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News & Features Discussion  » The Secret World: SWTOR vs. TSW – A Story Comparison

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62 posts found
  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4076

5/12/12 11:49:53 AM#41
Originally posted by jtcgs

Originally posted by elocke

TSW wins this competition in story telling for me, mostly due to style and delivery.  SWTOR just bored me with static camera placement and dull environs.


Sorry but that made no sense...and I dont like SWTOR.


A story cannot be bad because of static camera placement in a dull environment. The one and only thing SWTOR did good was the story, but that is Bioware for you. The fact that the items listed as being bad for SWTOR for you was not even story directed speaks volumns here...just like the article which seems to be trying really hard to find flaws with SWTOR while attempting to trump up TSW while still stating its far more linear and has no choices.


One would think that if you were trying to prove one story was better than the other you would actually be making points about the STORIES and nothing else.


Now I feel dirty for defending SWTOR...

When the story is delivered via visual medium as in the case of movies and video games, the camera placement and environment/setting/world the scenes take place in are EXTREMELY important to the story and enjoyment of said story.

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  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4076

5/12/12 11:54:23 AM#42
Originally posted by rankor2
I hate large story lines myself, I just want action. Kill those people? Ok I don't want to know why. Is it just me or is there to much emphasis on story now? I just want to kill, get rich or die trying. Gw2 looks like I can just play and kill stuff and not give a dam. Then get rewarded after death of many minions.

That's why they make games like Tera.  Perfect for players like yourself who just want combat.  They make games like TSW for players like me who want to get engrossed in a game world via puzzles and tons of exploration and deeeeep combat systems.  GW2 has this too, so not sure why you think GW2 doesn't have story, it does.  TONS of it.

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  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/12/12 12:56:16 PM#43







Originally posted by albaficass














Originally posted by Syllendale











I had ( and am having ) fun with SWTOR still. I am doing betas for TSW now and just simply am loving the game. Just because Funcom had done some things in the past wrong or whatever people are afraid to keep trying things by them even though many of those mistakes dont work there anymore ( hehe ).  But perhaps your right, Im sure they got making cheese right on the first  shot, no mistakes and I bet it was DELICIOUS!!!! ...... Ugh. 









TSW is horrible








bad graphics the yare just that bad








horrible animation 








UNBALANCE pvp








the only good idea is the moder world settings but that will soon be overshadowed by world of darkness















 








are you in closed beta, if so you broke NDA




there is no PVP in this open beta weekend


plus how can it be imbalanced anyway if everyone can spec the same skills?

 





 




 

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/12/12 1:00:42 PM#44

and yes it is "swtor done right"


much like gw2 is "warhammer done right"


 


wether the story is better than swtors story inst the point (though i think its better), the point is TSW isn't all about the story to the detriment of the rest of the game, its not corridor -> cutscene -> corridor -> cutscene -> corridor -> cutscene like some sort of CoD the MMO.


  DrNo172000

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/22/10
Posts: 48

5/12/12 2:43:14 PM#45

I like the story quite a bit (of course I loved Ragnar Tornquist other two games so no suprise there), my only problem is that it actually feels quite awkward that my character just makes funny faces (for me anyway).  I don't even necessarily need choices just a voice would be nice. 


  Goreson

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/11
Posts: 128

5/12/12 4:16:34 PM#46

Originally posted by elocke


Originally posted by jtcgs





Originally posted by elocke




TSW wins this competition in story telling for me, mostly due to style and delivery.  SWTOR just bored me with static camera placement and dull environs.





Sorry but that made no sense...and I dont like SWTOR.




A story cannot be bad because of static camera placement in a dull environment. The one and only thing SWTOR did good was the story, but that is Bioware for you. The fact that the items listed as being bad for SWTOR for you was not even story directed speaks volumns here...just like the article which seems to be trying really hard to find flaws with SWTOR while attempting to trump up TSW while still stating its far more linear and has no choices.




One would think that if you were trying to prove one story was better than the other you would actually be making points about the STORIES and nothing else.




Now I feel dirty for defending SWTOR...



When the story is delivered via visual medium as in the case of movies and video games, the camera placement and environment/setting/world the scenes take place in are EXTREMELY important to the story and enjoyment of said story.



 


Jeeez... you have little clue, do you?


The story in itself remains the story, nothing more, nothing less.


It's the presentation of the story, that takes it beyond that... or makes it fall: a dull storyteller will probably break even the most interesting story but a good one can make even a boring tale fun.


Now, the visual presentation of the cutscenes in SWTOR pretty much sticks to the classic standards of film making... should you be used to 5 sec cutscene sequences, well, I'd actually feel sorry for you.


Now, you also point at the "environment/setting/world"... which frankly I find weird.


The worlds are classic SW, and that goes down to the the looks of the landscapes, the style and feel of the cities, the settlements, even the interior of houses.


Yes, clothing, uniforms, style of technology, diversity of races, presentation of the common people (NPC) all of that seems well enough.


Of course, there could always be a bit more... and yet, if you knew the art of visual presentation you'd know that sometimes less is enough or even more.


So, maybe it is you who just doesn't like what he sees in SWTOR?


 


  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

5/12/12 4:25:42 PM#47
Originally posted by elocke

When the story is delivered via visual medium as in the case of movies and video games, the camera placement and environment/setting/world the scenes take place in are EXTREMELY important to the story and enjoyment of said story.

Tom has a ball (pan left) Tom has a red ball (stop center and pan out to sunsetting over a still lake) Tom has a big red ball (begins to rain softly)...

No, I cannot imagine that any change in camera placement, movement  or setting will make me more interested in Tom or his big red ball.

Again, camera is brought up because the actual topic...the story...cannot be defended. Chewbacca tactics and red herrings...and the fact even the websites article is doing it is a bad sign for the game...can no one actually compare the actual STORYLINE?!?

STORYLINE...

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4076

5/12/12 5:24:20 PM#48
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by elocke

When the story is delivered via visual medium as in the case of movies and video games, the camera placement and environment/setting/world the scenes take place in are EXTREMELY important to the story and enjoyment of said story.

Tom has a ball (pan left) Tom has a red ball (stop center and pan out to sunsetting over a still lake) Tom has a big red ball (begins to rain softly)...

No, I cannot imagine that any change in camera placement, movement  or setting will make me more interested in Tom or his big red ball.

Again, camera is brought up because the actual topic...the story...cannot be defended. Chewbacca tactics and red herrings...and the fact even the websites article is doing it is a bad sign for the game...can no one actually compare the actual STORYLINE?!?

STORYLINE...

I could argue that your analogy of Tom's ball, set to the right music and filmed that way, could be telling a story unto itself.  Reminiscent of games like Journey and Flower.  That's how I see it anyway.  Actual storyline, the genre's are different but let me defend how it's delivered.  

SWTOR - Main class quest (I enjoyed these for the most part, although pacing was thrown off due to being level gated and having to do tons of sidequests that didn't matter to your overall story) , planet quests and general run of the mill sidequests.  None of them interacting with each other, that I could find.   

TSW - Main storyline flavored by your faction, side quests in each zone that, surprise surprise, actually compliment or reflect the main storyline in every way.  That's just the quests that are available in the weekend beta, I believe there are faction quests that aren't turned on yet.

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  scotty899

Novice Member

Joined: 1/01/06
Posts: 173

5/12/12 7:36:15 PM#49

Originally posted by Anthur

Who just came up with the idea that an MMO needs a pre-determined peronal story which in most cases even is 100 % linear ?




They exist in SWTOR, TSW, GW2. Some are more and some are less entertaining. All have in common that you can enjoy them one time at most and they are completely unnecessary in an MMO. Imo these are wasted resources better invested into other features.





 


"other features" are done in mmo's now. bringing in an interactive story is an attempt to help the player level from 1 - cap without feeling a burden of grinding over and over and to actually enjoy the experience.  every mmo is linear if you think about it, everyone is directed to the end state of max level :P  


some may like stories, some may not. TERA has bugger all story compared to TSW and SWTOR, maybe you should give that a crack if you havn't already


  Goreson

Novice Member

Joined: 1/26/11
Posts: 128

5/12/12 8:16:13 PM#50
Originally posted by scotty899

Originally posted by Anthur

Who just came up with the idea that an MMO needs a pre-determined peronal story which in most cases even is 100 % linear ?

They exist in SWTOR, TSW, GW2. Some are more and some are less entertaining. All have in common that you can enjoy them one time at most and they are completely unnecessary in an MMO. Imo these are wasted resources better invested into other features. 

"other features" are done in mmo's now. bringing in an interactive story is an attempt to help the player level from 1 - cap without feeling a burden of grinding over and over and to actually enjoy the experience.  every mmo is linear if you think about it, everyone is directed to the end state of max level :P  

some may like stories, some may not. TERA has bugger all story compared to TSW and SWTOR, maybe you should give that a crack if you havn't already

I think just about anything that takes away from the "instant gratification" feel of today's MMOs is a step in the right direction. At least for MMORPGs.

I'm sure (or at least I hope) that eventually all those people like Anthur will eventually leave the MMORPGs and just go for MMOIAGwLS (Massively Multiplayer Online Instant Action Game with Levelled Stats).

  TangentPoint

Elite Member

Joined: 2/12/12
Posts: 1095

The "Real Game" begins at character creation.

5/13/12 11:17:44 AM#51

It doesn't surprise me at all to find that the story-telling element in TSW is more interestingly delivered, well voice-acted and and "snappier" (as MikeB put it) than in TOR. That's a stamp of Ragnar Tornquist's involvement; every game that he has a major role in has a similar style. It's one of the main things I was looking forward to from TSW knowing he was involved.


Seems my expectation in that regard won't go unsatisfied.


My philosophy on MMORPGs:

Leveling is what happens while you're playing the rest of the game.

Don't worry about levels. Just play.

  severius

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/10/04
Posts: 1520

5/13/12 12:11:49 PM#52

I would be hesitant to try and compare the stories yet, just because haven't seen the whole thing.  We've seen all of what?  1/10 of 1/3 of the game's story?  And all of this that we've seen is written by how many devs?  Was it just one?  Can you tell from this one how the Illuminati stories will play out or how the next section of the Templar's story?


From what I have seen there have been sparks of creativity, just like in TOR.  And there is mundane crap too, just like TOR.



  sacredfool

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/04/07
Posts: 702

5/13/12 1:23:53 PM#53

Originally posted by severius  1/10 of 1/3 of the game's story?  

The closed beta is about 1/10th from what I am told (It's only 1 out of 8 zones, and the starter zone too).


Lets just hope it's not another Tortage. 



Originally posted by nethaniah

Seriously Farmville? Yeah I think it's great. In a World where half our population is dying of hunger the more fortunate half is spending their time harvesting food that doesn't exist.


  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

5/13/12 3:12:13 PM#54

Originally posted by elocke

I could argue that your analogy of Tom's ball, set to the right music and filmed that way, could be telling a story unto itself.  Reminiscent of games like Journey and Flower.  That's how I see it anyway.  Actual storyline, the genre's are different but let me defend how it's delivered.  


SWTOR - Main class quest (I enjoyed these for the most part, although pacing was thrown off due to being level gated and having to do tons of sidequests that didn't matter to your overall story) , planet quests and general run of the mill sidequests.  None of them interacting with each other, that I could find.   


TSW - Main storyline flavored by your faction, side quests in each zone that, surprise surprise, actually compliment or reflect the main storyline in every way.  That's just the quests that are available in the weekend beta, I believe there are faction quests that aren't turned on yet.



 


1. Thank you for a mostly direct refute.


2. The point still stands that the placement of camera or what is happening off in the distance does not in fact change a story in a game. If the story is about Tom and his ball, no angle is going to change what the story is about.


3. You purposfully worded SWTORs sidequests differently to make them sound like they are not like TWSs side quests when in fact they are. The non-main story quests which BTW have nothing to do with the topic of storylines, are as tied in to the location as TSWs are...even the mundain kill quests...example, on Coruscant you are sent to the Old Galatic Market sector to stop a gang that is holding it hostage for the money they loaned to get someone elected, every single side quest, even the kill x amount of gang members are tied into what is happening in that sector. You sure arent sent to kill 20 boars on that planet sized city. Also you listed faction based storyline as a point as if SWTORs storylines are not faction based...


4. You gave a long refute filled with reasons...not tied to the main story...while quoting me asking if anyone can actually talk about the MAIN STORYLINES...so again, right back to the main issue...this topic states storyline comparissons yet doesnt do it...it would seem no one is capable.


“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  bbbmmmlll

Novice Member

Joined: 10/16/09
Posts: 79

5/13/12 8:47:01 PM#55

The SWTOR main story lines didn't impress me. The Replublic stories just seemed kind of silly - like finding the special potion to save the sick Jedi. Or out of place - a room of much higher level NPC Jedi's need my help to run two minutes away and clear an area? I guess the story lines always seemed at odds with what was actually going on with the world.  Doesn't help that in almost all cases the dialog wheel is just an illusion of choice.


I've only played TSW for eight hours and the main story line seems more engrossing so far. The Templar building was a bit weak, but once I got to the first starter zone I was enjoying it and never once had to suspend belief. Everything seemed to fit together nicely and I much prefer the cut scenes over a faux dialog wheel.


  eddieg50

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/22/05
Posts: 1473

5/13/12 8:58:59 PM#56

   I am happy to see TSW going the story route , although it is an adventure game also. swtor presented a very polished prefessional production with their story telling and although TSW production is not as good they have a wider variety of quests, both games tend to feel like single player games with mmo kind of tacked on but the great thing about mmo's is they can be changable so tsw looks very interesting at this point.  You will need a good system to play at high or ultra settings.

  TheDor

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 85

5/14/12 10:01:51 AM#57
Hold on, are you trying to say that Funcom made a story based game better than Bioware? That's the most ridiculous thing I've read in a while.
SW:TOR:
Fully voiced player character
Dialog options
8 full story lines
Cinematics that don’t look like a 5 year old animated them
Every quest has a cinematic and voice

TSW:
Player has no voice options, never says a peep during the entire game
No dialog options
3 story lines
Terrible quality cinematics (animation, textures, voice work)
Only the main story line and the primary adventure quests have cinematics and voice work


How is this even a comparison? TSW has literally 1/5 the story that SWTOR has. And, what story does exist, is terribly animated, textured, and voiced. People, go watch some youtube videos of TSW character's eyeballs rotating out of their heads during cinematics.

  CazNeerg

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/04
Posts: 2220

"So, Lone Star, now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb." Dark Helmet

5/14/12 2:48:16 PM#58

Both games have well written stories, but both are also very flawed.  TOR is flawed in the sense that most of it's story content is shared, so in order to see all of the portion that is actually fun you have to engage in massive amounts of repetition of the least interesting content.  It also has the problem of being limited to the rather puritanical standards of LucasArts in what they will allow in their stories.  PG < R when it comes to stories.


The most glaring flaw in TSW is that your character isn't even really a character, just an avatar for hanging equipment on.  He doesn't participate in the story on any level, he simply observes it.  The overall high quality and maturity of the story makes it that much more glaring how unfinished it feels when the character you play is revealed to be nothing but a set of pixels with no impact on or relevance to the game world.


Combine the BioWare focus on character and choice with TSW's focus on adult themes and interesting plot/setting, and *that* would be a truly awesome game.  As things stand, each game is a great example of where the other could use substantial improvement.  (And both blow the truly, truly terrible writing in GW2 out of the water.  Not that that is saying much.)


Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/14/12 3:15:11 PM#59
Originally posted by TheDor
Hold on, are you trying to say that Funcom made a story based game better than Bioware? That's the most ridiculous thing I've read in a while.
SW:TOR:
Fully voiced player character
Dialog options <- meaningless dialog options, that if you want to game the system have you constantly making all the Goodie choices or all the baddie choices otherwise you miss out on stuff
8 full story lines
Cinematics that don’t look like a 5 year old animated them
Every quest has a cinematic and voice

TSW:
Player has no voice options, never says a peep during the entire game  <- I like this, give me gordon freeman / skyrim style anyday, i find it massively imersion breaking when "I" talk with an american accent
No dialog options
3 story lines
Terrible quality cinematics (animation, textures, voice work) - a lie, vastly superior graphics to swtor - except for the shoddy jump animation and "impact" animations, in cutscenes no way does swtors "clone wars" look look better.  Voice is better too in tsw imo.
Only the main story line and the primary adventure quests have cinematics and voice work <-A bonus, we dont need 10 minutes of basildon exposition to go kill 10 whomp rats, n ot that tsw has a lot of those old fashioned wow quests anyway


How is this even a comparison? TSW has literally 1/5 the story that SWTOR has. And, what story does exist, is terribly animated, textured, and voiced. People, go watch some youtube videos of TSW character's eyeballs rotating out of their heads during cinematics.

the best comparison is - TSW manages to do the story thing while actually being a proper fully fledged MMO, not some sprpg with a chat room and the ocasional bit of coop in dungeons.  Shock horror you can actually go off and explore and find quests to do rather than just going up and down corridors or corridors disguised as mountain ranges or swamps or whatever.

  musicmann

Novice Member

Joined: 12/25/05
Posts: 1122

5/14/12 3:21:58 PM#60
Originally posted by Anthur

Who just came up with the idea that an MMO needs a pre-determined peronal story which in most cases even is 100 % linear ?


They exist in SWTOR, TSW, GW2. Some are more and some are less entertaining. All have in common that you can enjoy them one time at most and they are completely unnecessary in an MMO. Imo these are wasted resources better invested into other features.

I completely agree. While i was impressed with the quest setup, when a cutscene happened it really took me out of the moment so to speak.

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