I really like the idea of the mesmer and I'm glad ArenaNet are working on the class to make it better, I'm glad they're aware of the problems and they're listening. It's a very busy class that's broken in a lot of areas, but hopefully they can fix it, like I said they said they are aware of the problems.

the class is actually nicely balanced, just rough around the edges.

You guys know that Phantasm Haste makes phantasms hit insane damages and this is a bug confirmed from Anet, right? Because I saw couple of posts which say pistol phantasm is hitting hard and others agree.

Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

First of they underperform, the illusions dont do any damamge (might be broken) and their own damage is the lowest of all classes.

 

But worst is the fact that they feel like a one trick pony to me.

 

(Maybe its just my perception, because i love classes that are like swiss army knives)

For some reason i think they were seriously nerfed for this BW.

I was having trouble killing anything, while in last BW i was killing elites way over my lvl.

If it stays this way it will be almost pointless to play mesmer at all

Originally posted by beleren

You guys know that Phantasm Haste makes phantasms hit insane damages and this is a bug confirmed from Anet, right? Because I saw couple of posts which say pistol phantasm is hitting hard and others agree.

That'd make sense. Sword + Pistol and a Great Sword secondary was off the charts. I'd pop Illusionary Duelist and then change over to Great Sword and pop Phantasmal Berserker, and people would just melt in PVP. Other than that, damage wasn't spectacular, Illsionary Leap more times than not wouldn't work for me as well. And the dodge clones over-writing phantasms really irked me.

Originally posted by terrant

Originally posted by CrunkJuice2

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by CrunkJuice2

Originally posted by Yamota

Question is, once you do learn to play them, do they stack up against the Elementalist? From what I have seen so far I would say no.

well,mesmer didnt really seem like your typical caster type class

they seemed to be more deception and trickery then just nuking people down.but i dont know,i was thinkin lately about engineers.basically looking for a good profession with alot of CC and burst damage

 

I never saw mesmers as nukers but rather support/CC but from what I have seen their CC is rather lackluster and not sure what kind of support role they are supposed to play. All in all it seems like one of those classes that will be left out in teams in favor for a  more powerful class. Be it tank, dps or CC, mesmer does not seem to adequately fill any of those roles.

hmm

so like i put with the CC and burst damage then.would there be a better profession to look at then mesmer for that then,cuz i dont know.i looked at thief,but from what i looked up about there resource system,i didnt really like the sound of it.plus ive heard there pretty squishy for a melee class and i also didnt like the sound of that eather

 

Everyone is squishy. Except maybe Guardians. Seriously. You have to get used to moving constantly and timing dodges/CC/interrupts perfectly. You don't take damage in this game. If you get hit more than once in a few seconds, you're probably dead.

This is untrue.  Even on Explorable mode Ascalon Catacombs I could take quite a few hits as a Ranger.  There is a toughness stat for a reason.  Note:  My build stacked toughness and vit.

As far as Mesmer goes they seem pretty awful in PvP.  Not sure about PvE has we had none in any of the groups we did.

Originally posted by Kaisen_Dexx

Originally posted by beleren

You guys know that Phantasm Haste makes phantasms hit insane damages and this is a bug confirmed from Anet, right? Because I saw couple of posts which say pistol phantasm is hitting hard and others agree.

That'd make sense. Sword + Pistol and a Great Sword secondary was off the charts. I'd pop Illusionary Duelist and then change over to Great Sword and pop Phantasmal Berserker, and people would just melt in PVP. Other than that, damage wasn't spectacular, Illsionary Leap more times than not wouldn't work for me as well. And the dodge clones over-writing phantasms really irked me.

Yeh that was my combo also. I could literally ignore a target and watch him or her melt between those two phantasms... pretty insane.

That said I love the combo and though I'm sure it will get nerfed (fixed) i still think it will be my set of choice for spvp and pve ( i tend to prefer staff for large fights in WvW)

Back on topic:

Anet has said on forums that the Mesmer needs work but not to expect a class rehaul. My main complaints are as follows:

- Shatter mechanics don't work very well except for F4. The other take too long do reach the enemy (almost impossible against ranged) and the nerfed mind wrack is just basically useless. 

- Clones now doing zero damage cuts into mesmer dps - also because of shatter mechanics they're pretty useless dead as well. Finally, too easy to spot clones compared to the Mesmer.

- Clones should never replace phantasms when summoned. Additionally, they should seperate phantasms and clones altogether. 

- a number of skills need fixing or changing (like skill 3 for sword MH) 

- a number of traits need to be completely replaced as they don't really apply to much of anything

- Mesmer downed skills are pretty terrible 

- Mesmer needs another ranged main hand imo (pistol maybe? would be cool) 

I enjoyed my mesmer more in BWE1 but after playing around with different things I did manage to find a good build. Does anyone know if they upped confusion damage compared to last weekend? It seemed to be doing lots this time around.

I had trouble with the mesmer class this time around.  I had one at level 18 after the first weekend so started this weekend with that character but I was dying so much I just abandoned it and tried an elementalist instead which was a lot more enjoyable.

I ended up getting my elementalist to level 33 and barely died at all (well except in the dungeon that was deadly).

Personally I think a lot of the problems I was having was the changed skill system.  Without the boost to the life of illusion they tended to die too quickly and no mirror image was also a pain.  Before I saved skill points and bought good abilities I wanted, no I'm railroaded into picking worthless ones for the first 20+ levels.

Originally posted by Adiaris

Originally posted by Kaisen_Dexx

Originally posted by beleren

You guys know that Phantasm Haste makes phantasms hit insane damages and this is a bug confirmed from Anet, right? Because I saw couple of posts which say pistol phantasm is hitting hard and others agree.

That'd make sense. Sword + Pistol and a Great Sword secondary was off the charts. I'd pop Illusionary Duelist and then change over to Great Sword and pop Phantasmal Berserker, and people would just melt in PVP. Other than that, damage wasn't spectacular, Illsionary Leap more times than not wouldn't work for me as well. And the dodge clones over-writing phantasms really irked me.

Yeh that was my combo also. I could literally ignore a target and watch him or her melt between those two phantasms... pretty insane.

That said I love the combo and though I'm sure it will get nerfed (fixed) i still think it will be my set of choice for spvp and pve ( i tend to prefer staff for large fights in WvW)

...

 

 

See though, I NEVER saw one person devote an auto attack or two to dropping the Phantasms. Thats why It didn't occur to me they were bugged. I would have liked to see people actually deal with them instead of ignore them and die, before I make judgement calls on how powerful the mesmer really is.

Originally posted by Kaisen_Dexx

Originally posted by Adiaris

Originally posted by Kaisen_Dexx

Originally posted by beleren

You guys know that Phantasm Haste makes phantasms hit insane damages and this is a bug confirmed from Anet, right? Because I saw couple of posts which say pistol phantasm is hitting hard and others agree.

That'd make sense. Sword + Pistol and a Great Sword secondary was off the charts. I'd pop Illusionary Duelist and then change over to Great Sword and pop Phantasmal Berserker, and people would just melt in PVP. Other than that, damage wasn't spectacular, Illsionary Leap more times than not wouldn't work for me as well. And the dodge clones over-writing phantasms really irked me.

Yeh that was my combo also. I could literally ignore a target and watch him or her melt between those two phantasms... pretty insane.

That said I love the combo and though I'm sure it will get nerfed (fixed) i still think it will be my set of choice for spvp and pve ( i tend to prefer staff for large fights in WvW)

...

 

 

See though, I NEVER saw one person devote an auto attack or two to dropping the Phantasms. Thats why It didn't occur to me they were bugged. I would have liked to see people actually deal with them instead of ignore them and die, before I make judgement calls on how powerful the mesmer really is.

Idd. Just saying that phantoms currently are pretty off the charts in damage if traited a certain way but the whole class needs to be looked at and not one element at a time I feel. 

Originally posted by Adiaris

Anet has said on forums that the Mesmer needs work but not to expect a class rehaul. My main complaints are as follows:

- Shatter mechanics don't work very well except for F4. The other take too long do reach the enemy (almost impossible against ranged) and the nerfed mind wrack is just basically useless. 

- Clones now doing zero damage cuts into mesmer dps - also because of shatter mechanics they're pretty useless dead as well. Finally, too easy to spot clones compared to the Mesmer.

- Clones should never replace phantasms when summoned. Additionally, they should seperate phantasms and clones altogether. 

- a number of skills need fixing or changing (like skill 3 for sword MH) 

- a number of traits need to be completely replaced as they don't really apply to much of anything

- Mesmer downed skills are pretty terrible 

- Mesmer needs another ranged main hand imo (pistol maybe? would be cool) 

 

I enjoyed my mesmer more in BWE1 but after playing around with different things I did manage to find a good build. Does anyone know if they upped confusion damage compared to last weekend? It seemed to be doing lots this time around.

Very good points, and I hope Anet realizes this. I wrote them some similar suggestions in regards to the mesmer:

- Shatter shouldn't need the clones to run towards their target to deal the dmg. It should work almost like a debuff on target the clones were summoned on. Break the illusions and the target instantly takes the hit (or stun, w/e button u pressed). This just makes more sense.

- I agree, clones replacing phanstasms definitely seems like it would be a bug. Either way, they need to be separated. Not sure if there should be a cap, but they should definitely take a very close look at dps with max phantasms summoned.

- Going from BWE#1 to this one, mesmer definitely seems like it took a big hit on damage. I tried making mine more of a conditions dps build (similar to a necro) and it worked okay, but not great. Melee builds seemed to still work insanely well, though, but ranged definitely felt a bit lackluster. I really hope they tweak these things, because Mesmers have always been one of my favorite classes.

Originally posted by Adiaris

Originally posted by Kaisen_Dexx

Originally posted by Adiaris

Originally posted by Kaisen_Dexx

Originally posted by beleren

You guys know that Phantasm Haste makes phantasms hit insane damages and this is a bug confirmed from Anet, right? Because I saw couple of posts which say pistol phantasm is hitting hard and others agree.

That'd make sense. Sword + Pistol and a Great Sword secondary was off the charts. I'd pop Illusionary Duelist and then change over to Great Sword and pop Phantasmal Berserker, and people would just melt in PVP. Other than that, damage wasn't spectacular, Illsionary Leap more times than not wouldn't work for me as well. And the dodge clones over-writing phantasms really irked me.

Yeh that was my combo also. I could literally ignore a target and watch him or her melt between those two phantasms... pretty insane.

That said I love the combo and though I'm sure it will get nerfed (fixed) i still think it will be my set of choice for spvp and pve ( i tend to prefer staff for large fights in WvW)

...

 

 

See though, I NEVER saw one person devote an auto attack or two to dropping the Phantasms. Thats why It didn't occur to me they were bugged. I would have liked to see people actually deal with them instead of ignore them and die, before I make judgement calls on how powerful the mesmer really is.

Idd. Just saying that phantoms currently are pretty off the charts in damage if traited a certain way but the whole class needs to be looked at and not one element at a time I feel. 

Err sorry, Meant to ask in there if you had seen anyone actually attack a phantasm instead of just ignoring them and dieing.

Hate to say it but I am pretty sure you just arent playing them right.

I played my mesmer all the way thru 1st BW and now this one and I can now win a 1v1 against any class and usually did, not to mention I won several 1v2's and even a few 1v3's.  Knowing how to use your clones mixed with your stealth is the key to playing them.

As for the person who said they get out performed by Ele....you definatley are not playing them right lol.  I didnt lose a single 1v1 to an Ele all weekend, even when they blew their tornado form and everything I could still own them np without even using my elite skills.

I think it can be a difficult class to play. You have to find the right combo to use.  I leveled with some Mesmers and they were awesome.  What they didn't use were the illusionary skills.

Originally posted by Kaisen_Dexx

(snip)

See though, I NEVER saw one person devote an auto attack or two to dropping the Phantasms. Thats why It didn't occur to me they were bugged. I would have liked to see people actually deal with them instead of ignore them and die, before I make judgement calls on how powerful the mesmer really is.

Idd. Just saying that phantoms currently are pretty off the charts in damage if traited a certain way but the whole class needs to be looked at and not one element at a time I feel. 

Err sorry, Meant to ask in there if you had seen anyone actually attack a phantasm instead of just ignoring them and dieing.

Only occasionally and only in SPVP going against the same people on a number of rounds when they finally realized what I was up to with those two phantasms. Generally, I don't think I've seen most people pay too much attention to phantasms (if at all)

Originally posted by luclinraider

Hate to say it but I am pretty sure you just arent playing them right.

I played my mesmer all the way thru 1st BW and now this one and I can now win a 1v1 against any class and usually did, not to mention I won several 1v2's and even a few 1v3's.  Knowing how to use your clones mixed with your stealth is the key to playing them.

As for the person who said they get out performed by Ele....you definatley are not playing them right lol.  I didnt lose a single 1v1 to an Ele all weekend, even when they blew their tornado form and everything I could still own them np without even using my elite skills.

I would agree that Ele's are the easiest match up for Mesmers atm (at least for me). Easy to get out of their aoes in Staff and have them blow all their big damage spells without getting hit at all. Their usual squishiness also means they're easy to dps down rather quickly. 

From what I have seen every class stacks up to every other class if you know what your doing. I've roflstomped necromancers and been roflestomped by them. Same with Mesmers. Rangers. Engineers. Warriors, and every other class. I've seen a mesmer roflestomp a very good elementalist.

     Elementalists have very predictable movesets. Large windups and easy to dodge. Plus they are squishy as all getout.

     A mesmer chews threw elementalists like candy. If they are dodging and applying their chaos armor, shattering, etc. A good mesmer is one of the most scary things I've seen. That's true with all of the classes though. Most people just don't know how to play yet. They try to kite forever and only use one weapon. Or they never dodge. Or don't use combo fields. Or don't synergise their abilities with their traits or with each other. I have a different strategy as a thief for every class I see. If you don't. 

Originally posted by Nightverge

From what I have seen every class stacks up to every other class if you know what your doing. I've roflstomped necromancers and been roflestomped by them. Same with Mesmers. Rangers. Engineers. Warriors, and every other class. I've seen a mesmer roflestomp a very good elementalist.

     Elementalists have very predictable movesets. Large windups and easy to dodge. Plus they are squishy as all getout.

     A mesmer chews threw elementalists like candy. If they are dodging and applying their chaos armor, shattering, etc. A good mesmer is one of the most scary things I've seen. That's true with all of the classes though. Most people just don't know how to play yet. They try to kite forever and only use one weapon. Or they never dodge. Or don't use combo fields. Or don't synergise their abilities with their traits or with each other. I have a different strategy as a thief for every class I see. If you don't. 

This sums up my thoughts as well.  In this game the phrase "if at first you don't suceed, try, try again" is so true.  I had a hard time with all the classes in PvP at first, but with tinkering and trying out different tactics you learn how to make them seem overpowered.  The cool thing is how many different playstyles just one class has.

To the original topic, I found quite a few players who were melee based mesmers that were just devastating in WvW.  They alone could burst another class down as fast, if not faster, than the dps warriors.  Just like Nightverge says, you have to synergize your build, and be prepared for as many situations as you can.  Raw dps and condition builds seem very popular right now.  Mesmers, necros, and guardians are excellent at countering these type of builds.

Cheers!

Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

First of they underperform, the illusions dont do any damamge (might be broken) and their own damage is the lowest of all classes.

 

But worst is the fact that they feel like a one trick pony to me.

 

(Maybe its just my perception, because i love classes that are like swiss army knives)

Got my mesmer to 33 this weekend (started in prior betas), and I would tend to disagree with you on this assessment. I had a blast. One thing I noticed, there's one teir 1 trait that applies cripple when you shatter clones. Makes a world of difference. I found myself creating clones as fast as skills would allow (while fighting, of course) then sending them in to their doom, keeping a healthy bit of control on the enemies. I found myself real comfortable switching between greatsword and staff, and that switching weapons really boosts what you can do. Mesmer will still be my main when we go live, I love the profession.

what bugs me a lot with mesmer is that their clones dissapear when ur selected target dies.

This is basically how it works:  attack mob A using scepter , ur clones appear , target A dies then out of nowwhere target B comes out, all clones dissapear .