swtor is what you call a diamond in a rough. If bioware can polish the game, fix bugs,add good content and so forth, its going to be successful. 

it's not like wow was extermeely polished when its game was released and it didn't have 5+ million subs in the beginning. 

Originally posted by Wolvards

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by ktanner3

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by Wolvards

 

Agreed, but how many people bought boxes? 5 mill? lets say 2 mill just as a number. 2m x 60, just go with the basic, thats 120 million bam, not CE, jsut basic 60 box or DD, it's been out 4 months now? i'm losing track, 4 months times an average of 1.7 million at 15 bucks each, another 100 million, thats 220 mill give or take a large amount of money :) Are they even yet? nah probably not, but 1 or 2 more months and they turn a profit, not too shabby.

 If you are going to give an economics lesson you might want to factor in some minor details like the cost of the goods they sold, the cut of the stores that sold them, the cost of the servers and bandwidth they use, paying customer service and GMs and developers, the ongoing advertising... and so on, and so on..  You are clearly confusing revenue with profit.  Their monthly profit is a fraction of your napkin math.

 

 

He's guess is no less important than yours unless you have those facts available.

 If you can find a "guess" in my post let me know.  What I listed are things that are factual and are all costs bourne by the company.  At no time did I estimate what those amounts would be.  if somehow you see differently please be sure to point it out, otherwise... as I said the person I quoted is confusing REVENUE with PROFITS.

K i didn't make my post exactly clear, i was simply trying to justify the game not being a "failure", Not trying to give exact numbers, just threw stuff out there lol, don't get so up-tight about it.

That's alI was doing as well. I have no way of knowing what the actual revenue stream is, but even with those conservative estimates, I'd love to be failing at that rate.

Originally posted by asianbboy101

swtor is what you call a diamond in a rough. If bioware can polish the game, fix bugs,add good content and so forth, its going to be successful. 

it's not like wow was extermeely polished when its game was released and it didn't have 5+ million subs in the beginning. 

Dare I say it?

"You can't polish a..." nah forget it lol.

By mine.

Story driven 100m$ online game. 2 months of it and everyone gets fed up. Even the fanbois will have nothing to do once they finish all stories in it.

I just love SW lore but this is just plain boring game.

Originally posted by RefMinor
Mine

*Edited because apparently if you defend this game, and defend yourself, you get issued warnings*

Originally posted by Darklighter1

Originally posted by RefMinor
Mine

Yep, because your opinion matters.  I wish I could sit home all day and post all day about all the games I hate and don't play.  Clueless. 

Originally posted by asianbboy101

swtor is what you call a diamond in a rough. If bioware can polish the game, fix bugs,add good content and so forth, its going to be successful. 

it's not like wow was extermeely polished when its game was released and it didn't have 5+ million subs in the beginning. 

Originally posted by jacklo

Originally posted by Wolvards

K i didn't make my post exactly clear, i was simply trying to justify the game not being a "failure", Not trying to give exact numbers, just threw stuff out there lol, don't get so up-tight about it.

That's ok, I guess that's what EA are trying to do with their investors!

To give credit where credit is due, that was a good one lol

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by asianbboy101

swtor is what you call a diamond in a rough. If bioware can polish the game, fix bugs,add good content and so forth, its going to be successful. 

it's not like wow was extermeely polished when its game was released and it didn't have 5+ million subs in the beginning. 

 

Isn't a diamond in a rough a lump of coal

What game do you like? lol

Originally posted by Wolvards

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by asianbboy101

swtor is what you call a diamond in a rough. If bioware can polish the game, fix bugs,add good content and so forth, its going to be successful. 

it's not like wow was extermeely polished when its game was released and it didn't have 5+ million subs in the beginning. 

 

Isn't a diamond in a rough a lump of coal

What game do you like? lol

Apparently, none.

A flop? no but to me is is one of the worst mmos I have ever played, I had more fun in Warhammer

Originally posted by Wolvards

Originally posted by jacklo

Originally posted by Wolvards

K i didn't make my post exactly clear, i was simply trying to justify the game not being a "failure", Not trying to give exact numbers, just threw stuff out there lol, don't get so up-tight about it.

That's ok, I guess that's what EA are trying to do with their investors!

To give credit where credit is due, that was a good one lol

;-)

Just couldn't resist lol

Agreed, I was very dissapointed with TOR. It may not be a complete flop/failure as some put it due to the fact that enough thousands of poeple enjoy it and play it (however much I may disagree with them lol). With the franchise, the money, and the company behind it (EA), TOR should have been much more polished and much "better" of a game than what it is now. In that regards, I would say it failed; as to what degree of failure, that's up to the mmo playerbase (us gamers).

Originally posted by Wolvards

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by asianbboy101

swtor is what you call a diamond in a rough. If bioware can polish the game, fix bugs,add good content and so forth, its going to be successful. 

it's not like wow was extermeely polished when its game was released and it didn't have 5+ million subs in the beginning. 

 

Isn't a diamond in a rough a lump of coal

What game do you like? lol

I would say it is a failure.  As far as the "profits" go I am glad that many people pointed out the difference between revenue and profit. I did analysis on this a few weeks back and here is my 2 cents as an investor (Not in EA though just in general)

Since just before the launch of SWTOR till the end of March EA's stock has lost 29.4% of its value. In that exact same time frame the average company in its sector has increased its stock value by 17.7%. That means that EA has underperformed the market by a staggering 47.1%.

I think this is more telling than any of our guesses at when EA will turn a profit on this game (Ive noticed that appearantly turning a profit only means recovering development cost, at least on this forum). I know that there are many more factors affecting EA's stock price but I believe you would be hard pressed to find any intelligent investor who would say anything had a greater affect than SWTOR.

Originally posted by Lobotomist

Its Flop by investors standards.

There is no way the game will even return the money invested in it, and far cry  from bringing any profit.

So if that is not called flop, i dont know what is.

 

And I am not even talking about being flop in eyes of gamers

An awesome example of internet chat word-vomit.  Notice the confidence behind this post, almost shining in it's arrogance.  As if, he's simply stating a well investigated and hard-proven undeniable fact.  When in fact, he pulled this opinion directly out of his butt, wiped it off, and threw it on the page for everyone to marvel at.

Well done sir!  well done!

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by Wolvards

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by asianbboy101

swtor is what you call a diamond in a rough. If bioware can polish the game, fix bugs,add good content and so forth, its going to be successful. 

it's not like wow was extermeely polished when its game was released and it didn't have 5+ million subs in the beginning. 

 

Isn't a diamond in a rough a lump of coal

What game do you like? lol

 

I am currently Beta testing an iOS version of Traveller, the PnP space game, I play another Sci Fi MMO that I don't talk about here, I will also be beta testing a rebooted version of Outer Empires another iOS MMO in a couple of weeks, I have played Perpetuum, glitch, EvE, Uncharted Waters and even ran the Mortal Online trial for a couple of weeks over the last year. I have gained enjoyment from them all in different ways, even tried SWTOR but that was the weakest if them all. Feel free to tell me how crap any and all of the games I have played are as I try things out and make my own mind up.

I agree SW:TOR was a bad game, but a flop is yet to be determined, that will be decided once they close the doors, EvE is good, but have you tried PotBS? sounds like something you might get a kick out of, player driven economy like EvE, tons of ships, pretty good F2P game. It just seems like in all the forums you dislike every AAA title out there, which i don't entirely blame you, but you just seem dissapointed with the genre.

Whether it's a flop for Bioware or EA can only be known by them, someone with access to their internal docs, or "fly on the wall" access to their internal meetings and "off the record" discussions.

As far as player perception, well, I can offer three words that were thrown around awfully aggressively and asserted as undeniable fact to describe it prior to its release: "THE WoW Killer".  Of course, that didn't pan out. Not even close. And don't bother with "well, anyone who thought that would be the case..." responses, because the fact of the matter is A LOT of people did. You couldn't go 5 virtual feet without seeing someone declaring TOR the Second Coming for online gaming, the one to dethrone WoW, the MMO that would have Blizzard shitting bricks the size of mac trucks in their pants, for fear of having their population leave WoW in one massive flood of new TOR players. People got pretty carried away with it. So by those lofty standards, it certainly failed.

How about all the hyperbole and unfettered adulation over the title expressed by the media. Can you say "Public Love Affair"? Even this site's staff was in on it. Seemed I couldn't come to this site without seeing someone else slobbering all over their keyboards to heap more praise on the game. I wonder if some of these people look back at those articles and feel a pang of embarassment. I probably would.

It was touted as the "End All" for big budget MMOs, as though if it didn't do well, that no one else would ever dare invest the money to do another big budget project again. Of course that was ridiculous too.

I've seen some highly, highly hyped MMOs in my time playing. None of them, not one, has come even close to what I witnessed for TOR.

So, while I wouldn't go so far as calling it a literal failure - it is still running and does have a healthy playerbase afterall - I would say it has fallen far short of the expectations and hype piled upon it. For some people, that's a failure in its own right.

Originally posted by jeeshadow

Originally posted by Lobotomist

Its Flop by investors standards.

There is no way the game will even return the money invested in it, and far cry  from bringing any profit.

So if that is not called flop, i dont know what is.

 

And I am not even talking about being flop in eyes of gamers

 

An awesome example of internet chat word-vomit.  Notice the confidence behind this post, almost shining in it's arrogance.  As if, he's simply stating a well investigated and hard-proven undeniable fact.  When in fact, he pulled this opinion directly out of his butt, wiped it off, and threw it on the page for everyone to marvel at.

 

Well done sir!  well done!

Now that was bad timing with the post right above yours backing up the claim lol.

Too bad, was eloquently put.

Originally posted by Wolvards

I don't think it's a failure personally, from a buisness stand point, even if they only have 1 mill subs, that 15 mill a month give or take a couple million dollars, have they broke even yet? nah probably not, but it's well on its way IMHO.

Not even close....