Originally posted by Caliburn101

Originally posted by DKLond

Originally posted by dekou

Originally posted by DKLond

Unprecedented beta access? Ehm, no.

How many times have betas been the entire foundation for games being fantastic before release? It's happened with more MMOs than I care to count.

No amount of beta access will reveal how the game works in the long-term.

I was in the SWTOR beta. I disliked its WoW 0.9 combat and thought that pretty cutscenes alone wouldn't be able to carry it, but it'll be a decent game overall. I was right and got flamed a lot.

I was in TERA beta and saw lots of half-naked women.

I was in TSW beta. I disliked its combat and animations, but thought that its story and ambience are fantastic, combat might get better later on and it'll be a good game overall. Looks like I was right.

I was in the GW2 beta. It wasn't perfect, but it was awesome.

So yes, I think GW2 will be very successful. It won't kill WoW, but that's ok. The beta showed us almost every skill in the game and the majority of PvP content. Compare that to something like SWTOR's beta, which wasn't able to show Illum, because that whole planet was a pathetic failure.

I'm not denying that people think they know everything about GW2 based on the betas. But they don't. You haven't seen any of the later zones - and you can't really know how entertaining the formula will be in the LONG TERM. You can have GREAT fun for weeks - without knowing anything about long term sustainability. You've seen design elements and you've seen skills - but you can't know what the actual PvE CONTENT will be like throughout the game. You just assume everything is at the same level throughout the game, but it remains an assumption.

It's the exact same with games like SWtOR - where a LOT of people said they were having tons of fun for months after release. I'm not saying YOU did, but the hype was absolutely massive and it took quite a while before it dawned on people that the game might have AWESOME cutscenes - but still needed more than that.

I'm saying GW2 has great short-term PvE and if you're into PvP for the masses (or structured PvP like all the others) - then you will likely enjoy it for a while. But we have absolutely no way of knowing what this supposedly new formula does for long-term viability. All we can do is guess based on what we think we might enjoy - and my guess is that a lot of people will be disappointed after 3-6 months. But that's because I don't - personally - see the greatness in the game.

Naturally, if you see greatness - then it's only natural to assume it will be a fantastic game, both short-term and long-term - but it's still nothing but guesswork.

Nothing like confining yourself to a carefuly selected set of facts to illustrate your point.....

You 'forget' the huge amount of time taken to build the game; the early-stated design philosophy; the quality and consistency of what has been said would be in-game and what has been proven to be in-game.

Your naysaying is based on an assumptions which ignore these relevant issues - that the 'endgame' and other regions in the gameworld aren't geing to be as good as the areas already shown. You are assuming that the areas they have shown us are the ONLY ones in which they have spent time, exercised their design philosophy and where any consistency exists.

This is an illogical point of view based on the evidence to date - never mind extrapolating the likely quality of the content based on ANet's reputation, their massive lead-time, the flexibility of their development-finance model and the many times they have said - 'it will be ready when it's ready'....

On the contrary, many other recent MMO's have promised much, shown little, been rushed out, had mimimal betas or betas in which significant concerns were not addressed.

Not one of these things are true of GW2.

You are not seeing the wood for the trees....

None of what's, 'promised', is relevent here.

He isn't wrong at all, all he's doing is making assumptions based on what he's seen and making points on if long term this sort of content will lead to consistent enjoyment.  A fair point wouldn't you say?

It really isn't relevent how much time it took to make, or what their manifesto says, the proofs in the pudding and you haven't seen the whole pudding yet.  It's not illogical to be cautious, all of your assumptions are based on a fundamental belief in everything Anet says.  Not everyone else has such faith in an ultimately profit making business.

Your entitled to be excited for an upcoming game, but noone is, 'wrong', for being a bit more cautious.

Originally posted by DKLond

Originally posted by dekou

I think that for an online game to be successful, it must get ALL the basic features right. Out of the four games I mentioned, only GW2 does that. TOR has mediocre combat and an awful engine. TERA has horrible quests. TSW has visually boring combat, but Funcom still has a chance to fix it. GW2 doesn't really have any glaring faults I can think of. It could be better in some ways, but all video games could.

The point, which I seem to be losing sight of, is that we've seen GW2's basic features and how they work. Yeah, late-game PvE areas could be garbage, but that's VERY unlikely, given ANet's track record. If anything, their newbie areas tend to be a bit boring. Of course, ANet can screw up. It's possible. Is it likely? Nope.

A lot of people are going to be disappointed or pretend to be disappointed, anyway, but that doesn't mean the game will be a failure.

Ehm, you can't exactly take your own opinion about these games and point them out as "facts about GW2 vs other MMOs". You seem to think all the basic features are great - but not all will share that opinion. I certainly don't.

Yes, I can't and no, I don't. Of course, some people will dislike GW2. Maybe you will. However, the ones who loved the betas are very likely to love the final version and it definitely looks like they're the majority.

Originally posted by DKLond

Point being: We simply can't know yet. Hype yourself if you must - be at least understand that it's nothing but hype and faith.

We can't know yet? Duh! Of course we can't. You can't know you'll be able to finish reading this sentence before the world explodes. Is your point really something THAT obvious? Also,

Hype:

1. Excessive publicity and the ensuing commotion

2. Exaggerated or extravagant claims made especially in advertising or promotional material

3. An advertising or promotional ploy

4. Something deliberately misleading

So, which one of these is "I've played a game and liked it"?

I find it very hard to see for GW2 to "fail" considering it's B2P.

Altho i don't roll with the hype train, i'm pretty excited about ArcheAge, seeing that they've been truely open about their game developement (no NDA since closed beta started) and progress, it's looking mighty fine to say the least!

":Yes, you've played the beta of the game. That's not the full game, though. It's also not long-term experience with the design or formula."

The whole game is the end-game. This means that whatever we were doing in the beta events, is pretty much what we'll be doing throughout the game. GW2 has been quite explicit that there really is nothing significantly different about the game at level 80 than the game at level 1.  You don't start a second "end-game" campaign such as guild-raiding.  sPvP and V8 (WvWvW) are available from the beginning.

So yes, in a very real sense, we have played the full game, and we have tasted the long-term experience, because it's not significantly different from the beginning experience, and that's why we're happy with our decision to play; it's not like ANET is promising dissatisfied beta-players that the game will be different after we get to a higher level, or that they'll "fix" fundamental flaws; they've said that what you see in the Beta events is basically it - that's the game.  That's what the game is, essentially, from head to toe. It's not going to significantly change (core design/features) in higher levels or with future expansions.

It's like we've test-driven a car, love it, and you're saying "you haven't driven it 500 miles yet so you don't know if you're going to enjoy it down the road or not".  While it's possible that I might run into some unforseen issue down the road, you still have to base your decisions on the information avaiable.   Buying a car I enjoy during the test drives, and not a car I didn't really enjoy but which the car company promises will be fixed/changed soon, is a sound decision.

Originally posted by dekou

Originally posted by DKLond

Originally posted by dekou

I think that for an online game to be successful, it must get ALL the basic features right. Out of the four games I mentioned, only GW2 does that. TOR has mediocre combat and an awful engine. TERA has horrible quests. TSW has visually boring combat, but Funcom still has a chance to fix it. GW2 doesn't really have any glaring faults I can think of. It could be better in some ways, but all video games could.

The point, which I seem to be losing sight of, is that we've seen GW2's basic features and how they work. Yeah, late-game PvE areas could be garbage, but that's VERY unlikely, given ANet's track record. If anything, their newbie areas tend to be a bit boring. Of course, ANet can screw up. It's possible. Is it likely? Nope.

A lot of people are going to be disappointed or pretend to be disappointed, anyway, but that doesn't mean the game will be a failure.

Ehm, you can't exactly take your own opinion about these games and point them out as "facts about GW2 vs other MMOs". You seem to think all the basic features are great - but not all will share that opinion. I certainly don't.

Yes, I can't and no, I don't. Of course, some people will dislike GW2. Maybe you will. However, the ones who loved the betas are very likely to love the final version and it definitely looks like they're the majority.

Originally posted by DKLond

Point being: We simply can't know yet. Hype yourself if you must - be at least understand that it's nothing but hype and faith.

We can't know yet? Duh! Of course we can't. You can't know you'll be able to finish reading this sentence before the world explodes. Is your point really something THAT obvious? Also,

Hype:

1. Excessive publicity and the ensuing commotion

2. Exaggerated or extravagant claims made especially in advertising or promotional material

3. An advertising or promotional ploy

4. Something deliberately misleading

So, which one of these is "I've played a game and liked it"?

I'm not saying your reaction is hype in itself - I'm saying you're reacting TO hype - if you feel certain.

How? By saying "I played the GAME and liked it" - when, in fact, you've only played the BETA.

Diablo 3 sold 10 million copies recently. That's great - and a lot of people played the beta expecting to absolutely love playing the game.

Yet, if you go visit the forums - or you put your ear to the "grapevine" - you'll find people MASSIVELY disappointed in the LONG TERM aspect of Diablo 3.

You see? You can play a beta or you can play a game for many, many hours - and yet have absolutely NO real idea about how the game will be in the long term. That takes a massive amount of experience and insight into gaming and yourself. Even then, it can be very very tricky to understand how you will respond after dozens or hundreds of hours.

What the beta has demonstrated - assuming everything is of a similar quality - and the launch goes well, and the game doesn't crash and performs well, etc. - is that it's a great SHORT-TERM experience for the people who feel that the beta was great fun.

That much is REASONABLY certain for people like you. But long term? We just don't know.

Originally posted by MikeJezZ

Is there PvP in Archeage or is it just a mini game like in WoW?

 

If GW2 should somehow fail, I have no future games in my sight, Games nowadays seems to be of low standard anyway.

GW2 PvP is instanced, if instanced PvP is what you're calling a "mini game."

GW2 can't have open world PvP because it has no factions, it's server vs server vs server, so they must play in a "mini game" setting. Just larger than your average PvP maps (Excluding some of WoW's.)

On topic; After GW2 we have ArcheAge, Planet Side 2 to hype up. Then Titan comes along and blows any hype you've ever seen out of the water, if people are calling GW2 "Jesus 2.0" then Titan will be called "God 2.0."

The hype for Titan will be beyond anything we've ever witnessed.

Omnifish:

"It's not illogical to be cautious, all of your assumptions are based on a fundamental belief in everything Anet says.  Not everyone else has such faith in an ultimately profit making business.

Your entitled to be excited for an upcoming game, but noone is, 'wrong', for being a bit more cautious."

A prefectly fair point IF the OP was actually confining themselves to fence-sitting or encouraging caution. They are not however - they are obfuscating a troll/flame thread in 'reasonable' language.

Note the use of absolute statements, insulting language and self-contradiction. It's all there if you can be bothered to read it.

Originally posted by Emerwyn

So, since I'm getting a bit weary of seeing so much pointless overhyping about GW2, and that's making me feel like not playing it at all, I'm going to ask:

 

What game are you looking forward to getting overhyped after GW2?

Check back with me after I've been playing GW2 for 6 or 7 years and they announce they're in production for GW3. Then you'll have your answer.

Was never irrationally hyped about GW2.

Irrationally hyped... maybe about Titan if they manage to make it sound at least as interesting as WoW back in the days.

Originally posted by Emerwyn

See, you'rereading it wrong, as I thought. The message isn't "You're a fool to think GW2 will be good and GW2 will definitely fail."

The message is "GW2 will succeed, as has Aion, ToR, Diablo 3, etc, but in two months you'll be again burntout and looking for another thing to get overhyped about."

Your thread title : 

When GW2 fails, what's next mmo you're going to be irrationally hyped about?

Hyperbole to grab attention and build some kind of importance to a non-existing argument. Usually it's a trick used by children.

Originally posted by Emerwyn

And to that I bring question: What's the point on being a fanboy? Why can't you just be nice instead of acting as some company's barking dog and jumping at the throat of anyone who dares say anything negative about the game that at that moment is target of your neverending devotion?

Once again, you put the world into two categories : good guys and bad guys. Dog or master. Fanboys and critics. Failure or success. This is a very limited way of thinking.

Stop hating the whole world because you fail at being very excited in something.

edit : I saw your post saying you preordered gw2. This is (pathologically ?) nonsensical. As Eir_S said, you must have some difficulties to express yourself correctly, good luck in learning that.

Originally posted by newbinator
I don't buy into hype anymore. I used to though. That said, I'm not interested in GW2. Played the beta weekend and it's not for me. The one MMO I am looking forward to is WildStar.

Hopefully it's improved since last years gamescom. They showed it off way too early to be honest. The demo they had only gave us War public quests (no chain and reset timer) with intermittent standard go kill these and fetch that. Along with no kill credit for helping other players and most attacks which rooted you to the spot (atleast with the gunslinger). In short, a pretty standard MMO experience.

Though of course it was a very very early build so maybe all that will have changed come this years Gamescom.

Funnily enough though, Wildstar was the game a friend of mine played most of the weekend simply because it was always the game with the shortest queue.

He even made it into their gamescom vid. He's the big guy with white hair lying through his teeth about how amazed he was with the game simply because they stuck a camera in his face and he felt bad for the dev team. :p

Personally, I do not have trouble with people looking forward to the game. 

I -am- looking forward to GW2 and have preordered it. 

What I find highly distasteful is when some individuals act as a game's self-appointed holy templars that smite down with insults and massive bullying anyone that has an opinion diferent than them.

There's a lot of that going on in GW2, as has been with D3, ToR, and about every other AAA title you can think of.

That's the real sad part of all the "overhyping", since these people think they are protecting their holy ground, and they're just pushing away people that are on the fence with their fanatism.

Originally posted by Emerwyn

Yeah I'm curious about this, because it's the same every year. Conan, Warhammer, Aion, ToR, Rift, Diablo 3, etc.

 

It's like everyone is bored of whatever they're playing and they wish so hard for a new game to end their boredom that they just exercise an irrational hype towards a game that ends up dying out in 1-3 months. Not to say the games per se fail, as they usually have a good number of sales and/or subscriptions, but then suddenly the game wasn't so good and everyone's getting hyped about the next thing.

 

So, since I'm getting a bit weary of seeing so much pointless overhyping about GW2, and that's making me feel like not playing it at all, I'm going to ask:

 

What game are you looking forward to getting overhyped after GW2?

If the people overhyping the game are making you feel like not playing it at all I might suggest thinking for yourself or learning how to ignore idiots.

As to your question. I would have to say Planetside 2. I honestly dont see another MMORPG holding my attention the way they used to. That includes GW2. I'm going to play it untill I'm bored with it and then probably be done with MMORPG's and try out some other MMO types. Awesomenauts is a hell of alot of fun. I may just stick with that.

Originally posted by Emerwyn

Personally, I do not have trouble with people looking forward to the game. 

 

I -am- looking forward to GW2 and have preordered it. 

 

What I find highly distasteful is when some individuals act as a game's self-appointed holy templars that smite down with insults and massive bullying anyone that has an opinion diferent than them.

 

There's a lot of that going on in GW2, as has been with D3, ToR, and about every other AAA title you can think of.

 

That's the real sad part of all the "overhyping", since these people think they are protecting their holy ground, and they're just pushing away people that are on the fence with their fanatism.

Again, no proof, no arguments. Who are these Holy Templars you are talking about? Got any proof to back up what you are posting? I've read this before but it is nowhere to be found, they must be seen only by you I suppose.

I think you simply can't compare gw2 to other mmorpg sub driven games. Maybe to some f2p and even there it's a bit different. Main reason is B2P. gw2 costs you pretty much the same money as normal AAA title these days. If you get enough fun from it as from other AAA title, you win (and I think this is very possible).

Second thing I'd like to mention is, gw2 doesn't seem to be centered around equip hunting and end game raid grind (though I might be wrong here). For me it has very many aspects of casuality and jump-in-anytime gameplay.  Replayability may be quite good because of down scaling etc.

To wrap it up, gw2 may be rather a world where you go for a visit and enjoy being there, while you spend your "real" MMO time in differnt game, getting levels, goodies and other stuff that makes you uber. So there won't be "10 milions subscribers" but people will be happy to come back there.

As for hype, I'm totally in love with End of Nations right now :)

"I'm saying GW2 has great short-term PvE and if you're into PvP for the masses (or structured PvP like all the others) - then you will likely enjoy it for a while."

What is "short-term PvE" for some, is long, long-term PvE for others.  Not everyone burns through all available PvE content in a couple of months (or weeks) and, especially with GW2, not everyone is racing to get to level 80. Not everyone plays (or wants to play) MMOGs for the same reasons, and with the same playstyle.

Originally posted by Valua

Originally posted by MikeJezZ

Is there PvP in Archeage or is it just a mini game like in WoW?

 

If GW2 should somehow fail, I have no future games in my sight, Games nowadays seems to be of low standard anyway.

 

GW2 PvP is instanced, if instanced PvP is what you're calling a "mini game."

 

stuff like this could be why some see all the hype as irrational in the first place.

some obviously have incorrect assumptions or misinformation about the game.  

at the same time some gw2 folks like me right now have nothing better to do than correct you so the forums pile up with arguments about what stuff is or isn't in the game.

like instances..  and people who use the word instance and define it some crazy way like "on the other side of a loading screen."  

maybe those people with their wild notions think we're being irrational because we are correcting them and disagreeing with what they feel is perfectly reasonable and inarguable?