Originally posted by Faelan

Originally posted by Kyleran

I think what surprises people is that CCP really, truely believes that everyone should participate in some form in the PVP side of the game, and they are willing to lose certain subscribers in favor of creating a universe that supports those who embrace the concept.

I applaud them for sticking with this vision.

 

I applaud them as well, even though it's a big part of the reason why I am no longer playing (didn't get ganked, but the constant cat and mouse game made for a non-relaxing game and I play games to relax first and foremost).

However, I can't help but feel that they can afford to do that simply because there's nothing else like EVE at the moment. You either suck it up or accept that you won't be playing a deep quality space MMO any time soon. Heck, you could even take the space part out and say that if you want a deep quality MMO where crafting and trading matters and where progress isn't measured by levels, gear tiers and raid performance, EVE is all there is. Imagine if there was a viable alternative where ganking was less of an issue or even a non-issue?

I agree.

In a way, EVE is currently in the same enviable position that UO held when it first started. It's the "only game in town" that offers really deep and complex gameplay, so a large chunk of the playerbase "put up" with the ever present threat of ganking.

Of course, the case could be made that it's only possible to have deep and complex gameplay in games where the threat of ganking is possible :)

But there are other ways of removing equipment from a game (item wear, loss of gear in PVE deaths, etc.) that would also create a complex and dynamic game and economy. It simply hasn't been done successfully yet.

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Originally posted by Garkan

The "wolves Vs sheep" premise doesnt fit EVE at all.

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It does, you are mistaking cause for consequence tho..

Originally posted by Garkan

Originally posted by SlaverHound

Originally posted by Uhwop

Originally posted by SlaverHound

What happens when you have too many wolves and not enough sheep?

The people playing Jumpgate know.

 Welcome to the sandbox.

You can thank the guys who ran to the forums and demanded that CCP step in and prevent people from doing this.  They only motivated an escellation. 

And believe it or not, it actually has an effect beyond just creating "moar tearz".

 

I wonder we would keep this up.  Not like it's driving the cost of any of my ships in hi-sec.

Oh wait, it is!  You have to keep in mind, pretty much every time a hulk is destroyed, at least one other ship is as well, that's two ships that need to be replaced almost every time a hulk goes down. 

While I don't pvp, because not all goons pvp, I do hope this goes on for some time. 

If you scare away the fish guess what you wont be having for supper?

It happened before in another game.

Be careful.

People have said this stuff ever since the servers went live. I guess its always made under the presumption that the predators will not move onto killing the less capable predators. Most PvPers in EVE like killing each other as much as they like killing miners and mission runners, although those kills do provide a quite excellent vintage.

There are two changes that have happened that have not occured before in this game.  The first being an aggressive attack on a specific play style - sure, there's been attacks on industrialists before but nothing close to an ongoing completely funded and organized campaign and the second is the fact that the victims have no ability to rebuild their sand castle without funding the people that kicked their sand castle down - thanks to the changes in PI T2 production is in the hands of null and low sec players.

This presents a no win situation for high sec industrialists and the only winning move is not to play.

Edit:  Another great idea brought to you by CCP's blind ignorance.

This thread has been amusing to read.

I like the people suggesting that the ones that enjoy the industry side of the game suddenly train up lasers so they can do something about it in 6 months time when their training is complete.  LOL!  I don't play anymore but really?  Really?  That's a solution?  I wonder if you dummies even play at all.

Since I'm criticizing your solutions I should probably post the real solution.

Return drone loot and remove the PI tax and this problem is solved and so long as CCP keeps those two changes in place there's money to make from players restricting mining and perhaps incidentally driving people from the game.

CCP, lol @ the war you've invented in game that will cost you your sub money.

Originally posted by Hazelle

I like the people suggesting that the ones that enjoy the industry side of the game suddenly train up lasers so they can do something about it in 6 months time when their training is complete.  LOL!  I don't play anymore but really?  Really?  That's a solution?  I wonder if you dummies even play at all.

Opportunity Cost happens in EVE too, people learn to deal with it.

Stuff like this makes me afraid to ever play this game.

Words can not express what i feel right now.

I love how The Mittani's reaction to the whole ousting from the CSM thing is to convince his Mongol horde to go for broke.

Apology accepted.

People could just go back to the old fashion way of mining, do it in Apoc! lol  Cannot take that down with destroyers that easily.  When the game first released, we did mining in Apoc for a long time.  Yeah it was slow but nothing can realy hurt you either.  Just need an Indy follow you to pickup the ores.   Would work if nothing mining Ice.  Hulkgadeddon....  try that on Apoc.  pffft

The miners need to organize then fund various means to either weaken, bring down, or pay off the goons.

Originally posted by SlaverHound

Originally posted by Uhwop

Originally posted by SlaverHound

What happens when you have too many wolves and not enough sheep?

The people playing Jumpgate know.

 Welcome to the sandbox.

You can thank the guys who ran to the forums and demanded that CCP step in and prevent people from doing this.  They only motivated an escellation. 

And believe it or not, it actually has an effect beyond just creating "moar tearz".

 

I wonder we would keep this up.  Not like it's driving the cost of any of my ships in hi-sec.

Oh wait, it is!  You have to keep in mind, pretty much every time a hulk is destroyed, at least one other ship is as well, that's two ships that need to be replaced almost every time a hulk goes down. 

While I don't pvp, because not all goons pvp, I do hope this goes on for some time. 

If you scare away the fish guess what you wont be having for supper?

It happened before in another game.

Be careful.

Do you play EVE? I know slaverhounds are an ingame item and all, so I'm guessing you do but just don't leave highsec often. This wolves/sheep thing is utter BS. Unless you count maybe the population of highsec which aren't alts and truly are sheep play a game which is all about risk v reward yet being completely risk adverse sh*tbirds, everyone in EVE is a wolf AND a sheep. Sometimes you need ISK and fly a hulk or ratting ship with little to no defense against gankers, othertimes you are the ganker.

Once you get out from under mama Concord's skirt in some capacity you'll realize that most pvp occurs between people looking for fights. Most of the time, both sides think they can win or at least get a quick kill and run so they engage mutually. Sometimes kills happen because someone is moving a sluggish ship without scouts and runs into a bubble camp as well. 

[mod edit]

Directional scan is your friend.

Originally posted by Nevulus

officially started as a reason to hunt bots, it has now turned into one massive grief parade.

 

Funny thing, it ends up having little impact on the economy (not as much as originally it had intended) and hurts more the casual player miner than the bots it was suppose to hurt the most.

Those guys running multi-bots with 3-6 accounts have WAY more than enough isk to afford losing a couple of ships. Some even have enough isk to buy protection, and they DO. Whereas the newb miner or economy warrior ends up losing his ships and has to struggle to ever fully recover.

 

Time to hike up prices on mining vessels.

Not only that but I had a friend that wrote his own mining program and even made it to where he could remotely access it from his phone, which is easier now. The program he wrote basically did everything and even warped out when needed. So not sure  a botter really cares too much.

I was parting with him at my brothers and he says to me guess what i'm doing right now :)

Originally posted by freejackmack

Originally posted by Nevulus

officially started as a reason to hunt bots, it has now turned into one massive grief parade.

 

Funny thing, it ends up having little impact on the economy (not as much as originally it had intended) and hurts more the casual player miner than the bots it was suppose to hurt the most.

Those guys running multi-bots with 3-6 accounts have WAY more than enough isk to afford losing a couple of ships. Some even have enough isk to buy protection, and they DO. Whereas the newb miner or economy warrior ends up losing his ships and has to struggle to ever fully recover.

 

Time to hike up prices on mining vessels.

Not only that but I had a friend that wrote his own mining program and even made it to where he could remotely access it from his phone, which is easier now. The program he wrote basically did everything and even warped out when needed. So not sure  a botter really cares too much.

I was parting with him at my brothers and he says to me guess what i'm doing right now :)

Composing an angsty ragequit post because CCP Sreegs caught up with his little jinkety-ass home-made mining bot, banned his accounts and confiscated all the assets?

Originally posted by theJexster

The miners need to organize then fund various means to either weaken, bring down, or pay off the goons.

This works and is relatively cheap too. I know some people you can contact ingame to get on the safelist.

Maybe it's time to start the anti-Hulkageddon...

Originally posted by Irus

Maybe it's time to start the anti-Hulkageddon...

What's that? You wanna fly around remote repping every Hulk that you can find?

Originally posted by FastSloth

What's that? You wanna fly around remote repping every Hulk that you can find?

You know, that's an interesting idea...

What happened to Hellicity? Why are goons making Hulkageddon payouts? I'm all for it, just wondering wth is going on.

Originally posted by Irus

Maybe it's time to start the anti-Hulkageddon...

So do it then. Impotent forum fantasies never achieved anything.