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TERA: Rising

TERA 

General Discussion  » The Battle between GW2 and TERA

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57 posts found
  Bigbadwlf

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/21/12
Posts: 109

5/03/12 1:57:57 PM#41

I am playing on EU, so no, you are mistaken.

My reference is not directed at the OP directly, but just an overall forum observation.

  VikingGamer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/08/10
Posts: 1253

The strong are sometimes wrong but the weak are never free.

5/03/12 1:59:48 PM#42
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
Originally posted by VikingGamer
Originally posted by Puremallace
Originally posted by Alot

Rift stands no chance against any of the upcoming MMORPGs. It is simply too small and traditional to do any damage whatsoever.

I literally have a hard on waiting for the sheer reality of the fact that 5 mans as end game are a complete joke and ANYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYy competitive guild on this planet already realizes this.

 

Tera and GW2 are pvp games. Tera has a sub fee and pvp'rs are cheap as they come, so automatically it will fail. GW2 has no pve end game worth mentioning and WvW has no reward anyone cares about. Also pvp'rs are extremely unloyal so they will end up back in LoL anyways.

You mean fail like how EVE failed? It has a monthly fee and I hear it has a little bit of PvP.  (sarcasm off)

 

You cannot compare EVE Online to TERA Online... at all. I already made several posts on this, but I guess one more time doesn't hurt. EVE Online does use a P2P business model and has been quite successful. It has been able to grow throughout the years and come out with 15 mini/major expansions. But then take a look at the landscape of MMORPGs. There is only 1 maybe 2 games at best out the 600 or so that can directly compete with EVE Online. They have way more breathing room than TERA does.
 
 
If you look at the history of MMORPG games (especially the theme park P2P based whether medieval or fantasy or futuristic) that follow the typical formula (with maybe adding 1 new major: or relatively new addition) you will see this is clearly not the case. Post 2005 the P2P model for these types of games have decreased, and rapidly so post 2009. From 2010 till now only 5 games were released as a P2P model. Many games in turn have converted to hybrid or F2P models because they cannot sustain their initial business venture.
 
 
Even in one of my posts in this very thread I talked about half a dozen other AAA titles and/or hyped up games to show as examples that are upcoming. Not to be rude or anything but this is like the dozen times folks have compared (or have tried to in some shape or form) compare theme park games to EVE Online. I am not even sure how this is possible.

I didn't claim that Tera was anything like Eve and it doesn't need to be for it to serve as a counter example. A pvp game with a sub fee does not equal automatic fail.

All die, so die well.
Join SOLA in ArcheAge.

  Panther2103

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/09/08
Posts: 2066

5/03/12 2:02:19 PM#43
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor

Oh and I must of said the following at least a dozen times, but I guess a 13th time... doesn't hurt.

 

A. Yes we already know you don't need 12 million or 6 million or 3 million folks to keep a P2P model successful, but you need a considerable amount and more importantly one that stays for the long haul and not have a mass exodus in 3 or 6 months.

 

B. There is nothing wrong with a niche game, but if it becomes too niche it can and will hurt the P2P business model which eventually results into having barren servers and forcing it to become F2P (and in most cases P2W) down the road.

 

Ok with those 2 things out of the way, here are the populations charts. Note that they were taken around 11:30 pm EST (9:30 pm PST) on Sunday. Note the numbers I posted as caps for BHS and NHN which I posted above as well as what I talked about Aion.

 

As you can see there are 11 servers, but only 2 shows as highly populated, 2 as moderately populated, while the rest can probably be considered light. Note also that some folks have already hit level cap... yesterday.

EDIT: You have to scroll at the bottom of the post or open the picture to see the whole thing.

 

 

For Guild Wars 2 we had the following server list:

 

Anvil Rock
Borlis Pass
Yak’s Bend
Henge of Denravi
Maguuma
Sorrow’s Furnace
Kaineng
Jade Quarry
Fort Aspenwood
Ehmry Bay
Ferguson’s Crossing
Darkhaven
Vasburg
Eredon Terrace
Crystal Desert
Tarnished Coast
Steamspur Mountains
Blazeridge Mountains
Isle of Janthir
Sea of Sorrows
Deldrimor
Scavenger’s Causeway
Moladune
Eternal Grove

 

At the same time with TERA, roughly 2/3 of the Guild Wars 2 servers were listed as high and roughly 1/3 were listed as light in populations. Note that this was the first beta weekend that was not under the NDA. I did not include the European servers because I don't think I had access to them, I don't recall if we did, but I was told they had 2 dozen servers.

The thing about the Tera server populations is it is completely incorrect. It is purely based off of the amount of characters created. Not logged in. Which is why you will see a medium population with a queue but a full without one. All of the servers have a decent amount of people, the pvp being the most full. My server always has a ton of people logged in and I have had no issues finding groups for any of the content so far (level 33).

  VikingGamer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/08/10
Posts: 1253

The strong are sometimes wrong but the weak are never free.

5/03/12 2:15:58 PM#44
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
/snip   HUGE SCREENIE IS HUGE.

At the same time with TERA, roughly 2/3 of the Guild Wars 2 servers were listed as high and roughly 1/3 were listed as light in populations. Note that this was the first beta weekend that was not under the NDA. I did not include the European servers because I don't think I had access to them, I don't recall if we did, but I was told they had 2 dozen servers.

I am on Celestial Hills and if CH is one of the lightly populated servers then I wouldn't have noticed it for all the people on it. From the inside it looks packed, people everywhere, sometimes competing for quest mobs and so on. Also, there are a bunch of channels running for these zones.

Just because one game has servers that say Heavy population and other game has servers that say Medium population or Light doesn't mean a comparison can be made. Non of these companies reveal the actual numbers and server capacity thresholds. (except for Eve)

All die, so die well.
Join SOLA in ArcheAge.

  Panther2103

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/09/08
Posts: 2066

5/03/12 2:24:26 PM#45
Originally posted by VikingGamer
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
/snip   HUGE SCREENIE IS HUGE.

At the same time with TERA, roughly 2/3 of the Guild Wars 2 servers were listed as high and roughly 1/3 were listed as light in populations. Note that this was the first beta weekend that was not under the NDA. I did not include the European servers because I don't think I had access to them, I don't recall if we did, but I was told they had 2 dozen servers.

I am on Celestial Hills and if CH is one of the lightly populated servers then I wouldn't have noticed it for all the people on it. From the inside it looks packed, people everywhere, sometimes competing for quest mobs and so on. Also, there are a bunch of channels running for these zones.

Just because one game has servers that say Heavy population and other game has servers that say Medium population or Light doesn't mean a comparison can be made. Non of these companies reveal the actual numbers and server capacity thresholds. (except for Eve)

Yeah the main difference is, most companies list the light, medium, and heavy on what their server capacity is, and Tera lists it based off of total characters on the server. My server (Jagged Coast) was locked for character creation, but it had no queue, while basilisk crag had a queue and a medium population. It's an odd system.

  AmbrosiaAmor

Elite Member

Joined: 11/24/10
Posts: 805

5/03/12 2:29:24 PM#46
Originally posted by holdenhamlet

You do realize that all of the MMO flops since WoW started with tons of highly populated servers, right?

They all followed the same pattern.  Tons of hype before release, tons of bitching at release when people realize it doesn't live up to the hype, and then a dramatic decline in subs.

If anything TERA has an advantage because the game was not hyped here, so it doesn't have to live up to anything.

 

I do agree that hype is part of the problem. But I think there is one underlying problem that companies continue to make and that is using the typical basic ingredients over and over again and tag on the P2P model which has become quite unpopular in recent years. And you are correct that the majority of the P2P games do eventually flop and either close shop or quickly go the F2P with the P2W route. I will list it here, note I made the post below on another thread:

 

I think "One" of the main problems are the ingredients used in a MMORPG title: especially for 2012-2013 and beyond.


If you add the following ingredients (especially for a large company having a team of 150-200-300 or more):

1A. P2P model or 1B. P2P model with cash shop.

2A. EverQuest I/II/WoW clone or 2B. Lineage I/II/Aion clone (Clone being defined here as taking 90% or more and making it virtually the same with subtle differences). Nothing wrong with having "some" familiarity, but you need to separate yourself from the pack unless you are an indie company.

3. Going the theme park: extremely overused route [medieval fantasy or futuristic fantasy] MMO instead of going the sand park route.

4. Generic endgame content.

5. (Optional) Bring in maybe 1 brand new thing to the table (or a feature rarely used by other online games).


If you add all that up you will have a product that will most likely fail in the long run, especially if it follows a P2P model. It reeks of the been-there-done-that. And the majority of the people leave these types of theme park MMO games in under 6 months (fatal for P2P companies that employ a large team) since it needs a considerable amount of revenue to keep them P2P. Hence the flavor-of-the-month.

  User Deleted
5/03/12 2:29:30 PM#47
Originally posted by Panther2103
Originally posted by VikingGamer
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
/snip   HUGE SCREENIE IS HUGE.

At the same time with TERA, roughly 2/3 of the Guild Wars 2 servers were listed as high and roughly 1/3 were listed as light in populations. Note that this was the first beta weekend that was not under the NDA. I did not include the European servers because I don't think I had access to them, I don't recall if we did, but I was told they had 2 dozen servers.

I am on Celestial Hills and if CH is one of the lightly populated servers then I wouldn't have noticed it for all the people on it. From the inside it looks packed, people everywhere, sometimes competing for quest mobs and so on. Also, there are a bunch of channels running for these zones.

Just because one game has servers that say Heavy population and other game has servers that say Medium population or Light doesn't mean a comparison can be made. Non of these companies reveal the actual numbers and server capacity thresholds. (except for Eve)

Yeah the main difference is, most companies list the light, medium, and heavy on what their server capacity is, and Tera lists it based off of total characters on the server. My server (Jagged Coast) was locked for character creation, but it had no queue, while basilisk crag had a queue and a medium population. It's an odd system.

Doh! This explains everything. I was like "what you talking bout a queue?". 

I don't follow every single thing :p Just what catches my eye while browsing.

  Wicoa

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/08/07
Posts: 1613

5/03/12 2:42:04 PM#48

There is no battle this is a myth to stir talk of GW2 and quite frankly Im tired of it.  Tera is a launched game, GW2 is a beta game with no official release date.

 

If they released at the same time then sure there would be a battle.  When GW2 launches not only will it have to find a space with Tera it also has to compete with everyother game.

 

To put things in perspective The Secret World will launch before GW2 so will Diablo 3 and so will Torchlight 2 finally when it does launch it will probably have to compete with Mists of Pandaria yeh sure spout crap about WoW below but that won't stop a few million copies being sold by people who will never leave wow.

  rexzshadow

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/02/11
Posts: 1439

5/03/12 3:11:57 PM#49
Originally posted by Wicoa

There is no battle this is a myth to stir talk of GW2 and quite frankly Im tired of it.  Tera is a launched game, GW2 is a beta game with no official release date.

 

If they released at the same time then sure there would be a battle.  When GW2 launches not only will it have to find a space with Tera it also has to compete with everyother game.

 

To put things in perspective The Secret World will launch before GW2 so will Diablo 3 and so will Torchlight 2 finally when it does launch it will probably have to compete with Mists of Pandaria yeh sure spout crap about WoW below but that won't stop a few million copies being sold by people who will never leave wow.

Its funny how this NEVER comes up before the beta. Before it it was all about how much better GW2 is than Tera or other games. And now its all o you can't compare them because GW2 is in beta and Tera is launched. Well maybe people should have thought about it before they compare before and maybe NCSoft should have thought about it when they decide to put GW2 beta on top of Tera head start. and BTW thanks for the players NCSoft.

  Wicoa

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/08/07
Posts: 1613

5/03/12 3:16:09 PM#50
Originally posted by rexzshadow
Originally posted by Wicoa

There is no battle this is a myth to stir talk of GW2 and quite frankly Im tired of it.  Tera is a launched game, GW2 is a beta game with no official release date.

 

If they released at the same time then sure there would be a battle.  When GW2 launches not only will it have to find a space with Tera it also has to compete with everyother game.

 

To put things in perspective The Secret World will launch before GW2 so will Diablo 3 and so will Torchlight 2 finally when it does launch it will probably have to compete with Mists of Pandaria yeh sure spout crap about WoW below but that won't stop a few million copies being sold by people who will never leave wow.

Its funny how this NEVER comes up before the beta. Before it it was all about how much better GW2 is than Tera or other games. And now its all o you can't compare them because GW2 is in beta and Tera is launched. Well maybe people should have thought about it before they compare before and maybe NCSoft should have thought about it when they decide to put GW2 beta on top of Tera head start. and BTW thanks for the players NCSoft.

 

So that we are clear I have never changed my opinion on this and I have never played nor it is likely I will play GW2. If the situation were reversed I would keep the same thought.

I am however a Tera fan.

 

  EvilestTwin

Novice Member

Joined: 3/21/11
Posts: 279

5/03/12 4:26:12 PM#51
Originally posted by Puremallace
Originally posted by Alot

Rift stands no chance against any of the upcoming MMORPGs. It is simply too small and traditional to do any damage whatsoever.

I literally have a hard on waiting for the sheer reality of the fact that 5 mans as end game are a complete joke and ANYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYy competitive guild on this planet already realizes this.

 

Tera and GW2 are pvp games. Tera has a sub fee and pvp'rs are cheap as they come, so automatically it will fail. GW2 has no pve end game worth mentioning and WvW has no reward anyone cares about. Also pvp'rs are extremely unloyal so they will end up back in LoL anyways.

If doing the same 20 man instance raids over and over again for a chance at a rare drop is your idea of good PvE endgame, then yeah....

  Deron_Barak

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/06
Posts: 1139

5/03/12 4:51:59 PM#52
Projected player figures, the validity of the P2P model and who has the best PvP aside I'm finally able to log into TERA on a nightly basis.

I win.

Neener

Neener

Just not worth my time anymore.

  SoulOfRaziel

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/23/06
Posts: 411

5/03/12 4:55:25 PM#53

If u are in the group of people that GW2 dont have end game or pve end game plz try to learn more about it before saying things non sense

  just1opinion

Smart-Alek

Joined: 8/14/07
Posts: 4933

5/03/12 5:13:37 PM#54
Originally posted by Wicoa

There is no battle this is a myth to stir talk of GW2 and quite frankly Im tired of it.  Tera is a launched game, GW2 is a beta game with no official release date.

 

If they released at the same time then sure there would be a battle.  When GW2 launches not only will it have to find a space with Tera it also has to compete with everyother game.

 

To put things in perspective The Secret World will launch before GW2 so will Diablo 3 and so will Torchlight 2 finally when it does launch it will probably have to compete with Mists of Pandaria yeh sure spout crap about WoW below but that won't stop a few million copies being sold by people who will never leave wow.

 

Maybe you should have told your fellow TERA player this before he STARTED this thread.....

 

I care nothing about "battles" unless they're in the game I'm playing.  Battles BETWEEN games are idiotic in my opinion.  Everyone likes whatever game they like and MOST adults aren't going to easily be swayed just because some other person doesn't like the same thing.  What a waste of time reading this thread is.

 

This should be in General Discussion because it's not about TERA, it's about BOTH games.  Having it here just allows for the TERA fans to claim anyone from GW2 camp is "trolling" because we DARE to comment on a thread where our favorite game is mentioned.  But then, the OP has listed that they want to play TERA, so I shouldn't be surprised.  General Discussion (not on the TERA boards) is where it belongs.

 

Movin' on.....

President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

5/03/12 6:10:18 PM#55
Originally posted by Puremallace
Originally posted by Alot

 
"Tera and GW2 are pvp games. Tera has a sub fee and pvp'rs are cheap as they come, so automatically it will fail. GW2 has no pve end game worth mentioning and WvW has no reward anyone cares about. Also pvp'rs are extremely unloyal so they will end up back in LoL anyways."


You generalize too much.

By the way, have you actually read the underlined part? Wow, nice fail you got there.


Noone cares about GW2 or TERA because of the pve. Those games are pvp games to their core. If you look at the guilds playing Tera you would realize this. They are there for a fight and have never care about pve.

 

My only hope is that GW2/Tera put together LITERALLY gut WoW pvp servers, so maybe by some miracle we can catch up to the Koreans in competitive real action pvp.

What, are you insane? GW2's PvE is huge and amazing. There's an estimated 800 to 1000 hrs of PvE gameplay if you actually go through and try to do everything. You're confusing it with GW1, which was primarily PvP, but even they've boosted their PvE to a very nice level.

 

PvP game. Sheesh. People will make up all kinds of crap when they feel like their game is threatened.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

5/03/12 6:14:06 PM#56
Originally posted by VikingGamer
Originally posted by AmbrosiaAmor
/snip   HUGE SCREENIE IS HUGE.

At the same time with TERA, roughly 2/3 of the Guild Wars 2 servers were listed as high and roughly 1/3 were listed as light in populations. Note that this was the first beta weekend that was not under the NDA. I did not include the European servers because I don't think I had access to them, I don't recall if we did, but I was told they had 2 dozen servers.

I am on Celestial Hills and if CH is one of the lightly populated servers then I wouldn't have noticed it for all the people on it. From the inside it looks packed, people everywhere, sometimes competing for quest mobs and so on. Also, there are a bunch of channels running for these zones.

Just because one game has servers that say Heavy population and other game has servers that say Medium population or Light doesn't mean a comparison can be made. Non of these companies reveal the actual numbers and server capacity thresholds. (except for Eve)

Wait, what? You have to compete for quest mobs? You can't work together to get the kills with anyone that passes by with everyone getting full loot and experience?

Dang. I need to sit down. That's wierd.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  DLangley

Novice Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 1430

5/03/12 6:15:39 PM#57

There are enough threads on this topic already.

Locked.

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