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News & Features Discussion  » World of Warcraft: Putting the War Back in Warcraft - Part 2

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60 posts found
  Comaf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/13/10
Posts: 1146

I want an mmorpg where pvp matters, my enemies are not my race or class, and community matters.

4/30/12 10:51:31 PM#41

In 2004 when a lot of us left Dark Age of Camelot for WoW, we were promised quite a bit of WAR in Warcraft.  The vey fact they are  a 2 faction game is a huge handicap.  They could always add a third faction and get some real castle siege warfare on - but that's just  a dream, alas, just a dream.  I did giggle a bit about the "world" pvp dungeon.  Anyone who played DAoC had to, especially since we have Darkness Falls which fits 3 factions of pvp into its design. 


 


Anyway....


  TheHavok

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/13/04
Posts: 2437

"Free crack and everybody gets laid."

4/30/12 10:55:48 PM#42
Originally posted by Onomic

Wow was an awsome game until they started to dumb it down, but that personal preferance.


53 key binds is quite impressive to manage, way more then i will ever do but its a skill im not interested in the slightest.


fps games take skill but you usaly click 8 buttons half of em are the move keys. left,right,up,down,left mouse, right mouse, ctrl/shift to duck. Thats a skill system im way more interested in then mastering my keyboard.


The macro system in wow is a smal cheat, its such an advantage for those that know about it compared to those that has no clue about it.


Like target macro, you can set a macro to switch target to the enemy healer in arena match and cc em with one click of a button. A hugh advantage compared to look around and target em with mouse then use skill.

The macro system in WoW has its fair share of lovers and haters but I wouldn't call it a cheat.  In TBC, it was definitely different, where the macro system was somewhat broken and players could press a single button to do a huge array of commands that would be dictated by the situation they were in (ex: healer uses macro to find if any team member was CC'd, then instantly dispel that CC).  But Blizz fixed the macro system to get rid of these 1-button win capabilites.

The system is there and really picks up the pace of pvp.  Players know to work with it and around it.  For example, healers know that they are always going to be  prime target for CC and on every caster's focus bar (focus bar is like a player's second target bar).  This makes a lot of caster create macros to CC their focus target.  So, healers take extra precaution to line of sight the opposing casters (and DPS in general) and only pop out when need be, with their own mix of CC and CC-interupt abilities at hand.

It really is a pretty complex system of maintaining defensive cooldowns, controlling burst, CC'ing, LOSing, mana/resource efficiency, and many other factors. 

Of course the game still has to cater to a PvE crowd so imbalances arise all the time, but WoW's pvp is at a point where every class is viable and multiple strategies and comps arise all the time.

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 2016

4/30/12 11:03:03 PM#43
I'm tired, so don't really feel like reading through 40 posts to see if this has been covered, but here goes.  What they really need to figure out is how to have open world pvp be meaningful on servers where one side outnumbers the other 2, 3, or even 4 to 1.  Outside of instancing, which makes it no longer open world, how do you have open world pvp with desirable objectives under these conditions?
  Lukain

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/23/06
Posts: 593

4/30/12 11:09:48 PM#44

WOW is not & never will be a PVP game , it became the biggest MMO ever released  for its PVE & storie line  if it had 0 PVP in it it would still be the biggest MMO ever  if you wan't PVP play GW & GW2  thats what there made for  , I don't play WOW for its PvP  & if they released a PVP only expansion it will be the lowest selling of all wow expansions  imho !!

 

GW was such a great PVP game because the developers  wanted to make a PVP game  not a PVE/PVP game  which I think just can't be done right  , GM is not gonna Make a Buick that can be a boat too? so why do a game thats ment to be 2 things .

 

If blizzard wan't to make a WOW pvp title make a new one ..

 

 

 

 

  Seriousblack

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 9

4/30/12 11:10:59 PM#45

Originally posted by Mors.Magne

The only game that I think is better than WoW is Eve Online - most MMORPGs are WoW clones, and WoW is the biggest one.




 




Blizzard should task one dev, who likes world PvP, to sit quietly on his own - in a coffee shop or something - an figure out how to re-introduce world PvP back into WoW.




I'm sure it can be done - but Blizzard needs to keep loud mouth people, who don't really know what they are talking about, well out of the decision making process.




'Team discussions' could easily kill WoW totally, because all you get are the loud people talking.




 




Keep PR / advertising / accountants WELL AWAY from WoW, and then WoW might have a good future once again.





 


Good luck with that. It's a business. PR/ advertising/ accountants are essential.


  MMartian

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/25/10
Posts: 46

4/30/12 11:53:02 PM#46

PvP in general has destroyed MMORPGS.


By this I mean that the vast majority of subscribers are not interested in games where the emphasis is PvP. But having said that most do like the option to PvP if they choose.


WoW has through the competition server and game mechanics to allow them to generally tweak the PvP and PvE balance seperately have found the right balance between PvP and PvE in their game. The current allocation of development resources between PvP and PvE matches the subscriber interest.


As to the recent hype by the PvP crowed about "Open World PvP" in reference to many games, it does not fit into many of the MMORPGs where these people are demanding it so strongly. WoW is sort of one of those games. If open world PvP is missing in WoW on the PvP servers, then I would agree that some work may need to be done by WoW development. But any changes to promote that should not be translated to the PvE servers. My experience ever since classic WoW has been that most that try to engage in "Open World PvP" are mostly interested in greifing the play of low level characters in an area. While this is sort of to be expected on a PvP server, it is very frustrating to those that have no interest in PvP and/or are not high enough level to do anything about the greifers on PvE servers where people play to avoid those situations.


  erikk3189

Novice Member

Joined: 3/31/08
Posts: 310

5/01/12 1:33:47 AM#47

I started making all the reasons why this game sucks but I won't waste my time. But I will add this the game has been watered down to the point only Asian audiences like it as well as the pre-school kids of the USA.


If you still play this game or defend it then you're as bad as the game itself. Either that or you're what blizzard is aiming at, prerschool  diapered kids who are influenced easily.


GAGA!!


  Thoth-Amon

Novice Member

Joined: 4/29/08
Posts: 95

A black land of sorcery and nameless horror

5/01/12 3:24:01 AM#48
they need to put the WOW back in, never mind the WAR! theyve been regurgitating the same stuff for years now. its old. innovate or die.
  raven222

Novice Member

Joined: 2/10/05
Posts: 88

5/01/12 3:42:41 AM#49

I have been a great wow fun and long term player among other games.

But honestly are there people that still believe wow needs skill and is not all about gear.

All u need in wow is top gear and then u can dance around laughing at people as they fail.

I got resurrected last month , got my warlock to level 85 , started grinding gear then quit in a few weeks time.

Is this ur goal more and more gear , more and more grind cause grind it is , u grind raids and dungeons , grind arenas and bgs , then most wow players claim all other games are grinders but wow is not.

I am having the feeling that blizzard gets to u , like smoking malboro for 25 years does , in the end u are so blind that anything they feed u , u consider it to be new and fresh even if it is the same old same old.

I am glad new games are coming , with some new ideas .

Give us the original AV where u could fight it for days , logging the next day to the same av and i will go back.

Today AV is a race to last boss , lasts like 10 minutes , is this PVP or a PVE race, games end and the scores shows 0 player kills for most players great PVP.

Just a few thoughts

 

  User Deleted
5/01/12 4:23:24 AM#50
A pvp dungeon would be interesting. I wonder what the player base would think of that? Though I  think it would be even more interesting to put the entire next tier into a whole series of pvp dungeons.
  Mors.Magne

Novice Member

Joined: 3/02/07
Posts: 1432

5/01/12 4:37:44 AM#51

Originally posted by Netspook


Originally posted by Mors.Magne

The only game that I think is better than WoW is Eve Online - most MMORPGs are WoW clones, and WoW is the biggest one.




 




Blizzard should task one dev, who likes world PvP, to sit quietly on his own - in a coffee shop or something - an figure out how to re-introduce world PvP back into WoW.




I'm sure it can be done - but Blizzard needs to keep loud mouth people, who don't really know what they are talking about, well out of the decision making process.




'Team discussions' could easily kill WoW totally, because all you get are the loud people talking.




 




Keep PR / advertising / accountants WELL AWAY from WoW, and then WoW might have a good future once again.



 


So, you wanna let one single person decide the future of WoW, and the only requirement is that this person likes world PvP?


Thankfully, Blizzard is not that stupid.



 


A couple of weeks ago a study showed that if you want a complex problem solved it's better to have one competent person focusing on it.


'Team decision making' is perfect for pub quizzes when the answers are obvious. However, when questions get more difficult, only the loudest people tend to answer up. The best solutions are normally drowned out.


For example, Albert Einstien pretty much invented the atom bomb - it wasn't really that much of a team effort.


With regard to Blizzard, I can easily imagine a confident PR guy TELLING a dev what to do. I work in PR myself, so I have an insight into this.


  Mors.Magne

Novice Member

Joined: 3/02/07
Posts: 1432

5/01/12 4:47:46 AM#52

Originally posted by Seriousblack




Originally posted by Mors.Magne



The only game that I think is better than WoW is Eve Online - most MMORPGs are WoW clones, and WoW is the biggest one.








 








Blizzard should task one dev, who likes world PvP, to sit quietly on his own - in a coffee shop or something - an figure out how to re-introduce world PvP back into WoW.








I'm sure it can be done - but Blizzard needs to keep loud mouth people, who don't really know what they are talking about, well out of the decision making process.








'Team discussions' could easily kill WoW totally, because all you get are the loud people talking.








 








Keep PR / advertising / accountants WELL AWAY from WoW, and then WoW might have a good future once again.











 




Good luck with that. It's a business. PR/ advertising/ accountants are essential.





 


You want an accountant to design WoW? Really?


  Netspook

Novice Member

Joined: 3/01/07
Posts: 1440

5/01/12 9:58:17 AM#53
Originally posted by Mors.Magne

Originally posted by Netspook


Originally posted by Mors.Magne

The only game that I think is better than WoW is Eve Online - most MMORPGs are WoW clones, and WoW is the biggest one.




 




Blizzard should task one dev, who likes world PvP, to sit quietly on his own - in a coffee shop or something - an figure out how to re-introduce world PvP back into WoW.




I'm sure it can be done - but Blizzard needs to keep loud mouth people, who don't really know what they are talking about, well out of the decision making process.




'Team discussions' could easily kill WoW totally, because all you get are the loud people talking.




 




Keep PR / advertising / accountants WELL AWAY from WoW, and then WoW might have a good future once again.


 


So, you wanna let one single person decide the future of WoW, and the only requirement is that this person likes world PvP?


Thankfully, Blizzard is not that stupid.



 

A couple of weeks ago a study showed that if you want a complex problem solved it's better to have one competent person focusing on it.


'Team decision making' is perfect for pub quizzes when the answers are obvious. However, when questions get more difficult, only the loudest people tend to answer up. The best solutions are normally drowned out.


For example, Albert Einstien pretty much invented the atom bomb - it wasn't really that much of a team effort.


With regard to Blizzard, I can easily imagine a confident PR guy TELLING a dev what to do. I work in PR myself, so I have an insight into this.

 

Letting one single person's tastes and preferances decide the development of any MMO is beyond retarded. Anyone should be able to understand why, just not you, appearently.

You're omparing MMO development with the invention of the a-bomb? Really? If that's the level of "insight" you're using when doing your PR job, then I feel sorry for the company you're working for. But I doubt you're telling the truth, it doesn't seem like you know anything at all about PR.

  echolynfan

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/26/10
Posts: 728

I ain't got a gat but I gotta soldering gun

5/01/12 11:50:43 AM#54

Originally posted by ShakyMo

Doesnt matter what they do. 2 factions, engine that doesn't like lots of players on screen, and massively lob sided existing servers. They should leave pvp to gw2 and ps2 and concentrate on pve imo.

 


Don't know what game you're playing but Blizzard does one thing better than all of the other MMO's out there - it runs well. I don't have a top of the line computer and I get 60fps+ everywhere with settings on good. You can say what you want about Wow but you can't damn their performance.


Currently playing SWTOR and it's MUCH better than it was at launch.

  Seriousblack

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 9

5/01/12 9:31:08 PM#55

Originally posted by Mors.Magne




Originally posted by Seriousblack










Originally posted by Mors.Magne







The only game that I think is better than WoW is Eve Online - most MMORPGs are WoW clones, and WoW is the biggest one.
















 
















Blizzard should task one dev, who likes world PvP, to sit quietly on his own - in a coffee shop or something - an figure out how to re-introduce world PvP back into WoW.
















I'm sure it can be done - but Blizzard needs to keep loud mouth people, who don't really know what they are talking about, well out of the decision making process.
















'Team discussions' could easily kill WoW totally, because all you get are the loud people talking.
















 
















Keep PR / advertising / accountants WELL AWAY from WoW, and then WoW might have a good future once again.























 








Good luck with that. It's a business. PR/ advertising/ accountants are essential.











 




You want an accountant to design WoW? Really?





 


I didn't say it. Pay attention... you did. I have to agree with "spook" on your last comment.


  lady_k7332

Novice Member

Joined: 5/23/09
Posts: 1

5/02/12 2:57:55 AM#56
In the idea of PvE, a system like they used in the ol' JumpGate game might be handy. Maybe even play with a PvP version of it, yeah sure dailys are great, what about something with a shorter timer. Lots of ideas to play with there, maybe having to go through an alliance village as horde to "interogate" a character, a bounty system would be fun, lots of ideas one can mess with really. Just my 2c worth of thought.
  Theocritus

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/15/08
Posts: 3629

5/02/12 10:09:51 AM#57
      I lost interest in WoW just before the Lich King came out....IT sounds like that was about the peak of the game and it has gone downhill ever since...To be honest I dont miss the game one iota
  daltanious

Elite Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1945

5/02/12 11:49:03 AM#58
1 month before release of Swtor I have not seen single video regarding, have not been following at all ... somehow had impression will be disaster like Star Trek. But now Swtor is my best game ever and I can say it took throne over Wow. But wow is stil very close to throne. And my 3rd love for now is Rift. I can barely wait for any expansion of any of this three.
  oldwarlord

Novice Member

Joined: 5/02/12
Posts: 1

5/02/12 4:39:37 PM#59

 


We need something more than just pvp or pve. The only real rewards are some great item or reconition of victory. Sure, these are important to us. Unfortunately thats all we seem to fight for. Theres no real goal. What we need is a final goal, a victory. Something like one side taking a piece of land from the other side. This land has a resource our kingdom/Guild needs. While in our posession we try to build up defences in this teritorry while we aquire as much of this resourse while holding off the enemy. Also, not only do we take the territories which could have harder defenses the closer we get, we could actually take the enemies stronghold and win the game. People do like having high level characters. We also like the quest and challenge of an actual war. A final ending, a long awaited goal will give the people all the great memories they want. Money can be made easilly on such a game. People will pay for many things in such a game and feel the money was well spent. Between the quest, items, weapons, armor , and many other ideals, people of all game types will most likly enjoy such a game.


Another thing that would make a game like this great for me is something like spells and skills or crafts are not just given but quested for. A master  for a spell/skill/craft who tell you what must be done or what is needed to aquire said spell/skill/craft. Each one could be scattered across the territories so that a territory must be either snuck thru or taken to get said spell/skill/craft  


 


  PvPME

Novice Member

Joined: 10/23/07
Posts: 15

"The stupidity of humanity, makes me sick to my stomach."

5/08/12 6:23:32 PM#60

Tarren Mill, owning alliance for a few minutes only see the Alliance pouring in from Southshore and getting overwhelmed. Open world PvP at it's best.  Now that was PVP imo!


Alas, NEVER to be seen again.


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