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General Discussion  » Awesome World vs World | Yogscast

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50 posts found
  BadSpock

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7769

Logic be damned!

3/28/12 4:27:15 PM#21

Glad to see:

A) not mindless zerg

B) awesome small scale battles in scope of larger war

C) supply really, really matters

D) tactics and skill seem to outweigh numbers and certainly levels/gear

E) super long range of siege gives lots of room for flanking, more complex strategy

F) unless he's got some kind of mega-super powerful PC, incredibly smooth (only a few hiccups I saw in FPS)

Now Playing: Destiny, WoW

  achesoma

Novice Member

Joined: 5/05/05
Posts: 960

3/28/12 4:32:12 PM#22

Awesome.  This is how WAR should have been. 

  Betakodo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/16/12
Posts: 339

3/28/12 4:34:41 PM#23

Thanks for the link, but I don't get why people like Yogscast. I was linked one of their mincraft vids in the early minecraft day and instantly closed it the second I heard some guy making high pitched noises in an attempt to be funny.

  RizelStar

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 2824

We all breathe and we all die.

3/28/12 4:37:50 PM#24
Originally posted by BadSpock

Glad to see:

A) not mindless zerg

B) awesome small scale battles in scope of larger war

C) supply really, really matters

D) tactics and skill seem to outweigh numbers and certainly levels/gear

E) super long range of siege gives lots of room for flanking, more complex strategy

F) unless he's got some kind of mega-super powerful PC, incredibly smooth (only a few hiccups I saw in FPS)

This is what many forgot when the last blog went up.

Gold or Gems can't buy this stuff.

I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.

I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.

P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)

Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.

  BadSpock

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7769

Logic be damned!

3/28/12 4:43:06 PM#25
Originally posted by RizelStar
Originally posted by BadSpock

Glad to see:

A) not mindless zerg

B) awesome small scale battles in scope of larger war

C) supply really, really matters

D) tactics and skill seem to outweigh numbers and certainly levels/gear

E) super long range of siege gives lots of room for flanking, more complex strategy

F) unless he's got some kind of mega-super powerful PC, incredibly smooth (only a few hiccups I saw in FPS)

This is what many forgot when the last blog went up.

Gold or Gems can't buy this stuff.

Gear is just a handicap for skill anyway.

Nothing in MMOs is really that hard, MMOs with a focus on gear only give you the stats to make up for lack of skill in order to succeed in many cases.

I don't care if a person buys a +10% power item in the shop, they're still going to die when up against a vastly more skilled opponent.

Now Playing: Destiny, WoW

  Creslin321

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/27/09
Posts: 5424

3/28/12 4:50:41 PM#26
Originally posted by BadSpock

What makes me really happy?

This isn't Anet marketing spin.

This isn't professionally produced hype footage editted to sell it to us.

This is raw, actual in game footage of the systems and features actually working, live, in beta, with real players.

 

Does anyone remember seeing footage like this, that wasn't NDA breaches/leaks, for Illum in TOR?

For city sieges in WAR?

For keep sieges in AoC?

 

This clip in many ways reminded me a lot of WAR, but in other ways was very different.

I had a lot of fun in WAR keep sieges initially, but they gold old fast for one simple reason.  EVERY KEEP WAS THE SAME.  Same design, same tactics, same everything.  I remember the first keep siege I did was awesome, I bravely defended the keep from the ramparts with boiling oil before the enemy broke in with their battering ram, then I stalwartly stood on the final ramp keeping the enemy from killing your keep lord.

But then I realized that EVERY keep was this.  They ALL were essentially the same inside, and the same tactics were always employed.  It just got so boring.

One of the things I liked the most about this video and others is that they really show how much variety there can be in keep sieges.  All of the keeps I have seen look fairly different.  For example, this one had that rocky ledge that is accessible from only inside the keep from which you can set up artillery.  And really, the heavy use of artillery alone gives a lot of variety to sieges.

Maybe one siege is done with a heavy push and a siege golem.  Maybe another is done from a long distance with trebuchets.  And then the keep terrain comes into play...do you set up cannons on the rocky ledge to coutner possible artillery emplacements?  Or do you try for a more protected trebuchet deeper in the keep?  The again, do you anticipate that the enemy will break the wall and put some artillery on the inside of the wall to attack encroaching attackers.

VARIETY is the name of the game, and it looks like GW2 may have it :).

Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  Amjoco

Elite Member

Joined: 9/15/10
Posts: 4153

3/28/12 4:54:38 PM#27

That was fun to watch! I can't wait!

Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  UtukuMoon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/03/11
Posts: 1109

3/28/12 5:05:00 PM#28
Originally posted by BadSpock

What makes me really happy?

This isn't Anet marketing spin.

This isn't professionally produced hype footage editted to sell it to us.

This is raw, actual in game footage of the systems and features actually working, live, in beta, with real players.

 

Does anyone remember seeing footage like this, that wasn't NDA breaches/leaks, for Illum in TOR?

For city sieges in WAR?

For keep sieges in AoC?

 

 

To be honest you are right about WAR-SWTOR and AOC but even though i am an avid GW2 fan i have seen better in ArcheAge seige vids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8ymgFyzbDo

  Betakodo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/16/12
Posts: 339

3/28/12 5:07:48 PM#29
Originally posted by RizelStar

This is what many forgot when the last blog went up.

Gold or Gems can't buy this stuff.

Actually, you need gold to buy siege weapon blueprints don't you? Therefore gems can get you the blueprints. So gem buyers can buy the more expensive trebuchets instead of catapults more easily.

  Creslin321

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/27/09
Posts: 5424

3/28/12 5:08:23 PM#30
Originally posted by Sylvarii
Originally posted by BadSpock

What makes me really happy?

This isn't Anet marketing spin.

This isn't professionally produced hype footage editted to sell it to us.

This is raw, actual in game footage of the systems and features actually working, live, in beta, with real players.

 

Does anyone remember seeing footage like this, that wasn't NDA breaches/leaks, for Illum in TOR?

For city sieges in WAR?

For keep sieges in AoC?

 

 

To be honest you are right about WAR-SWTOR and AOC but even though i am an avid GW2 fan i have seen better in ArcheAge seige vids.

 I think ArcheAge and GW2 are going to be completely different games as far as sieges and PvP are concerned simply because...

In ArcheAge, as I understand you are fighting for keeps (pun intended).  In other words, if you take a castle, it is a castle that someone actually built from scratch, and you have that castle until it is taken back.  It will be a big deal and I think sieges won't be undertaken likely...also you can only do sieges at certain times.  So the sieges will be very meaningful, but happen much less frequently.

In GW2, you are fighting to win what is essentially a 2 week long "match."  You don't really have anything permanent at stake to lose in WvW.  So combat will happen much more frequently but will be less meaningful.

They are both good in their own ways.  Archeage will give you that great feeling of ownership and pride to defend your keep, while GW2 will give you lots of constant action and fun.

Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?

  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4114

3/28/12 5:09:05 PM#31
Originally posted by BadSpock

What makes me really happy?

This isn't Anet marketing spin.

This isn't professionally produced hype footage editted to sell it to us.

This is raw, actual in game footage of the systems and features actually working, live, in beta, with real players.

 

Does anyone remember seeing footage like this, that wasn't NDA breaches/leaks, for Illum in TOR?

For city sieges in WAR?

For keep sieges in AoC?

 

Exactly.  There is no "fakery" here, no "facade" of edited video or cutscenes just pure un adulterated gameplay in all it's glory and THE main reason I'm salivating over this game and just can not wait.  

One other game I know is doing this as well.  ArcheAge.  These 2 games have shown me more about them than any preview, review, or marketing ploy than all the MMORPGs in the last 10 years combined.

http://www.twitch.tv/elockethemmoaddict

https://twitter.com/MMOAddicted

  User Deleted
3/28/12 5:15:39 PM#32

My son and I watched to the end, and mists of pandoria was there and my son wanted to watch it.  So, I clicked on it, and he said, "oooooooo, it looks like wow", and I said it is wow.  And we both sat there laughing at how ugly everything was/is, and after a couple of minutes, I was just like, I'm closing this mess, and he said, "no, no, I wanta torture you"  lol  Anyway, just thought I'd mention that wow isn't completely without entertainment value.

  aesperus

Elite Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4847

3/28/12 5:38:10 PM#33

Great vids. Thanks for posting!

What I liked most about this vid, honestly, was the improvement in skill that the yogscast player seems to have gained. I even liked it towards the beginning when (simon?) asked 'when did u get good at video games?' and the response was 'oh, i'm not, I've just been lvling this character so I understand how to play him a lot better'.

The first video I saw of these guys, I thought they were idiots. However, they were playing quite well in this video. Not only did he hold his own in the keep, but he was also able to dish out a fairly decent amount of damage. I'm glad to see that the game is indeed not punishing people, but rather easing them into understanding it's mechanics.

The keep sieges do look very fun, and I can't wait. That keep did look like one of the smaller ones. I hope there will be options to purchase extra guards & such to help defend inside the keep. Looking forward to beta.

  RizelStar

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 2824

We all breathe and we all die.

3/28/12 5:42:41 PM#34
Originally posted by Betakodo
Originally posted by RizelStar

This is what many forgot when the last blog went up.

Gold or Gems can't buy this stuff.

Actually, you need gold to buy siege weapon blueprints don't you? Therefore gems can get you the blueprints. So gem buyers can buy the more expensive trebuchets instead of catapults more easily.

Can't buy supply, wow not same price but you could buy something but will need a certaint amount of supply.

Also gold and gems don't buy upgrades to fend off trebuchets lol.

Supply does all that.

Gold doesn't rebuild keeps, supply does.

Shall we continue?

I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.

I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.

P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)

Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.

  Master10K

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 3086

 
OP  3/28/12 6:01:16 PM#35
Originally posted by aesperus

Great vids. Thanks for posting!

What I liked most about this vid, honestly, was the improvement in skill that the yogscast player seems to have gained. I even liked it towards the beginning when (simon?) asked 'when did u get good at video games?' and the response was 'oh, i'm not, I've just been lvling this character so I understand how to play him a lot better'.

The first video I saw of these guys, I thought they were idiots. However, they were playing quite well in this video. Not only did he hold his own in the keep, but he was also able to dish out a fairly decent amount of damage. I'm glad to see that the game is indeed not punishing people, but rather easing them into understanding it's mechanics.

The keep sieges do look very fun, and I can't wait. That keep did look like one of the smaller ones. I hope there will be options to purchase extra guards & such to help defend inside the keep. Looking forward to beta.

Not to worry... That was an actual Tower they were defending and not a Keep (showed at the top-right). Keeps are much bigger an the Castle is the biggest structure in WvW. Also there will be upgrades. God bless ArenaNet.

  Requiamer

Novice Member

Joined: 5/20/05
Posts: 2054

3/28/12 7:07:30 PM#36
Originally posted by Brewsir

My son and I watched to the end, and mists of pandoria was there and my son wanted to watch it.  So, I clicked on it, and he said, "oooooooo, it looks like wow", and I said it is wow.  And we both sat there laughing at how ugly everything was/is, and after a couple of minutes, I was just like, I'm closing this mess, and he said, "no, no, I wanta torture you"  lol  Anyway, just thought I'd mention that wow isn't completely without entertainment value.

Well at least he play mmo, the favorite game of my son is a kind of sumo cat you have to feed with tons of sushi so he can save his little dog, and he kick me from the computer to play that...

  Shroom_Mage

Novice Member

Joined: 9/21/05
Posts: 871

It's all or nothin'!

3/28/12 8:35:47 PM#37

The two things that really stand out as being different from WAR are supply and safe zones.

WAR didn't have anything vaguely resembling supply. If the keep wasn't attacked for around five minutes the door would instantly reset. In GW2, starving a keep of supply by eliminating supply routes (the tower in the video had no supply routes) is extremely effective. They can't repair the door or walls, and they can't build siege weapons. You can't just turtle in a keep all day and expect to hang onto it.

Safe zones are another big deal. In WAR, a lot of keeps were a short walk from a friendly outpost. This made it too easy to zerg keeps, and there was nothing you could do about those safe zones, to which players often fled. Keeps in GW2 have towns inside of them. The ability to respawn in one of those towns is an upgrade that has to be purchased, and if the keep is taken, you completely lose that spawn point. It makes territory control much more dynamic than in WAR.

ArenaNet has a good chance of beating Mythic at their own game.

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss

  Zeroxin

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/21/06
Posts: 2518

My words are not here to sway you,they are here to make you understand.

3/28/12 8:41:15 PM#38
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by RizelStar
Originally posted by BadSpock

Glad to see:

A) not mindless zerg

B) awesome small scale battles in scope of larger war

C) supply really, really matters

D) tactics and skill seem to outweigh numbers and certainly levels/gear

E) super long range of siege gives lots of room for flanking, more complex strategy

F) unless he's got some kind of mega-super powerful PC, incredibly smooth (only a few hiccups I saw in FPS)

This is what many forgot when the last blog went up.

Gold or Gems can't buy this stuff.

Gear is just a handicap for skill anyway.

Nothing in MMOs is really that hard, MMOs with a focus on gear only give you the stats to make up for lack of skill in order to succeed in many cases.

I don't care if a person buys a +10% power item in the shop, they're still going to die when up against a vastly more skilled opponent.

I know a guy in DCUO who spent money to change his movement power just so he could get more skill points to beat people in pvp, to this day, this guy still cannot play without complaining that someone is hacking and all I hear on vent is how he's losing badly. It's always hilarious when people try to by power and fail.

This is not a game.

  Master10K

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 3086

 
OP  3/29/12 5:13:56 AM#39
Originally posted by Shroom_Mage

The two things that really stand out as being different from WAR are supply and safe zones.

WAR didn't have anything vaguely resembling supply. If the keep wasn't attacked for around five minutes the door would instantly reset. In GW2, starving a keep of supply by eliminating supply routes (the tower in the video had no supply routes) is extremely effective. They can't repair the door or walls, and they can't build siege weapons. You can't just turtle in a keep all day and expect to hang onto it.

Safe zones are another big deal. In WAR, a lot of keeps were a short walk from a friendly outpost. This made it too easy to zerg keeps, and there was nothing you could do about those safe zones, to which players often fled. Keeps in GW2 have towns inside of them. The ability to respawn in one of those towns is an upgrade that has to be purchased, and if the keep is taken, you completely lose that spawn point. It makes territory control much more dynamic than in WAR.

ArenaNet has a good chance of beating Mythic at their own game.

ArenaNet really do seem to be the masters of iteration, by taking an idea or interesting feature and iterating on it, until they can make it better. And from the various WvW vids that have been cropping up, it's certainly showing. Now the true test will be the upcoming Beta Weekend Events, where we can see nicely populated servers going up against each other.

  fiontar

Novice Member

Joined: 4/07/04
Posts: 3713

3/29/12 6:23:05 AM#40
Originally posted by BadSpock

That looks pretty awesome.

One somewhat skilled player being able to make such an impact, the last line in the sand etc.

Very cool stuff.

Especially like the catapults across the valley and how the narrator admits they should have spent more on defense and bolstering the keep for the next attack.

Sounds like the concept of supply in WvW is going to really change everything...

It will take time for strategies to develop and for people to believe in the strategies enough to do more than zerg. I noticed in the vid that the keep's supply depot was very limited and didn't refill, so there was no attention being paid to securing the surrounding resource camps and then guard the supply caravans.

A more organized effort to ensure the keep was well supplied would have made a difference and allowed better defense.

Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated

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