Originally posted by Cembrye

What people need to remind themselves is that freedom means not just taking the good, but also the bad.  If its a trade-off you are happy with, then Archeage is for you.  If not, there are tons of PVE only theme parks out there.

 

Originally posted by DarkPony

If community will be the biggest of AA's problems I'll be a happy pony.

Mmhmm.

Originally posted by MMOExposed
This game seem very interesting! But I feel the main thing that will Ruin the game up in the West won't be bugs or software issues,,

But will be THE PLAYERS.

NA culture, along with Sandbox PvP, tend to ruin an awesome gameplay experience when it comes to any sandbox MMO.
What will make Archeage any different here? The players to mess things up, and run players away, that may be interested in sandbox subgenre.

Like in EVE and entropia (90% of good mates on the comunity) i think archeage will be a good comunity enviroment,look at the oficial foruns,diferent of other games foruns out there archeage foruns is "almost" free of flames and bashes and troll posts

Theres is already some penalisations for random PK gankers

Jail (you pass a time not able to get your char out the jail)

Crime marks ( not sure what it do)

Bound (players with crime marks enough can have a bound placed on them,other players who kill him will receive the bound automaticaly)

Like in EVE and entropia (90% of good mates on the comunity) i think archeage will be a good comunity enviroment,look at the oficial foruns,diferent of other games foruns out there archeage foruns is "almost" free of flames and bashes and troll posts

If you find hard to PK in EVE just becouse the concord and bound,archeage will have hes concord plus many more penalisations for pkrs

Originally posted by Heinz130
<...>

Crime marks ( not sure what it do)

<...>

Some sort of evidence left at the crime scene by the culprit.  These can be invistigated and then used for Bounty Hunting and/or some detective "game in-game".

Found this description over at MMOSite.com

"If choosing to steal items from someone else though, you will leave behind footprints for each item you steal! Other players can pick up these footprints and report you for the crime.  Footprints disappear over time but exactly how long I'm not sure.  I do know it's less than a day.  If you want to be really sneaky you can scrub away your footprints or blood using a consumable item (a broom) so that others can't report you. But if you stole so much as to aggravate them then they have the option to play detective.  They get a consumable (powder of some sort) that they can throw over a certain area to reveal footprints/blood that have been hidden."

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by Heinz130
<...>

Crime marks ( not sure what it do)

<...>

 

Some sort of evidence left at the crime scene by the culprit.  These can be invistigated and then used for Bounty Hunting and/or some detective "game in-game".

Found this description over at MMOSite.com

"If choosing to steal items from someone else though, you will leave behind footprints for each item you steal! Other players can pick up these footprints and report you for the crime.  Footprints disappear over time but exactly how long I'm not sure.  I do know it's less than a day.  If you want to be really sneaky you can scrub away your footprints or blood using a consumable item (a broom) so that others can't report you. But if you stole so much as to aggravate them then they have the option to play detective.  They get a consumable (powder of some sort) that they can throw over a certain area to reveal footprints/blood that have been hidden."

 

nice.

As long as the punishment  for becoming an outlaw is harsh, the system might work to prevent ganking and greiving.

If being an outlaw has no real disadvantage, I fear for the popularity of this game in the long haul.

Did you ever seen a asiatic guy doing business? they are called tigers for a reason,i dont think they will let the game being ruined by the comunity

Moreover,after all my vast experience with mmorpgs ive NEVER seen a game being ruined by someoneelse but the own game staff

Originally posted by toddze

Another thing I find interesting, is when you get into the debate of PvP and PvE severs. Not saying Archeage will have different server rule sets, and I am talking about PVP games in genral, but overall which crowd is strongly opposed to different server rule sets? Its sure as heck isnt the PvE crowd. PVE crowd couldnt care less if there was a PVP server or not. But why is it that PVP crowd so strongly opposes a PVE server? Its because PVP servers end up dying because ultimately the players run other players off to the PVE servers. PVP crowd wants to force everybody to play by their rules. Without PVE servers the players just end up running players off to another game, which is what the OP is refering to I think.

Would I like to see PVP/PVE servers in AA? Maybe, but id rather see servers with the penalty for greiving and ganking higher on some severs vs other severs. Id have to see how the game plays before I know for sure on which id prefer.

I feel that if someone doesn't like to engage in conflict with the enemy on the battlefield, that this might not be the game for them. XLGames has only mention contemplation on sperate servers for hasher rules, but I don't believe a PVE server is in their scope of things. The mechanics of the game is designed around interaction.  I feel that the full scope of the game would not be imbraced, if players could only duel or not interact at all....True, it may affect the population of the game, but it could also change the experience of how they have envisioned the game to be, so far as the overall experience.

A lot of the games raid bosses occur in the open world, and the Entire 3rd continent is designed around control for territory, housing, and siege warfare. When a title is built around developing a game life, and then making sure you protect it,  exploring new lands,  while embracing the threat of unfriendliness in some lands, I don't see how a PVE server could work....Even if they did implement it.

Originally posted by wiseman00

Originally posted by toddze

Another thing I find interesting, is when you get into the debate of PvP and PvE severs. Not saying Archeage will have different server rule sets, and I am talking about PVP games in genral, but overall which crowd is strongly opposed to different server rule sets? Its sure as heck isnt the PvE crowd. PVE crowd couldnt care less if there was a PVP server or not. But why is it that PVP crowd so strongly opposes a PVE server? Its because PVP servers end up dying because ultimately the players run other players off to the PVE servers. PVP crowd wants to force everybody to play by their rules. Without PVE servers the players just end up running players off to another game, which is what the OP is refering to I think.

Would I like to see PVP/PVE servers in AA? Maybe, but id rather see servers with the penalty for greiving and ganking higher on some severs vs other severs. Id have to see how the game plays before I know for sure on which id prefer.

I feel that if someone doesn't like to engage in conflict with the enemy on the battlefield, that this might not be the game for them. XLGames has only mention contemplation on sperate servers for hasher rules, but I don't believe a PVE server is in their scope of things. The mechanics of the game is designed around interaction.  I feel that the full scope of the game would not be imbraced, if players could only duel or not interact at all....True, it may affect the population of the game, but it could also change the experience of how they have envisioned the game to be, so far as the overall experience.

A lot of the games raid bosses occur in the open world, and the Entire 3rd continent is designed around control for territory, housing, and siege warfare. When a title is built around developing a game life, and then making sure you protect it,  exploring new lands,  while embracing the threat of unfriendliness in some lands, I don't see how a PVE server could work....Even if they did implement it.

I am really intrerested in how they handle open world raid bosses.  That could be the making for some truely epic fights, just think PvPvE. However I think that varity is the key, I dont think its smart to make every raid boss open world. I hate instances though but make something like a portal system where only guild/alliance can use it. I am a strong believer that viartity and diversity is the key to long term sucess of PvE content. This T1,T2,T3 garbage is pathetic, its why these themeparks die off so fast. Id love to see a PvE end-game like XI had in AA. I could only imagine what it would have been like fighting some of the open world bosses if XI had open world PvP. I dont know that anyone would have actually ever killed one of the king raid bosses. Due to the players killing each other first . 

Originally posted by Phry

Originally posted by DixonHill

Its always the players. In any game, "some" players will always try to fight the game, bypass mechanics and obstacles and chose the path of least resistance. They are like water. And this will always produce problems for a much larger number of players, if not the whole playerbase.

This is, in my opinion, one of the main reasons for why themepark mmos have even been invented.

right.. so rather than it being dodgy coding, its because players break stuff.. awesome.. personally i thought the bit where the players broke stuff was called, BETA TESTING. but, wouldnt be the first game to be released in a questionable state, certainly won't be the last.

had to laugh though at the OPs 'its the players fault'.. QQ'ing.. priceless

Until Trammal hit, UO subs were falling. The person you quoted is touching upon the subject.

Folks not wanting to PVP arent going to look kindly on being someone elses E-sport. Once EQ hit, and folks had the option to not be griefed, it was game on for themeparks.

Giving players the power to drive off other players is the stupidest game mechanic of them all IMO. There is always that one jackass that has to fuck with others. IN a themepark that person wont be noticed. In a sandbox, devs better hope the damage to the playerbase is minimal.

Sandboxes are their own worst enemy.  I wont touch them in the MMO realm, but there are folks that would if they could craft/PVE in peace. If Jake Song is smart, he will make a game for all to enjoy since he seems to be aiming for all this sandbox content.

If the game is world wide FFA, I dont expect it will do very well in NA. In Asia though, I would imagine world wide FFA will go over pretty good.

Originally posted by toddze

I actually agree with the OP, to an extent. A handfull of players can ruin an entire server in an open PvP game. I think thats what the OP is meaning. FFA PVP is a niche crowd period, and the reason is ganking and greiving. Debate that all you like, throw out derogatory terms like "carebear" all you like but majority of gamers do not enjoy that type of play at all, again I think that is where the OP is going with this thread.

As for AA I hope the game mechanics thats suposed to curb the ganking and greiving work otherwise, the game will just be another niche game. Theres nothing wrong with that, everyone needs a game to play. But open world PvP will never be for the masses.   

This^

Originally posted by MMOExposed
This game seem very interesting! But I feel the main thing that will Ruin the game up in the West won't be bugs or software issues,,

But will be THE PLAYERS.

NA culture, along with Sandbox PvP, tend to ruin an awesome gameplay experience when it comes to any sandbox MMO.
What will make Archeage any different here? The players to mess things up, and run players away, that may be interested in sandbox subgenre.

If anything ruins ArcheAge it will likely be a F2P model

Originally posted by toddze

Another thing I find interesting, is when you get into the debate of PvP and PvE severs. Not saying Archeage will have different server rule sets, and I am talking about PVP games in genral, but overall which crowd is strongly opposed to different server rule sets? Its sure as heck isnt the PvE crowd. PVE crowd couldnt care less if there was a PVP server or not. But why is it that PVP crowd so strongly opposes a PVE server? Its because PVP servers end up dying because ultimately the players run other players off to the PVE servers. PVP crowd wants to force everybody to play by their rules. Without PVE servers the players just end up running players off to another game, which is what the OP is refering to I think.

Would I like to see PVP/PVE servers in AA? Maybe, but id rather see servers with the penalty for greiving and ganking higher on some severs vs other severs. Id have to see how the game plays before I know for sure on which id prefer.

Actually the main argument I hear from PVE players regarding PvP even existing in a game is that in order to balance PvP you need to balance classes which affect the PVE'ers who never intend to step foot in a warzone.

As of now, none of this will affect ArcheAge anyway as it mainly has an RvR ruleset  restricting PvP to certain zones

Originally posted by Grixxitt

Originally posted by toddze

As of now, none of this will affect ArcheAge anyway as it mainly has an RvR ruleset  restricting PvP to certain zones

From what i know, sieges are only in the 3rd continent, but can you still kill other players and destroy or steal their boats, houses, mounts, etc in the 2 other continents?

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Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

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Originally posted by Grixxitt

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Originally posted by toddze

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As of now, none of this will affect ArcheAge anyway as it mainly has an RvR ruleset  restricting PvP to certain zones

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From what i know, sieges are only in the 3rd continent, but can you still kill other players and destroy or steal their boats, houses, mounts, etc in the 2 other continents?

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Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Originally posted by Grixxitt

Originally posted by toddze

As of now, none of this will affect ArcheAge anyway as it mainly has an RvR ruleset  restricting PvP to certain zones

From what i know, sieges are only in the 3rd continent, but can you still kill other players and destroy or steal their boats, houses, mounts, etc in the 2 other continents?

Details are sketchy but you're correct, its just the criminal system which will effectively (?) nerf PvP outside of the 3rd continent

Originally posted by lizardbones

 

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Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

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Originally posted by Grixxitt

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Originally posted by toddze

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As of now, none of this will affect ArcheAge anyway as it mainly has an RvR ruleset  restricting PvP to certain zones

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From what i know, sieges are only in the 3rd continent, but can you still kill other players and destroy or steal their boats, houses, mounts, etc in the 2 other continents?

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I have done a bit of research on house building and farming, because that's something that I tend to enjoy doing in games, where possible. How farming and house building would work is you can build a house and a farm, but it's entirely possible that another player or group of players could come along and destroy it. In order to play with the more sandboxy feature, you have to accept the possibility of the losing everything you've built up. If you're offline and not there when it happens, tough cookies. Your stuff will just be gone.

I'm not sure how much this holds true for other stuff though. This would be enough to turn me off of the game. I'm waiting to see how it actually plays out in game though. We don't even know if the Eastern and Western versions of the game will operate under the same rule sets or not.

** edit **
From what I read, the house building and farming were restricted to the third continent. No houses or farming on the other two continents.

 

Thanks for the response. Not very happy to hear this. But i'll have to see the full system and game before jump the shark.

Originally posted by toddze

I actually agree with the OP, to an extent. A handfull of players can ruin an entire server in an open PvP game. I think thats what the OP is meaning. FFA PVP is a niche crowd period, and the reason is ganking and greiving. Debate that all you like, throw out derogatory terms like "carebear" all you like but majority of gamers do not enjoy that type of play at all, again I think that is where the OP is going with this thread.

As for AA I hope the game mechanics thats suposed to curb the ganking and greiving work otherwise, the game will just be another niche game. Theres nothing wrong with that, everyone needs a game to play. But open world PvP will never be for the masses.   

Open world FFA PVP isn't a niche crowd.  Hell, if you don't believe me check out DayZ, or hell even Call of Duty, seems pretty popular eh?  A ton of people love killing other players, period.  Problem is the vocal minority of PVEers always trying to convince devs that the majority of players are too scared of this style of game.  Real hardcore pvpers are stuck playing FPS games due to simple lack of options.   

Originally posted by BigHatLogan

Originally posted by toddze

I actually agree with the OP, to an extent. A handfull of players can ruin an entire server in an open PvP game. I think thats what the OP is meaning. FFA PVP is a niche crowd period, and the reason is ganking and greiving. Debate that all you like, throw out derogatory terms like "carebear" all you like but majority of gamers do not enjoy that type of play at all, again I think that is where the OP is going with this thread.

As for AA I hope the game mechanics thats suposed to curb the ganking and greiving work otherwise, the game will just be another niche game. Theres nothing wrong with that, everyone needs a game to play. But open world PvP will never be for the masses.   

Open world FFA PVP isn't a niche crowd.  Hell, if you don't believe me check out DayZ, or hell even Call of Duty, seems pretty popular eh?  A ton of people love killing other players, period.  Problem is the vocal minority of PVEers always trying to convince devs that the majority of players are too scared of this style of game.  Real hardcore pvpers are stuck playing FPS games due to simple lack of options.   

FFA PVP is a niche mechanic, and doesnt appear it will change anytime soon. Of all game mechanics used in MMOs, FFA is one of the least utiliized among NA subs. Eastern subs dont mind so much, but then again their subs are worth what? 50 cents a month is probably pretty close when compared to the 15 bucks a NA sub brings.

Until FFA Devs figure out a way to keep folks from chasing the lambs off, it will always remain niche. Hard to grow a market when new gamers can be griefed to the point of leaving. It was no mistake that UO grew in numbers once Trammel was introduced.

There is no problem liking things others do not, just dont kid yourself when it comes to estimating its popularity.  CoD offers players PVP on an equal footing. MMOs do not. You give noobs an equal chance to win against the lvled up griefers, and things will be different.

For once I kinda agree with MMOexposed.

*checks the sky to see if it's falling*

FFA games in the East don't really have the kind of Players that spend 90% of their time trying to make other Players ragequit. I assume there is a lot of 1-on-1 requests for a fair fight, then a lot of bowing afterwards. It's a culture thing.

The west, on the other hand, is a bunch of drooling CoD4 cockmongers that - given the chance - would scream into their mic solely to make ears bleed. There is no sense of honor (in the greater community, that is), and they don't treat a game world as if there are reputations to uphold. As far as they are concerned, it's just a persistant version of Team Deathmatch.

~Now, what *I* assume will be the hardest factor for the west to deal with would be the Eastern art style/aesthetics. People get really mouthy about "things looking too Asian", like we still have some kind of staunch nationalism issues, like we did back in the days of the cold war. I wouldn't call it racism, but it's close. The west just tends to put up an emotional wall when it comes to any kind of product from the east, even cuisine (if they are *that* much of an asshole). It's likely just how western culture (read: Americans) is.

(this all coming from one of them)

If people are concerned about some of the CORE gameplay mechanics this MMO is employing maybe you should find a new game that fits your gaming needs. Sorry it is incredibly annoying that a developer is finally stepping outside of the WoW box and have people complain that it is not  like every other AAA MMO that has hit the market the past couple of years. If you are a carebear and are concerned about being griefed or losing your items play a different game. I played Ultima Online for many years and what some people dont seem to understand is that yes griefers do run amok but players also rise up against the griefers and fight back. Each server was unique in that you had notorious player killers but groups of players also created anti-pk groups which kept things interesting . If this game launches in the west with FFA pvp and full loot history will repeat itself and have PK's and people who hunt down the PK's which will create a fun and unique server story, a lot better then some dev created quest that has you collect 10 cow testicles!