Originally posted by grndzro

only if the game dosent live up to it's hype.

GW2 will surpass it's hype. The previews and hands on experience tell us this quite clearly. 

On the flip side every pre launch piece of info on SWTOR pointed toward mediocrity.

So hyping games and having ridiculous expectations is okay, as long as you're the one doing it, if I read that correctly.

I don't think hype is an MMO's worst enemy.  I think creating a crappy MMO is an MMO's worst enemy.

Originally posted by Zekiah

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by grndzro

only if the game dosent live up to it's hype.

GW2 will surpass it's hype. The previews and hands on experience tell us this quite clearly. 

On the flip side every pre launch piece of info on SWTOR pointed toward mediocrity.

Wait what?

sorry this post is EXACTLY the hype problem.

GW2 WILL surpass its hype because we can all see into a crystal ball or becuase the very industry that hypes said they played it and it rocks?

Hype is a very effective marketing tool and one that most gamers fail to recognize prior to purchase.

Gamer junkies are their own worst enemies.

yes..I have found that gamers do tend to hyper focus and not notice the same pattern being ployed on them or think much outside of the box which should say something about myself because I am in fact a gamer myself

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by Zekiah

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by grndzro

only if the game dosent live up to it's hype.

GW2 will surpass it's hype. The previews and hands on experience tell us this quite clearly. 

On the flip side every pre launch piece of info on SWTOR pointed toward mediocrity.

Wait what?

sorry this post is EXACTLY the hype problem.

GW2 WILL surpass its hype because we can all see into a crystal ball or becuase the very industry that hypes said they played it and it rocks?

Hype is a very effective marketing tool and one that most gamers fail to recognize prior to purchase.

Gamer junkies are their own worst enemies.

yes..I have found that gamers do tend to hyper focus and not notice the same pattern being ployed on them or think much outside of the box which should say something about myself because I am in fact a gamer myself

Gamers are starting to catch on but will enough of them? Addiction is a terrible thing. 

JUST SAY NO!  

My point about the GW2 hype is that we'v seen plenty of info that is exciting. The Devs are not keeping a bunch of game details secret. We see everything that is going to be in game pretty much. 

So the hype really isn't hype but excitement over being able to play what we have seen.

Hype generally refers to hope.

There isn't many surprises surrounding GW2 and it's features. and we are still excited about it.

Originally posted by Sythion

 

I think the free advertisement gained from hype is invaluable. It may mean people buy your game and unsub, but those people probably wouldn't have bought the game without the hype anyway.

I think that developers and publishers need to be more mature about managing expectations, and have a clear view of who their game is not meant for. I think the MMO community would be so shocked by an honest discussion of a game's limitations and who will not enjoy it that it may gain a lot of respect instead of having the opposite affect of negative advertising that people likely fear.

In the end a game's success or failure is determined by how many people try it, and how good it is. Hype only matters for the first part.

Very well said.

The game industry is still in its infancy.  The flood of investors demanding a return on their investments... the race to find the next huge IP (The next "WoW")... the rush of non-gaming types looking to cash in on a successful bandwagon (marketing types, investor types, retailers)... it's a chaotic mess of take-the-money-and-run irresponsibility, ruining well-established franchises and brand names with the stroke of a pen.

It may take years for the dust to settle, but your comments are definitely in a direction that I'd hope to see the game developing community start to steer themselves toward.

After working for a few game companies myself, I can honestly say that --- for the most part---  marketing executives rank down there with lawyers on the grand scale of poorest excuses for human beings.  I've met a few exceptions, but they were gamers themselves.

Need to sell boxes?  Hype the crap out of your game and get those box sales!

Free to play game with fair microtransactions (LoL, Tribes)?  Create the most fun game possible!

Different business models definitely incentivize developers to behave in different ways.

Originally posted by BartDaCat

Originally posted by Sythion

 

I think the free advertisement gained from hype is invaluable. It may mean people buy your game and unsub, but those people probably wouldn't have bought the game without the hype anyway.

I think that developers and publishers need to be more mature about managing expectations, and have a clear view of who their game is not meant for. I think the MMO community would be so shocked by an honest discussion of a game's limitations and who will not enjoy it that it may gain a lot of respect instead of having the opposite affect of negative advertising that people likely fear.

In the end a game's success or failure is determined by how many people try it, and how good it is. Hype only matters for the first part.

Very well said.

The game industry is still in its infancy.  The flood of investors demanding a return on their investments... the race to find the next huge IP (The next "WoW")... the rush of non-gaming types looking to cash in on a successful bandwagon (marketing types, investor types, retailers)... it's a chaotic mess of take-the-money-and-run irresponsibility, ruining well-established franchises and brand names with the stroke of a pen.

It may take years for the dust to settle, but your comments are definitely in a direction that I'd hope to see the game developing community start to steer themselves toward.

After working for a few game companies myself, I can honestly say that --- for the most part---  marketing executives rank down there with lawyers on the grand scale of poorest excuses for human beings.  I've met a few exceptions, but they were gamers themsevles.

true..it doesnt feel like a young industry to us who live and breathe it but when the day is done MMO is not even one generation old.

Originally posted by Axehilt

Need to sell boxes?  Hype the crap out of your game and get those box sales!

Free to play game with fair microtransactions (LoL, Tribes)?  Create the most fun game possible!

Different business models definitely incentivize developers to behave in different ways.

Originally posted by BartDaCat

Originally posted by Sythion

 

I think the free advertisement gained from hype is invaluable. It may mean people buy your game and unsub, but those people probably wouldn't have bought the game without the hype anyway.

I think that developers and publishers need to be more mature about managing expectations, and have a clear view of who their game is not meant for. I think the MMO community would be so shocked by an honest discussion of a game's limitations and who will not enjoy it that it may gain a lot of respect instead of having the opposite affect of negative advertising that people likely fear.

In the end a game's success or failure is determined by how many people try it, and how good it is. Hype only matters for the first part.

The game industry is still in its infancy. 

And acts like a spoiled child.

The MMO industry has digressed over the years, not progressed. We have only ourselves to blame, we're the ones that have funded this greedy corporate beast.

You get what you pay for and personally, hype tastes like crap.

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by Axehilt

Need to sell boxes?  Hype the crap out of your game and get those box sales!

Free to play game with fair microtransactions (LoL, Tribes)?  Create the most fun game possible!

Different business models definitely incentivize developers to behave in different ways.

 Thats true, if you sell convenience in your cash shop, you are incentivised to create inconvenience in your game.

Yup, which is why games which only sell lateral playstyle unlocks (LOL, Tribes) are much more widely accepted than games which sell XP potions (and are incentivized to create mega-grinds.)

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by Axehilt

Need to sell boxes?  Hype the crap out of your game and get those box sales!

Free to play game with fair microtransactions (LoL, Tribes)?  Create the most fun game possible!

Different business models definitely incentivize developers to behave in different ways.

 

Thats true, if you sell convenience in your cash shop, you are incentivised to create inconvenience in your game.

bingo.

Hype is a fun part of the entertainment experience when used in moderation.  The key is to not *believe* the hype, to just let it wash over you but retain your skepticism.

When the hype for something that doesn't exist causes people to bash something that does exist, it's not fun any more.

Originally posted by Axehilt

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by Axehilt

Need to sell boxes?  Hype the crap out of your game and get those box sales!

Free to play game with fair microtransactions (LoL, Tribes)?  Create the most fun game possible!

Different business models definitely incentivize developers to behave in different ways.

 Thats true, if you sell convenience in your cash shop, you are incentivised to create inconvenience in your game.

Yup, which is why games which only sell lateral playstyle unlocks (LOL, Tribes) are much more widely accepted than games which sell XP potions (and are incentivized to create mega-grinds.)

LoL sells XP potions.

Hype may initially sell boxes, but that is a very short sighted approach. 

With the MMO genre, a game's lifespan is more important than intial box sales. We have yet to see a hyped game stay as strong after a year as it was hyped. 

Hype also seems to follow a ladder structure, the next step will always be better than the previous. "SWTOR sucks, GW 2 will be the savior of MMO's", and now it's "GW 2 sucks, Secret World will change it all", and after GW 2 it will be "Secret World sucks, Archeage will revolutionize!". 

Originally posted by Dusntmatter

Hype may initially sell boxes, but that is a very short sighted approach. 

With the MMO genre, a game's lifespan is more important than intial box sales. We have yet to see a hyped game stay as strong after a year as it was hyped. 

What makes you think MMO companies of today design games to last outside of quick box sales and a few months? These jackwagons are moving/firing/transferring staff before launch and most of them already working on their F2P model/scam.

They know exactly what they're doing and it has nothing to do with planning for longevity.

They want our cash and they want it NOW. Cash-in on the suckers and move on to the next crappy project. Rinse, repeat. Rinse, repeat.

Originally posted by Dusntmatter

Hype may initially sell boxes, but that is a very short sighted approach. 

With the MMO genre, a game's lifespan is more important than intial box sales. We have yet to see a hyped game stay as strong after a year as it was hyped. 

Hype also seems to follow a ladder structure, the next step will always be better than the previous. "SWTOR sucks, GW 2 will be the savior of MMO's", and now it's "GW 2 sucks, Secret World will change it all", and after GW 2 it will be "Secret World sucks, Archeage will revolutionize!". 

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by Dusntmatter

Hype may initially sell boxes, but that is a very short sighted approach. 

With the MMO genre, a game's lifespan is more important than intial box sales. We have yet to see a hyped game stay as strong after a year as it was hyped. 

Hype also seems to follow a ladder structure, the next step will always be better than the previous. "SWTOR sucks, GW 2 will be the savior of MMO's", and now it's "GW 2 sucks, Secret World will change it all", and after GW 2 it will be "Secret World sucks, Archeage will revolutionize!". 

 

ArcheAge isn't revolutionary, it's nostalgia in fancy clothing.

if archeage isnt revolutionary then to be fair no MMO is.

Originally posted by Zekiah

What makes you think MMO companies of today design games to last outside of quick box sales and a few months? These jackwagons are moving/firing/transferring staff before launch and most of them already working on their F2P model/scam.

subscriptions = money. 2 months play > revenue than a box sale if purchased from an in-store retailer. You'd have to be an idiot not to care.

Also, maybe don't be a conspiracy theorist if you want credibility.

Originally posted by Sythion

Originally posted by Zekiah

What makes you think MMO companies of today design games to last outside of quick box sales and a few months? These jackwagons are moving/firing/transferring staff before launch and most of them already working on their F2P model/scam.

subscriptions = money. 2 months play > revenue than a box sale if purchased from an in-store retailer. You'd have to be an idiot not to care.

Also, maybe don't be a conspiracy theorist if you want credibility.

well the problem is the options of possibilities.

its one of two possibles

1. either they are smart enough to be hoodwinking us this way

2. they all went to over priced colleges but are still amazingly stupid.

I am not sure which but most conspircy theories develop under the assumption that the people in charge are not actually morons which is the only other option.