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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

General Discussion  » This game won't survive the short-term future.

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135 posts found
  ktanner3

Master

Joined: 3/19/06
Posts: 4144

Trolls will be ignored

3/26/12 1:52:29 PM#41
Originally posted by crysent
Originally posted by Syllendale
Originally posted by ktanner3
Originally posted by eddieg50

   I have to dis agree with the op and this is why.   People who play swtor play it for different reasons than say eq2 or wow,  People who like it- like it because of the story line, voice overs, cut scenes, excellent sound, companions, small group fun, social points, star wars, . Bioware will continually make new content and that will keep old players and add new. My only hope is that they change the space game into something more substantial, but what they have now in terms of story etc will certainly keep me around

Me too and this analysis is spot on. The things that posters here gripe about TOR not having are things I could give two shits about. What TOR DOES have is more than enough to keep me playing in the foreseeable future. The games they keep trumpeting as being the death knell for TOR (GW2 , Archeage,Tera,Planetside 2) have absolutely NO appeal to me whatsoever. Plus, if I'm already having fun in one MMO, why in the world would I leave it to try something else? It's also interesting that two of those are sequels to games that had a very niche audience. I highly doubt they will be pulling TOR's target audience away. But I guess there's no harm in dreaming.

 

I laughed abit with the line I highlighted, and I agree with both those posters. The thing I truly find just mind blowing is, what seems to be the total desire to find negatives with everything. I see it like this.. If there is a game that you dont like but others do, why should it bug you enough to post about its negatives? True people like to be informed but this type of thread is a mere speculation rather than a fact that somethings wrong with it.  I"ve posted before about such a thing in games and I"ll say it, yet again, here. I dont like WoW for many reasons, one being the people playing it now , but I want it to continue to succeed as much , if not better than it is now for many years... Here is why... It keeps those with that short term mentality out of the game of my choice, making the game of my choice that more enjoyable. Enjoy, and please if you take a cookie from the tray,  USE the tongs.. thanks :)

Look - for some strange reason this post is being hijacked by fanboys:  THIS POST IS NOT A REVIEW OF THE GAME - no where in my op or any post that followed did I call ToR a bad game or anything of that sort.  This post is on the longevity of the game in the short term future.  In fact, I said ToR was a good game for a month or two.

I don't want this post to turn into "if you don't have anything good to say abou tthe game then go away"

As for the post asking what the consequence to ToR 'failing' would be - As I said, hopefully a lesson to gaming companies that the 'wow cloneage' is growing stale.

I invested money in this game (1 CE copy) I played at relase with my guild - I won't lie, at least to us it was a let down for various reasons.  I have every right to discuss the future of the game.

Um.. where are either of us trying to stop you from saying what you want? Feel free to pick the lines and showcase them for us because we both were discussing the topic. Let me check the title again...

THIS GAME WON'T SURVIVE THE SHORT-TERM FUTURE

Yep, that's what I thought. Now how again was me and eddie hijacking the thread by stating our disagreement with your topic and our reasons why?

Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  Pyuk

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/21/05
Posts: 657

3/26/12 1:56:47 PM#42

It'll survive, much like Warhammer survived. It just won't be anywhere near the numbers retention EA and Bio were gambling on.

I make spreadsheets at work - I don't want to make them for the games I play.

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

3/26/12 1:58:08 PM#43

More too little too late.

A year before release a group of testers tried to rally the testers behind getting Bioware to notice what was missing and wrong with the game and they were hit with fanboys defending the game and making useless comments about "its just beta" and "give them time".

If a game in beta is lacking in something, say...good crafting for example. You KNOW the crafting is bad, a post is made about it...dont defend the damn company. Say you agree and that you hope the maker is aware that YOU ALSO WANT IT IMPROVED and move on...or dont post if you dont need better crafting.

Derailing those actually trying to make a game better is foolish even if they are trying to improve part of the game that YOU dont use. Bioware got away with ignoring most issues while making the game because of the lack of the beta community working together to test and make the game better...like so  many other games before it.

The reason the market has so many average games is 100% the fault of the players, the people buying and paying for the products. you are the consumer, they are the providers, if they are providing bland products continually its due to the consumer thinking he has no power or voice when in fact THEY DRIVE THE MARKET because they ARE the market.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  User Deleted
3/26/12 2:03:09 PM#44

I don't think the game is gonna go anywhere anytime soon, but they aren't gonna be keeping the supposed 1.7 million people they have now. BioWare isn't currently skilled, creative and/or ambitious enough to really take this game to where it could be. They need new game designers to really take things to new levels, and right now, we've seen what little thought has been going into this game. They're currently restricted to the inside of the box.

The writing and voice talent are top-notch - no one can argue that -  but unfortunately a great story doesn't make up for shotty, cut-and-paste game design and mechanics that have already been done far too many times before.

Sorry SWTOR/BioWare, you need to step up your game in a hurry.

 

  CujoSWAoA

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/27/04
Posts: 1848

"Pablo Picasso said art is a lie that tells the truth."

3/26/12 2:09:54 PM#45

Star Wars Galaxies was only shut down due to expired contract and the on-coming launch of LucasArts new baby TOR.

It wasn't shut down due to lack of subscriptions.

TOR will remain open for god knows how long.  Eventually it'll go free to play and offer up its cheap little dime store novel stories for free.

But thats about it.

  Zippy

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/24/03
Posts: 1428

3/26/12 2:16:01 PM#46

I disagree with the OP about new games. I have never seen the MMO market look worse. There are are almost no games in development that look interesting.  TSW and Tera both seem to be awful.  GW2 seems to be targetted to the ultra casual with limited content that people will grow bored of quite quickly.  Once a few months have passed it will likely will only be a side game for people to play when bored.  EQNext could be big but its SOE and its likely 2014 at the earliest.  Archeage lookslike the only inetresting game on the list but its a 2014 release at earliest .  ToR will live or die on its own.  Presently it seems to be dying quite fast.  But I am sure it will bottom out at some point and stabilize and then maybe have a revival in a year or two once the game gets enough contnet to support players.  What will be the bottom out figure 500k?  200k?  Who knows it certainly has the ability with its IP to bring in newe players. But I do agree that GW2 will take away many players in he short term.  GW2 will be massively hyped and will appeal the casual player base that plays ToR.  The question is where will these players go once they become bored of GW2.  There are not many options.  WoW and EQ2 are getting old and then there is Rift and ToR and that si it for AAA mmos that provide updated content.

  Ambros123

Novice Member

Joined: 12/04/11
Posts: 891

3/26/12 2:23:11 PM#47

It's not gonna die, SW fans and BW fans alone will keep the game going.  Will it continue to be P2P by the end of the year or throughout 2013 is another question.  All MMOs have their nitch groups.  If AoC, War, Fallen Earth and whatever else very lackluster games then I'm sure SWTOR will survive just fine.

  FrodoFragins

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/29/10
Posts: 2759

3/26/12 2:34:14 PM#48
Originally posted by crysent

As the title says, and mark my words.  While this game is doing fine now, and would survive the current market, the horizon for mmo gamers looks as bright as I can remember in the last decade or so.  A quick over-view of what will likely be released this year: Planetside 2, Guild Wars 2, and Archage (not to mention a few lesser knowns Dust and EverquestNext)  - Right now the genre is stale, but in the next year I have a feeling that these games will drain the population from most games currently on the market including ToR.

Planetside 2 will have little to no impact.  The same goes for Archage and TSW.

 

GW2 is the only one that can have an impact, but I think it will be negligable as well.

 

The only thing that will hurt SWTOR is BW and where they take the game.

  waynejr2

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/12/11
Posts: 3712

RIP City of Heroes!

3/26/12 2:46:04 PM#49
Originally posted by crysent

As the title says, and mark my words.  While this game is doing fine now, and would survive the current market, the horizon for mmo gamers looks as bright as I can remember in the last decade or so.  A quick over-view of what will likely be released this year: Planetside 2, Guild Wars 2, and Archage (not to mention a few lesser knowns Dust and EverquestNext)  - Right now the genre is stale, but in the next year I have a feeling that these games will drain the population from most games currently on the market including ToR.

While there are some innovative features in ToR for the most part its lackluster.  ToR took the safe route of cliche mmo mechanics and its going to bite them down the road when some of the more innovative and promising games release.  Call me a naysayer, a dooms day kinda guy, whatever.

Of course the game won't shut down, that's not what I mean, but we all know that MMO's usually die long before the company actually shuts them down.

The bright side (and I'm stealing this from another poster) is that ToR might have been the game that breaks the 'wow clone' market of MMO's.  Companies might start pushing away from that market and that is a good thing.

 

You can feed me lines about 1.2 and the voice acting and such but there is little doubt that ToR for the most part played it safe and I think it will bite them.

Your "foresight" is so vague, it could apply to many situations and you could claim you were correct.

How about you give specific numbers and dates.  Concrete number we can verify your prediction.

  Robsolf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/06
Posts: 3996

Let go of my ears, I know what I'm doing!

3/26/12 3:26:51 PM#50
Originally posted by crysent

No - I don't think it can unfortunatly, the fundamentals of the game are too themeparkish to the extreme.  There isn't much room to change.  Perhaps it could happen, anything is possible and my opinions only worth a cent, but I will stick by my prediction.

So, if it's the "themeparkishness" of the game that will kill it, then I suspect LotRO and many other "doin' just fine" games will just collapse into oblivion.  Even WoW...

I don't think so.  Those games will be fine, and so will TOR, at least based on that prediction.  The only real threat is GW2, and it's B2P. 

If TOR fails, it won't be because of the "themeparkishness".  Lots of players like that about the game.  When people do claim to like this game, it's generally BECAUSE of these aspects.  TOR's main problem is the brick wall at 50.  If they don't fix it, it will be the game's downfall, IMO.

  sonicbrew

Novice Member

Joined: 7/25/03
Posts: 518

3/26/12 3:29:56 PM#51
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by crysent

No - I don't think it can unfortunatly, the fundamentals of the game are too themeparkish to the extreme.  There isn't much room to change.  Perhaps it could happen, anything is possible and my opinions only worth a cent, but I will stick by my prediction.

So, if it's the "themeparkishness" of the game that will kill it, then I suspect LotRO and many other "doin' just fine" games will just collapse into oblivion.  Even WoW...

I don't think so.  Those games will be fine, and so will TOR, at least based on that prediction.  The only real threat is GW2, and it's B2P. 

If TOR fails, it won't be because of the "themeparkishness".  Lots of players like that about the game.  When people do claim to like this game, it's generally BECAUSE of these aspects.  TOR's main problem is the brick wall at 50.  If they don't fix it, it will be the game's downfall, IMO.

Man no offense but could you please stop with the blinding retna burning colors in all your posts seriously? I would also agree with both of you to a certain extent, however, comparing this game to LOTRO is laughable at best. Have you even played LOTRO?

“Once the game is over, the king and the pawn go back in the same box.” ~ Italian proverb

  User Deleted
3/26/12 4:37:40 PM#52
Originally posted by ignore_me

Very few games have actually closed doors and went dark. So what is the definition of "won't survive" that is being used here? I need clarification.

Actually, EA is closing down 14 games in the near future.

 

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2012/03/ea-announces-server-shutdown-for-14-games-citing-dwindling-player-numbers.ars

 

I don't think SWTOR will actually close down for a long time, but you never know with EA.  The definition of won't survive is if SWTOR  follows these game's demise.  EA isn't in it for the fun, it's all money, so if SWTOR can pay for its upkeep I'm sure we'll see it around for many years.

 

 

 

  noncley

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/16/12
Posts: 621

3/26/12 4:51:08 PM#53

I believe it will survive the short-term future but it soon we will see a lot of 'relaunches' and 'rebootings' that are used to sell chargeable expansions.

  ignore_me

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/04/11
Posts: 2034

3/26/12 4:51:09 PM#54
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by crysent

No - I don't think it can unfortunatly, the fundamentals of the game are too themeparkish to the extreme.  There isn't much room to change.  Perhaps it could happen, anything is possible and my opinions only worth a cent, but I will stick by my prediction.

So, if it's the "themeparkishness" of the game that will kill it, then I suspect LotRO and many other "doin' just fine" games will just collapse into oblivion.  Even WoW...

I don't think so.  Those games will be fine, and so will TOR, at least based on that prediction.  The only real threat is GW2, and it's B2P. 

If TOR fails, it won't be because of the "themeparkishness".  Lots of players like that about the game.  When people do claim to like this game, it's generally BECAUSE of these aspects.  TOR's main problem is the brick wall at 50.  If they don't fix it, it will be the game's downfall, IMO.

 

There's a brick wall at 50 because the theme park content ends at 50. So do you make more quests that the locusts will burn through in a week (and are right back to peeps being pissed), or do you open the game up to other activities that are more easily sustained by the players themselves.

Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011

  RefMinor

Novice Member

Joined: 7/16/11
Posts: 3541

Hipster

3/26/12 4:58:37 PM#55
Originally posted by ignore_me
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by crysent

No - I don't think it can unfortunatly, the fundamentals of the game are too themeparkish to the extreme.  There isn't much room to change.  Perhaps it could happen, anything is possible and my opinions only worth a cent, but I will stick by my prediction.

So, if it's the "themeparkishness" of the game that will kill it, then I suspect LotRO and many other "doin' just fine" games will just collapse into oblivion.  Even WoW...

I don't think so.  Those games will be fine, and so will TOR, at least based on that prediction.  The only real threat is GW2, and it's B2P. 

If TOR fails, it won't be because of the "themeparkishness".  Lots of players like that about the game.  When people do claim to like this game, it's generally BECAUSE of these aspects.  TOR's main problem is the brick wall at 50.  If they don't fix it, it will be the game's downfall, IMO.

 

There's a brick wall at 50 because the theme park content ends at 50. So do you make more quests that the locusts will burn through in a week (and are right back to peeps being pissed), or do you open the game up to other activities that are more easily sustained by the players themselves.

 

Plus if SWTOR cost 200m you have to assume VO scenes are extremely expensive to produce, they will not create more, certainly not class specific, or even faction.
  DaRoamer

Novice Member

Joined: 5/11/10
Posts: 252

3/26/12 6:53:51 PM#56
Originally posted by RefMinor
Originally posted by ignore_me
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by crysent

No - I don't think it can unfortunatly, the fundamentals of the game are too themeparkish to the extreme.  There isn't much room to change.  Perhaps it could happen, anything is possible and my opinions only worth a cent, but I will stick by my prediction.

So, if it's the "themeparkishness" of the game that will kill it, then I suspect LotRO and many other "doin' just fine" games will just collapse into oblivion.  Even WoW...

I don't think so.  Those games will be fine, and so will TOR, at least based on that prediction.  The only real threat is GW2, and it's B2P. 

If TOR fails, it won't be because of the "themeparkishness".  Lots of players like that about the game.  When people do claim to like this game, it's generally BECAUSE of these aspects.  TOR's main problem is the brick wall at 50.  If they don't fix it, it will be the game's downfall, IMO.

 

There's a brick wall at 50 because the theme park content ends at 50. So do you make more quests that the locusts will burn through in a week (and are right back to peeps being pissed), or do you open the game up to other activities that are more easily sustained by the players themselves.

 

Plus if SWTOR cost 200m you have to assume VO scenes are extremely expensive to produce, they will not create more, certainly not class specific, or even faction.

They have already said they have more story content, with voice acting, coming this year.  They have also mentioned they have content in playable form that won't even be out until next year.

  Moaky07

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/24/07
Posts: 2199

MMO sandbox games are as exciting as watching paint dry.

3/26/12 7:16:36 PM#57
Originally posted by noncley

I believe it will survive the short-term future but it soon we will see a lot of 'relaunches' and 'rebootings' that are used to sell chargeable expansions.

Expansions are a great thing for themeparks. More area to engage in more PVE. I want to experience new areas as my character develops over time.

 

Having 2 expansions per yr for EQ was a bit much, as many zones were shipped that werent ready over the yrs. The POP cock block into Time broke the morale of a number of raiding guilds. I think 12 to 14 months is about the perfect timeframe between expansions. Longer than that a game gets restless individuals ala WoW, and shorter than that runs into the problems I mentioned with EQ.

Asking Devs to make AAA sandbox titles is like trying to get fine dining on a McDonalds dollar menu budget.

  wizlmtz

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/08
Posts: 21

mmmhmmmm

3/26/12 8:24:48 PM#58

I agree that this game won't last.   After being 50 for about month, there was nothing else for me to do. Im not hardcore & cleared all the endgame pve (norm, hard & nightmare modes). I'm full BM & Rakata (so easy to gear up compaired to vanilla) SWTOR does have better end game than WAR online, but that's not saying much! I played an Operative (probably because only 3% of the pop played) but if you play a more popular class your safe from the nerf bat. They won't nerf what everyone's playing, they can't afford the loss of subs. I know quite a few people who have already quit. Once Diablo 3 hits, (5/15/12) I doubt there will be much of a population & they'll have to merge servers. I should sell my account now while it has value. Anyone interested in it? :)

  RPGForever

Novice Member

Joined: 2/21/11
Posts: 118

3/26/12 9:37:16 PM#59

20% off? bad signal, most games do that after 1+ years after launch. Desperation? I think it will be free to play in a few months, so just have to wait till then.

  RefMinor

Novice Member

Joined: 7/16/11
Posts: 3541

Hipster

3/26/12 9:40:28 PM#60
Originally posted by RPGForever

20% off? bad signal, most games do that after 1+ years after launch. Desperation? I think it will be free to play in a few months, so just have to wait till then.

 

It's financial year end at the end of March, that's why they have all the free trials and now the 20% off.

 

As Yoda would say

 

Numbers falling, fear have the suits.
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