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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » Similarities Between WoW & GW2 Abiliites

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55 posts found
  ariboersma

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 1817

3/17/12 5:45:58 PM#21
Originally posted by Fir3line

blizzard always does this, look at warhammer and wow, first time I saw a pull ability was in warhammer, few months later wotlk releases with a hero class with its own pull.

I could give many more eg.

>.< 2 words...

 

Mortal Kombat

  fony

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 799

3/17/12 5:48:34 PM#22

they took some pointers from the guild wars 2 trade show demos too. hunters starting with pets and getting rid of ammo...few months after gamescom 2010.

  ariboersma

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 1817

3/17/12 5:52:21 PM#23
Originally posted by fony

they took some pointers from the guild wars 2 trade show demos too. hunters starting with pets and getting rid of ammo...few months after gamescom 2010.

you cant even say that was from GW2, the WoW hunters had been begging for that for eons.. also they had promised no ammo or changed ammo for years. Of course they could have finally decided to do it because GW2 had. 

  Magnetia

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/07/11
Posts: 960

Any fool can know. The point is to understand.

3/17/12 5:54:34 PM#24

http://wow.joystiq.com/tag/yak-mount/

Dolyak stolen? Or just regular yak....CONSPIRACY>!?

The warlock already had a demonic portal teleport for personal use. I do wish they worked a little differently instead of sounding like a mirror skill.

It does seem like a few similarities exist but it's not like people haven't stolen off WoW. Also adding these features sound good theoretically but building a combat system from the ground up with the feature in mind is different.

The ranger ability for example. Take into consideration the combat system and the pvp in WoW. Ask yourself does the ranger have enough escape ablities to make the talent effective? How does this change player playstyles? How will the damage balance out in pvp? pve? Will people cry OP? How do I counter someone who thrives on distance if I do not have abilties to close distances?

There are major class balances to consider when introducing something different. I remember another MMO i played where I rolled a healer class. It was also the only archer class in that game. This class was one of the most powerful classes in the game because I was self buffing self healing with excellent single target damage. I can see where they were trying to innovate but you can see what I am saying that adding more isn't necessarily making it better.

 

edit edit - http://wow.joystiq.com/2012/03/17/the-care-and-feeding-of-warriors-toolkits-and-themes/

Just took the time to read the article. I think the writer has more ideas than the developer.

 

 

Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  andre369

Elite Member

Joined: 8/06/06
Posts: 662

3/17/12 6:04:13 PM#25

Really who cares? Never played WoW never will, so I don't care if there are similar skills or features as long as it makes GW2 better.

  ariboersma

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 1817

3/17/12 6:14:51 PM#26
Originally posted by Magnetia

http://wow.joystiq.com/tag/yak-mount/

Dolyak stolen? Or just regular yak....CONSPIRACY>!?

I laughed so hard.. this is a blatant ripoff of something so stupid to rip off... why on earth are their yak mounts?!?!? If anything a water buffalo would be more appropriate but such a silly mount.

  Magnetia

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/07/11
Posts: 960

Any fool can know. The point is to understand.

3/17/12 6:21:50 PM#27
Originally posted by ariboersma
Originally posted by Magnetia

http://wow.joystiq.com/tag/yak-mount/

Dolyak stolen? Or just regular yak....CONSPIRACY>!?

I laughed so hard.. this is a blatant ripoff of something so stupid to rip off... why on earth are their yak mounts?!?!? If anything a water buffalo would be more appropriate but such a silly mount.

I thought so at first but I think in the end it's just a yak haha.

Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  User Deleted
3/17/12 6:33:58 PM#28

There are so many borrowed, cloned, stolen or copied ideas in the MMO industry.

I really could care less. As long as what they take, works and makes the experience better.

Frankly there are enough concepts out there not being utilized that really do work, Someone could litterally put an entire MMO togeather paying very close attention to what it's potential market REALLY wanted, never come up with a single new or origianl idea, but simply recycling what was good from something else.

SWG-Modular Character building

Rappelz-One of the better pet systems in an MMO (in spite of it being an asian grindfest)

Anarchy Online- Basing character gear equipping requirements on stats instead of levels.

EVE -various degrees of effectiveness for any single piece of equipment based on skill distributions (Can do more with less)

War->Rift->GW2- Evolution of Dynamic content.

And this list can go on and on. In many ways almost alll MMOs brought something to the table.

That game would be a compilation of borrowed ideas with nothing origianl and could still potentially be the game that saved the genre.

 

So, If An took it from Blizzard.......Where did Blizzard get it from?

Who cares? Does it work?

  ariboersma

Novice Member

Joined: 9/26/11
Posts: 1817

3/17/12 6:37:50 PM#29
Originally posted by Magnetia
Originally posted by ariboersma
Originally posted by Magnetia

http://wow.joystiq.com/tag/yak-mount/

Dolyak stolen? Or just regular yak....CONSPIRACY>!?

I laughed so hard.. this is a blatant ripoff of something so stupid to rip off... why on earth are their yak mounts?!?!? If anything a water buffalo would be more appropriate but such a silly mount.

I thought so at first but I think in the end it's just a yak haha.

I see what you did there ;)

  gaeanprayer

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 2359

3/17/12 6:44:32 PM#30

WoW in its entirety is a combination of stolen ideas, not a single thing there is original. WoW's success was built on a more accessable version of existing MMOs and once they became a "giant" they stopped even trying to hide they were borrowing ideas. I do dislike them for this, but not because of the borrowing of ideas, which really isn't that big a deal to begin with (all MMOs do it). My issue is that everytime they change things to integrate ideas from other games, they alienate portions of their existing database; they're always after the numbers, and don't seem to care a lot for the people that loved the game the way it was. I don't play WoW, never will, but I still think that's incredibly unfair to the people who do.

As for the comparisons you (OP) made, they're trivial in the scheme of things and not sure they're such a bad thing. In fact, giving warriors banners a la GW2 is a smart move, IMO. Warrior-types could use a little more depth beside "HULK SMASH" in pretty much all games.

"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."

  Opinicus

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/14/03
Posts: 30

3/17/12 6:52:32 PM#31

My guess is it's probably why we havent seen anything yet about TITAN. Blizzard is waiting for a few games to come out (GW2 in particular) to play them and take what's good to add to TITAN hehe. A few months ago, they said they were playing TITAN, why not show it? heheh

  gainesvilleg

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/27/11
Posts: 1087

3/17/12 7:09:11 PM#32
Originally posted by Msenge
Originally posted by gainesvilleg
Originally posted by InkStorm

I can't help but get the feeling that WoW's panda expansion is copying ideas from GW2.  I'm not talking about everything but there are certain abilities that stand out.

 The pandas might be copying off of the Asuras actually LOL.  Both sickeningly sweet and I could only imagine a child or a girl playing them.  Many games have sickeningly sweet pokemon type characters though, as much as it annoys me ha.

Warriors, in particular, will get a war banner when the class never needed or required such a tool.  It brings nothing new to the class as certain abilities were removed so their functionality could be given to it.  Some could even argue that this ability is worse as it's a static buff/debuff that must be directly placed on the ground.

I think Rift (or was it WoW?) had banners you could place that buffed those around you.  I think they were battleground awards that you could equip as a trinket.  Don't think this was warrior specific though.  Point is, I think banners were done before GW2 as well.

The warlock's lvl 87 spell is practically the exact same thing as the mesmer's portal.  Think about how the mesmer's ability works and then read this tooltip description.  "Creates a demonic gateway between two locations.  Stepping into the gateway causes any party member to be instantly transported to the other gateway."  They're the exact same spell!

 I know this spell existed in the roguelike Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup as well.  Yeah, Stone Soup isn't an MMO but that spell concept has been around quite a while.  I don't think GW2 can claim it as its own invention.  Rift also had an ability to teleport to a location you chose earlier if you were within 100 yards of it (riftstalker ability)

The hunter's new powershot talent, while not exactly gamebreakingly hard to conceive, is the ranger's long shot which deals damage based upon the distance between the caster and his target.

 Damage varying by distance isn't a new concept in general, although i don't recall seeing that in another MMO.  But many RPG's have spell damage that vary's by distance for instance that I know.

Similarly, the rogue's new blanket invisibility reeks of the mesmer's veil ability.  Rogues are masters of silence and perfected that ability themselves.  How, though, would a rogue instantly silence and hide a heavily plated and clunky character like a warrior?  Now think about how they would instantly cloak a dozen warriors at the same time...  It just doesn't make sense,  If they used magic then maybe, but they don't and that's the reason it's a believable ability for a caster like the mesmer.

 That is stupid that a rogue would be able to make others invisible.  Pretty lame.

I could keep going but I feel this is a good stopping point.  Some of the other abilities they've released share a similarity but differ overall while others simply haven't been revealed yet.

Not sure any of those ideas above are a completely new concept to any recent or upcoming game...

Well I don't know of stone soup but that riftstalker skill sounds just like one of the many Assassin shadow step skills from the original GW game.  Also the banner skills bit was also in the original GW game (though they weren't moveable after first being placed).  We also saw the GW2 banner skills at Gamescom and PAX in 2010 so unless Rift banner skills were also shown before the game's release (which I honestly don't know as I didn't follow it) then GW had it beforehand.

I'm not saying everything else the op said was right/wrong but at least some of your points might be a bit off.

Probably, I was just responding to the post saying WoW versus GW2.  I didn't research the exact origin of some of those spells but I bet a gateway spell for instance is as old school as pen and paper D&D...

GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind"
1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN
2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements

  deathangell

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/15/06
Posts: 86

3/17/12 8:50:56 PM#33

I think what 90% of the WoW community fails to realize is that WoW wasnt the first mmo; there were countless others prior to it. What allowed WoW to be heavily successful and thus cause games that are released afterwards to be compared to it was that it came out at the right time and main stream/ dumbed down there game for casuals. Other mmos that have solid reviews though there population has dwendled(sp?) is due to the fact that is does not condition its game to the casual player base DAOC and final fantasy are tributes to this as both are solid PvE PvP games but because both had elitest communitys care bears were not drawn or willing to stick around. But on topic of course abilities are reused recycled and revamped all the time yes there are refreshing new combinations that are drawn within each new mmo but at the end if u want to try to search for where there origin is within "your favorite mmo" you will find it.

I think when your choosing to move on from a game you should first ask your self what is it your looking for. I my self had issues with WoW mass appeal to the casual player base i dont enjoy a boss that i struggled with when first released because the mechanics were tough to be dumbed down because bad and or casual players( im not saying there one in the same but usually casual does = less experiance considering experiance comes with practice) want to be able to do the content. (off on a tangent so ill stop)

 

summary: all mmo's come from another mmo before it; WoW is not the mother child of successful mmo's its just the birth place of casual gaming where casuals got to control the content the progression of balance and the downfall to what most hardcore gamers would find once was a great game.

  Sukiyaki

Elite Member

Joined: 8/14/09
Posts: 1210

3/18/12 7:12:51 AM#34

Nothing new to see here.

Its will just add to the endless list of "features" which will continue to be falsely attributed towards Blizzard/WoW by "copying it, cloning it, stealing it, etc...", whenever another game picks them up, including GuildWars2 either.

They copy design concepts, give it new names and call it their own and of course PR praises their own genius and hard work at least 5 times till everyone sucked it up. Dont need to say anymore than "Transmog"

They copy novel ideas, dumb them down/raise rewards/weaken penalties/rephrase names of minisclue feats to sound grand/turn it into another skinner box, for their casual target audience, even when breaking the very idea of the feature itself, like turning it into a mindless grind cathering to lower instincts, then call it "polished". See: glyphs, see achievement system.

If they are incapable or too lazy to copy some latest popular features of new games, they offer a watered down version, give it the same or similar name and feign to offer the same. See: Deathwing "dynamic event", PR staff calling all new static manually planted world events "dynamic", see Wintergrasp "open world" "sieges" aka mindless zerg and grinding walls minigame etc

 

But in the WoW centric perception of many deluded fanbois everything is a WoW clone until proven wrong, unless complete lack of similarities is visibly obvious to even non-gamer just looking at some pictures.

When someone points out the original source and lack of novelity, hordes of WoW fanbois will drop the usual buzzwords Blizzards PR department carefully hammered into their heads: "polish" and "improvement", which is feigning to defend the false tribute towards WoW, by turning it into a matter of subjectivity. Effectively they attempt to prove that one game copied a/multiple features from WoW, instead of the originial, based on their subjective opinion that improvement/polish somehow makes ripping off ideas "perfectly acceptable", while lack thereof means "cheap copycat". And of course WoW always wins out in every and each of their opinionated reviews making it the "good copy" ,while the others of course are subpar making them the "bad copies". And then it spun back to defend the false allegation and tribute to WoW, even when they have nothing to do with the subjective opinion of a WoWfanboy about the quality of WoWs contents based on ripped of and/or old established ideas and mechanics.

And if all of it doesnt help the "10 MILLIONS!! like it, they must have done sth. better" fallacy is brought up again.

Get used to it. Those who fall for it and delude themself to believe Blizzards well coreographed sharade, wont realize nor comprehend it for the very same reasons they fell and keep falling for the spin in first place.

Games borrow and learn from each other. Blizzards WoW lives from it. Saves hell of a lot brainwork and time too.

  BereKin

Novice Member

Joined: 1/22/12
Posts: 285

3/18/12 8:07:13 AM#35

If that is true, it means that Blizzard is getting desperate and trying to keep WOW alive anyway possible. But, not to be called hater, this is normal to happen. WOW is 7 years old mmo and it passed its prime. Once it was good game, but now is just a shadow of its former glory. It would be best for WOW and Blizzard to leave this mmo in peace while it can retain some mesure of pride and focus its resources on next gen of mmo (like there mystery "Titan" project) and other possible future games.

 

  Zeus.CM

Novice Member

Joined: 6/13/10
Posts: 1790

www.croatian-maniacs.com

3/18/12 8:10:49 AM#36
Originally posted by Master10K

Just sounds like Blizzard being Blizzard. That's all. Hopefully GW2 comes out first, so that we won't have too many arguements about who stole what, from whom.

The sad part is that whenever Gw2 comes out, WoW players will always accuse Gw2 for being WoW-clone...

  Dragonantis

Novice Member

Joined: 12/16/10
Posts: 967

3/18/12 8:14:22 AM#37

Games developers have been stealing ideas from each other for years. Blizz wants to compete mid 2012 so they want as many improvements to WoW as they can fit in, best way to do that is steal them from other games.

Its nothing really new.

  Lord.Bachus

Elite Member

Joined: 5/14/07
Posts: 8131

I believe in life before death... So dont forget to enjoy it while you still can.

3/18/12 8:44:11 AM#38
Originally posted by Crake_1

Games borrow things from each other all the time. If they didn't the genre as a whole wouldn't change over time.

GW2's WvW is heavily inspired by DAoC, for example. 

Thats what they do, obviously blizzards strattegy has been copy the things that are good and improve them to fit the Blizzard style...

 

Arenanet is copying that very important part of Blizzard, but they are improving on the improvement part and adding a little innovation here and there... If that works out better in GW2 then the orriginal concpets did remains to be seen, on paper they look like a good deal of fun.

 

I am so happy that these game companies dont work like telephone companies because then lawyers would have put the whole gaming industry to a halt.

Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations)
Currently playing : The Elder Scrolls Online

  Apraxis

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/28/05
Posts: 1242

3/18/12 8:50:29 AM#39
Originally posted by Dream_Chaser

Every idea in every Blizzard (not Blizzard North) game is stolen.

Warcraft, the original Warcraft, happened because they couldn't get a Warhammer license. So they just changed things around a tiny bit so that it didn't infringe upon the license, but it was obviously just an Americanised Warhammer. Starcraft, because once again they couldn't get the license, was just a Warhammer 40k game. Both borrowed liberally from strategy games that had come before.

In fact, the only Blizzard games I can think of that didn't just outright steal things were Diablo and Diablo II (hello Blizzard North!).

World of Warcraft continued the tradition by stealing the idea for resource nodes from Final Fantasy XI, just implemented slightly differently, raids from Everquest, and mechanics from a slew of MMOs that had come before. The thing is is that Blizzard often does exactly what other people have done but with more polish, more marketing, and a larger appeal to the lowest common denominator. What makes it work is that they know to only steal the good mechanics/ideas/settinngs.

Yeap. And they have done it incredible well since years. Thats the reason why they are on the top of the industry. Cant blame that.. at least not for that... but if everyone does it inovation will end. And the whole game industry will break down. But one or two parasits are not much of a problem. ;)

  expresso

Tipster

Joined: 3/10/10
Posts: 2066

3/18/12 8:54:54 AM#40

I give the WoW hate on this thread an 8 out of 10.

But on topic, all games borrow from other games, if not we'll all still be playing pong only in HD.

Why must we all try and fight over which is game better? cannot we all just get along?

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