Trending Games | Elder Scrolls Online | WildStar | Star Wars: The Old Republic | Heroes of the Storm

  Network:  FPSguru RTSguru
Login:  Password:   Remember?  
Show Quick Gamelist Jump to Random Game
Members:2,643,567 Users Online:0
Games:681  Posts:6,077,278
Recent forum postsRSS
Active threads
Cloud view
List all forums
General Forums
Developers Corner General Discussion
Popular Game Forums
Click a status to find game forum
Game Forums
Click a letter to find game forum
A-C
2029 Online 2112: Revolution 2Moons 4Story 8BitMMO 9 Dragons A Mystical Land A Tale in the Desert III A3 ACE Online ARGO Online Aberoth Absolute Force Online Absolute Terror Achaea Adellion Aerrevan Aetolia, the Midnight Age Age of Armor Age of Conan Age of Empires Online Age of Mourning Age of Wulin Age of Wushu Aida Arenas Aika Aion Albion Online Alganon All Points Bulletin (APB) Allods Online Altis Gates Amazing World Anarchy Online Ancients of Fasaria Andromeda 5 Angels Online Anime Trumps Anmynor Anno Online Applo Arcane Hearts Arcane Legends ArchLord ArcheAge Archeblade Archlord X Asda 2 Asda Story Ashen Empires Asheron's Call Asheron's Call 2 Astera Online Astonia III Astro Empires Astro Lords: Oort CLoud Asura Force Atlantica Online Atriarch Aura Kingdom Aurora Blade Auto Assault Avatar Star Battle Dawn Battle Dawn Galaxies Battle for Graxia Battle of 3 Kingdoms Battle of the Immortals Battlecruiser Online Battlestar Galactica Online Battlestar Reloaded Beyond Protocol Black Aftermath Black Desert Black Gold Black Prophecy Black Prophecy Tactics: Nexus Conflict Blacklight Retribution Blade & Soul Blade Hunter Blade Wars Blazing Throne Bless Blitz 1941 Blood and Jade Bloodlines Champions Bounty Bay Online Brain Storm Brawl Busters. Brick-Force Bright Shadow Bullet Run Business Tycoon Online CTRacer Cabal Online Caesary Call of Camelot Call of Gods Call of Thrones Camelot Unchained Canaan Online Cardmon Hero Cartoon Universe CasinoRPG Castle Empire Castlot Celtic Heroes Champions Online Champions of Regnum Chaos Online Chrono Tales Citadel of Sorcery CitiesXL Citizen Zero City of Decay City of Heroes City of Steam City of Transformers City of Villains Civilization Online Clan Lord Clash of Clans Cloud Nine Club Penguin Colony of War Command & Conquer: Tiberium Alliances Company of Heroes Online Conquer Online Conquer Online 3 Continent of the Ninth (C9) Core Blaze Core Exiles Corum Online Craft of Gods Crimecraft Crimelife 2 Cronous Crota II Cultures Online Cyber Monster 2 Céiron Wars
D-F
D&D Online DC Universe DK Online DOTA DOTA 2 DUST 514 DV8: Exile Dalethaan Dance Groove Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark Ages Dark Legends Dark Orbit Dark Relic: Prelude Dark Solstice Dark and Light DarkEden Online DarkSpace Darkblood Online Darkest Dungeon Darkfall Darkfall: Unholy Wars Darkwind: War on Wheels Das Tal Dawn of Fantasy Dawntide DayZ Dead Earth Dead Frontier Deco Online Deepworld Defiance Deicide Online Dekaron Demons at the Horizon Desert Operations Destiny Diablo 3 Diamonin Digimon Battle Dino Storm Disciple Divergence Divina Divine Souls Dofus Dominus Online Dragon Ball Online Dragon Born Online Dragon Crusade Dragon Empires Dragon Eternity Dragon Nest Dragon Oath Dragon Pals Dragon Raja Dragon's Call Dragon's Call II Dragon's Prophet DragonSky DragonSoul Dragona Dragonica Dragons and Titans Dream of Mirror Online Dreamland Online Dreamlords: The Reawakening Drift City Duels Dungeon Blitz Dungeon Fighter Online Dungeon Overlord Dungeon Party Dungeon Rampage Dungeon Runners Dynastica Dynasty Warriors Online Dynasty of the Magi EIN (Epicus Incognitus) EVE Online Earth Eternal Earth and Beyond Earthrise Eclipse War Ecol Tactics Online Eden Eternal Edge of Space Einherjar - The Viking's Blood Elder Scrolls Online Eldevin Elf Online Elite: Dangerous Embers of Caerus Emil Chronicle Online Empire Empire & State Empire Craft Empire Universe 3 EmpireQuest Empires of Galldon End of Nations Endless Ages Endless Blue Moon Online Endless Online Entropia Universe EpicDuel Erebus: Travia Reborn Eredan Eternal Blade Eternal Lands Eternal Saga Ether Fields Ether Saga Online Eudemons Online EuroGangster EverEmber Online EverQuest Next EverQuest Online Adventures Evernight Everquest Everquest II Everquest Next: Landmark Evony Exarch Exorace F.E.A.R. Online Face of Mankind Fairyland Online Fall of Rome Fallen Earth Fallen Sword Fallout Online Family Guy Online Fantage Fantasy Earth Zero Fantasy Realm Online Fantasy Tales Online Fantasy Worlds: Rhynn Faunasphere Faxion Online Ferentus Ferion Fiesta Online Final Fantasy XI Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn Firefall Fists of Fu Florensia Flyff Football Manager Live Football Superstars Force of Arms Forge Forsaken World Fortnite Fortuna Forum for Discussion of Everlight Freaky Creatures Free Realms Freesky Online Freeworld Fung Wan Online Furcadia Fury Fusion Fall
G-L
GalaXseeds Galactic Command Online Game of Thrones: Seven Kingdoms Gameglobe Gate To Heavens Gates of Andaron Gatheryn Gauntlet Gekkeiju Online Ghost Online Ghost Recon Online Gladiatus Glitch Global Agenda Global Soccer Gloria Victis Glory of Gods GoGoRacer Goal Line Blitz Gods and Heroes GodsWar Online Golemizer Golf Star GoonZu Online Graal Kingdoms Granado Espada Online Grand Chase Grand Fantasia Grepolis Grimlands Guild Wars Guild Wars 2 Guild Wars Factions Guild Wars Nightfall H1Z1 Habbo Hotel Hailan Rising HaloSphere2 Haven & Hearth Hawken Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft Helbreath Hellgate Hellgate: London Hello Kitty Online Hero Online Hero Zero Hero's Journey Hero: 108 Online HeroSmash Heroes & Generals Heroes in the Sky Heroes of Bestia Heroes of Gaia Heroes of Might and Magic Online Heroes of Thessalonica Heroes of Three Kingdoms Heroes of the Storm Hex Holic Online Hostile Space Hunter Blade Huxley Illutia Illyriad Immortals USA Imperator Imperian Inferno Legend Infestation: Survivor Stories Infinite Crisis Infinity Infinity Iris Online Iron Grip: Marauders Irth Worlds Island Forge Islands of War Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted Jade Dynasty Jagged Alliance Online Juggernaut Jumpgate Jumpgate Evolution KAL Online Kakele Online Kaos War Karos Online Kartuga Kicks Online King of Kings 3 Kingdom Heroes Kingdom Under Fire II Kingdom of Drakkar Kingory Kings and Legends KingsRoad Kitsu Saga Kiwarriors Knight Age Knight Online Knights of Dream City Kothuria Kung Foo! Kunlun Online L.A.W. LEGO Universe La Tale Land of Chaos Online Lands of Hope: Phoenix Edition LastChaos League of Angels League of Legends - Clash of Fates Legend of Edda: Vengeance Legend of Golden Plume Legend of Katha Legend of Mir 2 Legend of Mir 3 Legendary Champions Lego Minifigures Online Life is Feudal Light of Nova Lime Odyssey Line of Defense Lineage Lineage Eternal: Twilight Resistance Lineage II Linkrealms Loong Online Lord of the Rings Online Lords Online Lost Saga Lucent Heart Lunia Lusternia: Age of Ascension Luvinia World
M-Q
MU Online Mabinogi Maestia: Rise of Keledus MagiKnights Magic Barrage Magic World Online Manga Fighter MapleStory Martial Heroes Marvel Heroes Marvel Super Hero Squad Online Marvel: Avengers Alliance MechWarrior Online Megaten Meridian 59 : Evolution Merlin MetalMercs Metaplace Metin 2 MicroVolts Midkemia Online Might & Magic Heroes: Kingdoms MilMo Minecraft Mini Fighter Minions of Mirth Ministry of War Monato Esprit Monkey King Online Monkey Quest Monster & Me Monster Madness Online MonsterMMORPG Moonlight Online: Tales of Eternal Blood Mordavia Mortal Online Mourning My Lands Myst Online: URU Live Myth Angels Online Myth War Myth War 2 Mytheon Mythic Saga Mythos N.E.O Online NIDA Online Nadirim Naviage: The Power of Capital Navy Field Need for Speed World Nemexia Neo's Land NeoSteam Neocron Nether Neverwinter Nexus: The Kingdom Of The Winds NinjaTrick NosTale Novus Aeterno Oberin Odin Quest Odyssey RPG Ogre Island Omerta 3 Online Boxing Manager Onverse Order & Chaos Online Order of Magic Original Blood Origins Return Origins of Malu Orion's Belt Otherland Forums OverSoul Overkings Oz Online Oz World Pandora Saga Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen Panzar Parabellum Parallel Kingdom Parfait Station Path of Exile Pathfinder Online Perfect World Perpetuum Online Phantasy Star Online 2 Phantasy Star Universe Phoenix Dynasty Online Phylon Pi Story Picaroon Pirate Galaxy Pirate Storm Pirate101 PirateKing Online Pirates of the Burning Sea Pirates of the Caribbean Online Pixie Hollow Planeshift Planet Arkadia Planet Calypso PlanetSide 2 Planetside Planets³ Playboy Manager Pocket Legends Pockie Ninja Pockie Pirates Pockie Saints PoxNora Prime World Prime: Battle for Dominus Priston Tale Priston Tale II Prius Online Project Blackout Project Powder Project Titan Forums Project Wiki Puzzle Pirates Quickhit Football
R-S
R2 Online RAN Online RF Online ROSE Online Rage of 3 Kingdoms Ragnarok Online Ragnarok Online II RaiderZ Rakion Rappelz RappelzSEA Realm Fighter Realm of the Mad God Realm of the Titans Realms Online Reclamation Red Stone Red War: Edem's Curse Regnum Online Remnant Knights Renaissance Repulse Requiem: Memento Mori Rift RiotZone Rise Rise of Dragonian Era Rise of Empire Rise of the Tycoon Rising of King Risk Your Life Rivality Rockfree Rohan: Blood Feud Role Play Worlds Roll n Rock Roma Victor Romadoria Rosh Online Roto X Rubies of Eventide Ruin Online Rumble Fighter Runes of Magic Runescape Rust Rusty Hearts Ryzom S4 League SAGA SD Gundam Capsule Fighter Online SMITE SUN Sagramore Salem SaySayGirls Scarlet Blade Scions of Fate Seal Online: Evolution Second Life Secret of the Solstice Seed Serenia Fantasy Seven Seas Saga Seven Souls Online Sevencore Shadow of Legend Shadowbane Shadowrun Online Shaiya Shattered Galaxy Sho Online Shot Online Shroud of the Avatar SideQuest Siege on Stars Sigonyth: Desert Eternity Silkroad Online Skyblade Skyforge SmashMuck Champions Smoo Online Soldier Front Soul Master Soul Order Online Soul of Guardian Space Heroes Universe Spellcasters Sphere Spiral Knights Spirit Tales Splash Fighters Squad Wars Star Citizen Star Sonata 2 Star Stable Star Supremacy Star Trek Online Star Trek: Infinite Space Star Wars Galaxies Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures Star Wars: The Old Republic StarQuest Online Stargate Worlds Starlight Story Starpires State of Decay SteelWar Online Stone Age 2 Stormfall: Age of War Storybricks Stronghold Kingdoms Sudden Attack Supremacy 1914 Supreme Destiny Sword Girls Sword of Destiny: Rise of Aions SwordX Swords of Heavens Swordsman
T-Z
TERA TS Online Tabula Rasa Tactica Online Tales Runner Tales of Fantasy Tales of Pirates Tales of Pirates II Tales of Solaris Talisman Online Tamer Saga Tank Ace Tantra Online Tatsumaki: Land at War Terra Militaris TerraWorld Online Thang Online The 4th Coming The Agency The Aurora World The Black Watchmen The Chronicle The Chronicles of Spellborn The Crew The Division The Hammers End The Legend of Ares The Lost Titans The Matrix Online The Mighty Quest for Epic Loot The Missing Ink The Mummy Online The Myth of Soma The Pride of Taern The Realm Online The Repopulation The Secret World The Sims Online The Strategems The West Theralon There Therian Saga Thrones of Chaos Tibia Tibia Micro Edition Tiger Knight Titan Siege Titans of Time Toontown Online Top Speed Topia Online Torchlight Total Domination Transformers Universe Traveller AR Travia Online Travian Trials of Ascension Tribal Hero Tribal Wars Tribes Universe Trickster Online Trove Troy Online True Fantasy Live Online Turf Battles Twelve Sky Twelve Sky 2 Twilight War Tynon U.B. Funkeys UFO Online URDEAD Online Ultima Forever: Quest for the Avatar Ultima Online Ultima X: Odyssey Ultimate Naruto Ultimate Soccer Boss Uncharted Waters Online Undercover 2: Merc Wars Underlight Unification Wars Universe Online Utopia Valkyrie Sky Vampire Lord Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Vanquish Space Vector City Racers Vendetta Online Victory - Age of Racing Vindictus Virtonomics Vis Gladius Visions of Zosimos VoidExpanse Voyage Century Online W.E.L.L. Online WAR (Warhammer Online) WAR2 Glory WYD Global Wakfu War Thunder War of 2012 War of Angels War of Legends War of Mercenaries War of Thrones War of the Immortals WarFlow Waren Story Wargame1942 Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium Online Warhammer Online: Wrath of Heroes Warkeepers Warrior Epic Wartune WebLords Wild West Online WildStar Wind of Luck WindSlayer 2 Wings of Destiny Wish Wizard101 Wizardry Online Wizards and Champions Wonder King Wonderland Online World Golf Tour World of Battles World of Darkness World of Heroes World of Kung Fu World of Pirates World of Speed World of Tanks World of Tanks Generals World of Warcraft World of Warplanes World of Warships World of the Living Dead WorldAlpha Wurm Online Xenocell Xiah Xsyon Xulu YS Online Yitien ZU Online Zentia Zero Online Zero Online: The Andromeda Crisis Zodiac Online Zombies Ate My Pizza eRepublik

MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

General Discussion

General Discussion 

The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Can't have that "feeling" without harsh death penalty

7 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Search
121 posts found
  kjempff

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/04
Posts: 640

Make worlds not stories

7/10/12 6:01:54 PM#61

I recently played everquest again for a year on progression servers.

After a month there was a vote if people wanted harsh death penalties (including corpse runs to regain your gear), the vote became a no and therefore penalties were changed to keeping gear and a light xp penalty. Its no secret that 99% of players on progression servers were returning players, but these still wanted ease when presented with the choise - The point here is the choise, when given two options most would choose the easier one always, but it has little to do with what gives them the best experience.

 

I didnt think it was a big deal so I didnt care at the time, but it did change the game for me, I became careless and therefore less involved in my character. The sense of danger was not present, and I would fearlessly run though areas because all that could happen was I landed at my bind spot having to run back. One good thing it brought was that trains were not very frequent, because you could efford to die deep in a dungeon.

 

So, I played for a year still and had a good time, so harsh death penalties were not a deciding factor. What I am trying to say, harsh death penalties are not THE thing that gives immersion, but it really does alot.

What I am thinking is.. I really dont want to go back to 6 hour corpse runs, but I want harsh penalties, so death without armor is a no go and probably is for most, but I would still like a serious xp hit which create some degreee of fear - By serious, something like half an hour in a xp group, and with the option to do a corpse run/resourrection to reduce the loss. Actually very close to what the progression servers rules are now, except on these the xp penalty is hardly noticable.

  Velocinox

Elite Member

Joined: 3/15/06
Posts: 589

7/10/12 6:07:32 PM#62

Stop trying to make other people play the game you think is fun.

 

Let them play their game and make the changes you can to make your game fun. Trying to change other people's opinions is a fool's mission.

 


Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by Garvon3

Originally posted by SuperXero89 If I have to grind more just to placate your ability to feel immersed, screw your immersion.
Right so... let's just make it so that if you log in... you automatically get to max level, get all the gear in the game.. and uh... all bosses die in one hit! Yeah, let's get rid of any kind of chance or penalty for failure!
Now, now. Don't you know that everyone deserves a trophy so that no one feels like they are lesser than anyone else? You are the worst possible and always come in last; no worries, here's a shiny ribbon to help shield your self-esteem from any sort of hit. Makes perfect sense, right?

 

You're making the same mistake most PvPers make and most people that tie their self-esteem to a stupid game.

It's not that people want a trophy for failing, It's that they don't care about trophies from a vidiot game

See, you measure your importance by how many noobs you pwnt in a virtual world.

We measure our importance by career success, by how happy our daughter is when we get home, and how much better we make our lives in the real world. We really don't care how we rank in an idle pastime we only engage in when we have some downtime to spend.

'Sandbox MMO' is a PTSD trigger word for anyone who has the experience to know that anonymous players invariably use a 'sandbox' in the same manner a housecat does.


No game is more fun than the one you can't play, and no game is more boring than the one you've become familiar with.


How to become a millionaire:
Start with a billion dollars and make an MMO.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 16610

7/10/12 6:18:23 PM#63
Originally posted by Velocinox

y is a big part of that.

So here's a thought...

Next time you want a thrill in an 'insanely boring' MMO, go with this personal rule:

If your character dies you DELETE it.

If you have the strength to hold to that conviction I am sure you will have all the in game ecxitement you can handle.

 

That doesn't make any sense. It's about players playing by the same rules, players all sharing similiar experiences.

It doesn't have any meanign if you die in the game and you delete your character where all the other characters all rez 20 feet away smelling of lavender.

As I've said numerous times, death penalties are personal things.

xp loss? Bah, give me xp loss, that is not a harsh death penatly. me getting a debuff that forces me to sit for 10 minutes because my character can't be effective? To me that's a harsh death penatly because it means I don't get to play. It also means I will eventually lose interest because my slap on the wrist means I go do something else. Drop items? Not too harsh as the can always be earned back.

I will say that for some (myself included) failure is a harsh death penatly. But for some people, they don't really feel failure, just the slap on the wrist.

I've also noticed that players won't retry encounters if they die once. Even if there isn't a harsh death penatly.

Death penalties only mean "something" to the people who find meanign in them. I died numerous times in L2 and just got back into the game (though once I died 6 times in a row and just had to put my toys away at that point) whereas in WoW I died twice in a row and just turned the game off because the tedious action of running back to my corpse was of no interest to me.

For my taste, as I've mentioned, all I need is the fear of failure. That actually has meaning. But others don't think so and we need artifical game constructs to enforce "what it means to fail".

  Velocinox

Elite Member

Joined: 3/15/06
Posts: 589

7/10/12 6:26:57 PM#64


Originally posted by Sovrath

Originally posted by Velocinox

y is a big part of that.
So here's a thought... Next time you want a thrill in an 'insanely boring' MMO, go with this personal rule: If your character dies you DELETE it. If you have the strength to hold to that conviction I am sure you will have all the in game ecxitement you can handle.  
It doesn't have any meanign if you die in the game and you delete your character where all the other characters all rez 20 feet away smelling of lavender.

...

all I need is the fear of failure. That actually has meaning.


 

You post is self-contradicting.

You say in one sentence that deleting your own character has no meaning to you unless all players face the same penalty.

However, you state in your post's closing, that all that really matters to you is the fear of failing.

If all that matters to you is the fear of failing, then why do you care how the other people play. Delete your character when it dies and you have plenty of fear about failing. Problem solved.

'Sandbox MMO' is a PTSD trigger word for anyone who has the experience to know that anonymous players invariably use a 'sandbox' in the same manner a housecat does.


No game is more fun than the one you can't play, and no game is more boring than the one you've become familiar with.


How to become a millionaire:
Start with a billion dollars and make an MMO.

  mmoguy43

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/31/09
Posts: 2255

7/10/12 6:28:49 PM#65
Originally posted by ReallyNow10
Originally posted by mmoguy43

Harsh penalties provides much less immersion than other things like more detail, sound, and music. Furthermore, MMOs are typically the most unimmersive types of games because of the other players. Why try to make MMOs more immersive with things that are not fun which don't add much immersion?

Instead of having old ideas resurface, don't you think it would be better to come up with new ones that still make the games fun to play?

Sorry, no to all of your points.

I really don't know why but sure

  Velocinox

Elite Member

Joined: 3/15/06
Posts: 589

7/10/12 6:37:20 PM#66


Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by Velocinox  You're making the same mistake most PvPers make and most people that tie their self-esteem to a stupid game. It's not that people want a trophy for failing, It's that they don't care about trophies from a vidiot game See, you measure your importance by how many noobs you pwnt in a virtual world. We measure our importance by career success, by how happy our daughter is when we get home, and how much better we make our lives in the real world. We really don't care how we rank in an idle pastime we only engage in when we have some downtime to spend.
Yes, that's me. I live my life through fucking video games and enjoy ruining the enjoyment of new players in every game I play. Sorry, bud. You do not know me well enough to make those calls. Nice try, Captain Assumptions. Here's your trophy. Well deserved.
 

You're the one that tied ones self-esteem to their success in a video game. Right there in your previous post.


Originally posted by Cecropia
Now, now. Don't you know that everyone deserves a trophy so that no one feels like they are lesser than anyone else? You are the worst possible and always come in last; no worries, here's a shiny ribbon to help shield your self-esteem from any sort of hit. Makes perfect sense, right?

I find it interesting that you got so defensive when the implication was returned in your direction.

'Sandbox MMO' is a PTSD trigger word for anyone who has the experience to know that anonymous players invariably use a 'sandbox' in the same manner a housecat does.


No game is more fun than the one you can't play, and no game is more boring than the one you've become familiar with.


How to become a millionaire:
Start with a billion dollars and make an MMO.

  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 10803

7/10/12 6:50:34 PM#67
Originally posted by Sovrath

I will say that for some (myself included) failure is a harsh death penatly. But for some people, they don't really feel failure, just the slap on the wrist.

I've also noticed that players won't retry encounters if they die once. Even if there isn't a harsh death penatly.

I have not noticed this

especially in DDO or dungeon crawls in EQ2, RIFT, etc

people die -- then zone back into the dungeon and proceed

 

in DDO, dead players need even more patience because they are ghost until another player brings their shard to shrine

 

 in Guild Wars 1 players died and got an accumulative death penalty but proceeded to the mission goals

  Dreamion

Novice Member

Joined: 6/13/07
Posts: 281

7/10/12 6:55:26 PM#68

The only real death penalty experience in a mmo that i've had comes from vanguard really, thought its not much, but dying deep into VT with no one to sum you and you know that you need to go all the way back to get some stuff back, really makes a unique feeling, i've actually never really thought about death penalties that hard, seeing this, makes me wonder.

  Cecropia

Gumshoe

Joined: 3/06/09
Posts: 3199

Poacher killer.

7/10/12 7:01:49 PM#69
Originally posted by Velocinox

 


Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by Velocinox  You're making the same mistake most PvPers make and most people that tie their self-esteem to a stupid game. It's not that people want a trophy for failing, It's that they don't care about trophies from a vidiot game See, you measure your importance by how many noobs you pwnt in a virtual world. We measure our importance by career success, by how happy our daughter is when we get home, and how much better we make our lives in the real world. We really don't care how we rank in an idle pastime we only engage in when we have some downtime to spend.
Yes, that's me. I live my life through fucking video games and enjoy ruining the enjoyment of new players in every game I play. Sorry, bud. You do not know me well enough to make those calls. Nice try, Captain Assumptions. Here's your trophy. Well deserved.

You're the one that tied ones self-esteem to their success in a video game. Right there in your previous post.


Originally posted by Cecropia
Now, now. Don't you know that everyone deserves a trophy so that no one feels like they are lesser than anyone else? You are the worst possible and always come in last; no worries, here's a shiny ribbon to help shield your self-esteem from any sort of hit. Makes perfect sense, right?

I find it interesting that you got so defensive when the implication was returned in your direction.

My comment was directed at a generation of perfectly raised wimps. It's the attitude and upbringing of the kind of nut that would actually take a self-esteem hit from something such as always losing in dodgeball or (another example) never prospering in a video game.

It was merely a wee bit of sarcasm, why you took it so literally is your business.

"Chuck's a good fighter but he's a UFC fighter... this is Pride." - Quinton Rampage Jackson
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb

  kantseeme

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/07/09
Posts: 739

7/10/12 8:28:58 PM#70
Originally posted by itgrowls

It occurred to me the reason why people want this feeling so much and the solution for the problem. Join the military and fight overseas specifically the army, then you'll have that feeling all the time. Otherwise i don't think that games will be adding this feature anytime soon.

 

In responce to "I dont think that games will be adding this feature anytime soon" i present you with the link below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h94QgkZcaLo&feature=player_embedded#!

 

 

And comparing troops fighting over seas to death penalty in MMOs? Bad form.

  MadnessRealm

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/02/09
Posts: 2684

Ignorance is Bliss.

7/10/12 8:34:26 PM#71
Originally posted by itgrowls

It occurred to me the reason why people want this feeling so much and the solution for the problem. Join the military and fight overseas specifically the army, then you'll have that feeling all the time. Otherwise i don't think that games will be adding this feature anytime soon.

Wizardry Online's doing it...permadeath to be more accurate. You've got Realm of the Mad God that does permanent death as well. DarkFall, MO, EVE have harsh death penality (lose everything you're carrying on death). Still, it's a niche genre, and just because you don't like it doesn't mean no MMO should try it.  It's not like someone's holding a gun to your head at point blank forcing you to play...

------
Your daily dose of common sense since 2009!

  tank017

Novice Member

Joined: 7/09/06
Posts: 2206

7/10/12 8:35:22 PM#72
When people die as a means to actually travel somewhere faster- which basically happens in every mmo these days- Then theres a problem.
  kantseeme

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/07/09
Posts: 739

7/10/12 8:36:45 PM#73
Originally posted by tank017
When people die as a means to actually travel somewhere faster- basically happens in every mmob these days-. Then theres a problem.

+1

  ReallyNow10

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 1471

If the reality ain't shared, it ain't an MMORPG.

 
OP  7/10/12 10:15:38 PM#74
Originally posted by gainesvilleg
Originally posted by ReallyNow10

Was listening to some old EQ midi music today, and the tune for the "Eerie Qeynos Catacombs" (as well as Befallen, as I recall) reminded me of the dread I felt and the hairs rising on the back of my neck when I ventured into those places.

http://www.mmotomb.com/music/everquest-music/

Why did I feel that way?  Because dying in game could really suck; you'd lose 20% of a level's worth of experience (i.e., about two hours of grinding to get back) and have to do a dangerous corpse run to get your gear back.  This made the scary eerie dungeons feel "scary" and "eerie".

Without the death penalty, there is none of that.  Therefore, I'll trade being frustrated 1% of the time in exchange for being heavily immersed the other 99% of the time; better than being slightly, sedately bored 100% of the time.

Remember, a stinging death penalty is not just about challenge, it's about immersion.

"Without the death penalty, there is none of that. Therefore, I'll trade being frustrated 1% of the time in exchange for being heavily immersed the other 99% of the time; better than being slightly, sedately bored 100% of the time." 

I absolutely 100% agree.  In fact I agree so much I wish I came up with that quote, as I would have made it my signature...

Thanks.  Feel free to use/modify that quote as your signature.

  dorugu

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/06/03
Posts: 121

7/10/12 10:35:01 PM#75

since yu want harsh death penalties yu culd either delete the char or one piece of yur equipped gear problem solved n think ow much immersion yull get  :)

i dun wan harsh death penalties thank you i find it irritatin enuff to get killed w/o aving penalties to deal with  as well

  ReallyNow10

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 1471

If the reality ain't shared, it ain't an MMORPG.

 
OP  7/10/12 10:39:08 PM#76
Originally posted by dorugu

since yu want harsh death penalties yu culd either delete the char or one piece of yur equipped gear problem solved n think ow much immersion yull get  :)

i dun wan harsh death penalties thank you i find it irritatin enuff to get killed w/o aving penalties to deal with  as well

Nope, silly ideas.  The idea is to feel immersed in the game world.  A MMORPG without a harsh death penalty is like touch football, ultimately lame, very lame.

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5164

Opportunist

7/10/12 10:49:23 PM#77
Originally posted by ReallyNow10

Was listening to some old EQ midi music today, and the tune for the "Eerie Qeynos Catacombs" (as well as Befallen, as I recall) reminded me of the dread I felt and the hairs rising on the back of my neck when I ventured into those places.

http://www.mmotomb.com/music/everquest-music/

Why did I feel that way?  Because dying in game could really suck; you'd lose 20% of a level's worth of experience (i.e., about two hours of grinding to get back) and have to do a dangerous corpse run to get your gear back.  This made the scary eerie dungeons feel "scary" and "eerie".

Without the death penalty, there is none of that.  Therefore, I'll trade being frustrated 1% of the time in exchange for being heavily immersed the other 99% of the time; better than being slightly, sedately bored 100% of the time.

Remember, a stinging death penalty is not just about challenge, it's about immersion.

That's not a stinging death penalty.  An hour or two of grinding xp is a token at best and not much different than paying a repair fee for armour damage.

When I played Lineage a death at high levels could cost a couple weeks worth of xp grinding or more depending on circumstances.  You could lose millions of adena worth of armour to mobs or the passing player that grabbed your stuff.

That was a sucky death penalty and it wasn't fun.  Eventually they allowed players to pay a fee to reduce the penalty.  It was wildly popular.

Harsh death penalties didn't create immersion they just discouraged risk taking.  I'm glad they've gone the way of the Dodo.

  LordPsychodi

Novice Member

Joined: 6/14/07
Posts: 102

7/10/12 11:09:00 PM#78
Originally posted by ReallyNow10
Originally posted by dageeza

I never needed a death penalty to not want to die or feel challenged, regardless of what game i am playing i always pride myself on not dying but zoning into someone elses train solo in eq with a 56k modem meant unavoidable death and that just pissed me off..

I was glad to see an end to harsh death penalties with WoW and still avoid games with them now..

It's not just about challenge, it's about feeling and immersion.

Example, I played EQ back in the day of harsh death penalties, and was once leaving a group in Mistmoore (high level undead castle-type zone).  I played a Paladin and had an Invis to Undead spell, so I could pass by them.  Problem was, the invis spells seemed to have either variable timers or you never knew (unless you kept track) when they'd pop off.

Well, I took a wrong turn in the castle and got lost.  My heart pounded when I saw the invis icon flashing like it had ten seconds before I'd drop the spell and become visible.  I kept running down the hall and into rooms where there would be tons of undead.  Was scary, real scary.  

When the invisibility did pop off, I aggroed a ton of high level undead, and found myself running outside the castle (finally found the way out) to a bridge overhanging a steep drop.  I jumped, hit the bottom and took tons of damage, did a quick Lay Hand on self, then ran to the zone line shouting "TRAIN TO ZONE" with tons of mobs after me, and every player in my path scattering and trying to react to what was happening.

This was a great gaming memory!  But, would not have had that with a wimpy death penalty; indeed, might have chose to die on purpose just to conveniently port back to town.

Do you get my point?

 

I'd say there's a fine point at which the trappings of your own mind and its intersection with reality ends. And the implicit point is right at the point at which you claim this adds more immersion, when I honestly think immersion is one of those qualities has nothing to do with what you described in the least. The quality of immersion begins and ends at every single point at which anything breaks line with reality due to that concept of *suspension of disbelief* You don't come back to life in real life with skills damaged. The only reason you felt what you did had nothing to do with the concern you placed on death, and nothing to do with the constraints of the game system or its rules at all, but SOLELY the fact that there is a corpse run and experience loss. The only difference that an experience penalty and corpse run adds is frustration and dealing with the consecquences of failure, which is a radically different thing, and amounts to exactly one thing: spending more time in a completely arbitrary fashion to get back to exactly where you were to try again. They might go hand in hand with your particular experience, but just given the very shape of the way things are, ultimately you only experienced that because you let yourself, and because you were unfamiliar with the area. It has nothing to do with the exactness of mechanics at all. Implicitly, this is why people who use guides generally don't feel as much, you were immersed by fear of the unknown weighted against the consequence of time, nothing more.

 

  SuperXero89

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/16/09
Posts: 2595

7/10/12 11:16:16 PM#79
Originally posted by Velocinox

Stop trying to make other people play the game you think is fun.

 

Let them play their game and make the changes you can to make your game fun. Trying to change other people's opinions is a fool's mission.

 


Originally posted by Cecropia



Now, now. Don't you know that everyone deserves a trophy so that no one feels like they are lesser than anyone else? You are the worst possible and always come in last; no worries, here's a shiny ribbon to help shield your self-esteem from any sort of hit. Makes perfect sense, right?

 

You're making the same mistake most PvPers make and most people that tie their self-esteem to a stupid game.

It's not that people want a trophy for failing, It's that they don't care about trophies from a vidiot game

See, you measure your importance by how many noobs you pwnt in a virtual world.

We measure our importance by career success, by how happy our daughter is when we get home, and how much better we make our lives in the real world. We really don't care how we rank in an idle pastime we only engage in when we have some downtime to spend.

That is the most beautiful and intelligent post I have ever seen on this forum.

  Axehilt

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/09
Posts: 7213

7/10/12 11:28:44 PM#80
Originally posted by LordPsychodi

I'd say there's a fine point at which the trappings of your own mind and its intersection with reality ends. And the implicit point is right at the point at which you claim this adds more immersion, when I honestly think immersion is one of those qualities has nothing to do with what you described in the least. The quality of immersion begins and ends at every single point at which anything breaks line with reality due to that concept of *suspension of disbelief* You don't come back to life in real life with skills damaged. The only reason you felt what you did had nothing to do with the concern you placed on death, and nothing to do with the constraints of the game system or its rules at all, but SOLELY the fact that there is a corpse run and experience loss. The only difference that an experience penalty and corpse run adds is frustration and dealing with the consecquences of failure, which is a radically different thing, and amounts to exactly one thing: spending more time in a completely arbitrary fashion to get back to exactly where you were to try again. They might go hand in hand with your particular experience, but just given the very shape of the way things are, ultimately you only experienced that because you let yourself, and because you were unfamiliar with the area. It has nothing to do with the exactness of mechanics at all. Implicitly, this is why people who use guides generally don't feel as much, you were immersed by fear of the unknown weighted against the consequence of time, nothing more. 

Definitely agree.

Although I don't agree that immersion has "nothing to do with the exactness of the mechanics at all". Good mechanics can definitely contribute to immersion.  But harsh death penalty (for most players) doesn't.

7 Pages « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 » Search