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The Secret World

The Secret World 

General Discussion  » TSW PvP - Can't stand the heat get out the kitchen.

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63 posts found
  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 6960

 
OP  7/26/12 8:34:58 PM#41
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by ShakyMo
 

name a successful 100% PVE game.

Everquest.  It may be old and subs are probably dwindelling now, but back in the day it was the king. I think that purely PvE games now would not do so well though, which is why I feel like TSW will be just something that people will forget about in a month.

It's been a month. First major update in 5 days with the second coming a month from that. TSW will still be the most highly rated game on this site one month from now.

  Celcius

Novice Member

Joined: 7/20/04
Posts: 929

7/26/12 8:46:39 PM#42
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by ShakyMo
 

name a successful 100% PVE game.

Everquest.  It may be old and subs are probably dwindelling now, but back in the day it was the king. I think that purely PvE games now would not do so well though, which is why I feel like TSW will be just something that people will forget about in a month.

It's been a month. First major update in 5 days with the second coming a month from that. It will still be the most highly rated game on this site one month from now.

Not really sure where you got that TSW is the most highly rated game on this site...The game is #2 on most popular and waaay down the list on the review scores..Not that it matters though, this site is mostly garbage when it comes to those kinds of things anyways. I would pay more attention to sites that are bigger like IGN,Gamespot,Gametrailers,ect. Yeah I know alot of the MMO reviews from most mainstream sites are crap to people like you and me, but to the average gamer who buys a new game they matter alot. Check out the gripes they have specifically on combat.

Edit: Did not check under the "released" category and i see what you were referencing now, but it does not matter. That changes pretty frequently  Again though, my argument stands. The sample size for the voting pool is way too small anyways (about 460 to Rift's 860) so its not very accurate.

The update isnt that major honestly. Auction house that was done pre-launch but was taken out since it was broken, like 6-7 new missions? (45 minutes lol) And a couple of heroic modes for some dungeons...not really a major update if you ask me. Also, while they did claim there would be monthly updates alot of people seem to haven taken this out of context. They wont have content patches with the amount of content in each pay say a game like Rift has. (closest comparison if they do monthly patches since Rift averages about 6-8 weeks each patch) 

This is actually what they said:

Mission packs on a monthly basis! The first few packs will contain new investigations for every adventure zone in the game -- but we also have more action and sabotage missions planned for the near future. These missions will feature fully voiced cut-scenes and new media pop-ups, and will match the quality of the missions currently in the game

They did not include anything on that huge bulleted list in the "monthly update" category except for this. And this is Funcom saying this. One of the few game developers still dumb enough to promise a list of content before it is even close to ready. If they keep up with the monthly updates (beyond mission packs, honestly that is a joke) then I will eat my hat.

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 6960

 
OP  7/26/12 10:06:22 PM#43
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by ShakyMo
 

name a successful 100% PVE game.

Everquest.  It may be old and subs are probably dwindelling now, but back in the day it was the king. I think that purely PvE games now would not do so well though, which is why I feel like TSW will be just something that people will forget about in a month.

It's been a month. First major update in 5 days with the second coming a month from that. It will still be the most highly rated game on this site one month from now.

Not really sure where you got that TSW is the most highly rated game on this site...The game is #2 on most popular and waaay down the list on the review scores..

Ok man your getting hard to talk to. Your not even trying to be truthful.

 

Look at the front page under released games what do you see? Rated by the users on this site. Take care.

 

 

  Ortwig

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/20/12
Posts: 1031

7/26/12 10:26:32 PM#44
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by ShakyMo
 

name a successful 100% PVE game.

Everquest.  It may be old and subs are probably dwindelling now, but back in the day it was the king. I think that purely PvE games now would not do so well though, which is why I feel like TSW will be just something that people will forget about in a month.

It's been a month. First major update in 5 days with the second coming a month from that. It will still be the most highly rated game on this site one month from now.

Not really sure where you got that TSW is the most highly rated game on this site...The game is #2 on most popular and waaay down the list on the review scores..Not that it matters though, this site is mostly garbage when it comes to those kinds of things anyways. I would pay more attention to sites that are bigger like IGN,Gamespot,Gametrailers,ect. Yeah I know alot of the MMO reviews from most mainstream sites are crap to people like you and me, but to the average gamer who buys a new game they matter alot. Check out the gripes they have specifically on combat.

Edit: Did not check under the "released" category and i see what you were referencing now, but it does not matter. That changes pretty frequently  Again though, my argument stands. The sample size for the voting pool is way too small anyways (about 460 to Rift's 860) so its not very accurate.

The update isnt that major honestly. Auction house that was done pre-launch but was taken out since it was broken, like 6-7 new missions? (45 minutes lol) And a couple of heroic modes for some dungeons...not really a major update if you ask me. Also, while they did claim there would be monthly updates alot of people seem to haven taken this out of context. They wont have content patches with the amount of content in each pay say a game like Rift has. (closest comparison if they do monthly patches since Rift averages about 6-8 weeks each patch) 

This is actually what they said:

Mission packs on a monthly basis! The first few packs will contain new investigations for every adventure zone in the game -- but we also have more action and sabotage missions planned for the near future. These missions will feature fully voiced cut-scenes and new media pop-ups, and will match the quality of the missions currently in the game

They did not include anything on that huge bulleted list in the "monthly update" category except for this. And this is Funcom saying this. One of the few game developers still dumb enough to promise a list of content before it is even close to ready. If they keep up with the monthly updates (beyond mission packs, honestly that is a joke) then I will eat my hat.

Dude, why are you still on The Secret World forum?  How about going over and enthusing under GW2 for awhile?

  Ambros123

Novice Member

Joined: 12/04/11
Posts: 891

7/26/12 10:40:59 PM#45
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Worstluck

OP, I realize you love this game and have become emotionally invested in it, but TSW pvp that consists of two battlegrounds, a persistent pvp zone that has amounted to token grinding, and dueling area is not something I consider fun. 

 

As far as flexibility, it is no way shape or form comparable to eve online.  The amount of ships and ways to build a ship are staggering when compared to the few viable builds for pvp in TSW.  I am not sure how you can even make that comparison--the only way you could is if you have never really played Eve or gotten very far. 

 

The game is not sandboxy in the least.  Once everyone has all the skills, which they will because there is no other progression, it will be just like every other thempark game in terms of PvP...people will find what build works and use it.

 if you think there are only 3 or 4 viablr builds you hvae not played enough. 

If you think there are only 3 or 4 viable builds you have not learned the system. There is no other way to put it.

 

There are no two builds the same. Go to the chornicle sit and find me two identical builds in the top 40 of any catagory. You wont find it. Hundreds of thousands of players and no two are made the same. Pretty cool and pretty sandboxy if you ask me. 

 

You say a lot here with no substance. There is no other mmo other than eve that gives you the flexibility in build as TSW. Plus you have people for avatars... 

Wake up an smell the coffee, if you think TSW isn't going to be ruled by FOTM builds then you have another thing coming. 

  AIMonster

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/31/08
Posts: 2002

7/26/12 10:41:37 PM#46

TSW's PvP is way too simplistic at it's core mainly because of how the combat system pigeonholed just about every aspect of the game.  Having played both extensively I can't see how anyone can compare GW2's PvP and TSW's PvP and say TSW's PvP is better.  I can maybe understand if you were talking about PvE, but GW2's PvP is in a league of it's own.

Guild Wars 2 has more flexibility in build options (TSW's overall skill system is great, but the current design of it forces you into only very specific and select builds to be effective), much more team dynamics, faster more action oriented gameplay, less "I win" rotations, massive siege warfare, gear equality in structured PvP (anyone who thinks you need vertical progression in PvP isn't a true PvPer in my eyes), tournaments, and is attempting to break into Esports following.

What does TSW's PvP have over Guild Wars 2?  Leaderboards.

Raptr link because it's the cool new trend:

  Worstluck

Novice Member

Joined: 1/29/11
Posts: 1280

No man controls my destiny... especially not one who attacks downwind and stinks of garlic.

7/26/12 10:58:18 PM#47
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Worstluck

OP, I realize you love this game and have become emotionally invested in it, but TSW pvp that consists of two battlegrounds, a persistent pvp zone that has amounted to token grinding, and dueling area is not something I consider fun. 

 

As far as flexibility, it is no way shape or form comparable to eve online.  The amount of ships and ways to build a ship are staggering when compared to the few viable builds for pvp in TSW.  I am not sure how you can even make that comparison--the only way you could is if you have never really played Eve or gotten very far. 

 

The game is not sandboxy in the least.  Once everyone has all the skills, which they will because there is no other progression, it will be just like every other thempark game in terms of PvP...people will find what build works and use it.

 if you think there are only 3 or 4 viablr builds you hvae not played enough. 

If you think there are only 3 or 4 viable builds you have not learned the system. There is no other way to put it.

 

There are no two builds the same. Go to the chornicle sit and find me two identical builds in the top 40 of any catagory. You wont find it. Hundreds of thousands of players and no two are made the same. Pretty cool and pretty sandboxy if you ask me. 

 

You say a lot here with no substance. There is no other mmo other than eve that gives you the flexibility in build as TSW. Plus you have people for avatars... 

 

 

 

 

 

You know what, you are right, I have not played TSW as much as you have I will admit that.  I didn't care for it in the end.  I loved the story and missions--just sick of instances and gear grinds.

 

Do you realize how many ships there are in Eve Online?  Here is abreakdown of just the basic ship classes in the game:

 

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Ship

 

Now a lot of ship classes are further broken down into various factions, amarr, gallente, caldari, minmatar, pirate factions and so forth.  There are very few ships that have no use at some level, and of course not every single ship was created with PvP in mind (but what is great about eve is that every ship can be involved in pvp in some way, some how).  All of these ships have various slots for modules, and there A LOT of different kinds of modules.  Every single module even has various levels power.  The sheer combination of ships and modules is insane.  This is complexity a themepark game like TSW can never achieve.

Now...we have skills.  Every category of course has different types of skills.  Again not everything is meant for pvp, but most skills do have some effect on pvp in some way.  I would imagine that almost every single character that has been playing for a decent amount has a slightly different skill set.   I have several characters that are years old all with totally different skill sets.  You will barely ever run into two people with the same skills in pvp.  Similar of course, but most likely different.  TSW does not have this complexity I am sorry.  At the end of day, every character in TSW that has been playing for a few months will have the same exact skills.  You have choice of what skills to put on your hotbar, but that is it.  There are going to be builds that are stronger than others.  This will limit that amount of variety you see.  Many of the skills in different weapons even do the same thing.  They repeat each other.  Just depends on if what weapon skin you want.

 

There is so much choice in Eve when it comes to pvp.  Sure there are OP ships here and there, but I have gotten by just fine flying what the hell I want when I want.  That is a sandbox.

 

There is some substance for you.  I even bothered to link things :) Instead of telling me to go prove your own point.  You provided absolutely no evidence in your OP that PvP in TSW is somehow hard, or that it is even complex or different than every other themepark game that has come out in recent times.  You just stated things, which was your opinion.

 

I have no problem with TSW, it's a fine game.  But PvP is not it's strong point and to be honest I think they should just focus on creating new story content and missions/raids/instances and drop the idea of making more pvp and trying to balance skills for pvp.  Keep what they have, make some changes to Fusang so it's not a facility trade I suppose.

  Lypheus

Novice Member

Joined: 1/23/04
Posts: 84

7/26/12 11:08:53 PM#48

PvP is hard?

Wow, guess I'm that good :).

Here's my 'winning' strategy, I basically 3 shot ppl and,  with very few exceptions, win while they are still down.

Touchdown! -> Beatdown -> Haymaker -> Wild At Heart.

Just for kicks, I run Epicenter just in case i'm not landing the usual 3-5k initial haymaker or WaH.

That's not to say you cannot theory craft all sorts of win conditions to beat that - good luck implementing them in a fight, 9/10 I have no issues reaching and KD'ing the target.

Fun game, very poor PvP options atm though, FP is getting pretty long in the tooth as-is and good luck queueing for the other two instances.

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 6960

 
OP  7/26/12 11:29:06 PM#49
Originally posted by Worstluck
snip

I am a fan of EvE. I know how deep the system is. It's ships though. Not people. We all know EvE is the exception to the rule. As I've said no system other than EvE will provide you more flexibility. 

 

read the OP again...

  Celcius

Novice Member

Joined: 7/20/04
Posts: 929

7/27/12 3:09:48 AM#50
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by ShakyMo
 

name a successful 100% PVE game.

Everquest.  It may be old and subs are probably dwindelling now, but back in the day it was the king. I think that purely PvE games now would not do so well though, which is why I feel like TSW will be just something that people will forget about in a month.

It's been a month. First major update in 5 days with the second coming a month from that. It will still be the most highly rated game on this site one month from now.

Not really sure where you got that TSW is the most highly rated game on this site...The game is #2 on most popular and waaay down the list on the review scores..

Ok man your getting hard to talk to. Your not even trying to be truthful.

 

Look at the front page under released games what do you see? Rated by the users on this site. Take care.

 

 

You clearly did not read my post. I went in shortly after posting that I saw what you were talking about and let you know of my mistake. I had to give you some credit, i mean you are clearly out of your league here when it comes to the gameplay in TSW being garbarge.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

7/27/12 4:06:58 AM#51
Magnum:
True build flexibility (this everyone uses AR thing is bullshit, a lot of pugging noobs use it because they think "yay self heals")
Leaderboards, although I've never looked at them
No e sports (i don't co side ramming a square e sports peg in a round mmo hole a win)
I CAN SEE THE NAMES OF WHO I AM FIGHTING

But overall gw2 has the better pvp, but its not the pinnacle of mmo pvp gaming that the fanbois make out. It's the best pvp in a good few years, but it aint no daoc, eve or planetside for 3.
  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

7/27/12 4:08:55 AM#52
Like reviews have any credibility

Swtor
Diablo3

They must be ace them 2 the reviewers say so.
  Ash23Neuro

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/07
Posts: 13

7/27/12 5:17:46 AM#53

I don't defend TSW by accusing GW2 of being asian. I base my opinon on what I've already seen (http://guildwars2.com.pl/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/hero-asura.jpg). In fact I dont care about GW2 at all. But I heard from my friends thats it's designed for PvP so by PvPers should go there (its possible make bomb squads like in WAR and schorch whole zergs of people). I dont know who develops this title (becasue I dont care). I hope that people who wait for this game will enjoy it. I realy do.

I enjoy TSW as it is because I like the game in general. I like modern setting, ocult stuff, secret war, fluff etc. This game is out for one month now. There is plenty cool features to implement.

  Ash23Neuro

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/07
Posts: 13

7/27/12 7:35:07 AM#54
Originally posted by Celcius
Originally posted by ash23neuro

If someone looks for pure PvP game I hope GW2 will deliver. Personaly I don't like GW2 setting inspired by asian fantasy pop culture.

 

GW2 is not inspired by asian fantasy pop culture. I really hate when people assume this just because NC Soft is publishing the game. ArenaNet is an American company and has always been one. Guild Wars 2 fantasy setting is based off the GW1 fantasy setting, which was being developed by Triforge (the name of the company before it became ArenaNet) by a group of developers who used to be at Blizzard. That company was making GW1 before they were even acquired by NC Soft, so there is no way it is even remotely designed with an asian fantasy setting in mind. NC Soft West is actually the publisher for Guild Wars, which is located in Seattle. So if you want to defend your game properly I suggest a stronger argument then "GW2 IS ASIAN GAME!" Saying that GW2 is a "pure pvp" game also shows your ignorance on the subject.

My above post is answer to this post.

  DonY81

Novice Member

Joined: 10/31/08
Posts: 332

7/27/12 7:42:02 AM#55

I need to know, what is rewarding from PVP??????

 

Is there leaderboards..????...Personally i always need a goal ingame, RL or anything.

  sfc1971

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/05/08
Posts: 422

7/27/12 8:26:50 AM#56
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by sfc1971

I used a blade/fist build, I took my sword and just started swinging and I won.

Favorite bit, dying, respawning and jumping right back in with AoE sword swinging. Upsets all the kids who think tactics and strategy matter when faced with someone who doesn't care about win/loss ratio that isn't tracked anyway, thank Odin!

TSW PvP is frantic mad rush vs frantic mad rush. Exhaustive fun. 

Shotgun, close range stun is nice too, they think because you carry a gun, you won't just dive straight in and go insane. But I do :P

 

Wins losses and kills are tracked on TSW Chronicles. Hmmm.

http://chronicle.thesecretworld.com/

Leader boards

 

it's early sorry if I misunderstood.

Didn't know that, hope it doesn't turn into star hugging (Lotro PvP gave people with a high kill ration stars, resulting in people who would tag enemy players with an AoE skill, then run away to get a kill credit without actually killing anyone themselves.

  Mad+Dog

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/02/10
Posts: 653

7/27/12 8:29:38 AM#57

pvp in any tab 123 game does not exist

 

/thread

  Worstluck

Novice Member

Joined: 1/29/11
Posts: 1280

No man controls my destiny... especially not one who attacks downwind and stinks of garlic.

7/27/12 8:38:44 AM#58
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Worstluck
snip

I am a fan of EvE. I know how deep the system is. It's ships though. Not people. We all know EvE is the exception to the rule. As I've said no system other than EvE will provide you more flexibility. 

 

read the OP again...

 

You have edited your orginal post to now fit your arguement and unfortunately no one quoted it.  Originally you had said it was comparable to Eve Online, now you have changed it to say that TSW is still complex, but not as complex as Eve's. 

 

Oh it's ships?  Really I didn't know that.  What about being a human avatar makes the pvp challenging or complex?  This is the best reply you can come up with?

 

I think we are done here mate.  Have fun with your simplistic pvp game of pressing 1234 and hoping for some crits before the CC wears out.  As I have also said, TSW is fine game, but it's no pvp game.  If you are going to advertise for the game, highlight it's strengths, do not try to market it's weaknesses in an attempt to make it look better than it actually is.

  EvolvedMonky

Novice Member

Joined: 8/25/08
Posts: 562

7/27/12 9:08:56 AM#59

TSW PvP killed the game for me... The missions are cool but pvp is a joke.  Sword aoe spam ftw. Why the f would you put a hard hitting aoe with no cooldown.  And the CC, if there is a CC immunity timer then it doesnt work for my char.  More than a few times Ive been stun locked by two people and died just standing there.

 

At first i thought it was cool cause I was going against noobs who I would position myself behind them and dodge as I kept him in my LoS while i did my melee channel. Thought it was cool until i experienced real pvp.

It consist of three builds 2 of em are for group pvp and only one is the Uber 1vs1 even 1vs3 if they opponent doesnt have this build.

Blood and Rifle (as in blood + anything or rifle + Anything) are the two that must be in a group to win pvp and your group will pwn all.

The uber build is sword + anything. And just do the AoE spam on it, hell it even gets an aoe stun.  Ive seen whole groups of nothing but aoe sword spammers and total dominate unique groups. 

Dodge, positioning all pointless.....AOE SWORD SPAM FTW

  Celcius

Novice Member

Joined: 7/20/04
Posts: 929

7/27/12 2:55:07 PM#60
Originally posted by Ash23Neuro

I don't defend TSW by accusing GW2 of being asian. I base my opinon on what I've already seen (http://guildwars2.com.pl/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/hero-asura.jpg). In fact I dont care about GW2 at all. But I heard from my friends thats it's designed for PvP so by PvPers should go there (its possible make bomb squads like in WAR and schorch whole zergs of people). I dont know who develops this title (becasue I dont care). I hope that people who wait for this game will enjoy it. I realy do.

I enjoy TSW as it is because I like the game in general. I like modern setting, ocult stuff, secret war, fluff etc. This game is out for one month now. There is plenty cool features to implement.

So you are saying that you were wrong about it being based off asian fantasy? Thanks for clarifying. Also since you "heard from your friends" that its a PvP only game I would suggest leaving GW2 out of any part of your argument entirely since you clearly know absolutely nothing about it.  For a "PvP only" game, GW2 certainly blows TSW PvE out of the water in terms of fun and challenge.

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