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Role Playing Discussion  » Do people actually ROLEPLAY anymore?

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220 posts found
  ozmono

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/12/06
Posts: 1023

6/23/12 9:12:07 PM#101
Originally posted by Cephus404

Good point, but let's be honest, the majority of computer games that tacked "RPG" onto their name had nothing whatsoever to do with role playing, it was a marketing tactic.

The question than becomes why do they still do it? Once upon a time it might have translated into more sales but now I think the mainstream doesn't really care about real roleplaying and the acronym MMORPG is too long! ;)

 

Seriously I think they were so successful at abusing the term that it means something completely different to most people now.

  Ranyr

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/08/04
Posts: 182

6/23/12 9:15:47 PM#102

Lots of roleplay going on in Tera Online, Celestial Hills server. :P

  Cephus404

Elite Member

Joined: 2/27/08
Posts: 3611

6/23/12 9:20:41 PM#103
Originally posted by Banegrivm

Ok, this I just had to comment on. Final Fantasy had NOTHING to do with the RP in the role playing game. Nowhere close, not even remotely. Dungeons & Dragons was the first role playing game ever, which came out in the 70's and was played at a table with friends. The first real computer RPG was a text based game called Zork and others followed, one of the most popular being the Ultima series, after which many followed. The first MMORPG's, all of which came before UO, EQ, and even WoW, fostered role playing elements in them and had massively thriving role playing communities. In fact it's a fair assessment to say that the role players ruled the communities of the MMORPG's at that time and non role players were a very small minority. You can thank big business for the lack of role playing in MMORPG's nowadays. This is what happens when you have people calling the shots that are completely ignorant about the business they are running. It happens all the time in the corporate heirarchy sadly. 

As someone who started playing D&D pretty much the day it came out, I have to quibble a bit.  D&D was the first commercially available tabletop RPG, but it certainly wasn't the first.  These things have been played underground for a long, long time with unofficial rules, in college dorm rooms, etc.  The hallmark of an RPG is freedom to do anything you want, when you want to do it, with your actions guided and ruled over by the GM.  No computer game ever has allowed that kind of freedom.  It's just not possible.  Zork wasn't an RPG, it was an adventure game where you followed a pre-programmed path to a number of predetermined endings.  That's not to say Zork wasn't revolutionary for it's day, but you couldn't go entirely off the rails and do whatever you wanted in it, you were restricted in the number of actions you could perform.  The same with Ultima and Wizardry and all the other computer games that came after.  You had a wide variety of choices, but you were still limited by the game.  There was a goal to the games and you were expected to go try to achieve that goal.

Today in MMOs, the same thing is true.  You are inherently limited in the number of things you can do and still be playing the game.  That makes it not an RPG, it's just an action game where you get to tweak sliders on your own character.  You're no more roleplaying your character than you roleplay Master Chief in a Halo game.  Just because some people run around in an MMO using funny voices no more makes it an RPG than someone pretending to be Master Chief in Halo 2.

So long as it's a computer calling the shots, it cannot be roleplaying.  You cannot take actions which the programmers haven't pre-defined.  That's the heart of actual roleplaying.  MMOs, or any computer game, is incapable of it.

Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None

  Banegrivm

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 202

6/23/12 9:21:51 PM#104
Originally posted by ozmono
Originally posted by Cephus404

Good point, but let's be honest, the majority of computer games that tacked "RPG" onto their name had nothing whatsoever to do with role playing, it was a marketing tactic.

The question than becomes why do they still do it? Once upon a time it might have translated into more sales but now I think the mainstream doesn't really care about real roleplaying and the acronym MMORPG is too long! ;)

 

Seriously I think they were so successful at abusing the term that it means something completely different to most people now.

 

Honestly mainstread doesn't have any idea what role playing is. Most people nowadays think that role playing in a role playing game is about chat room styled role play and it's not at all. That's a form of role play, yes, but it's not role playing in the context of a role playing game. Again we can blame the suits for that. "Damn the man" I say! :P I actually miss the old days of role playing. Those were some days for sure.

Banegrivm
Leader of the 1st Fist of Light
www.1stfistoflight.com

  Cephus404

Elite Member

Joined: 2/27/08
Posts: 3611

6/23/12 9:22:19 PM#105
Originally posted by ozmono

The question than becomes why do they still do it? Once upon a time it might have translated into more sales but now I think the mainstream doesn't really care about real roleplaying and the acronym MMORPG is too long! ;)

 

Seriously I think they were so successful at abusing the term that it means something completely different to most people now.

Because it's the name of the genre?  Most people have no idea what actual roleplaying is, they weren't alive when people sat around a table and rolled dice.  Why do people call the things recording artists release "albums"?  Albums are made out of vinyl.  They still use the terminology.

Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None

  gaeanprayer

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 2360

6/23/12 9:25:19 PM#106

If it makes you feel better, when they finally figure out how to make Holodecks a reality, I'm sure everyone will be so busy roleplaying, there will be people asking the exact opposite of that question.

Though, ~what~ they're roleplaying...

"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."

  Terrorizor

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/15/12
Posts: 337

6/23/12 9:30:35 PM#107

I would love to take part in a serious RP server.  It would be nice if the devs included a feature into the game that if a person was anti-RP on a RP server, they were moved to a different server.  I don't mean that if a person said "hey dude" instead of "Hail fine sir!" they were relocated, rather just relocating people that actively try to destroy RP.

If there was a game, that kept those ideals and was consistantly monitored by mods, I would pay a subscription. But that would be the only way.

  ozmono

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/12/06
Posts: 1023

6/23/12 9:31:04 PM#108
Originally posted by Cephus404
Originally posted by ozmono

The question than becomes why do they still do it? Once upon a time it might have translated into more sales but now I think the mainstream doesn't really care about real roleplaying and the acronym MMORPG is too long! ;)

 

Seriously I think they were so successful at abusing the term that it means something completely different to most people now.

Because it's the name of the genre?  Most people have no idea what actual roleplaying is, they weren't alive when people sat around a table and rolled dice.  Why do people call the things recording artists release "albums"?  Albums are made out of vinyl.  They still use the terminology.

I would say so. It's a good analogy with one possible exception that I can think of. According to some of the most popular dictionary definitions of the word album simply means “A collection of recordings, on long-playing record, cassette, or compact disc, issued as a single item.” Eventually I would imagine the most popular and most widely used definition will mean that. For now most people still recognise what album is because of it's roots. Some people have suggested that isn't the case with roleplaying including myself but to be honest I'm not really sure.

  Banegrivm

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 202

6/23/12 9:32:50 PM#109
Originally posted by Cephus404
Originally posted by Banegrivm

Ok, this I just had to comment on. Final Fantasy had NOTHING to do with the RP in the role playing game. Nowhere close, not even remotely. Dungeons & Dragons was the first role playing game ever, which came out in the 70's and was played at a table with friends. The first real computer RPG was a text based game called Zork and others followed, one of the most popular being the Ultima series, after which many followed. The first MMORPG's, all of which came before UO, EQ, and even WoW, fostered role playing elements in them and had massively thriving role playing communities. In fact it's a fair assessment to say that the role players ruled the communities of the MMORPG's at that time and non role players were a very small minority. You can thank big business for the lack of role playing in MMORPG's nowadays. This is what happens when you have people calling the shots that are completely ignorant about the business they are running. It happens all the time in the corporate heirarchy sadly. 

As someone who started playing D&D pretty much the day it came out, I have to quibble a bit.  D&D was the first commercially available tabletop RPG, but it certainly wasn't the first.  These things have been played underground for a long, long time with unofficial rules, in college dorm rooms, etc.  The hallmark of an RPG is freedom to do anything you want, when you want to do it, with your actions guided and ruled over by the GM.  No computer game ever has allowed that kind of freedom.  It's just not possible.  Zork wasn't an RPG, it was an adventure game where you followed a pre-programmed path to a number of predetermined endings.  That's not to say Zork wasn't revolutionary for it's day, but you couldn't go entirely off the rails and do whatever you wanted in it, you were restricted in the number of actions you could perform.  The same with Ultima and Wizardry and all the other computer games that came after.  You had a wide variety of choices, but you were still limited by the game.  There was a goal to the games and you were expected to go try to achieve that goal.

Today in MMOs, the same thing is true.  You are inherently limited in the number of things you can do and still be playing the game.  That makes it not an RPG, it's just an action game where you get to tweak sliders on your own character.  You're no more roleplaying your character than you roleplay Master Chief in a Halo game.  Just because some people run around in an MMO using funny voices no more makes it an RPG than someone pretending to be Master Chief in Halo 2.

So long as it's a computer calling the shots, it cannot be roleplaying.  You cannot take actions which the programmers haven't pre-defined.  That's the heart of actual roleplaying.  MMOs, or any computer game, is incapable of it.

 

Can't say I agree with that at all about role playing games. You could call that role playing and technically it's correct, but it still isn't a role playin game. I've heard people say "Cowboys & Inidians" are a role playing game, but I don't agree. Show me somewhere that has a published set of mechanics where there are specific rules for characters, game play, dice rolling, etc. Actual mechanics that push an interactive story driven environment. It didn't exist until Dungeons & Dragons. As far as Zork goes where the gaming industry is concerned it's considered a pivotol RPG. Many RPG's that followed at that time used a similiar template. Yes I do agree that it was limited, but even so now, many RPG's are likewise limited by the limits of technology.

 

I have always said that no online experience, no matter how fast, will never beat out that experience of sitting at a table with friends having that social experience that comes with it. However, I do think you can have role playing in an MMORPG. The original NWN did it. I've actually seen it happen in EverQuest with a series of GM events that were setup to interact with players. It can be done. It won't be done anytime soon however because it requires extra manpower. It requires actual people to be paid to both set up and run these events. Fiscally, it's much cheaper to create a static environment and just let it run itself, as a cold dead world that's unfeeling without any real change or interactivity to it and that is just very very sad.

Banegrivm
Leader of the 1st Fist of Light
www.1stfistoflight.com

  ozmono

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/12/06
Posts: 1023

6/23/12 9:34:45 PM#110
Originally posted by Terrorizor

I would love to take part in a serious RP server.  It would be nice if the devs included a feature into the game that if a person was anti-RP on a RP server, they were moved to a different server.  I don't mean that if a person said "hey dude" instead of "Hail fine sir!" they were relocated, rather just relocating people that actively try to destroy RP.

If there was a game, that kept those ideals and was consistantly monitored by mods, I would pay a subscription. But that would be the only way.

Once upon a time I would have directed you to a game called Adellion and it's still worth a look if you are interested in some cool roleplaying features but have a look at http://www.legendsofaryiure.com and if you want join us on our forums at http://www.legendsofaryiure.com/forums/index.php Things are a bit quiet at the moment but they will make a stronger push for a community when they have more to show.

  Deathofsage

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/11/11
Posts: 1010

Honestly:
FFXI Fanboy
RIFT hater.
Stop rewarding wow-clones.

6/24/12 12:31:42 AM#111
Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
Originally posted by Deathofsage

I never RP'd when I was playing RPG's. I didn't act like Zelda, anyone from Legaia, any FF Game, etc. RPG video games never meant anything like that for me. MMORPGs were just an extrapolation of that same idea so I regarded them the same.

 

Zelda is not even a playable character in the grand majority of the Zelda games, Link is. So of course, you have no reason to act ingame as if you were Zelda, you aren't playing her. *Facepalm*

I derped.

Link, sorry.

Spec'ing properly is a gateway drug.
12 Million People have been meter spammed in heroics.
Placing bets Blizzard's "Titan" will be a wow-clone.

  Xthos

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/18/10
Posts: 2627

6/24/12 12:34:49 AM#112

I would say more so on older games, and ones that are more sandboxish, but I am sure you will find them in new games also, and many games still make roleplay servers and try to have some rules for them, very limited ones, but a little bit more enforced if its pvp usually.

 

  Wolfthal

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/12
Posts: 6

6/25/12 3:59:00 PM#113
Originally posted by jpnz

I personally don't enjoy the whole 'hail thou shalt blah blah blah' so I don't participate in them.

I can RP and 'pretend' or I can hang out with friends on vent, go kill this big dragon and get 'phat lewt'.

For me, if there is little fun in RP why RP?

 

 

( read my previous comment on page 7 )

Well, you are free to do whatever you want. It's a free world, even if most democratic countries are actually fake. But that's a whole other matter. 

  Lawlmonster

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/07/09
Posts: 940

Take my advice, I'm not using it anyway.

6/26/12 2:00:19 AM#114
Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
Originally posted by Lawlmonster

Yep, but I certainly don't RP with the newer breed of MMO's. They're simply not conducive to an environment that promotes creativity, which is what role playing is all about, so I still rely on UO for the times that I want to be in character. There are plenty of great options out there for MUD'ers, IRC RP, various emulators: just about everywhere outside the last ten years of video gaming.

No, role-playing is not necessarely about being creative, which you seem to have implied. It is about playing a role and that's it. Creative people can indeed have fun by trying to be creative through role-playing, but the creativity is not a necessary condition.

You're kidding, right? The entire process of RP is about imagination, with or without boundaries, and is about as close as an individual can get to writing narrative fiction. Creativity is the bottom line: if you don't have it, you probably can't RP.

"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  Wolfthal

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/12
Posts: 6

6/27/12 3:29:10 PM#115
Originally posted by Lawlmonster
Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
Originally posted by Lawlmonster

Yep, but I certainly don't RP with the newer breed of MMO's. They're simply not conducive to an environment that promotes creativity, which is what role playing is all about, so I still rely on UO for the times that I want to be in character. There are plenty of great options out there for MUD'ers, IRC RP, various emulators: just about everywhere outside the last ten years of video gaming.

No, role-playing is not necessarely about being creative, which you seem to have implied. It is about playing a role and that's it. Creative people can indeed have fun by trying to be creative through role-playing, but the creativity is not a necessary condition.

You're kidding, right? The entire process of RP is about imagination, with or without boundaries, and is about as close as an individual can get to writing narrative fiction. Creativity is the bottom line: if you don't have it, you probably can't RP.

OMG! Your opinion is as same as mine. Check my previous comments on page 7. 

  Poison_Adele

Novice Member

Joined: 9/01/08
Posts: 293

6/30/12 8:18:13 PM#116

All this "rah rah rah, young people don't know what roleplay is" is complete BS. I've roleplayed heavily on NWN2 and forums, both had active and frankly very good younger roleplayers (15-18). Maybe you shouldn't just assume the reasons for things.

  SwampRob

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/05/07
Posts: 1010

6/30/12 9:34:14 PM#117

I still run a weekly tabletop pnp D&D session; I have done so for the past 20+ years.   So I get something of a fix there.

As far as video games go, for those that don't care for RP, fine, but I would KILL just to have one game with a RP server where RP'ing was STRICTLY enforced.    It's an RP server, so if you don't want to RP, don't join it.   Simple as avoiding a PvP server if you're not into that.

*Sorry about the large font, my eyes aren't what they used to be.

  bcoday

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/14/12
Posts: 4

7/01/12 1:16:01 PM#118

I can see where you're coming from. When I attempt to go on RP servers there doesn't even seem to be any actual RP going on. Most games that I've tried recently don't even have many RP servers, if they have any at all...

  Hodo

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/05/08
Posts: 559

7/03/12 7:29:08 AM#119

Its funny I just read an review about UO, where the reviewer said that roleplaying is dead, but its the players not the game.   I agree.  

 

The players in todays MMORPG environment are only out for the end game content, or to powerlevel through the game.  And the gaming developers are caving in to this fact.   They are releasing games like SMITE, DOTA, LoL, just so kids can have these grind fest powerlevel games that have little or no story and no chance at RP, which is good BUT.   But it doesnt get them out of the games that NEED good RP to be fun, or balanced, or even interesting.   Games that are sandboxes like UO, Xsyon, Mortal Online, and DFO all fail not because of the developers, (well MO the devs are doing a good job of trying to fail),  but they fail because of the players.   The current crop of players that are on the gaming servers now days, dont bother with RP.   They give themselves names that are not even close to RP, only to grief or gank, or just powerlevel because their gamertag on XBOX live is something "hard".   So they name their characters things like "BUILT", Beef", "Godly", "1337zor", "uberl0rd".   Names like that should be insta-banned on any Sandbox game environment.   But the developers go out of their way bending over backwards for these loser kids who have no other goal than to just be pains in someones rear, or power to the max level/skill just to say they did. 

 

Its sad but the games havent changed at the core, but the players have changed for the worse.

So much crap, so little quality.

  Wolfthal

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/12
Posts: 6

7/03/12 2:54:06 PM#120
Originally posted by Hodo

Its funny I just read an review about UO, where the reviewer said that roleplaying is dead, but its the players not the game.   I agree.  

 

The players in todays MMORPG environment are only out for the end game content, or to powerlevel through the game.  And the gaming developers are caving in to this fact.   They are releasing games like SMITE, DOTA, LoL, just so kids can have these grind fest powerlevel games that have little or no story and no chance at RP, which is good BUT.   But it doesnt get them out of the games that NEED good RP to be fun, or balanced, or even interesting.   Games that are sandboxes like UO, Xsyon, Mortal Online, and DFO all fail not because of the developers, (well MO the devs are doing a good job of trying to fail),  but they fail because of the players.   The current crop of players that are on the gaming servers now days, dont bother with RP.   They give themselves names that are not even close to RP, only to grief or gank, or just powerlevel because their gamertag on XBOX live is something "hard".   So they name their characters things like "BUILT", Beef", "Godly", "1337zor", "uberl0rd".   Names like that should be insta-banned on any Sandbox game environment.   But the developers go out of their way bending over backwards for these loser kids who have no other goal than to just be pains in someones rear, or power to the max level/skill just to say they did. 

 

Its sad but the games havent changed at the core, but the players have changed for the worse.

You have a few points, but generalizing at the beggining. Not all kids are like that. Why? I have plenty of points ( read my posts on page 7 ).

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