I wonder if that is why Blizzard\Activicion is for sale, the powers to be figure we have reached our peak time to sell while we can.  There is still allot of folks playing, MOP will birng back some players, I read allot of folks seem to have no intrest in MOP, and make fun of it.

Next stop for WOW is free to play in the next couple of years, the blizz suits have already said that once going f2p makes the more money tha subs they will make the switch.  They had a great run made loads of money opened up the gaming world to the casual market, can't be number one for ever.. /shrug


Novice Member

Joined: 8/20/09
Posts: 9

WoW veteran

8/07/12 8:10:14 PM#134
You mean it's still at over 9,000,000? That's way more than nine-thousand!

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/13/10
Posts: 3253

I am more than some of my parts

8/07/12 8:21:55 PM#135

just out of curiosity, if the game actually drops in subscription numbers after the expansion pack is released, will they own up to it?


All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.


Novice Member

Joined: 9/11/03
Posts: 236

8/08/12 10:43:33 AM#136
I think Blizzard is ignoring the overall trend here. Most of those WoW players that are playing Diablo 3 have a year-long commitment to pay for a WoW subscription (at least in part so they could get D3 for free), so how are they accounting for so may WoW players dropping their subs to play D3?

I suppose how much the player base increases once MoP, and comparing that to past Xpacks, will give us a better picture, but frankly I think their looking at a steady decline that's here to stay. Doesn't look to me like it will ever be in trouble - it will always bring on money - but they need to base their business commitments counting on a lower player base and profit.

I also believe they don't care much; they are pretty much done with putting a lot of effort into WoW. They don't want their old players to stick around, they want new players with lower expectations. They want the game to be good enough with minimal effort. I believe that's the real reason behind everything in WoW being simplified.


Have played: Everquest, Asheron's Call, Horizons, Everquest2, World of Warcraft, Lord of the Rings Online, Warhammer, Age of Conan, Darkfall


Novice Member

Joined: 7/15/10
Posts: 9

8/08/12 11:43:30 AM#137

Blizzard was my favorite gaming company a decade ago. Not any more. First, I never liked WoW. They seem to have focused on the desires of loud-mouthed 12 year old twitch gamers ("twitchies") when designing the game. It lacks the depth and complexity of games which were released many yeears before WoW. Most long-time gamer adults I know play other games. When a twitchie shows up in those other games, we always say he must be a WoW player. It has become standard in all other games to assume that the witless "twitchies" all come from WoW. I think the rest of the PC gaming world will be happier when WoW is gone and the millions of twitchies go back to simple-minded console gaming.

It was even more depressing to see that Blizzard took all the depth and complexity out of D3. It was/is a massive disappointment after over a decade of waiting. Real crafting (horadric cube) was removed and replaced with a random stat generator similar to the "Gamble" function in D2LoD. There are no jewels, runes, or rune-words. Only a few items can have sockets and there are only 4 choices to put in the socket. Companions can't equip armor. The entire game can be played through in normal mode in a long afternoon. Removing all of the complex item crafting possibilities eliminated a lot of the replay value of trying to find specific runes for rune words. It is really difficult to make a truly unique build because your armor can't be customized significantly. Everything after Act 1 goes so quickly that you feel cheated. Even the cut scenes were half-baked, with only a couple that are up to the standards set by previous Diablo releases. The only reason to keep running it after your first run through is the hope that you can sell a drop or two in the gold or real money auction houses.

Blizzard is a dim shadow of the company it once was. The true game design talent obviously moved elsewhere.

/two cents


Novice Member

Joined: 2/07/12
Posts: 192

8/08/12 1:46:58 PM#138
Originally posted by angzt

bottom line:


The company reported an operating profit of $371 million, up 175% from a year ago.

WoW is not their only producet this means nothing with regards to WoW.


Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/06/08
Posts: 790

8/08/12 2:03:19 PM#139

They removed the journey and shortened the lifespan of an endgame so that active players can clear all content within few weeks. Even if you loved this new style of a gameplay, you'll get bored very soon even if you spent time doing PvP and those minigames they'll implement in MoP.

There's simply not enough longevity in the game to keep all these people subbed for a longer period of time.


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Joined: 8/10/09
Posts: 1525

8/08/12 5:12:59 PM#140
Originally posted by eyelolled

just out of curiosity, if the game actually drops in subscription numbers after the expansion pack is released, will they own up to it?


Blizzard spin their sub numbers, but I will bet you with GW2 launching just before Panda it may indeed fall further. You get more bang for your buck with GW2 since it is a new game, and it is high fantasy mmo that will be very accessible to average Joe and Jane Warcraft.

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