Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Breezeycouk

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

Originally posted by BillMurphy

-snip

 In the US - Freedom of Speech allows you to say anything - and I mean anything.  Racism, rape, torture, molestation - you can make a website about any of these topics and the government cannot take it down, unles you are directly using it to commit a crime.

Are you trying to tell me that we should allow people to talk about the above things freely at MMORPG.com?  No.  This is a privately owned forum and we get to decide the rules.

And I don't even think in the UK you could hold a protest in the lobby of a corporate office complex.

Considering how rampant the first one is in todays MMOs, and considering how the other three could be used to describe the feelings of treatment of MMO IPs or MMO customers by MMO makers on a daily basis, I'd have to say maybe.

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Breezeycouk

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

Originally posted by BillMurphy

Hey guys,

Just popping in to tell you that you can refer all Game List information to Jim Moreno.  He's culling through the list from A-Z and adding new games as we get them.  Please be patient, as it's not exactly a super-quick undertaking when the list is 600+ titles now.

Jimmoreno at MMORPG dot com

Thanks!

What about all the locking of threads that criticize advertiser's products and refering them back under one gnereic "catch All" sticky?

 

I would ask if this site is run from America or somewhere else - I am from the UK and we have issues over Free Speech here whereas I still think the US has the First Amendment ??? (please feel free to correct me if I have the Admendment selection incorrect)

Free speech applies only in a public place.  When you are using this website you are in a private space.  I encourage you to walk into your neighborhood McDonalds and start spouting off political views, hold up signs, etc and see how long until they escort you off their private property.

While we are bound to uphold your civil rights (like allowing people of all ethnic backgrounds, etc) we do not have to grant you freedom of speech...no more that I have freedom of speech at your dining table.

I always found this angle amusing. You have free speech but not in private property. So seeing as in countries like US where private corporations own almost everything then there is no real free speech is there?

Free speech should be absolute, either you have it or you dont. Either you can tell your mind or you cant.

 This is why you see picketers and protesters on sidewalks, parks, etc.  It would be pretty unconstitutional to allow these people to protest inside another persons private space that they own or pay rent for.  Are you saying you would not mind it if I walked into your home and started spouting off my views and the law required me to be able to do that and you could not make me leave?

If you want to express your views online you can make your own website and do so - THAT is freedom of speech as is protected by the constituion.

 

  This is a privately owned forum and we get to decide the rules.

 

 

Bottom line that is it ^

Seriously?

.... to the OP's original post yes it's very annoying to try to go through the games list as it's not updated. I wouldn't know where to start to offer up feedback on that as I haven't been following all of these games.

Free speech. People seriously. Even in the early days of IRC you could be booted by channel operators if you broke their rules. Don't like their rules? Find a channel with rules you liked better. And trust me there was more freedom online back then but still there were rules. I really don't want to join a free for all site though sometimes it seems like that here I must admit. WTH is with all the fanboys v haters crap seriously? Nearly impossible to have any sort of genuine debate about anything and I'm not talking about mod censorship. I DO think that people in some sections (won't name names) need to grow a thicker skin and stop complaining as I have seen them running around trash talking other games at the same time they are crying that people are trashing theirs. I've found myself defending games I don't intend to play at all because quite frankly I feel sorry for some of the people who are interested. I really don't know how you deal with that though.

Originally posted by Hatewall

So Admin, whose office has the red phone that goes off anytime a comment is made about swtor that isn't glowing?

Sorry, but there is an agenda with certain titles on this site.

Well, I would disagree with you.  There is no agenda from my point of view.  If my moderators have a personal one - that could be - again, I don't really follow the forums that often. 

Almost all of our moderating is done via the "report" tool that users use to point out rule violations.  With a title like SWTOR there are a lot of haters, but still a lot of fans - so both sides of the fence are using the report system to point moderators to posts that violate our rules.

In almost all of the complaints I have personally fielded over the years about deleted posts or moderation because of "game bias", I almost always found that while someone was criticizing a game - they violated our rules at the same time.

If you browse our forums you will see a LOT of critical and negative posts about all games.  Why would we let those stand and delete other ones?  Typically it is either because a) the post complied with our rules or b) the moderators have not seen it yet.

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Hatewall

So Admin, whose office has the red phone that goes off anytime a comment is made about swtor that isn't glowing?

Sorry, but there is an agenda with certain titles on this site.

Well, I would disagree with you.  There is no agenda from my point of view.  If my moderators have a personal one - that could be - again, I don't really follow the forums that often. 

Almost all of our moderating is done via the "report" tool that users use to point out rule violations.  With a title like SWTOR there are a lot of haters, but still a lot of fans - so both sides of the fence are using the report system to point moderators to posts that violate our rules.

In almost all of the complaints I have personally fielded over the years about deleted posts or moderation because of "game bias", I almost always found that while someone was criticizing a game - they violated our rules at the same time.

If you browse our forums you will see a LOT of critical and negative posts about all games.  Why would we let those stand and delete other ones?  Typically it is either because a) the post complied with our rules or b) the moderators have not seen it yet.

take a look at the warnings on my account. how many of those were violating a rule? maybe one where i said another member was a 'piece of work"

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Breezeycouk

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

Originally posted by BillMurphy

Hey guys,

Just popping in to tell you that you can refer all Game List information to Jim Moreno.  He's culling through the list from A-Z and adding new games as we get them.  Please be patient, as it's not exactly a super-quick undertaking when the list is 600+ titles now.

Jimmoreno at MMORPG dot com

Thanks!

What about all the locking of threads that criticize advertiser's products and refering them back under one gnereic "catch All" sticky?

 

I would ask if this site is run from America or somewhere else - I am from the UK and we have issues over Free Speech here whereas I still think the US has the First Amendment ??? (please feel free to correct me if I have the Admendment selection incorrect)

Free speech applies only in a public place.  When you are using this website you are in a private space.  I encourage you to walk into your neighborhood McDonalds and start spouting off political views, hold up signs, etc and see how long until they escort you off their private property.

While we are bound to uphold your civil rights (like allowing people of all ethnic backgrounds, etc) we do not have to grant you freedom of speech...no more that I have freedom of speech at your dining table.

I always found this angle amusing. You have free speech but not in private property. So seeing as in countries like US where private corporations own almost everything then there is no real free speech is there?

Free speech should be absolute, either you have it or you dont. Either you can tell your mind or you cant.

 This is why you see picketers and protesters on sidewalks, parks, etc.  It would be pretty unconstitutional to allow these people to protest inside another persons private space that they own or pay rent for.  Are you saying you would not mind it if I walked into your home and started spouting off my views and the law required me to be able to do that and you could not make me leave?

If you want to express your views online you can make your own website and do so - THAT is freedom of speech as is protected by the constituion.

My home and a public internet forum is not the same, not by a long shot. So obviously going to people's homes, without their consent, should not be allowed.

And freedom of speech is not an exclusive US invention. It is mentioned in the UN declarations of human rights and interestingly it does not say that private corporations are exempt. I know that in US you hold private corporations sacred but most other countries hold freedom of speech even more sacred.

Once you go down the road of saying that freedom of speech is a right but not in this place and that place and only in some cases, then you are on a slippery slope.

 In the US - Freedom of Speech allows you to say anything - and I mean anything.  Racism, rape, torture, molestation - you can make a website about any of these topics and the government cannot take it down, unles you are directly using it to commit a crime.

Are you trying to tell me that we should allow people to talk about the above things freely at MMORPG.com?  No.  This is a privately owned forum and we get to decide the rules.

And I don't even think in the UK you could hold a protest in the lobby of a corporate office complex.

Okay - Sooooooooooooooo WAAAAAAyyyyyyyy off topic now but in answer to this comment:

Yes you can - A organisation "being open to the public by its very nature of inviting them in to do business" (Look up Public House aka Pub) then opens itself up to protest or the serving or excuction of papers ?

If the management feel that there is an issue over safety or trespass then they can ask for the police to remove the potential offender.  The police have to tread very carefully here - Please look up the so called "Fortnum "Riots"" so see where they went wrong on this.

I would say that :

A) MMORPG have been open and prepared to enter a dialogue over this but there is a danger that everything is now going off topic so as Original Poster I would ask that all these Freedom of Speech responses now stop - If you wish to discuss this please post your own topic on this in the relevant forum.

B) Can we please go back to discussing getting the topioc back online with how much the site may or may not be out of date ?

Originally posted by MMOarQQ

 

Seriously?

LOLOLOLOLOLOL SO WIN!!!!!

Originally posted by Hatewall

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Hatewall

So Admin, whose office has the red phone that goes off anytime a comment is made about swtor that isn't glowing?

Sorry, but there is an agenda with certain titles on this site.

Well, I would disagree with you.  There is no agenda from my point of view.  If my moderators have a personal one - that could be - again, I don't really follow the forums that often. 

Almost all of our moderating is done via the "report" tool that users use to point out rule violations.  With a title like SWTOR there are a lot of haters, but still a lot of fans - so both sides of the fence are using the report system to point moderators to posts that violate our rules.

In almost all of the complaints I have personally fielded over the years about deleted posts or moderation because of "game bias", I almost always found that while someone was criticizing a game - they violated our rules at the same time.

If you browse our forums you will see a LOT of critical and negative posts about all games.  Why would we let those stand and delete other ones?  Typically it is either because a) the post complied with our rules or b) the moderators have not seen it yet.

take a look at the warnings on my account. how many of those were violating a rule? maybe one where i said another member was a 'piece of work"

 Per our policy I won't discuss your actions in a public forum.  But you can email me at admin AT mmorpg.com and I will gladly review these for you...even on Easter when my wife and kids are looking at me like the a-hole daddy working on their special day ;-)

Originally posted by Larsa

Originally posted by BillMurphy

Hey guys,

Just popping in to tell you that you can refer all Game List information to Jim Moreno.  He's culling through the list from A-Z and adding new games as we get them.  Please be patient, as it's not exactly a super-quick undertaking when the list is 600+ titles now.

Jimmoreno at MMORPG dot com

Thanks!

With all due respect, he should start by removing 500 of the 600+ titles instead of adding new ones. :)

I suggest that every game in the game lists gets it's own sub-forum and the game gets automatically removed from the list when there hasn't been any forum activity for, say, 6 months. Might be a good method to shred all this dead weight.

This is a truly superb idea! 

+1

Whilst the game list does need to be updated, I think getting prominent information on the most popular games is more important. Go to the pages for the top 20 most discussed games on the site and make sure the basic information is correct!. 

The news, blogs, features etc are perfect, but other stuff on the HOMEPAGE looks like it hasnt been looked at by the staff for years. That list of upcoming MMOs someone posted is a perfect example. 

The one thing I am very suspicious of though, is that AAA games ALWAYS get a good review, regardless of the quality of the game. I have never seen a critical review of a AAA game on this site. 

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Hatewall

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Hatewall

So Admin, whose office has the red phone that goes off anytime a comment is made about swtor that isn't glowing?

Sorry, but there is an agenda with certain titles on this site.

Well, I would disagree with you.  There is no agenda from my point of view.  If my moderators have a personal one - that could be - again, I don't really follow the forums that often. 

Almost all of our moderating is done via the "report" tool that users use to point out rule violations.  With a title like SWTOR there are a lot of haters, but still a lot of fans - so both sides of the fence are using the report system to point moderators to posts that violate our rules.

In almost all of the complaints I have personally fielded over the years about deleted posts or moderation because of "game bias", I almost always found that while someone was criticizing a game - they violated our rules at the same time.

If you browse our forums you will see a LOT of critical and negative posts about all games.  Why would we let those stand and delete other ones?  Typically it is either because a) the post complied with our rules or b) the moderators have not seen it yet.

take a look at the warnings on my account. how many of those were violating a rule? maybe one where i said another member was a 'piece of work"

 Per our policy I won't discuss your actions in a public forum.  But you can email me at admin AT mmorpg.com and I will gladly review these for you...even on Easter when my wife and kids are looking at me like the a-hole daddy working on their special day ;-)

nah, I won't do that to you on Easter.

I have been around this site for a long time. been kind of loose around here lately. Not pointing at you, either.

Originally posted by Admin

Originally posted by Hatewall

So Admin, whose office has the red phone that goes off anytime a comment is made about swtor that isn't glowing?

Sorry, but there is an agenda with certain titles on this site.

Well, I would disagree with you.  There is no agenda from my point of view.  If my moderators have a personal one - that could be - again, I don't really follow the forums that often. 

Almost all of our moderating is done via the "report" tool that users use to point out rule violations.  With a title like SWTOR there are a lot of haters, but still a lot of fans - so both sides of the fence are using the report system to point moderators to posts that violate our rules.

In almost all of the complaints I have personally fielded over the years about deleted posts or moderation because of "game bias", I almost always found that while someone was criticizing a game - they violated our rules at the same time.

If you browse our forums you will see a LOT of critical and negative posts about all games.  Why would we let those stand and delete other ones?  Typically it is either because a) the post complied with our rules or b) the moderators have not seen it yet.

OR..... a nasty cabal of negative posters have pooled their resources and payed you off. That's the truth isn't it? ISN'T IT!!??

Hey "MMORPG must be a payolla scam" posters, if you are going to subscribe to batsh*t insane conspiracy theories, why can only the ones you LIKE be true?

Same bs post every 2 months or so, can't the mods just sticky one of these (and leave it out of the 'Recent' list) so we don't have to have to the same inane discussion. Post, read, visit or do not, it is your choice to do so, it is not your right to dictate the terms.

For balance, it's highly unlike any of you have been banned more frequently than I have for more stupid reasons than I have, but I don't have to come here if I don't want to. You want to excercise your rights? Do so by starting your own site or visiting one more to your tastes.

And going back to the topic at hand here.  We are seriously looking at getting the game list sorted out.  We took initiative on this months ago and while there have been improvements made they are not up to my satisfaction and I am going to make sure we have a better game plan. 

The home page uncoming game list is frankly embarassing and we are looking at this too - I think our data entry person entered "2011" when he meant "2012" - as we all know this happens to the best of us right after the new year.  Our system just shows the top 10 games with the oldest dates that are not "released" status.  Obviously we need to put some safeguards in place to keep this from being possible.

Thank you for the feedback too!

Originally posted by Admin

And going back to the topic at hand here.  We are seriously looking at getting the game list sorted out.  We took initiative on this months ago and while there have been improvements made they are not up to my satisfaction and I am going to make sure we have a better game plan. 

...

I would advise to take suggestions from your user base. Open a thread with a request for suggestions to get ideas rolling. Make it clear that it will be a heavily moderated thread and that all responses beside suggestions and discussions about the game list will be deleted.

Yes, I know, there are quite some tools around here, equally there are quite some smart people that might want to throw in an idea or two. :)

Originally posted by Epicent

Originally posted by MMOarQQ

 

Seriously?

LOLOLOLOLOLOL SO WIN!!!!!

hahahahahahaha

you sir has won whole thread :-)

no idea why you put up a screen from the last year, here is what you see atm tho:

Originally posted by Breezeycouk

Originally posted by BartDaCat

Originally posted by just1opinion

 

Your poll doesn't give enough choices, sorry.

I agree.  It doesn't offer enough choices to be a valid poll worthy of "Focus Group" status, thus, we will not be able to fund your thread with more advertising dollars.

 

As previously stated - I am concerned over splitting the vote - I had hoped to be present a simple choice (But I accept the error of not giving a "None of the Above" option)

I maybe a little out of touch after not really visting the site for so long but any advice on how to present polls in future would be gratfully recieved to make sure I am in line with current thinking

It was just a little light-hearted ribbing.  I was poking a little fun at the expense of your "ad base" comment.  It's actually interesting how this thread fleshed out, and I'm glad to see that the site admin added their input.

Originally posted by fenistil

Originally posted by BillMurphy

Hey guys,

Just popping in to tell you that you can refer all Game List information to Jim Moreno.  He's culling through the list from A-Z and adding new games as we get them.  Please be patient, as it's not exactly a super-quick undertaking when the list is 600+ titles now.

Jimmoreno at MMORPG dot com

Thanks!

It is understandable but quite a lot of games have information that is not-valid for years.  + some of them are really quite big titles (either past or still present) so yeah. 

I always found this kind of odd myself. How does a website dedicated (at least mostly) to MMORPGs have such outdated info about such major games? As you note, some of them aren't exactly obscure and under the radar.

Just when game actuall release or change it business model or reveal it's business model or reveal it's release date ,etc - when someone is writing news about it maybe he could just check game info as well and write a note to person responsibile?

Yep, that would seem to be the most organized and "real time" way to handle it. "Oh, such and such MMO is changing to a F2P model as of such-and-such date. Okay, mark the calendar so I can update the entry on the list when it makes the change. I would think it's not that big a deal to update it, if the website's back-end is well organized, some kind of CMS is being used, etc.

Your internal organisation is your business and you surely know better and growing game's list not making this easier ,but really quality of those very basic information took a nose dive quite a long time ago.

Many years ago when I was not registered I would refer to mmorpg's as a source often in my posts in other fourms or just when I was looking info myself.

Not anymore - cause you're just soo out of date or sometimes even wrong :/

Or sometimes weeks behind the times in releasing news articles. I've seen articles updated as "recent news" covering things that happened over a month prior to them being published to the site. It definitely makes you scratch your head.  A month in the gaming world is a very long time.

I thnk it'd be better in those cases to maybe set a "cut-off" period for news. A news update should be covered here within a week of being announced by the company, or it doesn't get mentioned. Mayyyyyybe a couple days longer. But beyond that, it should just be seen as a missed opportunity and left alone to make way for something more recent. 

Should be easy for the guy to change the list cus all he rly needs to do is look at some gaming news sites since whe can obviously say he wont be the first one making the change  saying it is becouse the list is 600+ is not a good even if he would only put 1 minute a week on this site there couldnt be things left from months ago.

And that this site is a fontain of ads is not new.. i personaly go here for the forum wich does get moderated heavily but for news this is not the place.

There are also alot of hidden ads  like things that look like they are giving you news but its filled with ads.