I decided to give ToR a shot and a small break to playing WoW this weekend and share my impressions so far.

First a small introduction of myself : I am a fan of MMORPGs and have been since 2001 when I started in EQ1. Though I prefer the older generation of MMOs up to 2004, I keep an open mind to changes.

I would also say that I was a major fan of Bioware's back in the BG series and NWN series days. I played all of the older games except Jade Empire. Recently, I have played fewer of their games mainly because I did not enjoy DA that much and I dislike how Origin works. I haven't played ME2/3 or DA2.

I am also a moderate fan of Star Wars having really loved the first three films that were released when I was a kid, and I enjoyed KoToR, and SWG on top of many other SW games. I was really hyped up about ToR a few years ago until I found out that it was all going to be about the story. I then felt a lot more negative and decided to give this game a miss until it would shave off some of its initial price.

So, I went into this trial week not having very high expectations. I still wanted to see what it was all about though, because I like following the industry and such.

I will start with the conclusion first in case people want to skip most of my post. The game to me really seems to be a mixed bag and I am still on the fence about it. I feel better about the game now than I did going in, so I am glad I have tried it. Will I get it? I am not sure. I could see myself playing it for a month or two, but I feel that it is not really worth the subscription they ask for it.

Now to some specifics. I got in yesterday and leveled a cyborg Bounty Hunter to 10 on a PvE server. I am using the French client but rolled on an English European server. I am only checking out the PvE portion of the game. I mainly soloed but did group up once.

Downsides :

Right off the bat, I would say the very long download is perhaps the worst part of my experience so far. It took me half a day with a 300+ kb/sec connection. When they only give you four days to trial the game, this is quite considerable time lost. In my case, I only have 2 days to trial the game because I have no internet during the work week. I think BW should have released a smaller and/or a streaming client option for this weekend. I don't personally see why a weekend trial necessitates a 12 gig download, since people just getting into the game will most likely not get past a certain point. It shows to me some lack of preparation on their part.

Storyline, though it has some positive elements to it. The game is just so ridiculously on rails. I thought WoW was bad, but at least some times you still have to find quest hubs while running from one point of interest to another, there are still some hidden quests, and Blizzard does not mark doors or the like in green in the gameworld to show where you have to go next. The latter part I found broke immersion completely. The storyline makes grouping up choppier in the sense that you have to wait for dialogue to finish for other players (or for yourself), you have to decide whose story you are working on if you have limited time, etc. I also do not like at all the way that storyline areas block a second person of the same class on your team from being able to go in. What is the reason for that decision?? Also some of the side quests are directly regurgitated from ME. I was wondering which game I was playing at times.

Upsides :

Atmosphere, at least at low levels, is really good. It felt like an updated KoToR and the artwork picks up where the latter game left off. I am glad for that. The music is also really good, and helps add to the starwarsy feel. Despite my gripes with some really bad dubbing, the voice overs are a nice addition. Overall the French translation is excellent. Animations are really not bad for a Western MMO.

The game engine is very, very smooth. I encountered no bugs at all with the actual gameplay and I thought my laptop would not run the game very well, but it actually does, and that at 60 fps in most places. The client is also stable. I tested  the game for over 12 hours (not all of it at my keyboard) and there seemed to be no memory leaks, no hiccups, no crashes, etc. This game is just as stable as WoW and Rift...the two games I deem the most stable in the MMO industry.

UI, which might be a surprise since a lot of people hate it. It is ergonomic and less in-your-face than in some games. I actually like it and got used to it pretty much within a couple minutes of play. The fact that ToR uses the standard controls is good, if not great for a sci-fi game that does a lot of shooting.

Storyline is also a positive. I like the BH storyline, it is well-done and fitting. It is typical BW fare, but considering how many classes there are and each one has their own story at first, I find that there is some replay value (as long as you are fairly casual). I don't know for how long this lasts, as I have noted some posts say that the story grows boring at higher levels so I am guessing that it isn't for very long, which is a pity since I do not at the moment see what else brings longetivity to this game.

Moderate :

Combat is fine... it seems pretty generic and I don't really have much to say. If people are ok with WoW's and Rift's, they should be ok with ToR's. I did notice that in PvE you have to fight groups from early on. I might comment on this if I have more time later on since I just picked up the Mercenary specialized class.

Crafting seems ok and I like that it is handled differently from other games as far as the acquisition of materials goes. I need to try it out some more so I will comment on it later if I have the time.

Class progression and the feel of the BH class are just meh. I don't find the way the BH plays as compelling as classes in EQ2, WoW, VG, DAoC, etc.

Good lord, you cry about how long it takes you to download the game on your crappy internet connection. Seriously? 

He would probbly be able to play more than 12 hours if EA gave him more than a weekend to play. They really should have made the trial longer. Overall within the time limits it's a fair assessment.

Another portion of my impressions will be about the actual free trial itself and how it feels to me as a first-time ToR player.

Other than the comment about the 12 gig download, I will say that overall it was pretty good.

Signing up for the new account was quick and easy. I did not have any glitches.

Once I got into the game, the tutorial was not in my face. Discreet dialogue boxes appear at the side of the screen explaining the basics. For a new time player to MMOs, this might not be obvious enough. The dialogues end up in the codex at some point.

One thing I did find less helpful though is that the game did not explain things like cover in combat, how dodge works, etc. I am still unsure if there are commands that allow my character to dive for cover (I noticed that Imperial agents can do it, can BHs?) or if it even helps. It was also not so good at explaining the different crafting skills. I had to page back and forth from the codex to the game screen to figure out which skills to take for weapon crafting. I did find that a little annoying.

There was very little explanation of how the UI works too. Fortunately, if you have played something like EQ2, it is pretty intuitive, but a person brandnew to the genre might struggle with it at first.

I was surprised overall to see how little explanation there was... it was definitely a hands-off approach. This does not impact me since I can navigate the standard MMORPG UI and game mechanics pretty well by now, but again, new MMO players might get put off by that.

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I only have another half a day to play since that is what they have limited us to. This is mainly about the actual trial experience rather than the full game experience which I cannot cover. If you don't want to read my impressions (not a review, I do not score it at any point in my post), then don't. I want to see what other people have to say about it and share my impressions since this is what posting on these forums is all about.

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I wonder where this strange idea comes from that stuff you don't enjoy becomes more enjoyable the longer you do it ... If he doesn't like the on rails feeling or the cheesy BW decisions where you are either a saint, indifferent or evil after 12 hours, i doubt playing 12 days instead will make it seem any better.

Some things are fundamental, and the only thing that will maybe change your view on them is a severe head injury. Also i never revised my initial opinion of a game upwards, with a bit of experience and research its quite easy to see where a game is going and judging wether you will like it or not.

Originally posted by AZHokie54

Good lord, you cry about how long it takes you to download the game on your crappy internet connection. Seriously? 

 

 

Well, 350 kb/sec is about average for here in France, so yeah, it is actually an issue. The whole point of the trial I assume is to net some new folks in the game. If the average person has to take half a day out to download it, it is excessive. I am sure that some other people would be pretty annoyed by that. In contrast, WoW's free trial is up and running in about 15 minutes, EQ2's about the same. So let's see... half a day vs. 15 minutes...

Edit - EQ2's old free trial. Now of course, it is F2P...

SWTOR was always an itch to scratch for me..so i kind of used my brains..i didnt get to play much in beta cos of other commitments.but what i did do was keep the game in my system and kept updating it when a patch came out.i found it enjoyable to an extent but the one thing that stood out for me was the storyline..i never hit spacebar once in the 15 lvls of playing jedi consular and i was suprised how much i enjoyed it.

Saying that though,i can understand why people who wanted this game to be brilliant are so pissed off.the ui is bad,oyu cant go 10ft without being under attack from something.you lvl up way to easy and out level the quests you have.and the pixalated shadows is a real turn off..not saying that gfx are everything but you do expect better,ffs its 2012.character models are an abomination.

but if you put those things aside i did enjoy myself.started on a sith warrior or something like that..dunno i seem to be enjoying the sith side more..especially when your in conversation with quest giver ,being sith i try to give the most appalling answer possible,sarcastic responses as well.i love that.i guess being a brit with that dry sarcastic humour i can empathise with my character lol.

Combat is slow, that is the only downside for me. I mean the Global Cooldown is 2 seconds or more :S

Originally posted by Rocketeer

I wonder where this strange idea comes from that stuff you don't enjoy becomes more enjoyable the longer you do it ... If he doesn't like the on rails feeling or the cheesy BW decisions where you are either a saint, indifferent or evil after 12 hours, i doubt playing 12 days instead will make it seem any better.

Some things are fundamental, and the only thing that will maybe change your view on them is a severe head injury. Also i never revised my initial opinion of a game upwards, with a bit of experience and research its quite easy to see where a game is going and judging wether you will like it or not.

It is true that to give a proper review of the game I should play it for an extended period of time, at least getting a character up to max, or at least play for a few months. Things can change between the new player experience and that at max level.

However, these are my impressions from the trial. The whole point of this trial is to get some new players interested in ToR. The aspects I mention in my OP seem to me to be core of the whole gameplay of ToR except for perhaps the lacklustre feel of the BH class. I am fully aware that level 10 is just the beginning and perhaps things will get much funner with regards to class-specific gameplay.

I suppose the issue is that this trial should have wow'ed my socks off since I believe I fall into the player demographics of whom BW should be targetting, but I am not wow'ed. I am not revolted either. So I guess the F2P weekend was a moderate success in my case. I am hoping other people will join in and give their impressions.

Originally posted by Rocketeer

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I wonder where this strange idea comes from that stuff you don't enjoy becomes more enjoyable the longer you do it ... If he doesn't like the on rails feeling or the cheesy BW decisions where you are either a saint, indifferent or evil after 12 hours, i doubt playing 12 days instead will make it seem any better.

Some things are fundamental, and the only thing that will maybe change your view on them is a severe head injury. Also i never revised my initial opinion of a game upwards, with a bit of experience and research its quite easy to see where a game is going and judging wether you will like it or not.

    Actually, I see his argument as a fairly valid one.  The simple fact is that in only a few hours it is very hard to learn the ins and outs of ANY game, especially an MMO.  Longer play allows for more indepth understanding of the mechanics and how they interact.  So finding fault with the amount of time played by this OP really isn't all that unusual.  Now if the guy had played 30 hours or more, OR better yet gotten to level 30, than I would agree with you Rocketeer.

Originally posted by MurlockDance

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I only have another half a day to play since that is what they have limited us to. This is mainly about the actual trial experience rather than the full game experience which I cannot cover. If you don't want to read my impressions (not a review, I do not score it at any point in my post), then don't. I want to see what other people have to say about it and share my impressions since this is what posting on these forums is all about.

What they usually mean by that is "keep playing until you like it and then comment, or just don't comment at all".  No one should need more than twelve hours to form an opinion on an MMO.  A gamer with any experience in the genre should be able to get a fairly accurate read on a game within their first hour in-world.  In a case where there's a limited time trial, you're not only supposed to form an opinion in a short time frame, but you are given no choice. 

Some people just don't want to hear when an opinion runs counter to theirs.  Using the old canard about not giving the game a chance is the cheapest and most effective way of justifying the dismissal of contrary opinions out of hand.  They are basically saying, you're not competent enough to draw any kind of fair conclusions, so your comments should be disqualified.

Originally posted by GMan3

Originally posted by Rocketeer

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I wonder where this strange idea comes from that stuff you don't enjoy becomes more enjoyable the longer you do it ... If he doesn't like the on rails feeling or the cheesy BW decisions where you are either a saint, indifferent or evil after 12 hours, i doubt playing 12 days instead will make it seem any better.

Some things are fundamental, and the only thing that will maybe change your view on them is a severe head injury. Also i never revised my initial opinion of a game upwards, with a bit of experience and research its quite easy to see where a game is going and judging wether you will like it or not.

    Actually, I see his argument as a fairly valid one.  The simple fact is that in only a few hours it is very hard to learn the ins and outs of ANY game, especially an MMO.  Longer play allows for more indepth understanding of the mechanics and how they interact.  So finding fault with the amount of time played by this OP really isn't all that unusual.  Now if the guy had played 30 hours or more, OR better yet gotten to level 30, than I would agree with you Rocketeer.

This is just silly.

This is about impressions, the OP didn't call it an "in-depth review" or whatever. Anyone playing any game gets some first impressions within seconds, and 12 hours in is more than enough to talk about them.

So i got 1 week free trial to this game... First off Kotor is nr1 game on my list. its my favorite and i still have to do a yearly run true the game.. so why havnt i picked up SwTor, well simpley becuse i been tired of mmo for some time...

so whit this trial and 1 year whit out mmo i figuered i be doomed and pick it up quik.. arund 15 houers later im more on the fence then ever.

First off the Combat it feel slow and just clicky. No tacti in it, and over all it feel so much like wow and so far from Kotor orignal combat. i miss opption in lvl and so on... i miss the entere lvl system from kotor (dnd based i think).

Story: this is fine at some point but it feels also stactic, loved the part where side quest was intresting and had choise in em but over all my choise dosnt affeced thing at all, It dosnt seem to make seans to me. main story is fun but again its feels on rails, I start off like a sith and i will end up as a sith, rather where i culd fall from grace or even redame my self in Kotor in some ways.

Univers: Kotor world felt uniqe and for me at times better then the orignal univers. this feel like a mix of Old and New... rather then just old repoublic. cant realy put my finger on it but they seem to be forced to add elements from the moives that dont fit at all and it feels sad.

I clearly understand i migth be finshed whit mmorp I started back in 99 so its been some years, and i do get my fun in a moba in stead like lol, so maybe thats why. but i do feel abit disapointed why culd they just made Kotor 3, its just seem more rigth then a mmorpg considere the rich lore and all.

anyway my tugths.... will i play abit more, probley will i buy dubt it. if so its just to play true the main story and get to 50 so a month or so... guess i have to check wife agro on that part :O

Originally posted by Netspook

Originally posted by GMan3

Originally posted by Rocketeer

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I wonder where this strange idea comes from that stuff you don't enjoy becomes more enjoyable the longer you do it ... If he doesn't like the on rails feeling or the cheesy BW decisions where you are either a saint, indifferent or evil after 12 hours, i doubt playing 12 days instead will make it seem any better.

Some things are fundamental, and the only thing that will maybe change your view on them is a severe head injury. Also i never revised my initial opinion of a game upwards, with a bit of experience and research its quite easy to see where a game is going and judging wether you will like it or not.

    Actually, I see his argument as a fairly valid one.  The simple fact is that in only a few hours it is very hard to learn the ins and outs of ANY game, especially an MMO.  Longer play allows for more indepth understanding of the mechanics and how they interact.  So finding fault with the amount of time played by this OP really isn't all that unusual.  Now if the guy had played 30 hours or more, OR better yet gotten to level 30, than I would agree with you Rocketeer.

 

This is just silly.

This is about impressions, the OP didn't call it an "in-depth review" or whatever. Anyone playing any game gets some first impressions within seconds, and 12 hours in is more than enough to talk about them.

Yeah that is just silly. I have uninstalled MANY games within a much shorter time frame. First impressions do count, if a game doesnt get my interest within the first hour, I am unlikely to invest any more of my time into it.

Originally posted by GMan3

Originally posted by Rocketeer

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I wonder where this strange idea comes from that stuff you don't enjoy becomes more enjoyable the longer you do it ... If he doesn't like the on rails feeling or the cheesy BW decisions where you are either a saint, indifferent or evil after 12 hours, i doubt playing 12 days instead will make it seem any better.

Some things are fundamental, and the only thing that will maybe change your view on them is a severe head injury. Also i never revised my initial opinion of a game upwards, with a bit of experience and research its quite easy to see where a game is going and judging wether you will like it or not.

    Actually, I see his argument as a fairly valid one.  The simple fact is that in only a few hours it is very hard to learn the ins and outs of ANY game, especially an MMO.  Longer play allows for more indepth understanding of the mechanics and how they interact.  So finding fault with the amount of time played by this OP really isn't all that unusual.  Now if the guy had played 30 hours or more, OR better yet gotten to level 30, than I would agree with you Rocketeer.

You're kidding right? Once you've played the starter areas, you've learned the ins and outs of ToR. There is absolutely no difference between playing levels 1 through 10 and playing levels 11 through 50 outside of you get more skills due to having advanced class. You play the first instanced dungeon, you've played them all.

Originally posted by Unlight

 

What they usually mean by that is "keep playing until you like it and then comment, or just don't comment at all".  No one should need more than twelve hours to form an opinion on an MMO.  A gamer with any experience in the genre should be able to get a fairly accurate read on a game within their first hour in-world.  In a case where there's a limited time trial, you're not only supposed to form an opinion in a short time frame, but you are given no choice. 

Some people just don't want to hear when an opinion runs counter to theirs.  Using the old canard about not giving the game a chance is the cheapest and most effective way of justifying the dismissal of contrary opinions out of hand.  They are basically saying, you're not competent enough to draw any kind of fair conclusions, so your comments should be disqualified.

On the subject at hand I think it's best I've not yet read what the op had to say about TOR as that's irrelevant to where this topic has went IMO. That said..

What people usually mean by that is the first so many levels (or hours) in an MMO are completely different than the feel of levels (or hours) after. This is the case for many MMO's, AOC, Ryzom, EQ2, (basically any game with starter zones/islands) which is most. I won't even begin to mention games like EVE...

AS an example in TOR it took many hours of game-play before the game even allowed me to freely move where I wanted to move. The first few days (worth of play) of the game are almost entirely single player in design. It doesn't change a whole lot in that respect, but it does change. You can't even PVP on planets until halfway through the leveling process.

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

Yet if someone argues that 'professional reviews' are bogus as measuring quality of some AAA game you'll scream.  Even though that's about what they play as many of the AAA developers hand-hold them though set pieces at the corporate office.   Very few AAA devs give out the game/enough access so they can really understand it.

PCGamer, for example, played well under 40 hours.   Yet he guaranteed it would take 200 of class story to hit cap.   My hairy butt.   It takes 50 hours for a competent MMO player to run the quest hubs and hit 50.    If you skip the cutscenes, it takes under 30 hours.  

Now, I know not all people can do that.   But if you've played MMOs for a while and you undertand the combat systems, choke points, level design, quest hubs, minimizing travel paths...    Yeah, it's not so hard.   And you're not rushing.   I never rush.  I never grind-to-level.  I always play the story.    But if you're just moving along like an experience, competent MMO player, this Monty-Haul experience point model suited for a single-player game just pushes you up too fast.  

Originally posted by GMan3

Originally posted by Rocketeer

Originally posted by Whiskeydust
How bout you update this after you have put more than a messily 12 hours in ... Plus you lost me when you said The client/engine is fine ..pffft ... It's an mmo instead of writing a review, put the time in !

I wonder where this strange idea comes from that stuff you don't enjoy becomes more enjoyable the longer you do it ... If he doesn't like the on rails feeling or the cheesy BW decisions where you are either a saint, indifferent or evil after 12 hours, i doubt playing 12 days instead will make it seem any better.

Some things are fundamental, and the only thing that will maybe change your view on them is a severe head injury. Also i never revised my initial opinion of a game upwards, with a bit of experience and research its quite easy to see where a game is going and judging wether you will like it or not.

    Actually, I see his argument as a fairly valid one.  The simple fact is that in only a few hours it is very hard to learn the ins and outs of ANY game, especially an MMO.  Longer play allows for more indepth understanding of the mechanics and how they interact.  So finding fault with the amount of time played by this OP really isn't all that unusual.  Now if the guy had played 30 hours or more, OR better yet gotten to level 30, than I would agree with you Rocketeer.

Two things:

1.  The starter areas are, in many respects, the most polished and diverse areas of SWTOR, as well as most MMOs.   Developers quite understand that first impressions count and set the tone for the rest of the game. 

2.   What you do in any starter area is pretty much what you're going to do for every character on every planet level 1-50.   You won't, despite all the skills, ever really branch-out into complex combat, but will find the one or two GCD timer attacks that give you the best dps and you supplement with a knock-back and rage/heat/ammo skill to keep your dps potential up.

Bounty Hunter, Commando, Vanguard, IA, Smuggler, Jedi, Sith....    It was all the same.    Well over a score of worthless/unused/barely-used abilities clogging up my UI and a half-dozen (including heals and knockbacks) that I used.   Not because I wanted to be in a rut.  But because there was no stratagy to the fighting.    It just didn't matter.   The difference between a high-level raid boss fight and a set-piece 3-trash mobs single-player instane was pretty much just time and hit points.