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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » how is GW2"s combat different from Tera's?

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96 posts found
  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

4/16/12 10:52:46 AM#21

There are some skills in GW2 that require a target to work properly however, that needs to be noted. For example, mesmer spells that create clones or illusions require a target for those illusions to attack, and when that target dies they shatter. What's interesting though is that this doesn't take away from the actiony feel, instead it adds specific levels of tactics to your casting as a mesmer.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  cinos

Novice Member

Joined: 8/22/05
Posts: 975

4/16/12 10:53:36 AM#22
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Roehon
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Fir3line
Originally posted by Jakdstripper

i'd like to ask this to those that have tried both games.

i myself have played Tera and it sounds to me like GW2's combat is pretty much the same thing. a mostly aim based combat with some tab targeting options.

am i getting the right idea here? or are they quite different? if so what exactly is different about GW2's combat when compared with Tera's?

you dont "aim" in gw2, you can fire any ability without a target and it will go on a straight line in front of you to the max range of your weapon, anything on its path will be hit.

You can also fire at someone thro objects and walls or out of range, making your skill go on cooldown so you need to pay attention to what you are doing

Yes you can do that buts its a lot easier to use the tab targeting system in GW2 and most people will. So at the end of the day the combat in GW2 is just a tab targeting system, but any attacks will hit anythign in front of you as well.. think similar to Age of Conan when you use tab targeting in that but without the combos.

 

Tera is more of an action mouse click game but also have special skills on the number keys, there is no need to tab target in this at all. Sadly everytime you attack in tera you character stops moving kinda takes away a bit of the fun and it could have been a lot better.

 

I do understand you can Tab target , but the person you're taking shots at can move out of the way right? The arrows don't follow you in this game like other MMOs.

If they are quick enough i think they can double tap to dodge but i believe its all based on dice rolls..

Not dice rolls. The projectile isn't predetermined to hit once it leaves the casters hand. It will only hit if you happen to be there once it reaches it's destination.

If you are on the ball it is possible to dodge any projectile. Though as you can only roll twice before the bar needs a recharge, you will likely get hit by the ones that are too fast to get out of the way of in time.

  cyress8

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/05
Posts: 866

BOOYAKA!

4/16/12 10:56:35 AM#23
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Roehon
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Fir3line
Originally posted by Jakdstripper

i'd like to ask this to those that have tried both games.

i myself have played Tera and it sounds to me like GW2's combat is pretty much the same thing. a mostly aim based combat with some tab targeting options.

am i getting the right idea here? or are they quite different? if so what exactly is different about GW2's combat when compared with Tera's?

you dont "aim" in gw2, you can fire any ability without a target and it will go on a straight line in front of you to the max range of your weapon, anything on its path will be hit.

You can also fire at someone thro objects and walls or out of range, making your skill go on cooldown so you need to pay attention to what you are doing

Yes you can do that buts its a lot easier to use the tab targeting system in GW2 and most people will. So at the end of the day the combat in GW2 is just a tab targeting system, but any attacks will hit anythign in front of you as well.. think similar to Age of Conan when you use tab targeting in that but without the combos.

 

Tera is more of an action mouse click game but also have special skills on the number keys, there is no need to tab target in this at all. Sadly everytime you attack in tera you character stops moving kinda takes away a bit of the fun and it could have been a lot better.

 

I do understand you can Tab target , but the person you're taking shots at can move out of the way right? The arrows don't follow you in this game like other MMOs.

If they are quick enough i think they can double tap to dodge but i believe its all based on dice rolls..

Zero dice rolls.  You can move out the way just by moving to the side if you want.  

BOOYAKA!

  Caldrin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 4112

4/16/12 10:56:51 AM#24
Originally posted by cinos
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Roehon
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Fir3line
Originally posted by Jakdstripper

i'd like to ask this to those that have tried both games.

i myself have played Tera and it sounds to me like GW2's combat is pretty much the same thing. a mostly aim based combat with some tab targeting options.

am i getting the right idea here? or are they quite different? if so what exactly is different about GW2's combat when compared with Tera's?

you dont "aim" in gw2, you can fire any ability without a target and it will go on a straight line in front of you to the max range of your weapon, anything on its path will be hit.

You can also fire at someone thro objects and walls or out of range, making your skill go on cooldown so you need to pay attention to what you are doing

Yes you can do that buts its a lot easier to use the tab targeting system in GW2 and most people will. So at the end of the day the combat in GW2 is just a tab targeting system, but any attacks will hit anythign in front of you as well.. think similar to Age of Conan when you use tab targeting in that but without the combos.

 

Tera is more of an action mouse click game but also have special skills on the number keys, there is no need to tab target in this at all. Sadly everytime you attack in tera you character stops moving kinda takes away a bit of the fun and it could have been a lot better.

 

I do understand you can Tab target , but the person you're taking shots at can move out of the way right? The arrows don't follow you in this game like other MMOs.

If they are quick enough i think they can double tap to dodge but i believe its all based on dice rolls..

Not dice rolls. The projectile isn't predetermined to hit once it leaves the casters hand. It will only hit if you happen to be there once it reaches it's destination.

If you are on the ball it is possible to dodge any projectile. Though as you can only roll twice before the bar needs a recharge, you will likely get hit by the ones that are too fast to get out of the way of in time.

Ah ok well from what i seen projectile shots are bloody fast so would be hard to dodge LOL...

My 3D models
http://dragon3d.webs.com/

  Laromuss

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/13/12
Posts: 328

4/16/12 10:56:58 AM#25

I've Tera from CBT 1 -5, the combat is aim and point but different from games like dragon's nest in the sense some of the animations/skills are rooted for a reason (the reason being, there are consequences for spamming skills which causes the player to think about what skills he should use before using it).

It will also depend on your class, some classes such as the Ranger at first will have rooted animations for some specific skils but later on as the player hits higher levels and is able to unlock glyphs, they can use skills while running.  Additonally with almost all classes there are some lock on skills but these are usually DOTs, Curses, debuffs, buffs and heals.  Early on the ranger will have a step back which will give him more distance

With the healer he can heal while running but will have to aim his heals to target lock players, addtionally he has AOE heals that require him to place a targeting radius on the ground for players to step into.  The healers attacks are mostly frontal, some short range but slow, he has evasion skills which propel him backwards away from danger and freezing/stunning enemies in place.

but in General almost all skills require aiming, positioning and strategic planning of cool downs and not skill spamming as that leaves the player vulnerable.  Of course that is from my experience of the game so far. 

hope that helps

 

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

4/16/12 10:57:31 AM#26
Originally posted by cinos

Not dice rolls. The projectile isn't predetermined to hit once it leaves the casters hand. It will only hit if you happen to be there once it reaches it's destination.

If you are on the ball it is possible to dodge any projectile. Though as you can only roll twice before the bar needs a recharge, you will likely get hit by the ones that are too fast to get out of the way of in time.

That's why you learn to watch the caster animations. You can tell from the animations, or at least you'll be able to learn, what's about to be cast, so you can preact accordingly.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  grimm6th

Novice Member

Joined: 10/22/10
Posts: 978

4/16/12 10:58:39 AM#27
Originally posted by bobfish

It is nothing like TERA's combat. You need to look at SWTOR/WoW for a good comparison, though GW2 doesn't root in place when you use most abilities, so you can move and fight at the same time.

Still have targeting, dice rolls behind the scenes and a hotbar of skills though.

If by dice rolls you mean to hit or miss, then you are wrong.  The only random chance thing is critical hits.  Whether something hits your or not depends on if the projectile or attacl would have hit your character (with some allowances made for online play of course, but any game that doesn't factor in this kind of thing fails as a game).

 

So yeah, TERA has the crosshair aiming and root to attack, which sucks, and GW2 has target nearest or in front of you if you don't already have a target when you use a skill.  Very few skills require being rooted.  Both games have a hotbar, but TERA has their first (basic attack) skill set to the L-mouse button.  GW2, sets their first (basic attack that is different with each weapon) skill to 1 and they have the option to have the game autocast a selected skill on recharge.  Oh, BTW...GW2 has no target ally skills....just thought I would add that.

 

TERA was appearently made to be playable with a console controller, but I really didn't like that control setup when I tried it.  Basically TERA is going for action rpg combat in a traditional MMO and GW2 heavily incorporated action RPG elements into MMORPG combat, making something of a hybrid that I find works quite nicely.

 

BTW in GW2 you can dodge in any direction with double tapping your WASD keys or whatever you have your movement set to.

I used to TL;DR, but then I took a bullet point to the footnote.

  Caldrin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 4112

4/16/12 10:59:03 AM#28
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by cinos

Not dice rolls. The projectile isn't predetermined to hit once it leaves the casters hand. It will only hit if you happen to be there once it reaches it's destination.

If you are on the ball it is possible to dodge any projectile. Though as you can only roll twice before the bar needs a recharge, you will likely get hit by the ones that are too fast to get out of the way of in time.

That's why you learn to watch the caster animations. You can tell from the animations, or at least you'll be able to learn, what's about to be cast, so you can preact accordingly.

Maybe 1v1 that would be possible but in big group fights there is just way too much going on... then again only seen liek 10 mins of someone playing a pvp match.

 

Guess we will have to wait until its out to see for sure :)

My 3D models
http://dragon3d.webs.com/

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

4/16/12 11:03:14 AM#29
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by cinos

Not dice rolls. The projectile isn't predetermined to hit once it leaves the casters hand. It will only hit if you happen to be there once it reaches it's destination.

If you are on the ball it is possible to dodge any projectile. Though as you can only roll twice before the bar needs a recharge, you will likely get hit by the ones that are too fast to get out of the way of in time.

That's why you learn to watch the caster animations. You can tell from the animations, or at least you'll be able to learn, what's about to be cast, so you can preact accordingly.

Maybe 1v1 that would be possible but in big group fights there is just way too much going on... then again only seen liek 10 mins of someone playing a pvp match.

 

Guess we will have to wait until its out to see for sure :)

Aw hell folks, we're doing this wrong. The GameBreaker video in this thread: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/473/view/forums/thread/347013/New-Gameinformer-Video-Worth-Watching.html has some skilled developers playing the game much more like it's intended. You can see the benefits of weapons swapping, dodging, watching the enemy, etc. This video REALLY demonstrates GW2 combat quite nicely.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  ariboersma

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 1817

4/16/12 11:08:31 AM#30
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Volkon
Originally posted by cinos

Not dice rolls. The projectile isn't predetermined to hit once it leaves the casters hand. It will only hit if you happen to be there once it reaches it's destination.

If you are on the ball it is possible to dodge any projectile. Though as you can only roll twice before the bar needs a recharge, you will likely get hit by the ones that are too fast to get out of the way of in time.

That's why you learn to watch the caster animations. You can tell from the animations, or at least you'll be able to learn, what's about to be cast, so you can preact accordingly.

Maybe 1v1 that would be possible but in big group fights there is just way too much going on... then again only seen liek 10 mins of someone playing a pvp match.

 

Guess we will have to wait until its out to see for sure :)

Aw hell folks, we're doing this wrong. The GameBreaker video in this thread: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/473/view/forums/thread/347013/New-Gameinformer-Video-Worth-Watching.html has some skilled developers playing the game much more like it's intended. You can see the benefits of weapons swapping, dodging, watching the enemy, etc. This video REALLY demonstrates GW2 combat quite nicely.

ah very true.. OP watch the vid in this article!

  Unlight

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 2586

4/16/12 11:11:51 AM#31
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by cinos
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Roehon
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Fir3line
Originally posted by Jakdstripper

i'd like to ask this to those that have tried both games.

i myself have played Tera and it sounds to me like GW2's combat is pretty much the same thing. a mostly aim based combat with some tab targeting options.

am i getting the right idea here? or are they quite different? if so what exactly is different about GW2's combat when compared with Tera's?

you dont "aim" in gw2, you can fire any ability without a target and it will go on a straight line in front of you to the max range of your weapon, anything on its path will be hit.

You can also fire at someone thro objects and walls or out of range, making your skill go on cooldown so you need to pay attention to what you are doing

Yes you can do that buts its a lot easier to use the tab targeting system in GW2 and most people will. So at the end of the day the combat in GW2 is just a tab targeting system, but any attacks will hit anythign in front of you as well.. think similar to Age of Conan when you use tab targeting in that but without the combos.

 

Tera is more of an action mouse click game but also have special skills on the number keys, there is no need to tab target in this at all. Sadly everytime you attack in tera you character stops moving kinda takes away a bit of the fun and it could have been a lot better.

 

I do understand you can Tab target , but the person you're taking shots at can move out of the way right? The arrows don't follow you in this game like other MMOs.

If they are quick enough i think they can double tap to dodge but i believe its all based on dice rolls..

Not dice rolls. The projectile isn't predetermined to hit once it leaves the casters hand. It will only hit if you happen to be there once it reaches it's destination.

If you are on the ball it is possible to dodge any projectile. Though as you can only roll twice before the bar needs a recharge, you will likely get hit by the ones that are too fast to get out of the way of in time.

Ah ok well from what i seen projectile shots are bloody fast so would be hard to dodge LOL...

The projectiles move fast, but there are usually 'tells" in the mob's animation, which an astute player can pick up on so they can trigger their dodge in time.  I understand that most, if not all, of the heavier hitting skills are telegraphed in some way. 

This is one of the reasons why players will be expected to be paying attention in combat, rather than just spamming off cooldown.  Saving skills for when they'll be most useful is what will set apart poor players from successful ones, as will recognizing when to trigger them.  The enemies themselves will tell us when that is, *if* we're on the ball.

  Zeroxin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/21/06
Posts: 2514

My words are not here to sway you,they are here to make you understand.

4/16/12 11:13:15 AM#32
Originally posted by Pivotelite

No the skills curve and auto-aim, but characters have a dodge roll ability usable if you have enough energy on a meter or something like that...however nobody seems to use it.

Skills don't curve or auto aim. If you shoot them at a direction they go in that direction until they hit their max range or something gets in the way. Some skills home-in but they are mostly like lasers with a constant stream, and only one skill I know of actually follows the target, it's called homing missile or something of the sort and it's an underwater skill for the Engineer.

This is not a game.

  Caldrin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 4112

4/16/12 11:15:03 AM#33
Originally posted by Zeroxin
Originally posted by Pivotelite

No the skills curve and auto-aim, but characters have a dodge roll ability usable if you have enough energy on a meter or something like that...however nobody seems to use it.

Skills don't curve or auto aim. If you shoot them at a direction they go in that direction until they hit their max range or something gets in the way. Some skills home-in but they are mostly like lasers with a constant stream, and only one skill I know of actually follows the target, it's called homing missile or something of the sort and it's an underwater skill for the Engineer.

IF you have someone targeted they auto aim at that target but wont follow the target when fired... from what people have said above yes that target can dodge out of the way.

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  Volkon

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Facts do not require fiction for balance.

4/16/12 11:18:58 AM#34
Originally posted by Caldrin
Originally posted by Zeroxin
Originally posted by Pivotelite

No the skills curve and auto-aim, but characters have a dodge roll ability usable if you have enough energy on a meter or something like that...however nobody seems to use it.

Skills don't curve or auto aim. If you shoot them at a direction they go in that direction until they hit their max range or something gets in the way. Some skills home-in but they are mostly like lasers with a constant stream, and only one skill I know of actually follows the target, it's called homing missile or something of the sort and it's an underwater skill for the Engineer.

IF you have someone targeted they auto aim at that target but wont follow the target when fired... from what people have said above yes that target can dodge out of the way.

They auto-aim to where that target will be when the spell arrives, but don't track. What that means is that if you're moving, you see the cast happen, you can change direction and avoid the projectile.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  viddster

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/01/10
Posts: 214

4/16/12 12:05:25 PM#35

I have played both games and have bought both games as I like them both, but their combat is quite different. I will not add to the already thorough list of GW2 combat, except to say it is half old school MMO tab targetting and half action based combat.

 

There does seem to be a myth that TERA's combat is not movement orientated, which is just not true. Most combo and skill attacks have a movement element built into them, moving you in a direction during the combo attack. The problem seem to stem from the collision detection, and people stand directly in front of the mob and do not get any movement giving a very fixed and immobile feel to the combat.

 

If I can link you to a video of how warriors are meant to be played here. You can see if you just watch a few minutes of just how much some classes do move around, it just takes a while to get used to the fact you need to aim in a direction not necessarily at the mob. All classes have movement like this even the more fixed classes like lancer and Beserker. As said before, alot of skills can be movement unlocked with Glyphs giving even greater movement versatility, and alot of mana regenerating skills can be used whilst moving.

 

Also people seem to say there are not many skills like GW2, I would like to point out you only get 5 skills with different weapons and off hand items in GW2 at one time. There are alot of combinations available which is nice, but you only get 5 per combination, plus 5 utility skills like heals. I see alot of people also knock TERA because it has limited skills which is also not true. You get skills every few levels and probably only have half your skills at level 24, plus alot of more movement oriented skills are unlocked at higher level, this gives the impressions of a lack of skills at low level.

 

Also skills in GW2 can be used cross class like arrows and fire wall, so you can combine skills or weapons. TERA is very fixed in this and each class has very fixed skills, but they can be adjusted with Glyphs which helps tp a degree.

 

Looking forward to both, and i will probably play TERA until GW2 comes out. Just wanted to clear up a couple of things about TERA, people seem to be giving it a hard time. In truth it is a very well finished, fantastic looking MMO.

 

 

 

 

  adam_nox

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/31/06
Posts: 2062

4/16/12 12:31:30 PM#36

Someone post video proof that projectiles won't curve and hit someone who's targetted.  I don't mean if they use dodge.  I mean if they are just running or strafing and someone fires at them, it should miss if the distance between them is great enough. 

Further, does the game have area effect spells/abilities that 'explode' when they hit something?  If so, you should be able to hit the ground in front of someone to keep from whiffing against a moving target.  If such a situation cannot occur, then it's still the same old auto target stuff.

  User Deleted
4/16/12 12:32:44 PM#37
Originally posted by Jakdstripper

i'd like to ask this to those that have tried both games.

i myself have played Tera and it sounds to me like GW2's combat is pretty much the same thing. a mostly aim based combat with some tab targeting options.

am i getting the right idea here? or are they quite different? if so what exactly is different about GW2's combat when compared with Tera's?

Its different because you dont actually aim in GW2, its a hybrid Tab Target with Active dodging.

  RizelStar

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4/16/12 12:33:58 PM#38
Evil is correct I played both however in GW 2 if you do move and stay active you can dodge attacks if the don't touch you. I think there is some auto aim but it can be avoided due to it being hot key action and not mouse it'd be hard to aim with hot key I mean least a bit more difficult than mouse so it makes sense that in GW 2 attacks have a tad but if follow. Though seriousely if you zig zag you won't get hit, that show you avoid getting hit if you run out of energy and block.

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  Volkon

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Facts do not require fiction for balance.

4/16/12 12:38:50 PM#39
Originally posted by adam_nox

Someone post video proof that projectiles won't curve and hit someone who's targetted.  I don't mean if they use dodge.  I mean if they are just running or strafing and someone fires at them, it should miss if the distance between them is great enough. 

Further, does the game have area effect spells/abilities that 'explode' when they hit something?  If so, you should be able to hit the ground in front of someone to keep from whiffing against a moving target.  If such a situation cannot occur, then it's still the same old auto target stuff.

Watch that Gamebreaker vid I posted in this thread, I think there may be examples in there. As for your second part, engineers have grenades... think they work like that (AoE circle). There are also skills that you can detonate at will.

 

I can state for a fact that you can avoid projectiles by changing direction if you time it correctly however.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  ariboersma

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 1817

4/16/12 12:52:55 PM#40
Originally posted by Unlight
Originally posted by Caldrin
snip

Ah ok well from what i seen projectile shots are bloody fast so would be hard to dodge LOL...

The projectiles move fast, but there are usually 'tells" in the mob's animation, which an astute player can pick up on so they can trigger their dodge in time.  I understand that most, if not all, of the heavier hitting skills are telegraphed in some way. 

This is one of the reasons why players will be expected to be paying attention in combat, rather than just spamming off cooldown.  Saving skills for when they'll be most useful is what will set apart poor players from successful ones, as will recognizing when to trigger them.  The enemies themselves will tell us when that is, *if* we're on the ball.

lets not forget the longbow will be much easier to avoid, the shortbow is supposed to be the counter to that. I mean this is a PVP situation but I am sure some mobs will use long or short bows and some will be avoidable while others arent.

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