Originally posted by TheRealAMC

Originally posted by itgrowls

Originally posted by TheRealAMC

So, to close things up, I will ask you a question. Will Guild Wars 2 pass or fail based on it's quality, or will Guild Wars 2 pass or fail because it has or hasn't met the often demanding expecations of a "massive" playerbase? My personal feelings are that this game will have the quality, but ArenaNet needs to expect the worse if it's players are expection the holy grail of gaming out of the Bellevue  based company many have come to love. 

-Hoping for a good first thread post, and future work as a gaming blogger/journalist. (:

Simple answer, it already has delivered both on the promises made by the developers to the fans and undecided players alike, AND on the quality and features that have been expressed in EVERY VIDEO AND INTERVIEW THE ANET DEVS HAVE EVER TALKED IN. 

So, so long as people don't post nonsense on these forums (like "this games hype is going to kill it" or "the game is full of hype" misrepresenting the facts that the game is well past the hype and into the already delivered stage) then everything should be fine. 

You see there is a big big difference between a game Dev claiming that a game they are making is going to be epic, huge, take over the entire market, destroy all other competitors, and then not deliver like a recent EA game....Ahem (And i DO have the clips to back this up) and a company of a Devs who's goal was to make a great game with features that would cure many of the problems all MMO players have faced throughout mmo history without breaking the game experience (which is all that Arenanet has done from the beginning).

So since it's already been established that it's no longer a mystery what they are doing and it's no longer detrimental to the MMO players, can we actually move on from this type of post and post on things that are actually relevant to the game now? Thanks. :)

I would just like to state that:

1. I did not claim that it's hype would kill it, I said it is a plausible outcome that is up for question, that is why this thread is a question to the replying parties.

 Guild Wars 2: Will Extreme Hype Kill The Game Before It's Time?

The very title of your post claims otherwise. It's not simply a debate as you have painted it, it's yet another implied slander. IMO It's beating a dead horse once again in these forums, now i know you claim to be new, however a simply cursory glance into the forums history will show you how dead this topic is.

2. This is relevent to the game, because we are discussing the game's ability to stand pressure from negative influences, despite it's quality which many of us feel is assured. 

Since this is a dead horse topic it is no longer relevant since all cards have now been successfully placed on the table. Only the launch will show if the game will survive the negativities and the dead horse threads like these coming out of these forums. So posting over and over about this, no matter how you paint the reason why, still doesn't justify the post.

3. I  haven't posted any misrepresenting facts about the game other than that I am trying to define it's combat system and end game in comparison to other popular games. 

 "To put this in other terms, it is quite possible for the game to not live up to the expected hype and despite what quality it may have as a game." Look familiar? Claiming that there is in any way Hype about this game is at this point in time, in the open beta stage with no NDA, misrepresenting facts. Hype =/= what Anet is doing RIGHT NOW with the title which is delivering on all that they have claimed would be in this title. 

With that being said, I'd not have you or anyone insulting or dimenishing the value of a good debate based on your own preferences either, so please be advised to be a little less harsh on this matter. Thank you (:

Oh And for any debate to be meaningful you do have to take a bloody nose or two from people who are pointing out that you are wrong, just because I'm intense doesn't mean I'm wrong about how completely unnecessary this post and posts like it are at this point. The fact remains the only hype they are spreading is not about the game but about why they designed it the way it is by claiming that it was a reaction to a slow and stagnant industry, that game itself has no hype anymore as they have revealed everything they promised as fact right there in your face fact, on video that would stand up in any court of law.

 

Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

Originally posted by MMOExposed

Originally posted by DJJazzy

Originally posted by MMOExposed

Originally posted by DJJazzy

Originally posted by MMOExposed

Originally posted by DJJazzy

Originally posted by MMOExposed

Originally posted by DJJazzy

Originally posted by MMOExposed

Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

Originally posted by MMOExposed

Originally posted by Quirhid

Only way hype can hurt the game is if somepeople spread wrong information about it leading to many misconceptions and then disappointment. As long as people keep hyping the right things, I don't see the hype as a bad thing.

 

I believe that is happening with people telling others that GW2 is aim based combat like Tera, which it isn't. You have no crosshairs to aim up and down and left and right all at once.

I believe that is happening in response to the people telling others GW2 combat is just tab targetting and play like any other MMO with tab targetting, and so it can't be action combat.

The truth is combat in GW2 is action packed, but more of the movement variant and less of the targetting using a crosshair variant.

I think most people reading "action combat" will picture FPS type of combat - neither Tera or GW2 offers a complete FPS experience, with Tera offering the aiming and GW2 offering the movements aspects.

Tera is a mix of aiming and combat games ala streetfighter, while GW2 is a mix of third person shooters with traditional MMORPGs.

One interest thing that I hadn't time to fully evaluate is how tab-targetting vs aiming (you can aim the general direction of the shot/swing/skill by pointing your character) compare in terms of efficiency in GW2 - while I was playing an engineer and was fighting a oak heart (one of those massive treant/trees creature) I could aim my shots low or high, and it was very noticeable when I used the flamethrower skill #2, Flame bast, that shoots a ball of napalm. On another occasion I was firing a crippling shot (Aimed shot, warrior rifle skill #2) at a fleeing enemy and a bird flew straight in the shot path and took the hit instead. Against a larger enemy like the oakheart I could have aimed higher and avoided the bird.

 

Well what about those people that were saying GW2 doesn't have homing attacks? Guardian's first focus skill soul ray or something like that, is a homing attack.

Ray of Judgement? When a foe hid behind an obstruction, it certainly didn't hit that opponent.

 

Most attacks have hit detection feature. But still homes based on tab targeting. (tab targeting includes clicking on a target or pressing tab).

And again using my example I used before,,, let's say a enemy is standing on a keep roof in GW2, and you are on the ground. How will you aim at them with your ranged attack to hit them if you don't use tab target? You going to just manually aim up at them with mouse like in Tera?

In this situation, I am going to pretend like I don't know the answer. Do you mind explaining the answer to my question to somebody like me who hasn't played Guild Wars 2 yet?

I'm not quite getting what a homing attack is within your context. If I have someone targeted, I use a ranged skill that is within their range, it will hit them unless they move out of the way or they move behind an obstruction before that projectile reaches them.

 

Excuse me for assuming you played beta, but I will assume that for the time being. Did you play a Guardian at all, and try Ray of Judgment? Next beta try it on a player that is moving. Notice that when targeted, the attack will curve to their direction, like a fireball in WoW curse and home in on target like a missile.

No they didn't.

 

Yes, yes it does. This ironically is also mentioned on the wiki slightly compared to other combat info. Next beta test, try it out. I played the recent stress test, and it was there.

I moved out of the way of many ranged attacks, try hiding behind a rock or other obstructions. It certainly didn't "home" to my location. You'll see some nice pretty red obstruction words on your screen.

 

Ok. You won't take my word for this. I have no reason to lie about this. So that's why I say to anybody that doubt my words on this, to try it for yourself. You will see what I mean. I have no reason to lie or mislead, since I don't get anything out of it. So try this for yourself. Ask somebody you know on another server you fighting against to run past you whole casting ray spell focus weapon for guardians. Watch the attack home and curve to hit target. Just try it. Don't take my word for it. Try it yourself.

Aiming a target on a roof:

You make sure the target is in sight and aim up or use tab target (still needs to be in sight) and hope the tab target aims up for you.

Regarding the homing skills - there might be some homing skills, there might be some rooting on the ground skills, there might be skills that hit people behind obstrucions.

In FPS you also have lock on target skills.

The special effect of those skills is exactly that.
 

Now tell me the recharge of that skill.

 

This what I wanted somebody to come out and say.

Ps: seriously the quotes on this editor is out of hand. I suggest Somebody from MMORPG.com staff changing the editor tool to something else cause this is getting crazy..

Originally posted by TheRealAMC

I understand your reasonings, but the whole point of my original post was that, can the game be ruined by possible hype over the expectations people have? As for subjectivity, I wouldn't ever claim that an opinion isn't subjective. Probably one of my favorite internet personalities is John "Totalbiscuit" Baine, he doesn't like score based systems or systems based on subjectivity because subjectivity is as it should be. While he gives very subjective opinions, he leaves the viewers the decision to decide what they think of the game instead of giving a raw score. When I talk about hype I am not just talking about the exaguration from players, but also, to an extent, the reviewers. If IGN and Gamestop decided to give GW2 a score of 2 points and claimed it was a horrible game, how many do you think would trust their opinion and NOT get the game? Subjectivity is a nastey business, but not if it is done with fairness in mind.

I think relatively few would trust a single review. It is much more difficult to get a consensus in reviews than two reviews on complete opposites of the spectrum. Pretty much every game ever released has had good reviews and bad reviews. That by definition does not construe hype unless the review used exageration or hyperbole to justify the conclusion. 

I personally don't believe even fan/hater hype has any significant affect on the outcome of a game. The only lasting impact of hype typically comes from the developers themselves. I cited three games which exemplify this. Funcom now has a reputation of delivering incomplete products because of their hype. WAR was largely brought down by developers hyping a product they knew was not even remotely close to their claims... Finally Tasos of DarkFall fame has to be one of the most polarizing figures in the Indie MMO industry. He went so far beyond hype to flat our flagrant lying. 

That will hurt a game... None of which I have yet seen from ANet although people keep claiming they have done it in spades. (not you specifically).

Originally posted by jondifool

Originally posted by atziluth

Originally posted by DarkPony

Originally posted by atziluth 

I have asked this before, and I will do it again... Please show where the developers have excessively exagerated the core elements of GW2.

How about pretty much the entire Manifesto Video?

Probably the most clever 5.53 minutes of mmo marketing in the history of the genre, pulling emotional strings by the dozen.

1. Over 1/2 of the video had no commentary (last 3+ minutes, just gameplay). 

2. The ONLY thing in that video that could be construed as exageration is permenant world effects. We simply do not know if that is the case, however it seems unlikely. 

3. Everything else they have either delivered on completely or partially... This being a manifesto... I would say that is an incredibly good records so far without the game even being released. 

2 Ree went out fast after the manifesto video saying she was talking about the personal story, not permanent changes to the open world. But that doesn't qualify as purposly excessively exageration , only as misspeaking that was corrected.

But to find thing that qualify maybe the qoutes about not only wanting to make the best MMO ever, but the best game ever. While maybe not exagerating on the aim of the game, i think statements like this do fuel unreasonable expectation for some easyly excited fans

This just supports my point even further. Having Devs come out so fast afterward (Completely forgot about that) reafirms my point that they are not trying to hype. Get fans riled up and excited yes, exagerate and mislead... no. 

This is just a general response to your point and I am not saying you believe they are hyping specifically.

Originally posted by itgrowls

Originally posted by TheRealAMC

Originally posted by itgrowls

Originally posted by TheRealAMC

So, to close things up, I will ask you a question. Will Guild Wars 2 pass or fail based on it's quality, or will Guild Wars 2 pass or fail because it has or hasn't met the often demanding expecations of a "massive" playerbase? My personal feelings are that this game will have the quality, but ArenaNet needs to expect the worse if it's players are expection the holy grail of gaming out of the Bellevue  based company many have come to love. 

-Hoping for a good first thread post, and future work as a gaming blogger/journalist. (:

Simple answer, it already has delivered both on the promises made by the developers to the fans and undecided players alike, AND on the quality and features that have been expressed in EVERY VIDEO AND INTERVIEW THE ANET DEVS HAVE EVER TALKED IN. 

So, so long as people don't post nonsense on these forums (like "this games hype is going to kill it" or "the game is full of hype" misrepresenting the facts that the game is well past the hype and into the already delivered stage) then everything should be fine. 

You see there is a big big difference between a game Dev claiming that a game they are making is going to be epic, huge, take over the entire market, destroy all other competitors, and then not deliver like a recent EA game....Ahem (And i DO have the clips to back this up) and a company of a Devs who's goal was to make a great game with features that would cure many of the problems all MMO players have faced throughout mmo history without breaking the game experience (which is all that Arenanet has done from the beginning).

So since it's already been established that it's no longer a mystery what they are doing and it's no longer detrimental to the MMO players, can we actually move on from this type of post and post on things that are actually relevant to the game now? Thanks. :)

I would just like to state that:

1. I did not claim that it's hype would kill it, I said it is a plausible outcome that is up for question, that is why this thread is a question to the replying parties.

 Guild Wars 2: Will Extreme Hype Kill The Game Before It's Time?

The very title of your post claims otherwise. It's not simply a debate as you have painted it, it's yet another implied slander. IMO It's beating a dead horse once again in these forums, now i know you claim to be new, however a simply cursory glance into the forums history will show you how dead this topic is.

2. This is relevent to the game, because we are discussing the game's ability to stand pressure from negative influences, despite it's quality which many of us feel is assured. 

Since this is a dead horse topic it is no longer relevant since all cards have now been successfully placed on the table. Only the launch will show if the game will survive the negativities and the dead horse threads like these coming out of these forums. So posting over and over about this, no matter how you paint the reason why, still doesn't justify the post.

3. I  haven't posted any misrepresenting facts about the game other than that I am trying to define it's combat system and end game in comparison to other popular games. 

 "To put this in other terms, it is quite possible for the game to not live up to the expected hype and despite what quality it may have as a game." Look familiar? Claiming that there is in any way Hype about this game is at this point in time, in the open beta stage with no NDA, misrepresenting facts. Hype =/= what Anet is doing RIGHT NOW with the title which is delivering on all that they have claimed would be in this title. 

With that being said, I'd not have you or anyone insulting or dimenishing the value of a good debate based on your own preferences either, so please be advised to be a little less harsh on this matter. Thank you (:

Oh And for any debate to be meaningful you do have to take a bloody nose or two from people who are pointing out that you are wrong, just because I'm intense doesn't mean I'm wrong about how completely unnecessary this post and posts like it are at this point. The fact remains the only hype they are spreading is not about the game but about why they designed it the way it is by claiming that it was a reaction to a slow and stagnant industry, that game itself has no hype anymore as they have revealed everything they promised as fact right there in your face fact, on video that would stand up in any court of law.

 Funny, first thing I learned in 5th grade grammar was the difference between a statement and a question. "Will Extreme Hype Kill The Game Before It's Time?" "Extreme Hype WILL Kill The Game Before It's Time." Also, what I said wasn't a fact, it was a subjective opinion, as I stated. This is very much a subjective opinion as I am asking you as the posters what you think of the matter. Also, dead horse? Really? The only thing that's ever a dead horse, is a dead horse. Talk about punch in the nose, I'll tell you something right now. As long as this website allows me to post topics like this, I will post them. Your opinion is subjective as well, and I have the ability to not follow your advice. The fact that people ARE willing to debate this discussion means black beauty here is alive and kicking. Now, is there anything you'd like to post that IS relevent to this topic, cause I think barrating others is a dead horse at this point.

 

Originally posted by MMOExposed

 -snip-

This what I wanted somebody to come out and say.

Ps: seriously the quotes on this editor is out of hand. I suggest Somebody from MMORPG.com staff changing the editor tool to something else cause this is getting crazy..

You mean like this?

Anyways, the whole discussion about ray of judgement is sort of pointless as, having played the game yourself, you should already know.  This is because, even if a specific skill has a homing projectile, nearly all of them do not.  This whole debate started *probably* because most people do not know the specific properties of all the skills.  even if we played a guardian with a focus offhand...

lastly, ray of judgement, as far as I can tell, sends a ball of energy bouncing between allies and enemies...it isn't really a projectle in the same sense as other skills...like arrows.

im from the days of gw vs wow on this forums , and it makes me feel really good now that every time someone makes a post that might look like a gw2 flame , it gets completely smashed like a mosquito .

lol

the problem here is that a question is half a statement ... if you make a question that the anser is yes or no , that means there is 50% chance for both.

my wife uses that trick a lot , makes a question when i know that was a order. there is no actual choice.

flame questions get nuked with atomic bombs

now on topic :

this game will be much better then the current hype simply because when the rest of the mortals that didnt play the beta will start playing , the number of good posts, videos , reviews will increase by millions , so the current hype is nothing compared to what is about to come after release.

get ready for a huge guildwars 2 community.

Originally posted by neoteo

im from the days of gw vs wow on this forums , and it makes me feel really good now that every time someone makes a post that might look like a gw2 flame , it gets completely smashed like a mosquito .

lol

the problem here is that a question is half a statement ... if you make a question that the anser is yes or no , that means there is 50% chance for both.

my wife uses that trick a lot , makes a question when i know that was a order. there is no actual choice.

flame questions get nuked with atomic bombs

now on topic :

this game will be much better then the current hype simply because when the rest of the mortals that didnt play the beta will start playing , the number of good posts, videos , reviews will increase by millions , so the current hype is nothing compared to what is about to come after release.

get ready for a huge guildwars 2 community.

 

You say you were here from the GW1 vs WoW days,,,, so do you also remember the argument from GW1 fans that used box sells to compare to WoW back when WoW only had 8million subs? How many total boxes did they sell again? I wonder what percentage of them stayed.

Originally posted by atziluth 

I have asked this before, and I will do it again... Please show where the developers have excessively exagerated the core elements of GW2.

How about pretty much the entire Manifesto Video?

Probably the most clever 5.53 minutes of mmo marketing in the history of the genre, pulling emotional strings by the dozen.

1. Over 1/2 of the video had no commentary (last 3+ minutes, just gameplay). 

2. The ONLY thing in that video that could be construed as exageration is permenant world effects. We simply do not know if that is the case, however it seems unlikely. 

3. Everything else they have either delivered on completely or partially... This being a manifesto... I would say that is an incredibly good records so far without the game even being released.

I'll not bother with your first point because it isn't relevant but the orange bits are very much your own subjective judgement.

Here's the transcript. I'll paint the bits of text how I see them: exagerated bits red and the clever, cliche marketing one liners orange. The yellow bits are debatable as I see them.

Please note that compelling hand gestures and excited, emotionally loaded voices fall away if you just read the text, but they are an essential part of the marketing strategy behind the video.

 

Mike O'Brien: "We founded ArenaNet to innovate, so Guild Wars 2 is our opportunity to question everything, to make a game that defies existing conventions. If you love MMOs, you'll want to check out Guild Wars 2, and if you hate MMOs, you'll really want to check out Guild Wars 2. Guild Wars 2 takes everything you love about Guild Wars 1 and puts it into a persistent world that's got more active combat, a fully-branching, personalized storyline, a new event system to get people playing together, and still no monthly fees."

 

Daniel Dociu: "The look of Guild Wars 2 is stylized. We're going for a painterly, illustrated aesthetic. Everything in our world feels handcrafted and artisanal. We treat our environments as if they are characters themselves."

 

Colin Johanson: "When you look at the art in our game, you say 'Wow, that's visually stunning. I've never seen anything like that before,' and then when you play the combat in our game, you say 'Wow, that's incredible. I've never seen anything like that.' In most games, you go out, and you have really fun tasks, occasionally, that you get to do, and the rest of the game is this boring grind to get to the fun stuff. 'I swung a sword. I swung a sword again. Hey! I swung it again.' That's great. We just don't want players to grind in Guild Wars 2. No one enjoys that. No one finds it fun. We want to change the way that people view combat."

 

Ree Soesbee: "As a structure, the MMO has lost the ability to make the player feel like a hero. Everybody around you is doing the same thing you are doing. The boss you just killed respawns ten minutes later. It doesn't care that I'm there."

 

Colin Johanson: "You'll get quest text that tells you 'I'm being attacked by these horrible things,' and it's not actually happening. In the game world, these horrible centaurs are standing around in a field, and you get a quest step that says 'Go kill ten centaurs.' We don't think that's OK. You see what's happening. You see centaurs running to the trading post, knocking the walls down, burning and killing the merchants."

 

Ree Soesbee: "We do not want to build the same MMO everyone else is building, and in Guild Wars 2, it's your world. It's your story. You affect things around you in a very permanent way."

 

Colin Johanson: "Cause and effect: A single decision made by a player cascades out in a chain of events."

 

Ree Soesbee: "You're meeting new people whom you will then see again. You're rescuing a village that will stay rescued, who then remember you. The most important thing in any game should be the player. We have built a game for them."

Originally posted by neoteo

im from the days of gw vs wow on this forums , and it makes me feel really good now that every time someone makes a post that might look like a gw2 flame , it gets completely smashed like a mosquito .

lol

the problem here is that a question is half a statement ... if you make a question that the anser is yes or no , that means there is 50% chance for both.

my wife uses that trick a lot , makes a question when i know that was a order. there is no actual choice.

flame questions get nuked with atomic bombs

now on topic :

this game will be much better then the current hype simply because when the rest of the mortals that didnt play the beta will start playing , the number of good posts, videos , reviews will increase by millions , so the current hype is nothing compared to what is about to come after release.

get ready for a huge guildwars 2 community.

Meh, I don't like flame posts, they make interesting reads. However, I personally love everything about GW2. Not enough to be a fanboy, I love innovation, I love painting,  I love writing stories, and I love good music. What a convenient thing that this game has all of the above when it comes to design elements. I would only flame the developers of the game for bad decisions, the game itself is a true example of every reason why I like video games. Reason why this topic looks like a yes or no question, is because it is a yes or no question, though it actually requires thought to debate this stuff without just jumping the gun. Jumping the gun also includes calling this a dead horse and telling me to proverbally screw off as well, but apparently that's a hard concept to learn in today's society.

---

Originally posted by TheRealAMC

---

Originally posted by neoteo im from the days of gw vs wow on this forums , and it makes me feel really good now that every time someone makes a post that might look like a gw2 flame , it gets completely smashed like a mosquito . lol the problem here is that a question is half a statement ... if you make a question that the anser is yes or no , that means there is 50% chance for both. my wife uses that trick a lot , makes a question when i know that was a order. there is no actual choice. flame questions get nuked with atomic bombs now on topic : this game will be much better then the current hype simply because when the rest of the mortals that didnt play the beta will start playing , the number of good posts, videos , reviews will increase by millions , so the current hype is nothing compared to what is about to come after release. get ready for a huge guildwars 2 community.

---

Meh, I don't like flame posts, they make interesting reads. However, I personally love everything about GW2. Not enough to be a fanboy, I love innovation, I love painting,  I love writing stories, and I love good music. What a convenient thing that this game has all of the above when it comes to design elements. I would only flame the developers of the game for bad decisions, the game itself is a true example of every reason why I like video games. Reason why this topic looks like a yes or no question, is because it is a yes or no question, though it actually requires thought to debate this stuff without just jumping the gun. Jumping the gun also includes calling this a dead horse and telling me to proverbally screw off as well, but apparently that's a hard concept to learn in today's society.

---

my post is a observation of the whole thread and not a finger pointing to the first post.

im surprised that most people on mmorpg.com now protect gw2 with their souls when it used to be wow 7 years ago.

but from the post above yours i can see some wow left overs still here

I also like GW2, but for what it is. I wasnt overhyped about this game, nor any other MMO experience since Warhammer community turned me off, and show me the cause and effect of overhyping. It leads to bad communities, that will defend each and every flaw with whatever argument that places blame on the player instead of developers.

Player: " hey this game is very laggy"
Fanboy " that's not the game fault, that's your PC fault."

Rift player: " hey somebody hacked into my account on my brand new PC"
Fanboy: " that's not Trion's fault, you are just stupid and need to stop looking at porn"

Warhammer player: " hey the animations are poor and glitchy"
Fanboy: " that's not mythics fault, you have a poor PC"

GW2 player: " hey melee isn't balanced to ranged combat in large scale PvE and PvP."
Fanboy: " that's not Anet fault, you just not skilled"

We see this over and over. The overhyped fans, defend games from critisim, which entitled developers with the feeling that their game is perfect and needs no improvements. UO to EQ transition is a key example here. The fanboys defended UO from the PvE players that wanted something different and less gankfest. Nothing happen till EQ came along and topped everything, because the fanboys made that issue into a nonissue in the eyes of developers. Developers eventually made changes. This is why I don't like blind hyped up fanboys in the community, because they will never want to see the game improved, since it's perfect in their eyes.

If I were to ask you to name something wrong with GW2 in their very thread, very few of you would say anything negative about It for fear of community backlash.

I don't fear community backlash, so I speak my mine. I dealt with community like this over on WarhammerAlliance, AoC forum, MMORPG.com, and even Guild Wars 2 guru, and that Inc guild Wars fan forum before the hype of GW2, which I also were banned from. Funny looking back on my old post, most of my predictions came true, but I was called a troll back then.

What I noticed from observing these fanboy behavior, is that there is this hive mind socializing going on, in which anything that seem similar to the enemy is hated, unless it is announced by the developers themselves, than and only then, it's looks like the community jumps up and down overjoyed by the idea. We saw this even in WoW, when the community hated ideas from Warhammer, until Blizzard added them in WoTLK, than it became the greatest idea ever. I won't point out examples of this in GW2, since they are all over the place.

Originally posted by MMOExposed

 What I noticed from observing these fanboy behavior, is that there is this hive mind socializing going on, in which anything that seem similar to the enemy is hated, unless it is announced by the developers themselves, than and only then, it's looks like the community jumps up and down overjoyed by the idea. We saw this even in WoW, when the community hated ideas from Warhammer, until Blizzard added them in WoTLK, than it became the greatest idea ever. I won't point out examples of this in GW2, since they are all over the place.

You know, it's not always the same people hating one thing and then liking another.

I like what I like.  I've pointed out things I don't like about what GW2 does now (I miss sidekicking up, and I really hope they make server guesting as pain/cost free as possible).

But I like what I like.  If I don't like a feature in one game, that doesnt' mean I magically like it in another.

Lots of people are like that.  They pick something they like, and they just look for a game that appeals to what they want.

The idea that the community is some sort of weird amorphous drone mind is sort of insulting. :(

Originally posted by MMOExposed
I also like GW2, but for what it is. I wasnt overhyped about this game, nor any other MMO experience since Warhammer community turned me off, and show me the cause and effect of overhyping. It leads to bad communities, that will defend each and every flaw with whatever argument that places blame on the player instead of developers.

Player: " hey this game is very laggy"
Fanboy " that's not the game fault, that's your PC fault."

Rift player: " hey somebody hacked into my account on my brand new PC"
Fanboy: " that's not Trion's fault, you are just stupid and need to stop looking at porn"

Warhammer player: " hey the animations are poor and glitchy"
Fanboy: " that's not mythics fault, you have a poor PC"

GW2 player: " hey melee isn't balanced to ranged combat in large scale PvE and PvP."
Fanboy: " that's not Anet fault, you just not skilled"

We see this over and over. The overhyped fans, defend games from critisim, which entitled developers with the feeling that their game is perfect and needs no improvements. UO to EQ transition is a key example here. The fanboys defended UO from the PvE players that wanted something different and less gankfest. Nothing happen till EQ came along and topped everything, because the fanboys made that issue into a nonissue in the eyes of developers. Developers eventually made changes. This is why I don't like blind hyped up fanboys in the community, because they will never want to see the game improved, since it's perfect in their eyes.

If I were to ask you to name something wrong with GW2 in their very thread, very few of you would say anything negative about It for fear of community backlash.

I don't fear community backlash, so I speak my mine. I dealt with community like this over on WarhammerAlliance, AoC forum, MMORPG.com, and even Guild Wars 2 guru, and that Inc guild Wars fan forum before the hype of GW2, which I also were banned from. Funny looking back on my old post, most of my predictions came true, but I was called a troll back then.

What I noticed from observing these fanboy behavior, is that there is this hive mind socializing going on, in which anything that seem similar to the enemy is hated, unless it is announced by the developers themselves, than and only then, it's looks like the community jumps up and down overjoyed by the idea. We saw this even in WoW, when the community hated ideas from Warhammer, until Blizzard added them in WoTLK, than it became the greatest idea ever. I won't point out examples of this in GW2, since they are all over the place.

AWWWWWWW YEEEAAAA another irrelivant post to make your point across why you do not like the game .. =P

 

Amazing.. I love them keep them coming.

Originally posted by Meowhead

Originally posted by MMOExposed

 What I noticed from observing these fanboy behavior, is that there is this hive mind socializing going on, in which anything that seem similar to the enemy is hated, unless it is announced by the developers themselves, than and only then, it's looks like the community jumps up and down overjoyed by the idea. We saw this even in WoW, when the community hated ideas from Warhammer, until Blizzard added them in WoTLK, than it became the greatest idea ever. I won't point out examples of this in GW2, since they are all over the place.

You know, it's not always the same people hating one thing and then liking another.

I like what I like.  I've pointed out things I don't like about what GW2 does now (I miss sidekicking up, and I really hope they make server guesting as pain/cost free as possible).

But I like what I like.  If I don't like a feature in one game, that doesnt' mean I magically like it in another.

Lots of people are like that.  They pick something they like, and they just look for a game that appeals to what they want.

The idea that the community is some sort of weird amorphous drone mind is sort of insulting. :(

 

May b insulting, when you think about it, but that's how the real world works. You can say things in a political correct manner, or you can be straight forward about it, like I am, since I am not afraid of backlash on a site like this.

Originally posted by sammyeli

Originally posted by MMOExposed
I also like GW2, but for what it is. I wasnt overhyped about this game, nor any other MMO experience since Warhammer community turned me off, and show me the cause and effect of overhyping. It leads to bad communities, that will defend each and every flaw with whatever argument that places blame on the player instead of developers.

Player: " hey this game is very laggy"
Fanboy " that's not the game fault, that's your PC fault."

Rift player: " hey somebody hacked into my account on my brand new PC"
Fanboy: " that's not Trion's fault, you are just stupid and need to stop looking at porn"

Warhammer player: " hey the animations are poor and glitchy"
Fanboy: " that's not mythics fault, you have a poor PC"

GW2 player: " hey melee isn't balanced to ranged combat in large scale PvE and PvP."
Fanboy: " that's not Anet fault, you just not skilled"

We see this over and over. The overhyped fans, defend games from critisim, which entitled developers with the feeling that their game is perfect and needs no improvements. UO to EQ transition is a key example here. The fanboys defended UO from the PvE players that wanted something different and less gankfest. Nothing happen till EQ came along and topped everything, because the fanboys made that issue into a nonissue in the eyes of developers. Developers eventually made changes. This is why I don't like blind hyped up fanboys in the community, because they will never want to see the game improved, since it's perfect in their eyes.

If I were to ask you to name something wrong with GW2 in their very thread, very few of you would say anything negative about It for fear of community backlash.

I don't fear community backlash, so I speak my mine. I dealt with community like this over on WarhammerAlliance, AoC forum, MMORPG.com, and even Guild Wars 2 guru, and that Inc guild Wars fan forum before the hype of GW2, which I also were banned from. Funny looking back on my old post, most of my predictions came true, but I was called a troll back then.

What I noticed from observing these fanboy behavior, is that there is this hive mind socializing going on, in which anything that seem similar to the enemy is hated, unless it is announced by the developers themselves, than and only then, it's looks like the community jumps up and down overjoyed by the idea. We saw this even in WoW, when the community hated ideas from Warhammer, until Blizzard added them in WoTLK, than it became the greatest idea ever. I won't point out examples of this in GW2, since they are all over the place.

AWWWWWWW YEEEAAAA another irrelivant post to make your point across why you do not like the game .. =P

 

Amazing.. I love them keep them coming.

P.S guys he speaks his "mine" therefore he is right =P 

 

Originally posted by MMOExposed

 

May b insulting, when you think about it, but that's how the real world works. You can say things in a political correct manner, or you can be straight forward about it, like I am, since I am not afraid of backlash on a site like this.

Well, yeah, I wouldn't be if I were you, you end up in getting so many people with temporary bans, why WOULD you be afraid? :D

Anyway, speaking your mind and being rude doesn't assure that you're correct, it just assures that you're opinionated and rude.  I'm sure you'd like to think you're right, but don't we all?

---

Originally posted by MMOExposed
I also like GW2, but for what it is. I wasnt overhyped about this game, nor any other MMO experience since Warhammer community turned me off, and show me the cause and effect of overhyping. It leads to bad communities, that will defend each and every flaw with whatever argument that places blame on the player instead of developers.

Player: " hey this game is very laggy"

Fanboy " that's not the game fault, that's your PC fault."

Rift player: " hey somebody hacked into my account on my brand new PC"

Fanboy: " that's not Trion's fault, you are just stupid and need to stop looking at porn"

Warhammer player: " hey the animations are poor and glitchy"

Fanboy: " that's not mythics fault, you have a poor PC"

GW2 player: " hey melee isn't balanced to ranged combat in la

rge scale PvE and PvP."

Fanboy: " that's not Anet fault, you just not skilled"

We see this over and over. The overhyped fans, defend games from critisim, which entitled developers with the feeling that their game is perfect and needs no improvements. UO to EQ transition is a key example here. The fanboys defended UO from the PvE players that wanted something different and less gankfest. Nothing happen till EQ came along and topped everything, because the fanboys made that issue into a nonissue in the eyes of developers. Developers eventually made changes. This is why I don't like blind hyped up fanboys in the community, because they will never want to see the game improved, since it's perfect in their eyes.

If I were to ask you to name something wrong with GW2 in their very thread, very few of you would say anything negative about It for fear of community backlash.

I don't fear community backlash, so I speak my mine. I dealt with community like this over on WarhammerAlliance, AoC forum, MMORPG.com, and even Guild Wars 2 guru, and that Inc guild Wars fan forum before the hype of GW2, which I also were banned from. Funny looking back on my old post, most of my predictions came true, but I was called a troll back then.

What I noticed from observing these fanboy behavior, is that there is this hive mind socializing going on, in which anything that seem similar to the enemy is hated, unless it is announced by the developers themselves, than and only then, it's looks like the community jumps up and down overjoyed by the idea. We saw this even in WoW, when the community hated ideas from Warhammer, until Blizzard added them in WoTLK, than it became the greatest idea ever. I won't point out examples of this in GW2, since they are all over the place.

---

you just explained better what i feel about hype on forums

i also am a troll and a fanboy , i know i am and do it on purpose , just like when you go to a soccer game you live the fanboyism experience to the limit until you dont have voice for screaming during 90 minutes.

i did play the beta and i did many negative reports everytime they asked me for one.

i think anet already knows how to deal with large communities ... at least it seams like they are much more mature dealing with millions of people then when the first guild wars came out.

the hype and flame wars on this forums is just hilarious

its good to read when you are bored :)

Originally posted by sammyeli

Originally posted by MMOExposed
I also like GW2, but for what it is. I wasnt overhyped about this game, nor any other MMO experience since Warhammer community turned me off, and show me the cause and effect of overhyping. It leads to bad communities, that will defend each and every flaw with whatever argument that places blame on the player instead of developers.

Player: " hey this game is very laggy"
Fanboy " that's not the game fault, that's your PC fault."

Rift player: " hey somebody hacked into my account on my brand new PC"
Fanboy: " that's not Trion's fault, you are just stupid and need to stop looking at porn"

Warhammer player: " hey the animations are poor and glitchy"
Fanboy: " that's not mythics fault, you have a poor PC"

GW2 player: " hey melee isn't balanced to ranged combat in large scale PvE and PvP."
Fanboy: " that's not Anet fault, you just not skilled"

We see this over and over. The overhyped fans, defend games from critisim, which entitled developers with the feeling that their game is perfect and needs no improvements. UO to EQ transition is a key example here. The fanboys defended UO from the PvE players that wanted something different and less gankfest. Nothing happen till EQ came along and topped everything, because the fanboys made that issue into a nonissue in the eyes of developers. Developers eventually made changes. This is why I don't like blind hyped up fanboys in the community, because they will never want to see the game improved, since it's perfect in their eyes.

If I were to ask you to name something wrong with GW2 in their very thread, very few of you would say anything negative about It for fear of community backlash.

I don't fear community backlash, so I speak my mine. I dealt with community like this over on WarhammerAlliance, AoC forum, MMORPG.com, and even Guild Wars 2 guru, and that Inc guild Wars fan forum before the hype of GW2, which I also were banned from. Funny looking back on my old post, most of my predictions came true, but I was called a troll back then.

What I noticed from observing these fanboy behavior, is that there is this hive mind socializing going on, in which anything that seem similar to the enemy is hated, unless it is announced by the developers themselves, than and only then, it's looks like the community jumps up and down overjoyed by the idea. We saw this even in WoW, when the community hated ideas from Warhammer, until Blizzard added them in WoTLK, than it became the greatest idea ever. I won't point out examples of this in GW2, since they are all over the place.

AWWWWWWW YEEEAAAA another irrelivant post to make your point across why you do not like the game .. =P

 

Amazing.. I love them keep them coming.

 

Didn't you just call me a troll in another thread,, so what are you doing here in this quote?

Also note, at the top I actually say I like the game. Just not going to overhype something like this, which is in fact being overhyped like each and everyother big named AAA MMO has been.

I look at things from a realistic point of view. How will GW2 hold player population numbers? Something that even other AAA MMO been having trouble with. I know nobody like the GW1 references, but, hey that game was a ghost town before GW2 hype, lead to mass population grinding out HoM for GW2. Look at the recent marketing attempt by Anet for saving character names. You have to play GW1.

Originally posted by DarkPony

Mike O'Brien: "We founded ArenaNet to innovate, so Guild Wars 2 is our opportunity to question everything, to make a game that defies existing conventions. If you love MMOs, you'll want to check out Guild Wars 2, and if you hate MMOs, you'll really want to check out Guild Wars 2. Guild Wars 2 takes everything you love about Guild Wars 1 and puts it into a persistent world that's got more active combat, a fully-branching, personalized storyline, a new event system to get people playing together, and still no monthly fees."

 

Well Guild Wars 2 defies existing conventions doens' it? The combat system, the storyline, crafting, traveling, questing they did made changes to what other games did before.

Translation of the phrase in orange: what is to hate in MMOs? Grinding, gear-based PVP, boring kill-10-rats quests. Guild Wars 2 doesn't have any of those that make people HATE MMOs so a game that doesn't have what people hate in MMOs is a game MMO-haters should check out isn't it?

The storyline is indeed branching at least more than in most other games and yes I'm adding single player RPGs as well. At least in Guild Wars 2 you get a fully personalized storyline instead of doing the same things that all others do. If you are a human commoner your storyline is vastly different to a human noble and this is only for the first 10 levels, afterwards other choices in character creation enter the equation providing a totally different experience, you lost a sister or born to unknown parents? Completely different story. You choose to save a friend or prevent the bad guys from poisoning the water supply? You see consequences afterwards, your actions have consequences and we are only at the very first levels, it gets better with the 3 different "orders" you can join that have different agendas and different storylines. I made 2 humans during BWE and never did the same quest/story until level 15.

 

Colin Johanson: "When you look at the art in our game, you say 'Wow, that's visually stunning. I've never seen anything like that before,' and then when you play the combat in our game, you say 'Wow, that's incredible. I've never seen anything like that.' In most games, you go out, and you have really fun tasks, occasionally, that you get to do, and the rest of the game is this boring grind to get to the fun stuff. 'I swung a sword. I swung a sword again. Hey! I swung it again.' That's great. We just don't want players to grind in Guild Wars 2. No one enjoys that. No one finds it fun. We want to change the way that people view combat."

 

Have you ever seen anything like that in an MMO? And don't say TERA, TERA was revealed after the first gameplay of Guild Wars 2 became available. So at the time of that manifesto Guild Wars 2 combat system seemed incredible and original nothing compared to others. Keep in mind how old that video is. There was no TERA back then. No grind in Guild Wars 2 is a proven fact. You must change your view to play the game, you can't play GW2 like another MMO.

 

Ree Soesbee: "As a structure, the MMO has lost the ability to make the player feel like a hero. Everybody around you is doing the same thing you are doing. The boss you just killed respawns ten minutes later. It doesn't care that I'm there."

 

Isn't that true? Everyone is doing the same thing I'm doing while in Guild Wars 2 dynamic events change that. True lots of players will experience similar events but not everyone. Dynamic Events change what you experience, you might make 2 human characters and experience some DEs differently. The big bosses don't respawn on timer, there are SPECIFIC events that must happen in order for bosses to spawn and attack the nearest camp/city/town/fort whatever.

 

Ree Soesbee: "We do not want to build the same MMO everyone else is building, and in Guild Wars 2, it's your world. It's your story. You affect things around you in a very permanent way."

 

That's also true. Your choices in your story affect what happens, how npcs react and talk to you in your personal area, your home district.

Have you even experienced a meta event? Maybe no that's why you put that text in red. There was a lumberyard that was under attack by Skriit, during one of the Dynameic Events they tried to steal some tools scattered around and the players had to defend them, or kill the Skrrit before they get the tools back to their base. When I was there we FAILED. For the next event in the chain we had to get back inside their cave and retreive the tools by either killing skriit or looting some boxes. After we gathered enough the npc created a big bomb and we had to protect him on his way inside the Skriit cave. Then BOOOM the bomb exploded CLOSING THE ENTIRE CAVE AREA. And that didn't respawn. I don't know if it is permanent but the rocks didn't suddenly disappear. So it's TRUE you AFFECT THINGS AROUND YOU IN A VERY PERMANENT WAY.

Same with the waterworks event, if you fail to stop the bandits from poisoning the water supply the water becomes corrupted and Oozes spawn around the place..... Changing what events are available around there

 

Colin Johanson: "Cause and effect: A single decision made by a player cascades out in a chain of events."

 

See above.

 

Ree Soesbee: "You're meeting new people whom you will then see again. You're rescuing a village that will stay rescued, who then remember you. The most important thing in any game should be the player. We have built a game for them."

 

See above. The npcs remember what you did. They remember if you helped bomb the Skrrit cave, they remember if you saved the waterworks from corruption, what more are you asking for?

I apologize for the spoilers in there