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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Im sick of damage numbers.

16 posts found
  Castillle

Forum Bunny

Joined: 10/24/10
Posts: 2681

 
OP  7/31/12 3:11:48 PM#1

So Ive been playing Dead Island  recently and one thing annoyed me.  The damage numbers.  I mean...I hate it.  I turned it off and even turned off the enemy hp bars.  Turning it off made the game so much more fun for me.  No longer do I try to look at "ZOMG 5k crit!" or anything like that.  I just run around, bashing zombies face in and chop their head off when theyre down (just to make sure theyre dead). 

I tried borderlands 1 again this morning and the god forsaken damage numbers and hp bar annoyed the living !@#$ out of me -.-

Death to damage numbers and hp bars! DEATH!!!! Oh and death to the name above the avatar thing too.  That is so annoying. DEATH TO NAME ABOVE THE AVATARS! o.O

Edit : Its annoying how your finger can stick out while hiding behind a tree and all of the sudden your name appears to the d00d youre hiding from. 

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  User Deleted
7/31/12 3:25:57 PM#2

Heh, I can agree with that.

I've always wanted to see the physical damage, either on the avatar or on a Paper Doll. More blood means more damage, and to where (limb, torsu, neck, etc.). And damage that can cripple or mame. And blood spouts mean damage over time.

And then add skills to fake it, and a chance to surprise the enemy then.

There's more excitement of you don't know when exactly your target is going to drop, or what exactly is currently happening.

Names need work too, agreed there also.

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19248

7/31/12 3:29:29 PM#3

nah .. i do want to know how much damage i am doing.

in fact, that is why recount is such a popular add-on for wow, and theorycrafting popular in many games.

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11896

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Wildstar, and Combat Arms

7/31/12 3:36:41 PM#4
Originally posted by Castillle

So Ive been playing Dead Island  recently and one thing annoyed me.  The damage numbers.  I mean...I hate it.  I turned it off and even turned off the enemy hp bars.  Turning it off made the game so much more fun for me.  No longer do I try to look at "ZOMG 5k crit!" or anything like that.  I just run around, bashing zombies face in and chop their head off when theyre down (just to make sure theyre dead). 

I tried borderlands 1 again this morning and the god forsaken damage numbers and hp bar annoyed the living !@#$ out of me -.-

Death to damage numbers and hp bars! DEATH!!!! Oh and death to the name above the avatar thing too.  That is so annoying. DEATH TO NAME ABOVE THE AVATARS! o.O

Edit : Its annoying how your finger can stick out while hiding behind a tree and all of the sudden your name appears to the d00d youre hiding from. 

Make characters with smaller hands.

  Elphyi

Novice Member

Joined: 7/26/12
Posts: 14

7/31/12 3:47:31 PM#5

Simple Fix to Damage Numbers.

 

 

Turn it off in Options.

 

Wasnt that simple?

lol

Elphyi Xfire Miniprofile
  Castillle

Forum Bunny

Joined: 10/24/10
Posts: 2681

 
OP  7/31/12 4:06:26 PM#6
Originally posted by Amaranthar

Heh, I can agree with that.

I've always wanted to see the physical damage, either on the avatar or on a Paper Doll. More blood means more damage, and to where (limb, torsu, neck, etc.). And damage that can cripple or mame. And blood spouts mean damage over time.

And then add skills to fake it, and a chance to surprise the enemy then.

There's more excitement of you don't know when exactly your target is going to drop, or what exactly is currently happening.

Names need work too, agreed there also.

That would be awesome! And yes I would prefer seeing the damage on the enemy instead of the damage on their healthbar. 

For MMOs, sure you can turn them off but aside from looking at numbers theres not much else to do...And doh I posted it on the wrong page x.x I meant for it to be in general gaming.

 

 

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  Axehilt

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/09
Posts: 7213

7/31/12 4:11:02 PM#7

The issue is progression.  Games with progression at a minimum need to visualize the relative effectiveness of your Shovel vs. a Level 5 or a Level 25 zombie (because that same shovel is going to probably take more than 2x as many hits to kill the second zombie -- possibly way more than 2x.)

While this doesn't require damage numbers, numbers are the absolute clearest way of communicating precise effectiveness -- you see you're still doing 10 damage against a zombie which has 100 hp (level 25) instead of 50 hp (level 5).

In a game where basic zombies always died to 5 hits, you wouldn't need any visuals at all -- neither healthbar nor numbers -- because the game would always behave exactly the same.

  Vahrane

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/08
Posts: 373

7/31/12 4:15:40 PM#8

    Go play Darkfall! It has visual damage representation and no numbers above peoples heads when you've landed a blow. The incredible amount of flaws in its design might turn you off though.

  Quirhid

Novice Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5492

I dare you to pin a label on me.

7/31/12 4:26:52 PM#9

Atleast camouflage hasn't been used succesfully in videogames. Not that I've heard anyway. There's always a way to adjust your graphics settings or modify your opponent's model (or delete the skin entirely). And making sure people haven't made any adjustments or modification can prove tricky if its even possible. Not worth the effort, I think.

I'd say hiding, if implemented, pretty much needs to be the lame invisibility style hiding to be abuse proof.

Still, using as small model as possible and as neutral colors as possible has a small advantage against regular players. Why did I pick a female model in an FPS game? Because its a smaller than the bulky male character. Even if they had the same size hitboxes the female character would be slightly harder to spot. Size matters.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Castillle

Forum Bunny

Joined: 10/24/10
Posts: 2681

 
OP  7/31/12 4:26:52 PM#10
Originally posted by Axehilt

The issue is progression.  Games with progression at a minimum need to visualize the relative effectiveness of your Shovel vs. a Level 5 or a Level 25 zombie (because that same shovel is going to probably take more than 2x as many hits to kill the second zombie -- possibly way more than 2x.)

While this doesn't require damage numbers, numbers are the absolute clearest way of communicating precise effectiveness -- you see you're still doing 10 damage against a zombie which has 100 hp (level 25) instead of 50 hp (level 5).

In a game where basic zombies always died to 5 hits, you wouldn't need any visuals at all -- neither healthbar nor numbers -- because the game would always behave exactly the same.

I kinda get it but I kinda dont because if you were using a level 25 shovel youd usually be able to kill the level 25 zombie in 4-6 hits and youll be able to kill the level 5 zombie with 5 hits from a level 5 shovel.  So like...Whats the point aside from yknoe....staring at higher numbers/different color pallete? >.<

 

As for playing darkfall..Idk...Isnt that getting a reboot or something? I  might try it after the reboot o.O Im waiting for Star Farer though (or somefing....)  The graphics guy for Terraria is making that with a 7 or so person team! @_@ Block building ftw.

''/\/\'' Posted using Iphone bunni
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  Axehilt

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/09
Posts: 7213

7/31/12 4:59:43 PM#11
Originally posted by Castillle

I kinda get it but I kinda dont because if you were using a level 25 shovel youd usually be able to kill the level 25 zombie in 4-6 hits and youll be able to kill the level 5 zombie with 5 hits from a level 5 shovel.  So like...Whats the point aside from yknoe....staring at higher numbers/different color pallete? >.<

 As for playing darkfall..Idk...Isnt that getting a reboot or something? I  might try it after the reboot o.O Im waiting for Star Farer though (or somefing....)  The graphics guy for Terraria is making that with a 7 or so person team! @_@ Block building ftw.

Well progression isn't always justified.

For example, in Dead Island I felt having progression was a bad choice and the game would've been better if done more in the style of L4D.

But if you have progression then that implies everything isn't progressing at the same rate (if zombies level at exactly the same rate as your shovel, why have progression at all?)  And when zombies don't level at the same rate as your shovel, you need some indication of where you're at in terms of progression -- and trial/error can be pretty frustrating because it's not transparent to players why they did crappy against this zombie when the last one died in 4 hits.  And that's what healthbars and/or HP numbers do for players: gives them transparency into what's happening.

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19248

8/01/12 1:45:09 AM#12
Originally posted by Castillle
 

I kinda get it but I kinda dont because if you were using a level 25 shovel youd usually be able to kill the level 25 zombie in 4-6 hits and youll be able to kill the level 5 zombie with 5 hits from a level 5 shovel.  So like...Whats the point aside from yknoe....staring at higher numbers/different color pallete? >.<

 

Precision? Knowing the average vs variance? Curiosity?

What if sometimes you kill with 5 blows and sometimes 6? People will want to know the average .. and if they track the data, and work the numbers out, you may was well give it to them.

People want to know. If you look at WOW, it does NOT display numbers in its early incarnation. What happened? Add ons are created to track and estimate the numbers. So Blizz finally gave in and put the numbers there.

People want to know if they are doing 5% more DPS if they swap a piece of gear. That is why tools like RAWR and recount is popular. That is why Blizz put in DPS calcuation in D3.

 

  ZekkCC

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/10/06
Posts: 275

8/01/12 1:46:13 AM#13
  Indrome

Novice Member

Joined: 5/03/12
Posts: 294

This is like trying to drive straight through Schroedinger's minefield!

8/01/12 2:07:30 AM#14

Agreed, OP. I once designed a damage-system without numbers or health bars for an old (dead) MMO named The Chronicles of Spellborn during its beta.

It relied on "color coding" the enemy's and your own status via visual cues overlayed over the textures (from green to red on various spots) or an optional "health orb" that gradually changes colors from green (healthy) to red (damaged) as well.

The system was supposed to give the "impression" of determining your enemy's condition like you would in a real fight - by looking and watching, not by reading.

Sadly, it wasn't picked up. The damage numbers and health bars stayed. I wish there was at least ONE good game to explore the possibilities of leaving those out. (Skyrim has them, GTA has them, any AAA MMO has them...)

  Zooce

Novice Member

Joined: 1/24/11
Posts: 588

8/01/12 2:31:58 AM#15

Usually prefer to see all the numbers floating around myself, but the option should be present to hide such clutter when players seek a minimalist experience.

  QuicklyScott

Novice Member

Joined: 4/27/12
Posts: 448

The opinion of a penguin.

8/01/12 2:42:25 AM#16

I really don't think floaty numbers are neccessary in a zombie survival fps game. I was over joyed when I first hit a 10 in Runescape though.  Bad with some; great with others.  It has to be used in the right context, otherwise it's goofy and not needed.