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General Discussion  » I think F2P was the plan all along

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45 posts found
  Grand_Nagus

Novice Member

Joined: 10/13/08
Posts: 335

 
OP  7/31/12 11:48:52 PM#1

 

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.

The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

  azmundai

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/18/10
Posts: 1429

7/31/12 11:50:19 PM#2


Originally posted by Grand_Nagus
 Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

if it was the plan all along it would have gone f2p months before losing 1.5 million subs.

LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already :)

  Br3akingDawn

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/01/11
Posts: 1346

7/31/12 11:58:47 PM#3
Originally posted by azmundai

 


Originally posted by Grand_Nagus
 Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

 

if it was the plan all along it would have gone f2p months before losing 1.5 million subs.

they would had lost more money if they went f2p even earlier and lost box sales.

  mmoguy43

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/31/09
Posts: 2421

8/01/12 12:30:35 AM#4

I'll call it. OP is crazy.

They probably were open to the idea of shifting to F2P all along but they really didn't want to because it wouldn't bring in as much money.

  Nafnir

Novice Member

Joined: 10/08/04
Posts: 18

8/01/12 12:36:24 AM#5
Originally posted by mmoguy43

I'll call it. OP is crazy.

They probably were open to the idea of shifting to F2P all along but they really didn't want to because it wouldn't bring in as much money.

I wouldn't call him completely crazy. I feel that Bioware hedged their bets with tor. They obviously wanted the monthly model to suceed, that brings in tons of revenue. However seeing alot of mmo's in the industry head the F2P route they developed the game in mind should that switch ever need to happen. Most games have long waiting periods where devs need to discuss and balance out how the model is going to work.

Usually the first announcement is "Hey, check us out. We're going F2P!" then a couple months later they release the details of the model. Then few months after that they re-release their game with it. Bioware seems to have the model and all that you can do with it down pretty pat, pretty fast.

Lurke® Circa 2004

  Magnetia

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/07/11
Posts: 1023

Any fool can know. The point is to understand.

8/01/12 12:44:36 AM#6

I don't think they planned for it to go f2p but I think they were certainly prepared to do so if things went badly.

Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  dageeza

Novice Member

Joined: 8/14/04
Posts: 580

8/01/12 12:47:04 AM#7

The subscription model is so close to dead that companies who know their game is not worth a sub have to plan for freemium in advance just to try and survive..

 

Playing GW2..

  eyelolled

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/13/10
Posts: 3203

I am more than some of my parts

8/01/12 12:53:11 AM#8

If they didn't expect it to go F2P, they were stupid.  If any P2P game developer doesn't expect their game to go F2P, then they're stupid.  Expecting the inevitable doesn't mean you can't still try for lasting subscription success, but in this day, F2P better be prepared for, it's not something to be figuring out when you're picking up the peices.

All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.

  Esquire1980

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/07
Posts: 532

8/01/12 1:27:43 AM#9
Originally posted by Grand_Nagus

 

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.

The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

 

BTW, Howdy Nagus.

I really doubt it.  BioWare Austin has been a bit too quiet here recently.  Either they had nothing to say or they already knew that no1 was going to like what they could say.  It turns out the latter is the trueism.

I've played a game that were under some of these lead devs before.  That's not how they think.  These guys CHANGED SWG to the point that most of the playerbase quit in a few months time and they still believed they were right.  These guys are now afraid for their jobs and are coming up with anything that can be came up with to try and keep their egos at the high point.  1st, it was blamed on the community, now it's blamed on a 15 per/mo sub.  It just couldn't be their development and their running of the game and/or decisions of bringing NERF WARS to yet another SW game, ask them, I'm positive they'll tell you.

We both know how this will end up.  Will be interesting to watch another playerbase go thru their version of a F2P NGE just the same as we watched STO and Cryptic do the same.  All of these guys who still hold BioWare highly will find out they are the target of the new "C-Store" as they are invested and will get out that perverbial wallet even if the free players will not or can not.  Almost can't wait for the TOR version of TCG (SWG's The Card Game) or Cryptic's lockboxes.  Both were, spend alot of money on a "gamble" and very possibly not get what you wanted in the 1st place.  "So, spend some more, please".

This will certainly be interesting to watch, again.  And then maybe the industry will take note of the correct blame and we may see as much of Dallas Dickerson et al as we see of Rubenfield.

  NagilumSadow

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/12
Posts: 304

8/01/12 1:46:42 AM#10
Originally posted by Grand_Nagus

 

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.

The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

 

 

Everyone across the net is jumping on the bandwagon now saying they saw the "writing on the wall," but take it from the person that actually did this coming and wrote essays on the subject shortly after launch. 
 
EA isn't doing this because of some grand plan, its because the players forced their hand; EA/BIO/LA discovered the players weren't the sheep they were expecting.


http://wyrdblogging.blogspot.com/

  Gdemami

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7922

8/01/12 1:54:39 AM#11


Originally posted by Grand_Nagus

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

Of course. EA said many times they are ready to operate and profit from the game on many levels.

You cannot know how many users the game will have after the launch but you can layout different business scenarios and adjust the strategy to make best profit, afterall it is only about the money.


They are not the armchair generals here, they are making billions a year...

  NagilumSadow

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/12
Posts: 304

8/01/12 2:11:08 AM#12
Originally posted by Gdemami

 


Originally posted by Grand_Nagus

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

 

Of course. EA said many times they are ready to operate and profit from the game on many levels.

You cannot know how many users the game will have after the launch but you can layout different business scenarios and adjust the strategy to make best profit, afterall it is only about the money.


They are not the armchair generals here, they are making billions a year...

 

 

 

So the mass firings, Forbs basically calling them "fools" and loosing mass percentage points on the exchange were all part of the plan?
 
Heck no wonder Seve Jobs choose the former president of pepsi cola to run apple years ago -- Sculley was named Silicon Valley's top-paid executive and totally eroded apple's margins.


http://wyrdblogging.blogspot.com/

  Lobotomist

Elite Member

Joined: 5/20/07
Posts: 5052

I got so much trouble on my mind Refuse to lose.

8/01/12 2:11:40 AM#13
Originally posted by Grand_Nagus

 

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.

The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

This is unfortunately not true.

I called it long ago.

They should have launched as B2P (like GW2) and than later charge for new areas/quests like LOTRO.

You see SWTOR's targeted audience were sRPG players (fans of Bioware) that are new to P2P concept. Most of them could not agree with paying subscription for what they usually pay for free. But on other hand they are perfectly well with buying the game itself.

Here Bioware not only lost most of initial sales ( they could sold as well as Diablo 3 ) but they became focus of primarly MMO players, that game was poorly tageted at.

This is the way they would maximise profits.

 

Unfortunately SWTOR name is so tarnished and dragged trough dirt now, that even F2P is late.

It should have been than , and not now.

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 17419

8/01/12 2:15:49 AM#14
Originally posted by Grand_Nagus

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.

The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

Nah, they would have released the game as B2P then, still earned most of the money and kept a lot more players.

I think EA and Bioware got a nasty surprise, since MMOs have gotten more and more solofriendly TOR was the next logical step but it seems like Wow and Rift already taken the solocontent as far as it can go and that the trend is finally turning for something a bit more social again.

  User Deleted
8/01/12 2:16:51 AM#15
Originally posted by Grand_Nagus

 

Call me crazy, but I have a feeling this was the plan ALL ALONG! What? Why? Think about it. The market has been shifting towards F2P for some time now. EA had to know this. LA had to know this. Bioware had to know this. Next, TOR had a huge development budget. My guess is that even before launch the plan was to launch as a P2P game to get as much money as they could from box sales and subs, then change to a F2P model.

The original influx of income could possibly pay off the game's development cost, leaving all F2P revenues as pure profit. Pretty sneaky!

 

Ah, the eternal debate: "Are they really that stupid, or..... ARE THEY EVIL GENIUSES? 

 

No, they really are that stupid.

  Purutzil

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/11
Posts: 2955

The Critical Hit Pretzel!

8/01/12 2:18:16 AM#16

I don't think it was the plan to go F2p... at least this early. I know F2P was in their thoughts though and was likely expected as an option down the road, just not this early.

  User Deleted
8/01/12 2:19:06 AM#17

It was a plan for:

"OMG were so deep in red that only "re-launch" can possibly save it"

Its was 1 scenario up from total desaster.

  Gdemami

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7922

8/01/12 2:27:15 AM#18


Originally posted by NagilumSadow

So the mass firings, Forbs basically calling them "fools" and loosing mass percentage points on the exchange were all part of the plan?   Heck no wonder Seve Jobs choose the former president of pepsi cola to run apple years ago -- Sculley was named Silicon Valley's top-paid executive and totally eroded apple's margins.

Layoffs are natural after you buy a company or merges, it is a part of expense management.

EA laid off almost 3k people in 2008-2009 after they bought Pandemic Studios, Take-Two Interactive and whatnot.


By "Forbes" you mean this weak minded contributor? Just silly...


Stocks...well, everyone is losing stocks in video entertainment industry. However they are still making good money and are the largest western publisher on the market...

  NagilumSadow

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/12
Posts: 304

8/01/12 2:32:27 AM#19
Originally posted by Gdemami

 


Originally posted by NagilumSadow

So the mass firings, Forbs basically calling them "fools" and loosing mass percentage points on the exchange were all part of the plan?   Heck no wonder Seve Jobs choose the former president of pepsi cola to run apple years ago -- Sculley was named Silicon Valley's top-paid executive and totally eroded apple's margins.

 

Layoffs are natural after you buy a company or merges, it is a part of expense management.

EA laid off almost 3k people in 2008-2009 after they bought Pandemic Studios, Take-Two Interactive and whatnot.


By "Forbes" you mean this weak minded contributor? Just silly...


Stocks...well, everyone is losing stocks in video entertainment industry. However they are still making good money and are the largest western publisher on the market...

 

Friend, with your brand of logic, I would suggest running for public office.

 


http://wyrdblogging.blogspot.com/

  Gdemami

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7922

8/01/12 2:34:08 AM#20


Originally posted by NagilumSadow

Friend, with your brand of logic, I would suggest running for public office.

 


Welcome to world of reason...

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