Originally posted by gu357u53r

Originally posted by Mavacar

Gonna buy character slots for real cash, planning on spending as much on the cash shop every month as I would if it was a subscription, but I won't use gems to get gold.

I respect you for what you just said.  I wish I could do that, but beyond the game access fee or box sale I don't see the point in thinking I should have to keep paying to access what I paid for already.  It is the setback of these games though they require a massive backend server and maintenance crew to keep the game running.  At least they respect that I am inhabiting their servers, and keeping the player population thriving by not having me pay to access ontop of the initial game fee.  So I will play as long as possible until the in game item & currency farmers start to ruin it by asking for real cash for something that is already obtainable by anyone.   It will take awhile, but eventually it will piss me off.  Because ultimately the developers don't care about it, they let it happen because it doesn't really affect anything financially for them.  If however gamers would stop cheating, and rise up to be more truthful and make it more about skill than spending extra money amongst themselves we wouldn't have to worry about this behavior.  But unfortunately there are going to be those bad few even coming from the developers side, maybe an ex-developer that was terminated, that will expose the exploit to start this never ending cycle of the cesspool of the MMORPG gaming industry.

Everquest 1 and Everquest 2 already do this.

Players spam the chat channels selling station cash for the cash shop for in game currency. So you can buy in game currency using your hard earned cash.

Anything that i feel that "I" need i will probably pay up front with cash, other then that i will check out the trading post for gold -> gem sale

Originally posted by blayugs

Everquest 1 and Everquest 2 already do this.

Players spam the chat channels selling station cash for the cash shop for in game currency. So you can buy in game currency using your hard earned cash.

The only legitimate way for the developers to sell in game items is if they were purely cosmetic, not tradeable, and require an access fee for the game.  The game however can not require a reoccuring pay to access fee.  If the game already has a reoccuring access fee then all items should be obtainable by all players, meaning there should be no other items sold on top even if they are cosmetic unless they have a clause in the agreement from the very beginning of the game.  If however the agreement changes after the game is released then they should be held liable for the damages they are causing their players.  The reason the game has to have an access fee, and not free to play is because then it allows Joe Schmoe the ability to resell it in game spamming the chat channel ruining it for everybody else in the game.  If however you require an access fee it forces you to be absolutely sure that is the in game cosmetic item you want to buy.  I am not knocking free to play games because this is about the only way I would agree with this sort of manipulation since you don't pay anything to play the game.  This is very hard for me to word properly as an online gamer.  One in particular that has standards for what makes an online game honest and fair for all online players involved, and I hope there are other gamers out there who share this same point of view.  I hope this made sense because it is very hard to word properly the way I feel about the fairness and honesty of an MMORPG that is fee required with a reoccuring pay to access payment model.

The only thing I'll be buying is 3 character slots, apart from that, the cash shop could have a level 90 sword and I wouldn't give two middle fingers.

If i like the game the way i think i will....

i will be buying gems both with ingame gold & with real money at some point to support game.

Originally posted by gu357u53r

Originally posted by blayugs

Everquest 1 and Everquest 2 already do this.

Players spam the chat channels selling station cash for the cash shop for in game currency. So you can buy in game currency using your hard earned cash.

The only legitimate way for the developers to sell in game items is if they were purely cosmetic, not tradeable, and require an access fee for the game.  The game however can not require a reoccuring pay to access fee.  If the game already has a reoccuring access fee then all items should be obtainable by all players, meaning there should be no other items sold on top even if they are cosmetic unless they have a clause in the agreement from the very beginning of the game.  If however the agreement changes after the game is released then they should be held liable for the damages they are causing their players.  The reason the game has to have an access fee, and not free to play is because then it allows Joe Schmoe the ability to resell it in game spamming the chat channel ruining it for everybody else in the game.  If however you require an access fee it forces you to be absolutely sure that is the in game cosmetic item you want to buy.  I am not knocking free to play games because this is about the only way I would agree with this sort of manipulation since you don't pay anything to play the game.  This is very hard for me to word properly as an online gamer.  One in particular that has standards for what makes an online game honest and fair for all online players involved, and I hope there are other gamers out there who share this same point of view.  I hope this made sense because it is very hard to word properly the way I feel about the fairness and honesty of an MMORPG that is fee required with a reoccuring pay to access payment model.

Sony has been double dipping for a while. You buy the game then pay a monthly fee and buy items from the cash shop or even buy cash shop currency and sell it in game to other players for ingame currency.

I played the first Guild Wars game through the Trilogy. Neever did buy EotN. I also never found a need to buy a single thing off the cash shop.

For GW2 I have a similar plan. I am not against the cash shop but I find everything on there useless. Occasionally there may be some costume or cosmetic armor set that I will want and I will also buy some Transmog stones to apply the stats from my other gear pieces. Other then that the boost potions are all pointless, and I find the chest keys pointless since I can just buy the items from players with gold if its somethign I want rather then paying cash for a key to get a random item from a chest that I may or may not like the result of.

I might get some gems for gold if I feel that i need more character slots or bank space. The rest of the stuff seems useless to me and I will only get those 2 things in worst case scenario.

I'll only buy expansions with real money. If I need something from the cash shop, I'll get gems with gold.

Cash for gems.  If demand is high, and it looks to be, the trade imbalance will favor the gem seller.

If its anything like others I've seen with this concept (Aeria does it with fun cards), it will end up like $5.00 for 20 hours work of wealth creation.  That's slave labor wage.

Originally posted by ActionMMORPG

Cash for gems.  If demand is high, and it looks to be, the trade imbalance will favor the gem seller.

 

If its anything like others I've seen with this concept (Aeria does it with fun cards), it will end up like $5.00 for 20 hours work of wealth creation.  That's slave labor wage.

 Bingo.

I think it's funny there are a lot of posts in this thread basically calling people who will buy gems and trade them for gold "suckers."  But who is more of a sucker?  Someone who grinds for 20 hours to save $5.00, or someone who spends $5.00 to save 20 hours of grinding?  Considering that $5.00 is less than minimum wage...I'll let you come to your own conclusions.

Personally, I'm not going to trade gems for gold just because I like the progression aspect of RPGs and I feel like "paying" for my gold would spoil it (which is incidentally why I don't like this whole idea in the first place).  But I realize who is going to get the better end of this bargain.

Neither as I disagree with the concept.  It is not a deal breaker providing ANET keeps its word on what the cash shop will be and its impact on the game, I will just chose not to take part.  

Personally I would feel MUCH better about the whole cash shop if they removed the selling of gems in game. Just my opinion

Originally posted by Melangel

Personally I would feel MUCH better about the whole cash shop if they removed the selling of gems in game. Just my opinion

 I agree :).  I know that GW2 isn't going to be a gear treadmill like many other MMORPGs, but I can't help but think that gold will offer SOME kind of advantage...otherwise it would be pointless.  So I mean, the two options here are either gold is completely pointless, or you can gain some kind of advantage with real money.

Originally posted by Creslin321

 Bingo.

I think it's funny there are a lot of posts in this thread basically calling people who will buy gems and trade them for gold "suckers."  But who is more of a sucker?  Someone who grinds for 20 hours to save $5.00, or someone who spends $5.00 to save 20 hours of grinding?  Considering that $5.00 is less than minimum wage...I'll let you come to your own conclusions.

Personally, I'm not going to trade gems for gold just because I like the progression aspect of RPGs and I feel like "paying" for my gold would spoil it (which is incidentally why I don't like this whole idea in the first place).  But I realize who is going to get the better end of this bargain.

You really don't need much money in GW2. The game is not focused on getting gold to get new stuff for.

You can still craft and play the market if you so wish but gold is a lot less useful than in say Wow or EQ. You will do fine with the gold you just get naturally while you play without grinding it forever.

So you could spend real money to get gold of course but what are you to do with it anyways? Besides the runes and new armor while you level up you really don't need much gold besides for repairing stuff.

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Melangel

Personally I would feel MUCH better about the whole cash shop if they removed the selling of gems in game. Just my opinion

 I agree :).  I know that GW2 isn't going to be a gear treadmill like many other MMORPGs, but I can't help but think that gold will offer SOME kind of advantage...otherwise it would be pointless.  So I mean, the two options here are either gold is completely pointless, or you can gain some kind of advantage with real money.

Indeed AND I would personally NOT have the gems in game in any LEGAL way. They are ALREADY being listed on gold selling websites for GW2 as well as GW2 gold. I googled yesterday to see. Illegal gold/item selling is in probably every game out there, and I prefer to be able to spot with ease peole who have bought their way through illegal means. Add to the fact one must be inconvenienced in order to be "convinced" to pay for a convenience and I am more then a little disappointed with ANet. Still there is time and we will see what happens come release.

Originally posted by Creslin321

 I agree :).  I know that GW2 isn't going to be a gear treadmill like many other MMORPGs, but I can't help but think that gold will offer SOME kind of advantage...otherwise it would be pointless.  So I mean, the two options here are either gold is completely pointless, or you can gain some kind of advantage with real money.

Well, extra character slots and more bank slots are a kind of advantages. So might looking really good be depending on who you ask.

If you want a character that have 20 different outfits you switch between and store the rest on the bank you will have a lot easier time if you spend some gems.

If you on the other hand just like hard dungeons or massive PvP you basically need a little gold to repair and to get new armor every 10 levels or so.

So some people will have some advantages from buying gems of course, but they are not really competetive edvantages.

Originally posted by Loke666

Originally posted by Creslin321

 I agree :).  I know that GW2 isn't going to be a gear treadmill like many other MMORPGs, but I can't help but think that gold will offer SOME kind of advantage...otherwise it would be pointless.  So I mean, the two options here are either gold is completely pointless, or you can gain some kind of advantage with real money.

Well, extra character slots and more bank slots are a kind of advantages. So might looking really good be depending on who you ask.

If you want a character that have 20 different outfits you switch between and store the rest on the bank you will have a lot easier time if you spend some gems.

If you on the other hand just like hard dungeons or massive PvP you basically need a little gold to repair and to get new armor every 10 levels or so.

So some people will have some advantages from buying gems of course, but they are not really competetive edvantages.

 Yeah, I mean what you consider an "advantage" is all up to personal interpretation.  Personally, I don't mind things that give you access to more characters, offer minor conveniences that are not attainable by just playing the game (like more bank slots), or allow you to pimp out your character cosmetically.  I tend to mind when cash shops offer:

A.  Items that provide a clear power advantage over players that didn't pay.

B.  Items that offer an alternative to grinding (gold for gems, exp scrolls, loot boxes, etc.)

C.  Items that are required to experience certain things in the game world (mystic keys possibly).

Originally posted by Loke666

I might get some gems for gold if I feel that i need more character slots or bank space. The rest of the stuff seems useless to me and I will only get those 2 things in worst case scenario.

Things you get for yourself (i.e. gems -> stuffs) you don't even need to exchange for gold... the items shown has gem costs associated to them. So you can buy gems then trade for items... no idea if you can buy them with direct cash though.

Personally; I will definitely be using my disposable income on the cosmetic items, and some of the convenience options, such as the character slots.

I don't see the XP or Karma boosts as an unfair advantage, nor do I see them as neccessary. The one thing I want out of Guild Wars 2 is a new experience, and I believe exploring and finding the various dynamic events currently going on in the area will fulfill that quite nicely if the videos are anything to go by.

I am more than happy to support the game with purchases that offer good player value, and the decision to buy gems is ultimately up to me and that is what I love about the system, because it allows me to determine what I would like to enhance my gaming experience, because I'm not going to be competing with anyone outside of Arena's and Multi-Server Conquest (WvWvW).