Here's a theory...

I will not name any games, but I will say this: It annoys me greatly when some vocal fan(s) start demanding new unrelated features to a game being developed which is already focusing on something else. Now I know everyone has a right to like any feature they like but for the love of all that is good I hate the people who demand features like crafting and housing to every single game. Because if the developer gives in and makes them they will inevitably eat away resources and if those features don't turn up good for the people who demanded it in the first place, and the rest didn't have care in the first place, those resources were wasted. Those manhours could've been used to make the existing game and the existing features even better.

So this vocal minority, in their selfishess, ends up pissing on everyone's breakfast serials. So f*** you, if its you I'm talking about!

Normally I don't start demanding game features until I've put in a decent amount of hours in it. Now a days that seems to be around 10hrs but what you say suggests you are speaking of games that are not yet released. In that case, I say as much fan feedback they can get, the better. If we're talking about a racing game and people want, I dunno, airplanes or avatars that wear cool pants, then I understand what you mean but, Dev's don't take that into account anyway.

I'm actually starting to believe Dev's don't take many of the fan feedback into account. I say that in general because more and more I read about how Dev's get these really compact deadlines from executives rushing a game due to marketing or some kind of quik prift motive, whatever, something business related rather than what would be good for the game.

Also, with so many gamers complaining ABOUT gamers complaining I'm just at the point where I'm not even going to play these mediocre games anymore. I can skip the whining, and the whining about the whining, and just relax. If I have to, I can just reinstall old games that have the options I want and take the hit in graphics.

Originally posted by Quirhid

Here's a theory...

I will not name any games, but I will say this: It annoys me greatly when some vocal fan(s) start demanding new unrelated features to a game being developed which is already focusing on something else. Now I know everyone has a right to like any feature they like but for the love of all that is good I hate the people who demand features like crafting and housing to every single game. Because if the developer gives in and makes them they will inevitably eat away resources and if those features don't turn up good for the people who demanded it in the first place, and the rest didn't have care in the first place, those resources were wasted. Those manhours could've been used to make the existing game and the existing features even better.

So this vocal minority, in their selfishess, ends up pissing on everyone's breakfast serials. So f*** you, if its you I'm talking about!

Which "vocal minority" do you wish to shut up from stating their desires?

You won't stop people from asking for what they think they want.

However the true test of developer quality is whether they know which features fit best with their game and their demographic, and which features they could invent completely from scratch to surprise players.

I agree with the OP. There's a certain crowd of players that make absurd demands for game features (or their removal) without any consideration for their purpose.

WoW? WE DEMAND HOUSING!

Call of Duty? WE DEMAND HOUSING!

Angry Birds? WE DEMAND HOUSING!

It's worse than back seat drivers and arm chair quarterbacks. It's ridiculous.

Maybe game developers need to stop advertising their games so far from release that gamers think they can influence the game's design by demanding features.

Originally posted by Trionicus

Normally I don't start demanding game features until I've put in a decent amount of hours in it. Now a days that seems to be around 10hrs but what you say suggests you are speaking of games that are not yet released. In that case, I say as much fan feedback they can get, the better. If we're talking about a racing game and people want, I dunno, airplanes or avatars that wear cool pants, then I understand what you mean but, Dev's don't take that into account anyway.

 

I'm actually starting to believe Dev's don't take many of the fan feedback into account. I say that in general because more and more I read about how Dev's get these really compact deadlines from executives rushing a game due to marketing or some kind of quik prift motive, whatever, something business related rather than what would be good for the game.

 

Also, with so many gamers complaining ABOUT gamers complaining I'm just at the point where I'm not even going to play these mediocre games anymore. I can skip the whining, and the whining about the whining, and just relax. If I have to, I can just reinstall old games that have the options I want and take the hit in graphics.

Originally posted by Axehilt

However the true test of developer quality is whether they know which features fit best with their game and their demographic, and which features they could invent completely from scratch to surprise players.

Ain't that the truth.

Originally posted by evolver1972
I don't mind people giving their feedback to a developer to ask for features they want.  If the developer is good and knows what features fit into the game, then there shouldn't be a problem.  Just like parents, developers need to learn to say "no" sometimes.

Then they simply need to say "no" more often. If they don't like it they can go harrass some other dev making some other game.

Originally posted by OldManFunk

I agree with the OP. There's a certain crowd of players that make absurd demands for game features (or their removal) without any consideration for their purpose.

 

WoW? WE DEMAND HOUSING!

Call of Duty? WE DEMAND HOUSING!

Angry Birds? WE DEMAND HOUSING!

 

It's worse than back seat drivers and arm chair quarterbacks. It's ridiculous.

 

Maybe game developers need to stop advertising their games so far from release that gamers think they can influence the game's design by demanding features.

WoW should have had housing already. Considering how the game is set up, with your achievements, trophies, mounts etc, housing is just another thing to show off, and to display one's "achievements" Housing fits the whole concept of gameplay in WoW perfectly.

Wouldn't have been hard to do either, just create a zone with plots all over, maybe yards, could have your mounts roaming behind the house (if you bought a big enough one to fit them all). Probably would have kept people who were tired of the game longer.

Also, things like housing or quality crafting are not absurd demands, they were once part of the package, lol. Too many people settle for less, and crap these days.

Player: I want a game that is fun, with some depth!

Dev 1: Damn people, always asking for unreasonable things.

Dev 2: Just ignore it, like usual.

Dev 1: Yup, they're going to buy it anyway, lol.

Originally posted by mmoguy43
Can you give some examples where the devs gave in to the fans and added a feature that didnt belong or improve the game?

If I must... one of the top of my head. CCP focused their efforts on something called "planetary interaction" and walking on sations, for a while effectively neglecting the whole spaceship part of the game for a full year. Fans loved PI because it expanded the game further, and avatars are a long required feature in the game. Well, PI turned up to be a lame minigame with a poor UI and the famed walking on station was a 3-d model confined to a room not much bigger than a prison cell. Wooptie do. Worth it wasn't it? Now, now I know the walking in stations is a start of something bigger, but was it really worth starting the downward spiral which lead to the brief exodus of players last year?

The game is primarily about spaceships. Make sure the spaceship-part is fun and works properly.

Then there was the SWTOR thing, which I didn't really follow in much detail, but what I came to understand is that the fanbase insisted the devs to add spacecombat and spaceships to the game even when they weren't originally planned for release. Bioware caved and the game launched unfinished. Thank you again vocal minority! How much of those resources that went on to those spaceships could've made the rest of the game a little bit better, a little more polished?

Originally posted by Quirhid

Originally posted by mmoguy43
Can you give some examples where the devs gave in to the fans and added a feature that didnt belong or improve the game?

If I must... one of the top of my head. CCP focused their efforts on something called "planetary interaction" and walking on sations, for a while effectively neglecting the whole spaceship part of the game for a full year. Fans loved PI because it expanded the game further, and avatars are a long required feature in the game. Well, PI turned up to be a lame minigame with a poor UI and the famed walking on station was a 3-d model confined to a room not much bigger than a prison cell. Wooptie do. Worth it wasn't it? Now, now I know the walking in stations is a start of something bigger, but was it really worth starting the downward spiral which lead to the brief exodus of players last year?

The game is primarily about spaceships. Make sure the spaceship-part is fun and works properly.

Then there was the SWTOR thing, which I didn't really follow in much detail, but what I came to understand is that the fanbase insisted the devs to add spacecombat and spaceships to the game even when they weren't originally planned for release. Bioware caved and the game launched unfinished. Thank you again vocal minority! How much of those resources that went on to those spaceships could've made the rest of the game a little bit better, a little more polished?

Eve- PI was worth adding and isn''t a "lame minigame". The avatar revamp was also well recieved. Only the limited stroll around your capt quarters combined with poor AUR items is worth mentioning. Players for a long time have wanted walking-on-stations and still do. It is the dev's responsibility to plan and manage the update but they failed to do that. It has nothing to do with what players demand.

SWTOR- bad example since most of the features they wanted to have in didn't make it. In fact the devs went against the player demands and made a space rail shooter instead of the X-wing vs TIE fighter they very loudly demanded.

You are taking devs for fools that do anything the players demand as if we are responsible for them breaking their game. Gimme a break.

Originally posted by Quirhid

Originally posted by mmoguy43
Can you give some examples where the devs gave in to the fans and added a feature that didnt belong or improve the game?

If I must... one of the top of my head. CCP focused their efforts on something called "planetary interaction" and walking on sations, for a while effectively neglecting the whole spaceship part of the game for a full year. Fans loved PI because it expanded the game further, and avatars are a long required feature in the game. Well, PI turned up to be a lame minigame with a poor UI and the famed walking on station was a 3-d model confined to a room not much bigger than a prison cell. Wooptie do. Worth it wasn't it? Now, now I know the walking in stations is a start of something bigger, but was it really worth starting the downward spiral which lead to the brief exodus of players last year?

The game is primarily about spaceships. Make sure the spaceship-part is fun and works properly.

Then there was the SWTOR thing, which I didn't really follow in much detail, but what I came to understand is that the fanbase insisted the devs to add spacecombat and spaceships to the game even when they weren't originally planned for release. Bioware caved and the game launched unfinished. Thank you again vocal minority! How much of those resources that went on to those spaceships could've made the rest of the game a little bit better, a little more polished?

While I didn't agree with the WiS tangent I don't think that's the worst offender.  Players calling for a PvE server and battlegrounds in Eve are far worse.

Originally posted by rounner
The problem with SWTOR was they didnt listen to the players...

Maybe the devs were on a cut-scene at the time...

Originally posted by Psychow

Originally posted by rounner
The problem with SWTOR was they didnt listen to the players...

 

Maybe the devs were on a cut-scene at the time...

Or maybe they were in an instance and didn't realize what was going on in the outside world.

Originally posted by dave6660

Originally posted by Psychow

Originally posted by rounner
The problem with SWTOR was they didnt listen to the players...

 

Maybe the devs were on a cut-scene at the time...

Or maybe they were in an instance and didn't realize what was going on in the outside world.

Or doing a space combat mission. (does that count as an instance? Let's say no, it's more fun that way)

Players can and will make outrageous demands.  That doesn't mean the game company has to listen though.  Like all parents learn, sometimes you have to know when to say "no".