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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

General Discussion  » If it is true that SWTOR cost near 500mil...

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172 posts found
  RebelScum99

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1127

6/15/12 7:34:10 PM#101
Originally posted by Teala


Yes, I think they banked a lot of cash onto this game and because it is not delivering it is hurting them finacially.  To say it isn't is just closingyour eyes and covering your ears and saying "lalalala".

As for this thread having nothing good coming from it.   Alot of good has come from it.  Just because you do not think that doesn't mean we are not learning something.    Just as a person that puts their finger in a fire is burned and it is a negative experience...they learned a positive lesson.  Don't put your finger in the fire. 

Yeah, except your point wasn't that SWTOR not delivering has hurt them financially.  Your point was that SWTOR not delivering is the REASON why EA's stock is so low.  Two different arguments, and only one of them could be considered a rational one.  

And I'm glad you learned a positive lesson about not putting your finger in a fire, at least.  I'm assuming that's an analogy for linking financial articles without actually understanding what they mean.  

 

  smh_alot

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/10/12
Posts: 990

6/15/12 7:35:28 PM#102
Originally posted by Wicoa

That alone cost a small fortune.  You can go on about plucking numbers out of thin air or "haters" ganging up on poor old swtor, all I know is those people got paid good money and probably lots of it.

Yes 500 mill sounds about right factoring in the extra costs they added ontop of what is an expensive genre to make a game for.

 

Sure, voice acting costs 300-400 million dollars. That makes sense: so that means that the voice acting in TOR costs as much as making WoW, AoC, LotrO, WAR, Rift, EQ2, Vanguard and some more MMO's together. Sure, that makes a lot of sense. Oh, and that means that TSW and GW2 will cost 200+ million dollars too, because the amount of voice acting that those MMO's have is definitely not negligible in the amount of hours that they have regarding voice acting. Or will this again be some double standard, where when it comes to other MMO's, we shouldn't think like that, but only when it comes to TOR? Now, that would be unreasonable or even trolling, don't you think? :-)
  Atlan99

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/07/08
Posts: 1355

6/15/12 7:36:17 PM#103
Originally posted by Teala
 

 just closingyour eyes and covering your ears and saying "lalalala".

 

^This

Is what you have been doing all thread.

/Thread

  StoneRoses

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/13/09
Posts: 911

6/15/12 7:36:54 PM#104
Originally posted by Teala
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by Teala


If you are getting pissed because I point out a funny coincidence...that is my fault?  I am trying to show that there is a coincidence here.  It is not made up.   EA's stocks climbed as the release of SWTOR grew near.  It peaked at the launch.  After the launch the stocks start going down.   It's as if the stock went down as more and more players left and it is still going down.   If you do not think there is something odd there and care to speculate as to why it would follow that weird pattern then don't.  If you are getting angry becuase I point that out.  ::shrugs:: Not my fault.

Except anyone with an ounce of deductive reasoning and who is NOT wearing a tinfoil hat can see that this is most defintely NOT a coincidence.  EA's stocks have been going down for years.  And yes, of course their stocks would show a surge just before SWTOR released, because the game had a tremendous amount of hype.  That's how it works.  Once the game failed to live up to the hype, EA's stocks continued their downward trend like they've been doing for YEARS before SWTOR got released.  

If your point was to say that SWTOR hasn't lived up to the hype, and failed to save EA's asses, then yeah, I think most reasonable people would agree with you.  But that isn't your point.  Your point was to create a fictional correlation between two things that really don't have any correlation.  Do you think that SWTOR is EA's only game?  Just a few weeks ago EA publicly said that SWTOR wasn't a very high priority for them in terms of future development.  We all got a good laugh out of that, and I'm sure you did, too.  And yet, now suddenly you'd have us believe that this game, which isn't even in EA's Top tier of games, is soley responsible for the decline of the company?  

Mods should go ahead and lock this ridiculous thread up.  There's only one reason it was started, and no good can come of it.  


Yes, I think they banked a lot of cash onto this game and because it is not delivering it is hurting them finacially.  To say it isn't is just closingyour eyes and covering your ears and saying "lalalala".

As for this thread having nothing good coming from it.   Alot of good has come from it.  Just because you do not think that doesn't mean we are not learning something.    Just as a person that puts their finger in a fire is burned and it is a negative experience...they learned a positive lesson.  Don't put your finger in the fire. 

They were also banking on games like Madden 2011 and Battlefield 3.

  RebelScum99

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1127

6/15/12 7:37:50 PM#105
Originally posted by MrTuggles
I am not sure where you get your information,  but the initial budget that was reported was near $300m. After release, and the game doing poorly, EA/BW tried to say the costs came in at around $200m in total. Most people do think it cost closer to the $300m that was originally stated.

Actually, the initial budget was never reported near 300 million, either.  It was one guy trumpeting that number over and over on a message board, an alleged former EA employee, and it was debunked countless times.  

Fact is, nobody knows how much it cost to make, but EA did say it was roughly between 150-200 million.  And they are the only official source we've heard on the subject.  Whether you choose to believe them or some disgrunteled ex-employee/internet troll is up to you.  

  Teala

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/16/04
Posts: 7397

"Really officer, they're herbs."

 
OP  6/15/12 7:39:17 PM#106
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by MrTuggles
I am not sure where you get your information,  but the initial budget that was reported was near $300m. After release, and the game doing poorly, EA/BW tried to say the costs came in at around $200m in total. Most people do think it cost closer to the $300m that was originally stated.

Actually, the initial budget was never reported near 300 million, either.  It was one guy trumpeting that number over and over on a message board, an alleged former EA employee, and it was debunked countless times.  

Fact is, nobody knows how much it cost to make, but EA did say it was roughly between 150-200 million.  And they are the only official source we've heard on the subject.  Whether you choose to believe them or some disgrunteled ex-employee/internet troll is up to you.  

Can you pull up this EA/BW quote where they say it cost between 150-200 mil?  If you can pull up an actual quote of them saying this, I'll have the mods lock this thread.   How's that?

  Quenchster

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/12
Posts: 452

6/15/12 7:40:09 PM#107
Originally posted by sirphobos

Every time someone brings up how much SWTOR cost to develop, the number grows higher.  By next near, SWTOR will have cost approximately $5 billion to develop.

It actually seems to be lowering itself for some reason. When I first heard about costs for this game numbers ranged from around 200 million to 300 million. Then EA Louse said 300 million. Then for some reason after the dust settled people started saying 150 to 200 million. Now I'm hearing even lower numbers than those.

I think that numbers closer to EA Louse's number is probably the safest bet. The guy was like a prophet.

  Trionicus

Novice Member

Joined: 1/31/12
Posts: 488

6/15/12 7:40:38 PM#108
Originally posted by Teala

that might explain why EA's stocks are taking a nose dive.    They still haven't recovered the initial investment of making the game and this is hurting their stocks.   They have to pay licensing fees to both Lucas Arts and Simutronics, which I am sure is a huge chunk of change.   Anyway, if it is true that SWTOR cost near 500 million to make...that might explain why EA's stocks are still nose diving.

EA stocks  <<< clicky

As SWTOR subs go...so does EA's stocks it seems.   If you look at the 6 month cycle, you can see that the stocks peeked jsut before the release of the game.  Since then...it's been in a nose dive. 

You can be sure that SWTOR costs more then 50mill unless they paid all those voice actors in toilet paper. As for actual costs to create the game... conjecture? We also know that primetime TV commercial spots are very expensive, all TV spots are expensive though. Those CGI trainlers alone could have ran them 15mill or more.

I believe total spent on adverts & development = 200mill-300mill.

From what I've read, EA just doesn't do good business and survives mostly on their ongoing successful franchises. Gettin Bioware was a good move and I think it bought them a decade or 2 in the business but, it just looks like a bunch of suits at EA keep making the wrong decisions.

I'm personally looking forward to them finding new and interesting ways to milk the now dead to me Mass Effect franchise.

  evianwater

Novice Member

Joined: 4/10/09
Posts: 305

6/15/12 7:40:40 PM#109
Originally posted by Wicoa

That alone cost a small fortune.  You can go on about plucking numbers out of thin air or "haters" ganging up on poor old swtor, all I know is those people got paid good money and probably lots of it.

Yes 500 mill sounds about right factoring in the extra costs they added ontop of what is an expensive genre to make a game for.

I think you're greatly over-valuing the voice actors...

 

Voice acting isn't some cushy gig that nets you six figures (unless you're on the very very high end.)

 

The Bureau of Labor statistics puts Voice acting at about $22 an hour. (With a range from $7 an hour to $77 an hour)

 

So lets get crazy and throw out some silly numbers.

 

800 voice actors, each working for 1 hour, being paid the average = $17,600

 

Now I can't remember how many hours of voice acting I read were in SWTOR...for some reason the number 250,000 keeps popping in my head.

 

$22 x 250,000 hours = $ 5,500,000. 

 

That's a very very small portion of even 80 million, let alone 200-500 million.

 

(Of course these numbers are just averages, and they don't mean anything. This post is to give perspective.)

 

 

Edit : Let's get really crazy...

 

$22 x  1,000,000 hours = $22,000,000. 

  smh_alot

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/10/12
Posts: 990

6/15/12 7:41:44 PM#110
Originally posted by MrTuggles
Originally posted by Lukain

No MMO ever  cost 500 Million Dollars to make  , I think you have an extra 0 .. I read the budget was 50-60 Million which Is what you would expect for a Major MMO

 

 

 

 

 

I am not sure where you get your information,  but the initial budget that was reported was near $300m. After release, and the game doing poorly, EA/BW tried to say the costs came in at around $200m in total. Most people do think it cost closer to the $300m that was originally stated.

 

Sorry, but that was stated by an anonymous blogger, or are you saying we should believe everything that all anonymous bloggers write? Besides, it was debunked by official EA representatives that stated that the actual development cost was nowhere near that high. In fact, no official statements has been given at all, besides third party speculation that are estimations ranging from the 80 million dollars to hundreds of millions of dollars. EA/BW/TOR haters however love to make the claim that TOR has cost as much to make as the other top 6 most expensive MMO's ever together, and try to sell that as reasonable -_-
  Moaky07

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/24/07
Posts: 2199

MMO sandbox games are as exciting as watching paint dry.

6/15/12 7:50:45 PM#111
Originally posted by Quenchster
Originally posted by sirphobos

Every time someone brings up how much SWTOR cost to develop, the number grows higher.  By next near, SWTOR will have cost approximately $5 billion to develop.

It actually seems to be lowering itself for some reason. When I first heard about costs for this game numbers ranged from around 200 million to 300 million. Then EA Louse said 300 million. Then for some reason after the dust settled people started saying 150 to 200 million. Now I'm hearing even lower numbers than those.

I think that numbers closer to EA Louse's number is probably the safest bet. The guy was like a prophet.

Hell even if Louse was right(which I dont believe for a second), the OP has taken that number n added another 65%.

 

It was understood the number of 500M was for analysts wanting to throw the BW purchase into the mix....not the dev costs themselves, which the OP is trying to present as fact.

 

The delusion in this thread ranks up there with "they are giving us PRE-CU servers back".

Asking Devs to make AAA sandbox titles is like trying to get fine dining on a McDonalds dollar menu budget.

  Bossalinie

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/29/07
Posts: 606

6/15/12 7:56:53 PM#112

SWTOR caused our national debt to default.

  evianwater

Novice Member

Joined: 4/10/09
Posts: 305

6/15/12 7:58:23 PM#113
Originally posted by bossalinie

SWTOR caused our national debt to default.

EA could've ended world hunger, and bought everyone an island to re-create the story of Lost...

 

with how much they spent on SWTOR.

 

.....

 

Said an "analyst" from Marketwatch

  RebelScum99

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1127

6/15/12 8:00:05 PM#114
Originally posted by Teala
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by MrTuggles
I am not sure where you get your information,  but the initial budget that was reported was near $300m. After release, and the game doing poorly, EA/BW tried to say the costs came in at around $200m in total. Most people do think it cost closer to the $300m that was originally stated.

Actually, the initial budget was never reported near 300 million, either.  It was one guy trumpeting that number over and over on a message board, an alleged former EA employee, and it was debunked countless times.  

Fact is, nobody knows how much it cost to make, but EA did say it was roughly between 150-200 million.  And they are the only official source we've heard on the subject.  Whether you choose to believe them or some disgrunteled ex-employee/internet troll is up to you.  

Can you pull up this EA/BW quote where they say it cost between 150-200 mil?  If you can pull up an actual quote of them saying this, I'll have the mods lock this thread.   How's that?

Here is the Los Angeles Times article that came out in January.  In it, the cost of production for the game was specified.  There doesn't seem to be a direct quote from anyone from Bioware/EA giving that figure, but the source for their article were people inside the company, including Daniel Erickson, Rich Vogel, and Greg Zeschuk, all with Bioware. 

"It may have been the largest entertainment production in history.  More than 800 people on four continents have spent six years and nearly $200 million creating it." 

"It's also a great risk.  In addition to the nearly $200 million spent to create the game, tens of millions of additional dollars per year will be required to keep it refreshed with new stories and adventures."

http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/20/star-wars-the-old-republic-the-story-behind-a-galactic-gamble/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=63378#/0

 

  RebelScum99

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1127

6/15/12 8:03:01 PM#115
Originally posted by Moaky07
Originally posted by Quenchster
Originally posted by sirphobos

Every time someone brings up how much SWTOR cost to develop, the number grows higher.  By next near, SWTOR will have cost approximately $5 billion to develop.

It actually seems to be lowering itself for some reason. When I first heard about costs for this game numbers ranged from around 200 million to 300 million. Then EA Louse said 300 million. Then for some reason after the dust settled people started saying 150 to 200 million. Now I'm hearing even lower numbers than those.

I think that numbers closer to EA Louse's number is probably the safest bet. The guy was like a prophet.

Hell even if Louse was right(which I dont believe for a second), the OP has taken that number n added another 65%.

 

It was understood the number of 500M was for analysts wanting to throw the BW purchase into the mix....not the dev costs themselves, which the OP is trying to present as fact.

 

The delusion in this thread ranks up there with "they are giving us PRE-CU servers back".

Louse has been debunked about 1000 times, btw.  So he's no prophet at all.  

  Teala

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/16/04
Posts: 7397

"Really officer, they're herbs."

 
OP  6/15/12 8:04:50 PM#116
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by Teala
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by MrTuggles
I am not sure where you get your information,  but the initial budget that was reported was near $300m. After release, and the game doing poorly, EA/BW tried to say the costs came in at around $200m in total. Most people do think it cost closer to the $300m that was originally stated.

Actually, the initial budget was never reported near 300 million, either.  It was one guy trumpeting that number over and over on a message board, an alleged former EA employee, and it was debunked countless times.  

Fact is, nobody knows how much it cost to make, but EA did say it was roughly between 150-200 million.  And they are the only official source we've heard on the subject.  Whether you choose to believe them or some disgrunteled ex-employee/internet troll is up to you.  

Can you pull up this EA/BW quote where they say it cost between 150-200 mil?  If you can pull up an actual quote of them saying this, I'll have the mods lock this thread.   How's that?

Here is the Los Angeles Times article that came out in January.  In it, the cost of production for the game was specified.  There doesn't seem to be a direct quote from anyone from Bioware/EA giving that figure, but the source for their article were people inside the company, including Daniel Erickson, Rich Vogel, and Greg Zeschuk, all with Bioware. 

"It may have been the largest entertainment production in history.  More than 800 people on four continents have spent six years and nearly $200 million creating it." 

"It's also a great risk.  In addition to the nearly $200 million spent to create the game, tens of millions of additional dollars per year will be required to keep it refreshed with new stories and adventures."

http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/20/star-wars-the-old-republic-the-story-behind-a-galactic-gamble/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=63378#/0

 

Well, there you go...you let me know when you find that quote. 

  Quenchster

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/12
Posts: 452

6/15/12 8:11:51 PM#117
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by Moaky07
Originally posted by Quenchster
Originally posted by sirphobos

Every time someone brings up how much SWTOR cost to develop, the number grows higher.  By next near, SWTOR will have cost approximately $5 billion to develop.

It actually seems to be lowering itself for some reason. When I first heard about costs for this game numbers ranged from around 200 million to 300 million. Then EA Louse said 300 million. Then for some reason after the dust settled people started saying 150 to 200 million. Now I'm hearing even lower numbers than those.

I think that numbers closer to EA Louse's number is probably the safest bet. The guy was like a prophet.

Hell even if Louse was right(which I dont believe for a second), the OP has taken that number n added another 65%.

 

It was understood the number of 500M was for analysts wanting to throw the BW purchase into the mix....not the dev costs themselves, which the OP is trying to present as fact.

 

The delusion in this thread ranks up there with "they are giving us PRE-CU servers back".

Louse has been debunked about 1000 times, btw.  So he's no prophet at all.  

How did they debunk him? Did they throw out their world record for having the most voice acting to prove that that sound wasn't what they were most proud about?

  RebelScum99

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1127

6/15/12 8:14:49 PM#118
Originally posted by Teala
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by Teala
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by MrTuggles
I am not sure where you get your information,  but the initial budget that was reported was near $300m. After release, and the game doing poorly, EA/BW tried to say the costs came in at around $200m in total. Most people do think it cost closer to the $300m that was originally stated.

Actually, the initial budget was never reported near 300 million, either.  It was one guy trumpeting that number over and over on a message board, an alleged former EA employee, and it was debunked countless times.  

Fact is, nobody knows how much it cost to make, but EA did say it was roughly between 150-200 million.  And they are the only official source we've heard on the subject.  Whether you choose to believe them or some disgrunteled ex-employee/internet troll is up to you.  

Can you pull up this EA/BW quote where they say it cost between 150-200 mil?  If you can pull up an actual quote of them saying this, I'll have the mods lock this thread.   How's that?

Here is the Los Angeles Times article that came out in January.  In it, the cost of production for the game was specified.  There doesn't seem to be a direct quote from anyone from Bioware/EA giving that figure, but the source for their article were people inside the company, including Daniel Erickson, Rich Vogel, and Greg Zeschuk, all with Bioware. 

"It may have been the largest entertainment production in history.  More than 800 people on four continents have spent six years and nearly $200 million creating it." 

"It's also a great risk.  In addition to the nearly $200 million spent to create the game, tens of millions of additional dollars per year will be required to keep it refreshed with new stories and adventures."

http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/20/star-wars-the-old-republic-the-story-behind-a-galactic-gamble/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=63378#/0

 

Well, there you go...you let me know when you find that quote. 

I didn't find any quote, because...wait for it...EA has never release the actual production numbers.  So I was wrong about that. I just remember the LA times article, as well as the countless marketing analysts who have estimated the costs of production between 150-200 million.  

So a few  things to gather from this:

1)  The LA times article contains direct quotes from people at Bioware, so you'd have to assume that 200 million figure came from them too, unless the Times just decided to make up that number and throw it in there.  

2)  Assuming we can't take the $200 million number seriously since it's not a direct quote from EA, how are we to take EALouse's $300 million seriously?  Or your $500 million number seriously, both of which have only ever come from ONE source each, while numerous analysts have predicted between 150-200 million spent?  

3)  Again, you created a thread throwing out this $500 million figure based on a number put out by a single person, and now you are asking for proof that the game only costs $200 million?  Isn't the burden of proof just as much on you as it is me?  I don't recall seeing any direct EA quotes in any of your links either.  

 

  evianwater

Novice Member

Joined: 4/10/09
Posts: 305

6/15/12 8:16:56 PM#119

Rebel, just let the thread die. She's just trying to keep it going. Logic prevailed to anyone who actually cared. She's been proven to be nothing more than a troll.

  Teala

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/16/04
Posts: 7397

"Really officer, they're herbs."

 
OP  6/15/12 8:19:42 PM#120
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by Teala
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by Teala
Originally posted by RebelScum99
Originally posted by MrTuggles
I am not sure where you get your information,  but the initial budget that was reported was near $300m. After release, and the game doing poorly, EA/BW tried to say the costs came in at around $200m in total. Most people do think it cost closer to the $300m that was originally stated.

Actually, the initial budget was never reported near 300 million, either.  It was one guy trumpeting that number over and over on a message board, an alleged former EA employee, and it was debunked countless times.  

Fact is, nobody knows how much it cost to make, but EA did say it was roughly between 150-200 million.  And they are the only official source we've heard on the subject.  Whether you choose to believe them or some disgrunteled ex-employee/internet troll is up to you.  

Can you pull up this EA/BW quote where they say it cost between 150-200 mil?  If you can pull up an actual quote of them saying this, I'll have the mods lock this thread.   How's that?

Here is the Los Angeles Times article that came out in January.  In it, the cost of production for the game was specified.  There doesn't seem to be a direct quote from anyone from Bioware/EA giving that figure, but the source for their article were people inside the company, including Daniel Erickson, Rich Vogel, and Greg Zeschuk, all with Bioware. 

"It may have been the largest entertainment production in history.  More than 800 people on four continents have spent six years and nearly $200 million creating it." 

"It's also a great risk.  In addition to the nearly $200 million spent to create the game, tens of millions of additional dollars per year will be required to keep it refreshed with new stories and adventures."

http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/20/star-wars-the-old-republic-the-story-behind-a-galactic-gamble/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&dlvrit=63378#/0

 

Well, there you go...you let me know when you find that quote. 

I didn't find any quote, because...wait for it...EA has never release the actual production numbers.  So I was wrong about that. I just remember the LA times article, as well as the countless marketing analysts who have estimated the costs of production between 150-200 million.  

So a few  things to gather from this:

1)  The LA times article contains direct quotes from people at Bioware, so you'd have to assume that 200 million figure came from them too, unless the Times just decided to make up that number and throw it in there.  

2)  Assuming we can't take the $200 million number seriously since it's not a direct quote from EA, how are we to take EALouse's $300 million seriously?  Or your $500 million number seriously, both of which have only ever come from ONE source each, while numerous analysts have predicted between 150-200 million spent?  

3)  Again, you created a thread throwing out this $500 million figure based on a number put out by a single person, and now you are asking for proof that the game only costs $200 million?  Isn't the burden of proof just as much on you as it is me?  I don't recall seeing any direct EA quotes in any of your links either.  

 


I never said my number was an actual number - all I said was it is speculated as in "If it is true...".  You however said you could put up an actual quote from EA/BW.   No biggy.   I know you'll never find an actual quote.    That is OK though.   We're all just guessing...but I think I am closer to the right number than some of you.  :)

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