Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

Thanks for link Creslin even though they haven't specified does it mean any PVE character who enters structured PVP? i am just assuming here.

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

EDIT:  Here's a source, this is from the wiki:

A character used to enter structured PvP will retain race and profession. The character will be given a fixed maximum level, and all skills and items will be available without the need to unlock them first. Player statistics will be tracked and used to generate a player ranking.^[1]

 

So this game is only good for the people that played GW1?

OK!!!

Good luck!

Originally posted by dontadow

Originally posted by Kyleran

Which is why I've been saying GW2 isn't really a "proper" MMORPG in the traditional sense because they've tried very hard to reduce/minimize the progression aspect of it and flatten it out more into a FPS model of leveling the playing field for everyone.

But no matter what you call it, there is obviously a huge playerbase who want this sort of title, so it will do great.

 

 

It's this kind of rhetoric that makes folk angry.  Last night, I equate it to slavery.  Slaves of a genere that should not have a "way the game must be made". 

Even in FPS's Call of Duty plays different than half life which plays differently than RAGe. The mechanics are different, progression is different, the only similarities at some point u fire a gun. 

But somehow, the mmorpg genre has created a template a game must be to be called an MMO.  

Guild wars 2 is a "proper" mmo. What is a proper MMO

Massive (lots of people) check

Multiplayer (lots of people playing together) check

Online (internet connections linking these players) check

Role-Playing Game (interactive story, create a character and explore his role in the universe) check 

The design of a game does not define the genre of a game.  

 

Honestly, I don't care how a game is defined. I play what I like.

Does the game appeal to me----Check

Will it be fun------Check

will there be others with whom I can enjoy my time in the virtua world-----Check

Is this a game that can hold my attention while I waste how ever many hrs of my life-----Check

Does it fit the traditionally accepted model of an MMORPG-------Who gives a flying [CENSORED]

Edit. It has now been discovered that there is P2W, It may be small. but W/E.

Well, have fun guys.

Originally posted by Comaf

Originally posted by nomatics856

I thought mmorpgs were about progression, if I automatically wanted to get into the fray of things and have a game about 100% skill, wouldnt I play a twitched based FPS, mmorpgs should be 50% skill, 50% progression

 It's...not...an...mmorpg. 

 

They might call it that.  It might be listed here.  But it's not an mmorpg.  It's an E-sport like SW:ToR.  The lore is a joke, merely cosmetic so you have something to read about when you pick one of the 5 races that get to kill each other in a battleground or W v W v W.  It's immediate gratification pvp with some pve tossed in for good measure.

 

It's not an mmorpg.

However, now that we've got that out of the way.  You can still have fun with it.  My ten year son likes MW3 and Black Ops though he thinks GW2 looks too childish, I still think it looks kind of fun :)

 

I am a PVE'r at heart...and like to role-play (light).  I've never liked the pvp in games like WOW very much although I would attempt to pvp (even as low level player) if we were being invaded.   Guess what happened.   I couldn't even touch a level 80 char.

They could kill me with one swipe and there I'd be dead and watching them storm into my home city.   Even if 10 of us lowbies were fighting a level 80 it made no difference...unless you were 80 you couldn't touch them.   I hated having to stand and watch a bunch of level 80's storm into my home city and I felt helpless....they was NOTHING I could do to prevent the attack.

That was no real contest...the lvl 80 was getting kills but no challenge ... we were getting killed but no challenge...can't kill something you can't hit.

NOW, we will have challenge.  Everytime you go into pvp, you will be facing folks that can fight back, that can kill and be killed.

For the FIRST time, I am excited about PVP.  

Originally posted by Ankur

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

Thanks for link Creslin even though they haven't specified does it mean any PVE character who enters structured PVP? i am just assuming here.

 

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

EDIT:  Here's a source, this is from the wiki:

A character used to enter structured PvP will retain race and profession. The character will be given a fixed maximum level, and all skills and items will be available without the need to unlock them first. Player statistics will be tracked and used to generate a player ranking.^[1]

 

Yes ankur its any pve person that enters the mists to pvp

For structured pvp you are boosted to max with skills gear trait points.  this is your pve charicter  you dont have to make pve/pvp specific toons although you can if you want.   once you enter the mists where ALL pvp is located you can go to structured pvp where you have everything unlocked, or go to WvW and have only bolstered stats and level, not gear and trait points.

Once you leave the mists and go back to pvp you will be your original level with the same gear stats level everything that you had when you last entered pvp zone, Unless you played in WvW where even though your bolstered you still gain exp and loot from playing.

In wvw you level look like this: (80) 15.  were you are level 15 actually but bolstered up to 80.   you can then gain levels to look like (80) 20. and those are peremenant just like if you were in pve.  when you leave WvW you will be lvl 20

Originally posted by Ankur

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

Thanks for link Creslin even though they haven't specified does it mean any PVE character who enters structured PVP? i am just assuming here.

 

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

EDIT:  Here's a source, this is from the wiki:

A character used to enter structured PvP will retain race and profession. The character will be given a fixed maximum level, and all skills and items will be available without the need to unlock them first. Player statistics will be tracked and used to generate a player ranking.^[1]

 

 Well it actually just means "character."  There is no such thing as a PvP only character in GW2 ;).  At least AFAIK.

Originally posted by garretth

That was no real contest...the lvl 80 was getting kills but no challenge ... we were getting killed but no challenge...can't kill something you can't hit.

NOW, we will have challenge.  Everytime you go into pvp, you will be facing folks that can fight back, that can kill and be killed.

For the FIRST time, I am excited about PVP.  

 

And that is why they are actually pissed.

It means that if they spend 1000 hours doing instances for uber gear, they cant steamroll unchallenged and stroke their epeens about how leet they are. I mean, its not like they are going to spend those 1000 hours just having FUN, needs to be for a reward that gives them an edge over everyone else.

Level playing fields, its the bain of l33t d00ds the world over.

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Ankur

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

Thanks for link Creslin even though they haven't specified does it mean any PVE character who enters structured PVP? i am just assuming here.

 

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Ahh I see, I'm like 99% certain it works the way I described.  I don't have a source to prove it, but I remember hearing about the system in a video or something way back when.

EDIT:  Here's a source, this is from the wiki:

A character used to enter structured PvP will retain race and profession. The character will be given a fixed maximum level, and all skills and items will be available without the need to unlock them first. Player statistics will be tracked and used to generate a player ranking.^[1]

 

 Well it actually just means "character."  There is no such thing as a PvP only character in GW2 ;).  At least AFAIK.

Ok because i was under the impression that there are PVP only chatacers too in GW2.

Originally posted by nomatics856

I thought mmorpgs were about progression, if I automatically wanted to get into the fray of things and have a game about 100% skill, wouldnt I play a twitched based FPS, mmorpgs should be 50% skill, 50% progression

In the mists, yes.

But you should view the mists as the E-sport part of the game. If you want something that is more traditional you play PvE and structured PvP.

And besides, in most games PvP is 25% progression, 25% skill and 50% gear. not optimal either.

It might well be that GW2 ain´t your type of game but having a E-sport part is not a bad idea, MMOs really never got that part right. WoW have tournaments where you get a max level character and certain gear to compete against other that is the same as well.

Originally posted by garretth

I am a PVE'r at heart...and like to role-play (light).  I've never liked the pvp in games like WOW very much although I would attempt to pvp (even as low level player) if we were being invaded.   Guess what happened.   I couldn't even touch a level 80 char.

They could kill me with one swipe and there I'd be dead and watching them storm into my home city.   Even if 10 of us lowbies were fighting a level 80 it made no difference...unless you were 80 you couldn't touch them.   I hated having to stand and watch a bunch of level 80's storm into my home city and I felt helpless....they was NOTHING I could do to prevent the attack.

That was no real contest...the lvl 80 was getting kills but no challenge ... we were getting killed but no challenge...can't kill something you can't hit.

NOW, we will have challenge.  Everytime you go into pvp, you will be facing folks that can fight back, that can kill and be killed.

For the FIRST time, I am excited about PVP.  

 

Took the words out of my... ummm... fingers.

If there's anything more annoying than losing in PvP because you're lower level, it's winning because you're higher level.

Progression in PvP just doesn't work.  Or I should say, it doesn't work for people that want an honest to goodness challenge.  I think GW2 just might create a massive "Well, duh!!!  Why didn't we think of that?" moment in development history with this.

Can't help but wonder if it may even have a Trammel effect on other MMOPvP games...

We shall see.

When you play in matches you get boosted to lvl 80 and all skills and stats are unlocked

Quote from devs

When a player takes a character into PvP, they are granted access to all the necessary skills, items, etc. Characters are set to the maximum level, putting everyone on an even playing field. This makes player skill more important than time invested in a particular character. When you take your character back to the PvE environment, you return to the skills and gear you had there, but the game will save your last PvP setup. You'll also be able to store templates for builds. This way, you can try out new stuff in PvP but still easily return to your familiar builds.

Each profession will load into PvP with a starter template that allows new players to have a competent build without needing to delve into detailed skill selection, item selection, or other tweaks. However, these more detailed customization options will be available for players who are more comfortable with the system.

Source http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/pvp/pvp-overview/

When you play W v W v W in the mists you get boosted to lvl 80 and your gear is change to that stats if it were 80, you dont get all skills etc only what you had.

Quote from devs

We wanted to make WvW fun and easy to get into, so there’s no level grinding required—you can just hop into the battle using your normal PvE character, regardless of what level you are.

When fighting in the Mists, you’ll be using your regular PvE character and the gear you’ve acquired in your adventures through Tyria. In the Mists, players all fight at the same level. Any character below level 80 will be adjusted so they are roughly equivalent in power to what they would be at level 80. This makes combat among characters of any level not only possible, but actually fun!

Source http://www.arena.net/blog/mike-ferguson-on-guild-wars-2-world-vs-world

Originally posted by Pyuk

OP - Uh yeah, GW 1 was set up that way, too. However, people who chose that route did not have as good gear as people who progressed through the game levels. They were competative, but not as well geared. Not news.

You are lieing.......... you could unlock jsut as good of gear from pvping with a pvp only toon than as a pve toon.  Gear  just maxed out at endgame. You could still unlock the runes and skills. PvE guys just had different looking gear. Stop stating false statements just to make the pve side seem more interesting than it is.

Its one of the reasons that I do not mind GW2 CS cos the games are set up like an FPS / TPS games.

You can buy anything in the CS but it does not matter as everyone is equal at lvl 80.

Its all about skills and latency lol.

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Laughing-man

Originally posted by skeaser

Originally posted by Laughing-man

When you zone into the Mists you are level 80.

However, its not the same as being a level 80 and zoning into the mists.  Once you zone out you are back to what ever level you were, and obviously once you are 80 in good gear you will be better off than someone who is level 1 stepping in with nothing and being buffed to make it a competition.

 

If you check out some Mists PVP vids you can see next to their level an (80)

So it would appear like (80) 15    as it does in this video.

 

So...just like SWTOR...

Pretty much, yes.

 The WvW level-boosting is just like SWTOR, but the competitive PvP (BG) level boosting is not...

WHen you do a BG, you essentially play a different character that just happens to look like you and be the same class, but is level 80, has all the skills, and has max level gear.  Compare this to SWTOR where you are just statistically boosed to level 50 but you gain no skills, and are stuck with your current gear and talents.  That was the problem with SWTOR.  If you boost a level 15 to level 50, he will still get owned by the level 50 because the level 50 has all the skills, better gear, etc.

That's only partly right, as after the 50's were separated into their own bracket, this wasn't really a problem. It was the lvl 50 PVP gear progression that casued the imbalance.

Originally posted by Ankur

If it works exactly like GW then PVE character only get boost to lvl 80 but they will be lacking in skills and armor compared to lvl 80 PVP characters. In that case everyone has to make a seperate PVP character for BG.

It doesn't work exactly like GW. It works exactly like GW2.

You have a character you create in PvE. If you go to WvW, you take your gear, weapons, etc., get boosted to level 80 and have at it there. Players drop level appropriate drops for you, so you can continue to progress through WvW just like PvE. If you do competitive PvP, you enter the Mists in a lobby type area with a full set of PvP gear, weapons, stats, etc. In other words, your same PvE character is maxxed out and changed into level 80 gear and weapons. You then fight in competitive PvP as a level 80 character equal to everyone else in stats and gear.

That's how they're advertizing it, that's what I expect. No reason to expect otherwise, and the videos all show people with their characters fully boosted to 80, so there's no reason to doubt them.

Originally posted by BadSpock

OMG someone is doing something different than EQ/WoW/WAR/AoC/TOR/EQ2 etc. etc.

No way it's going to work, I mean, everyone here just LOVES the fact that all these MMOs do things the same way right?!

 

we want something different until is turns out to be something different!

Originally posted by nomatics856

I thought mmorpgs were about progression, if I automatically wanted to get into the fray of things and have a game about 100% skill, wouldnt I play a twitched based FPS, mmorpgs should be 50% skill, 50% progression

I think posts like these, posts that are complete flame bait and without any proof, should warrant bans.

nothing new to see here move along.

they told everyone that the matches would be scaling duh who the heck cares. Stil doesn't mean you know what you are doing or have all the weapon skills or the elite/healing skills. 

get a clue buy a vowel.

Originally posted by caremuchless

Originally posted by nomatics856

I thought mmorpgs were about progression, if I automatically wanted to get into the fray of things and have a game about 100% skill, wouldnt I play a twitched based FPS, mmorpgs should be 50% skill, 50% progression

I think posts like these, posts that are complete flame bait and without any proof, should warrant bans.

 

What? Why? RPGs have just about always been about the building and progression of a character. Your skill is represented by the knowldge you have of the systems in place, as well as mechanics used. This is a completely different skill set than what you find in an FPS or other genres.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Which is why I've been saying GW2 isn't really a "proper" MMORPG in the traditional sense because they've tried very hard to reduce/minimize the progression aspect of it and flatten it out more into a FPS model of leveling the playing field for everyone.

But no matter what you call it, there is obviously a huge playerbase who want this sort of title, so it will do great.

If I remember correctly from one of the old interviews, ANet guys said that MMO is not a game design, it's the technology behind it.

http://www.guildwars.com/events/tradeshows/gc2007/gcspeech.php