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News & Features Discussion  » Star Wars: The Old Republic: SWTOR - The 'Singleplayer RPG'

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296 posts found
  serariel

Novice Member

Joined: 11/08/08
Posts: 13

7/26/12 11:16:50 PM#221

This article makes some good points, I would add though that it is not grouping that is the problem with this game but that it doesn't make you excited about leveling your character. I think that's why a lot people lost intrest prematurely an d left the game. Even if you did play to level cap you simply lost intrest after because there wasn't much left to do after. A lot of planets looked the same to me and my characters wardrobe was drab at best. There weren't ayny cool powers to gain after a ceratin level everything was just a upgrade to exsiting powers. I feel ike that is whats bleeding the game of it's players. I for one really like this game and even with it's faults will continue playing. But I have heard these complaints from other players very often. 

  Gruug

Elite Member

Joined: 4/03/08
Posts: 1226

The more you know, the more you know you don't know.

7/26/12 11:27:41 PM#222

I have leveled a Jedi Sentinel and a Commando to level 50 totally grouped the whole time. I have also played a Smuggler/Gunslinger to 50 and done it totally solo. Time wise it took me less and was much more enjoyable leveling in the groups. Soloing, while satisfying in a different sort of way, forced me to miss a lot of group content designed specifically for grouping. So, what MikeB has to say is right on! SWTOR is NOT a single player RPG but can be if you really want it to be so.....just it won't be as enjoyable.

Let's party like it is 1863!

  omidus

Novice Member

Joined: 2/26/08
Posts: 94

7/26/12 11:51:26 PM#223

Terrible biased opinion calling out other biased opinion lol laughable editorial lol.

so many articles going with "SWTOR is not wow" from this site and yet this guy uses wow as a comparison, such a hypocritical site.

  Whyhate

Novice Member

Joined: 7/19/12
Posts: 43

7/26/12 11:52:02 PM#224

Of course SWTOR isn't technically a single player RPG.

 

Just how a wow clone isn't technically a wow clone because it's not 100% exactly the same.

 

Arguing about semantics is missing the point.

 

It's also funny to see how most of the replies on this thread saying that SWTOR is a single player RPG have valid points and explain their opinion, while everyone who disagrees just says things like "you are all trolling" without even trying to refute anything.

  User Deleted
7/27/12 7:33:10 AM#225

Spot on article. Its point ive been arguing for few years now. Theres almost ZERO solo content in MMOs (almost zero content has 1 player cap, or "forced solo"), and theres quite a lot of forced grouping content.

Its just funny for all that call on "sinle-player MMO" (or any incarnation of that statement) that you can group at any time, anywhere, yet they call on forced grouping. I dont think its the problem with the game though...

Forced grouping is out. Now that noone is forced to group with you...what will you do? Oh, i know :)

 
  kantseeme

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/07/09
Posts: 739

7/27/12 8:14:06 AM#226
Originally posted by StoneRoses
Originally posted by Fadedbomb
Originally posted by gasperk
Originally posted by ste2000
What a useless article.
We all know that SWTOR technically is a MMORPG, the point is that it is bad designed and people play instinctively the game as Single Player, because the MMO part is not interesting enough, in fact it is pretty boring.
So people play the Storylines and once they finish the exciting bit, they are left with the MMO part which people find too boring to play.
Don't compare WOW with SWTOR, the first is still a MMO (not the best I admit), the second is a MMO by name but a Single Player game by fact.
No amount of wall of text can deny that, since the drop in subscription is a better judging measure than any word.
 

 

QFT !!!! Couldnt say better myself.  

QFE, I also don't believe I could have said it better myself. A wall of text with an opinion is one thing, but to post it as an article as "fact" is another.

 

MMO Waltzing again! You guys are practically pros!

 

QFT all you want, nothing more than subjective!

 

This a great example of players making the game what it is. You are practically given the same group and social features like other MMO's. This is just plain LAZY on the players part!

 

The game can ONLY hold your hand for so long, yes, you actually have to make en effort to talk to folks online in the game. The developers can't teach you that.

 

Not our fault you guys get bored, maybe no one likes to play with you, or you just don't play well with others.

The path of least resistence. Make something easy then make something hard. Now at the end offer the same reward for doin eather one and see what most people will choose. Sure theres group content but for the most part its worthless.

  kantseeme

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/07/09
Posts: 739

7/27/12 8:16:37 AM#227
Originally posted by mikahr

Spot on article. Its point ive been arguing for few years now. Theres almost ZERO solo content in MMOs (almost zero content has 1 player cap, or "forced solo"), and theres quite a lot of forced grouping content.

Its just funny for all that call on "sinle-player MMO" (or any incarnation of that statement) that you can group at any time, anywhere, yet they call on forced grouping. I dont think its the problem with the game though...

Forced grouping is out. Now that noone is forced to group with you...what will you do? Oh, i know :)

 

I was hoping for your answer to your own question. Wanted to know what you say you know.

  Hurvart

Novice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 566

7/27/12 8:35:52 AM#228

I dont like linear quest hub games. But I also dont like forced grouping. A game should be a virtual world and its main focus should be exploring that world. You should be able to do that solo or always play in a group if you prefer that.

The problem with SWTOR is that it is to linear. The whole game is linear from start to finish. The zones(planets), the quests, all progress...There is no interesting virtual world. Even if you can group it feels like a singleplayer game. And even if there was forced grouping a linear game with instances would not feel like true MMORPG. I donnt want the game to tell me where to go and what to do. I dont want to follow a path when I start playing in some new area...or follow a path when I improve my character and progress in game. I want options and I want to be able to play the game in a unique way and build a unique character. There should be content created by the devs.. A lot of good content. But it should be optional. Not linear quest hub content that you are forced to do on rails...

That is the real problem with SWTOR and games like it. Streamlined, handholding, on rails and no freedom to try to be unique and to explore...

  Normike

Novice Member

Joined: 6/24/07
Posts: 440

7/27/12 8:55:16 AM#229

What are people talking about SWTOR feeling like a single-player RPG?

Anarchy Online

Asheron's Call

Champion's Online

City of Heroes

City of Villains

Dark Age of  Camelot

DC Universe Online

Dungeons and Dragons Online

EVE Online

Everquest

Jumpgate: Evolution

Lineage

Lord of the Rings Online

Matrix Online

Rift

Star Trek Online

The Secret World

Shadowbane

Tera

Ultima Online

Vanguard

Warhammer Online

WoW

After playing all of those I'm supposed to be convinced that somehow SWTOR does odd and weird and suddenly their MMO isn't an MMO anymore? Is this the twilight zone? SWTOR isn't lacking anything when you compare it to most of the MMOs in this list. No incentive to grouping? Uh, yes there are some incentives to grouping in SWTOR. Everything is instanced? Uh, no there are many quests that are out in the open world zones. Which worked for me because I don't think 20 players zerging an objective is brilliant MMO mechanics. It's just another way of doing it. And just like other MMOs I've played, I liked SWTOR and would/will still be playing if/when there's an expansion pack.

 

 

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10942

I think with my heart and move with my head.-Kongos

7/27/12 10:26:48 AM#230


Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by lizardbones  


It doesn't matter what people consider the game. A key component of single player games is the fact that other people are not there. A key component of single player games with multiplayer options such as Minecraft is that there is a choice about other people being there. SWToR has neither of these properties. The game involves other people being there whether you want them there or not. Calling SWToR a single player game is, as MikeB stated, hyperbole. No useful discussion can occur when one or both of the participants are misrepresenting the key point of the discussion.  
one key thing is perception how the game feels to many people.. When this issue is a constant and is seen all over the place over and over and over yet you hardly ever saw this complaint on any of the other games mentioned in this thread how can you really say it's a non-issue or not worth arguing about. Many are not litteraly saying this game is a single player game at all and I thought that was pretty obvious by now.



Saying the game feels like a single player game is a totally valid observation. It doesn't jump into stating something false to try and be "right".

If the game feels like a single player game, or if the game lacks incentive to group, these are the statements that need to be made. You can have a discussion with statements like this. If that's the goal. If the goal is to just be the last person shouting, then it doesn't really matter what anyone says, only who shouts the loudest.

For what it's worth, I sort of agree with the people who say the game feels like a single player game. I would have preferred it if they made SWToR as a single player game, with the option to invite people into your world. It would have been a better game (imo).

I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  Hurvart

Novice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 566

7/27/12 11:47:26 AM#231

For people that like hybrid virtual world type games all new themepark MMO:s feels like singleplayer games. And obviously someone like that will not like SWToR very much. There really is nothing hybrid or virtual world in it at all... Some of the other themeparks are a bit better. They have features like day and night, weather and more open and less linear  zones/areas. If you think all modern themeparks are bad games you will think SWToR is very very bad....

I think themepark fans often enjoy some hybrid/sandbox features. Even if they dont like true sandbox games. If there is nothing like that at all it will feel like something is missing. The game will feel dead. Some would perhaps say like a singleplayer game. When there is to much focus on story it is difficult to combine that with hybrid features I think.

  Clerigo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/01/10
Posts: 405

Healing Over Time since 2004

7/27/12 3:53:11 PM#232

Labeling this game or any other similar tittle as a single player rpg with multi-player elements is a false statement.

SW:TOR may suffer from other issues that brought players to abandon the game, but in its form is a pure mmorpg, where the players are given the choice to join other players to take part in the content play. Just like any other true mmorpg game out there.

Now, this is a solid game, but in all its purpose, it came out in the era of the "mmorpg genre is dead" player syndrome. And that, for me, is what is making players go nuts all the time. I understand that because i have suffered from the same syndrome but managed to beat it by admiting that i cant expect to beat the experience i had when for the 1st time a solid mmorpg made an impact on my gaming life, because what i felt in that time was all new to me and i cant hope to feel it again untill some label press something radical thing along the way, 

I too want to experience that "new" feeling again, like i had when i played Guild Wars for the 1st time, and when someone told me "hey come check this WoW game" and i was like blessed with eternal chocolate cream cascade and fluffy strawberries, but the real issue here is that this genre is trying hard to reinvent itself and following some new formulas but has still yet to succeed in captivating players again. Other labels see this happening so they chose to follow the traditional way and put all known elements of the mmorpg concept in the best was they can, but things are hard to manage in this genre.

We clearly have many lines of thinking glued to this genre, that need to be erased and melted into one clear view on the subject, and thats how you beat this syndrome.

If a label manages to introduce to the genre a game that has quality, it is functional on both PvE and PvP elements, has all the elements in game design that translates into an rpg experience, has content to be made on both single and multi player base and has enough end game content that can make you feel happy for the money you spent, but you come bashing it down anyway, then you have the syndrome and you need to find the cure.

  GrumpyMel2

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/24/09
Posts: 1828

7/27/12 4:16:59 PM#233
Originally posted by lizardbones

 


Originally posted by GrumpyMel2

Originally posted by Maverick827 Funny how these threads go on for pages and pages when one side is blatantly incorrect.   SWTOR is not a single player game.  It does not play any different than other games that you label MMOs.  If you personally feel that WoW, Rift, TSW, GW2, etc. are single player games because you're an old-school MMO fan and prefer forced grouping, then fine, you can call SWTOR a single player game.  You can call all of them single player games.  Otherwise, you're just hypocritical and dead wrong.
Clearly ALOT of people here consider SWTOR a single-player game. I don't believe the reason for that is because they all got together and held a secret meeting that no-one else was invited to where they decided that "single-player game" would be how they collectively would refer to SWTOR.

 

Telling them thier "wrong" is about as productive as telling someone thier wrong for considering asparagus as a "horrible" choice of flavor ice cream. You may disagree but clearly there is something which is leading to that perception.

Unless you think people are being purposefully dishonest in thier statements about how they percieve the game....then there must be something which is causing those perceptions. Fans of SWTOR (of which I am not, but I assume you and Bitton are) would be better served rather then telling people that they are WRONG about thier perceptions..... trying to find out what specificaly is causing those perceptions in the first place..... and then seeing if they could make EA/Bioware aware of them. That is, unless, you are unbothered by the fact that a large number of people percieve SWTOR as a single-player game. If that's the case, then by all means continue to argue why aspargus is the awesomest ice cream flavor ever...but don't be too surprised if your arguements fail to sway anyone to that view.




It doesn't matter what people consider the game. A key component of single player games is the fact that other people are not there. A key component of single player games with multiplayer options such as Minecraft is that there is a choice about other people being there. SWToR has neither of these properties. The game involves other people being there whether you want them there or not.

Calling SWToR a single player game is, as MikeB stated, hyperbole. No useful discussion can occur when one or both of the participants are misrepresenting the key point of the discussion.

 

(Cough) You do understand that people are using the term in a FIGURATIVE not literal sense here correct? (i.e. Saying that "Our baseball team got slaughtered yesterday" does not mean the players actualy got cut to pieces with a butcher knife).

I don't think anyone here is contending that literaly only one player can access the TOR servers at a time. What they are saying is...for the amount of emphasis given group and cooperative play, it MAY as well be a single-player game. Is that better for you?

  rdrakken

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/15/12
Posts: 435

7/27/12 4:49:57 PM#234
Originally posted by Sovrath

Really rdrakken? is that the card you are playing? Draw again.

Most of the people who purchased SWToR would never have continued to play it into the future. Are you really making the assumption that if x million players buy a game then the game is trash because all those players didn't continue playing it? Or perhaps the game should always have had a smaller audience in the first place, regardless of subject matter? 

 Really Sovrath? Is that the card you are playing? Draw again.

Are you really saying that if most of the people that buy a game think its crap and quits playing it that it doesnt mean anything because a small amount of people do think its ok? Or perhaps if the game didnt have a large audience and only the people that think its good purchased it that it would suddenly be a perfect game because there were no customers to talk bad about it?

Yeah...two can play at that game.

  nilden

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/26/05
Posts: 976

7/27/12 5:06:19 PM#235

If they let you use three companions at once you could play an offline single player mode. The only thing you would be missing are raids.

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  Normike

Novice Member

Joined: 6/24/07
Posts: 440

7/27/12 5:46:43 PM#236
Originally posted by nilden

If they let you use three companions at once you could play an offline single player mode. The only thing you would be missing are raids.

Same for warlock with pets in WoW? "If  WoW let the warlock have 3 tanking/dps pets then you could play an offline single player mode. The only thing you would be missing are the raids." Well, you wouldn't get the auction house, the pvp battlegrounds, ranked matches, other players buffs, guild buffs, general chat (nvm that's a good thing). Oh look, the same thing for SWTOR too! Isn't that interesting. Never saw that coming! This SWTOR must think it's an MMO or something.

 

Is there really any "emphasis on single player"  in SWTOR even? My game time was about 50% pvp, 30% group instances, 15% solo questing, 5% outdoor group questing. Most of my time was spent playing with other people. You can choose to level from beginning to max with solo questing but why?

  nilden

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/26/05
Posts: 976

7/27/12 6:05:36 PM#237
Originally posted by Normike
Originally posted by nilden

If they let you use three companions at once you could play an offline single player mode. The only thing you would be missing are raids.

Same for warlock with pets in WoW? "If  WoW let the warlock have 3 tanking/dps pets then you could play an offline single player mode. The only thing you would be missing are the raids." Well, you wouldn't get the auction house, the pvp battlegrounds, ranked matches, other players buffs, guild buffs, general chat (nvm that's a good thing). Oh look, the same thing for SWTOR too! Isn't that interesting. Never saw that coming! This SWTOR must think it's an MMO or something.

Oh it's an MMO alright, a single player MMO.

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  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10942

I think with my heart and move with my head.-Kongos

7/27/12 6:33:33 PM#238


Originally posted by GrumpyMel2

Originally posted by lizardbones  

Originally posted by GrumpyMel2

Originally posted by Maverick827 Funny how these threads go on for pages and pages when one side is blatantly incorrect.   SWTOR is not a single player game.  It does not play any different than other games that you label MMOs.  If you personally feel that WoW, Rift, TSW, GW2, etc. are single player games because you're an old-school MMO fan and prefer forced grouping, then fine, you can call SWTOR a single player game.  You can call all of them single player games.  Otherwise, you're just hypocritical and dead wrong.
Clearly ALOT of people here consider SWTOR a single-player game. I don't believe the reason for that is because they all got together and held a secret meeting that no-one else was invited to where they decided that "single-player game" would be how they collectively would refer to SWTOR.   Telling them thier "wrong" is about as productive as telling someone thier wrong for considering asparagus as a "horrible" choice of flavor ice cream. You may disagree but clearly there is something which is leading to that perception. Unless you think people are being purposefully dishonest in thier statements about how they percieve the game....then there must be something which is causing those perceptions. Fans of SWTOR (of which I am not, but I assume you and Bitton are) would be better served rather then telling people that they are WRONG about thier perceptions..... trying to find out what specificaly is causing those perceptions in the first place..... and then seeing if they could make EA/Bioware aware of them. That is, unless, you are unbothered by the fact that a large number of people percieve SWTOR as a single-player game. If that's the case, then by all means continue to argue why aspargus is the awesomest ice cream flavor ever...but don't be too surprised if your arguements fail to sway anyone to that view.
It doesn't matter what people consider the game. A key component of single player games is the fact that other people are not there. A key component of single player games with multiplayer options such as Minecraft is that there is a choice about other people being there. SWToR has neither of these properties. The game involves other people being there whether you want them there or not. Calling SWToR a single player game is, as MikeB stated, hyperbole. No useful discussion can occur when one or both of the participants are misrepresenting the key point of the discussion.  
(Cough) You do understand that people are using the term in a FIGURATIVE not literal sense here correct? (i.e. Saying that "Our baseball team got slaughtered yesterday" does not mean the players actualy got cut to pieces with a butcher knife).

I don't think anyone here is contending that literaly only one player can access the TOR servers at a time. What they are saying is...for the amount of emphasis given group and cooperative play, it MAY as well be a single-player game. Is that better for you?




Yes, I understand what sarcasm is. Sarcasm is great for expressing an opinion. It's not so great for debating a topic of discussion. What is happening here is that people are using exaggeration to debate a topic of discussion. They are defending the statement, "SWToR is a Single Player RPG" as if it were a fact, not an exaggeration. It doesn't prove anything. It's not even an interesting discussion. It just starts a back and forth shouting match with a lot of pointless nitpicking.

What is the difference between people who literally contend that SWToR is a single player game and people who present that exaggeration as if it were a fact, even if they don't literally believe it? How is an actual discussion supposed to take place in either of those cases?

I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  Adamai

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/06/10
Posts: 468

7/27/12 6:37:35 PM#239
Swtor is a single player game developped by mmo developers ! Who clrearly discovered that single player games cannot be retrofitted into an mmo format. This is why swtor is failing misserably ! To fix and save the game and put it back on its 25 year plan !!!, they need to put every aspect of mmo ideally heavily influenced by swg and eve onlines corporation aspects and a far far
More intuitive resources and crafting system like swg ! for me. Without these important mmo features and mechanics ! No game can really be concidered a true mmo, thats just my oppinion and why i dont play the game any more , its important for me to state i played to level 33 which is far more time than required to pass judgment on any mmo , the fact i couldnt be arsed to bore myself stupid going any further in this sorry excuse and complete insult to the starwars logo is evidence enough that its a pile of crap and not an mmo. Frankly i think i did incredibly well to drag it out for as long as i did given the seriousness of it all, in all honesty i had had enough if swtor after typhon. I continued with hope that the game would improve but instead it got worse and the more i leveled the less it fealt like an mmo and now i think its not an mmo and refuse to sub until dramatically changed
  Adamai

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/06/10
Posts: 468

7/27/12 6:45:19 PM#240
4 platergrouping is the only multiplay aspect of the game ! Hardly worthy of the mmo classification .... Heres a few ecanpled of true mmos ! eve online.. Swg.. Daoc.. Warhammer online rvr... Mortal online. Anything really where 100's of players can join in, in any single aspect of the game together .. Solo play disconects entireky from mmo
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