Originally posted by Jason2444

I think they should indicate active events in a not-so-gamey way.

 

Instead of a big blip on the map to indicate a dragon attacking a town, why not show that it's happening by having giant pillars of fire and smoke radiating off the horizon?

 They have this in the game already. If you see smoke in the background chances are there is a dynamic event going on like a farm or village burning. Or if you see a flock of harpies circling in the sky. Weather changes can also be caused by or kick off an event.

Originally posted by Creslin321

I've watched a lot of gameplay videos from the beta and one thing I've noticed is that players tend to go to a scout, run to a hearts task location, finish the task, move onto the next location, just like you would in a quest-grind MMORPG.  The problem with this is that the whole point of the hearts tasks are just to get players in the vicinity of a dynamic event that may happen.  But since players just burn through these tasks so fast and then move on, they often seem to miss the actual dynamic event.

Without anything to tell the player that there is an active event going on, I worry that many people will just blaze through GW2 like any other quest-grind MMORPG.  Filling up heart after heart and very rarely encountering an actual event.

So I was thinking that it may be a good idea to have active dynamic events show up on a player's map, so they can zip to the location of the event once it starts.  This is how Rift worked, and it really helped people find where the Rift events were.

So what do you all think?  Is it a good idea to have active events pop up on your map?  Or will this hurt the feeling of exploration too much?

EDIT:  I put minimap up there previously...that was an error, I meant the big map.  Minimap only goes out a short distance from your character.

They already said certain npcs you find tell you about events taking place and sometimes help you find them.. There would be no point to these cool features if there was a big x marks the spot on the map..

I dont know (havent noticed it) how does it work right now. But if give us a "very specific" spot where each event takes place that would not be very good because then you will have every player camping specific events and forgetting about the rest of the zones.

I prefer to have some kind of hints to let me know events would take place nearby, not right here *points down on map*

Originally posted by evicton

Originally posted by Creslin321

I've watched a lot of gameplay videos from the beta and one thing I've noticed is that players tend to go to a scout, run to a hearts task location, finish the task, move onto the next location, just like you would in a quest-grind MMORPG.  The problem with this is that the whole point of the hearts tasks are just to get players in the vicinity of a dynamic event that may happen.  But since players just burn through these tasks so fast and then move on, they often seem to miss the actual dynamic event.

Without anything to tell the player that there is an active event going on, I worry that many people will just blaze through GW2 like any other quest-grind MMORPG.  Filling up heart after heart and very rarely encountering an actual event.

So I was thinking that it may be a good idea to have active dynamic events show up on a player's map, so they can zip to the location of the event once it starts.  This is how Rift worked, and it really helped people find where the Rift events were.

So what do you all think?  Is it a good idea to have active events pop up on your map?  Or will this hurt the feeling of exploration too much?

EDIT:  I put minimap up there previously...that was an error, I meant the big map.  Minimap only goes out a short distance from your character.

I actually have been getting the same feeling. And think they should be on the map, if you actually want them to be done that is.

On top of this I actually wish they'd remove these heart tasks all together. My understanding right now is you can go do the heart tasks and when your done, your ready to move on to the next zone. Now granted this is from the newbie zones, but I'm also worried most people are just gonna do hearts in there leveling unless you stick DE right in front of them and say hear  do this.

 

That's my fear as well...

People will nearly always follow the path of least resistance when leveling.  And right now, it's looking like doing hearts tasks like you were in a quest-grind MMO is that path.

The one thing that always made GW2 stand out from Rift and WAR is that, despite having a similar "public quest" (dynamic event) system, GW2's PVE leveling experience would be ALL dynamic events outside of the personal story.  Rift and WAR had public quests sure, but they had a normal quest grind too.  And more oft than not, the normal quest grind would dominate your gameplay experience simply because it was easy to use.

I worry that the same will happen with GW2 now that hearts tasks have been introduced.  They essentially provide you a way to play the game "like WoW" where you just bounce from node to node filling up a bar...or in this case, a heart.  I really want to make sure that the dynamic event system is not ignored because it's just "easier" to do hearts tasks.

One cardinal rule of game design is that no matter how great a system is, it's worthless if no one experiences it. 

I don't want them on the map.

If that happened then the majority of people in the zone would always be heading for the most popular events. Everyone would be doing the same thing and in the same places as each other. It would encourage event farming and turn the game into another linear, although more dynamic, treadmill rather than a explorable journey. Basically, it would make it 'more' themepark.

Originally posted by frogtown

Originally posted by Jason2444

I think they should indicate active events in a not-so-gamey way.

 

Instead of a big blip on the map to indicate a dragon attacking a town, why not show that it's happening by having giant pillars of fire and smoke radiating off the horizon?

 They have this in the game already. If you see smoke in the background chances are there is a dynamic event going on like a farm or village burning. Or if you see a flock of harpies circling in the sky. Weather changes can also be caused by or kick off an event.

Stuff like this would be fine as well.  But I don't think this is true for every single kind of event.  Maybe in a really major "town attack" event, you would notice it from far away.  But for an event where you have to escort a guy through a mine...there's going to be on real sign of it going on.

My only point is that people should have some notice from fairly far away that an event is happening.  Unless events are so frequent that you literally can't miss them (which seems unlikely from the videos I've seen), I foresee players missing events to be a potential problem.

Compared to impressions of the rest of the game, there were some fairly negative impressions of dynamic events from the press beta.  And these impressions all seem to be due to players just "missing" things.  For instance, PCGamer expressed that events didn't really change anything and were really no different than either a public quest ala WAR, or a normal quest ala WoW.  But it's likely that they just mistook hearts tasks for events or didn't bother to follow NPCs after an event's completion.

I just don't want players to miss a great part of the game because it wasn't made clear to them.

Why are people so desperate to completely get rid of all exploration in MMOs?

Originally posted by Vannor

I don't want them on the map.

If that happened then the majority of people in the zone would always be heading for the most popular events. Everyone would be doing the same thing and in the same places as each other. It would encourage event farming and turn the game into another linear, although more dynamic, treadmill rather than a explorable journey. Basically, it would make it 'more' themepark.

I think this will be happening anyway. Once people learn of where to find a few specific events, they'll (in mass) go to whichever they find the most fun or has the "coolest" outcome(s). IMO anyway.

Originally posted by Vannor

I don't want them on the map.

If that happened then the majority of people in the zone would always be heading for the most popular events. Everyone would be doing the same thing and in the same places as each other. It would encourage event farming and turn the game into another linear, although more dynamic, treadmill rather than a explorable journey. Basically, it would make it 'more' themepark.

Yeah this is a good point.  In Rift, people would just form a herd and run from rift event to rift event...it really made the game feel more linear and buided.

I feel like my whole issue with this is really caused by the scout system (and hearts tasks), even though it seems like I'm supporting it.  The scout system points you to, what are essentially WoW quests, in an area where dynamic events tend to happen.  But it doesn't actually point you to currently happening events.  I just have this fear that this has the potential to turn "WoW quest-grinding" into a viable, and maybe even most popular, leveling strategy in GW2.  And I really don't want that.

I feel like if they have the scout system and hearts tasks...then they need to tell you when events are happening.  Otherwise, people will follow their guide (scout) and just do hearts tasks.

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by frogtown

Originally posted by Jason2444

I think they should indicate active events in a not-so-gamey way.

 

Instead of a big blip on the map to indicate a dragon attacking a town, why not show that it's happening by having giant pillars of fire and smoke radiating off the horizon?

 They have this in the game already. If you see smoke in the background chances are there is a dynamic event going on like a farm or village burning. Or if you see a flock of harpies circling in the sky. Weather changes can also be caused by or kick off an event.

Stuff like this would be fine as well.  But I don't think this is true for every single kind of event.  Maybe in a really major "town attack" event, you would notice it from far away.  But for an event where you have to escort a guy through a mine...there's going to be on real sign of it going on.

My only point is that people should have some notice from fairly far away that an event is happening.  Unless events are so frequent that you literally can't miss them (which seems unlikely from the videos I've seen), I foresee players missing events to be a potential problem.

Compared to impressions of the rest of the game, there were some fairly negative impressions of dynamic events from the press beta.  And these impressions all seem to be due to players just "missing" things.  For instance, PCGamer expressed that events didn't really change anything and were really no different than either a public quest ala WAR, or a normal quest ala WoW.  But it's likely that they just mistook hearts tasks for events or didn't bother to follow NPCs after an event's completion.

I just don't want players to miss a great part of the game because it wasn't made clear to them.

They might need to do something at the end of an event to clearly let people know that there's a next step coming up shortly.  I think they mentioned waiting around a minute or so to see if something new happens, but that may as well be an hour for the average gamer.  We tend to move along pretty quickly once we "finish" something, to look for something else to do.  By the time a minute passes, I can see most people being well gone before the next link in the chain begins.  That would certainly give the impression that DEs are standalone public quests, similar to WAR.

Nha i think its good how they do it. If it is marked on the map those events will be overloaded with people creating lag and everything bad attached. The fact you know they happen if you are close on the map is enough, if you find a good event, you'll probably call some friends, or ask some help in the chat anyway.

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by Vannor

I don't want them on the map.

If that happened then the majority of people in the zone would always be heading for the most popular events. Everyone would be doing the same thing and in the same places as each other. It would encourage event farming and turn the game into another linear, although more dynamic, treadmill rather than a explorable journey. Basically, it would make it 'more' themepark.

I think this will be happening anyway. Once people learn of where to find a few specific events, they'll (in mass) go to whichever they find the most fun or has the "coolest" outcome(s). IMO anyway.

 

I agree that it will happen anyway. But events on the map would make it easier and encourage people who usually wouldn't play like that to do it as well. It'll be just like what the QuestHelper addon did to the MMO industry all over again. A lot of people blame WoW for the stale gameplay these day, without realising that the real problem was caused by that addon for WoW.

I just want to re-iterate what some others have already said, which is that events are already indicated on the map, within orange-bordered circles. An escort event would have a shield icon within the orange circle, while a battle event has a crossed-sword icon within the orange circle. In both cases, the circle moves across the map if the event is in motion (such as with an escort event).

In the demo at PAX Prime last year you could see where The Sunless was going to land even before you got a pop-up notification, because of the huge orange circle on the map. And yes, I am referring to the larger map and not the minimap/compass.

In contrast, renown hearts don't have an orange circle around them, just the heart icon either empty or full on the map. You only get the orange circles around the renown hearts temporarily when you speak to a scout and they point out the areas of interest one at a time. The circles go away after that.

*I reserve the right to have a faulty memory, but this is how I recall it going down.

Originally posted by Creslin321

I've watched a lot of gameplay videos from the beta and one thing I've noticed is that players tend to go to a scout, run to a hearts task location, finish the task, move onto the next location, just like you would in a quest-grind MMORPG.  The problem with this is that the whole point of the hearts tasks are just to get players in the vicinity of a dynamic event that may happen.  But since players just burn through these tasks so fast and then move on, they often seem to miss the actual dynamic event.

Without anything to tell the player that there is an active event going on, I worry that many people will just blaze through GW2 like any other quest-grind MMORPG.  Filling up heart after heart and very rarely encountering an actual event.

So I was thinking that it may be a good idea to have active dynamic events show up on a player's map, so they can zip to the location of the event once it starts.  This is how Rift worked, and it really helped people find where the Rift events were.

So what do you all think?  Is it a good idea to have active events pop up on your map?  Or will this hurt the feeling of exploration too much?

EDIT:  I put minimap up there previously...that was an error, I meant the big map.  Minimap only goes out a short distance from your character.

I dislike the heart system on so many levels for this very reason.  Ive even seen it being commented on so many times in the press beta events where they described the Dynamic Event system as not being that good or not having a long chain.......WELLL NO DUHHH YOU DUMBTWIT, you are doing nothing but the heart quests.  People are so accustomed to being told where to go and what to do that I believe Anet should of totally gone away from the approach and forced players to have to explore their surroundings t oget to the content.  But thats just me.

Originally posted by sidhaethe

I just want to re-iterate what some others have already said, which is that events are already indicated on the map, within orange-bordered circles. An escort event would have a shield icon within the orange circle, while a battle event has a crossed-sword icon within the orange circle. In both cases, the circle moves across the map if the event is in motion (such as with an escort event).

In the demo at PAX Prime last year you could see where The Sunless was going to land even before you got a pop-up notification, because of the huge orange circle on the map. And yes, I am referring to the larger map and not the minimap/compass.

In contrast, renown hearts don't have an orange circle around them, just the heart icon either empty or full on the map. You only get the orange circles around the renown hearts temporarily when you speak to a scout and they point out the areas of interest one at a time. The circles go away after that.

*I reserve the right to have a faulty memory, but this is how I recall it going down.

So if this is true, then events are already on the map.  I would be interested to hear other impressions regarding this topic from people who played at a Con or the press beta if any press members are lurking.

Originally posted by Vannor

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by Vannor

I don't want them on the map.

If that happened then the majority of people in the zone would always be heading for the most popular events. Everyone would be doing the same thing and in the same places as each other. It would encourage event farming and turn the game into another linear, although more dynamic, treadmill rather than a explorable journey. Basically, it would make it 'more' themepark.

I think this will be happening anyway. Once people learn of where to find a few specific events, they'll (in mass) go to whichever they find the most fun or has the "coolest" outcome(s). IMO anyway.

 

I agree that it will happen anyway. But events on the map would make it easier and encourage people who usually wouldn't play like that to do it as well. It'll be just like what the QuestHelper addon did to the MMO industry all over again. A lot of people blame WoW for the stale gameplay these day, without realising that the real problem was caused by that addon for WoW.

I agree, I feel the same way about this implementation in games like The Elder Scrolls series as well. It has a tendancy to put players on the fast lane through the game world, and kills exploration.

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by Creslin321

I've watched a lot of gameplay videos from the beta and one thing I've noticed is that players tend to go to a scout, run to a hearts task location, finish the task, move onto the next location, just like you would in a quest-grind MMORPG.  The problem with this is that the whole point of the hearts tasks are just to get players in the vicinity of a dynamic event that may happen.  But since players just burn through these tasks so fast and then move on, they often seem to miss the actual dynamic event.

Without anything to tell the player that there is an active event going on, I worry that many people will just blaze through GW2 like any other quest-grind MMORPG.  Filling up heart after heart and very rarely encountering an actual event.

So I was thinking that it may be a good idea to have active dynamic events show up on a player's map, so they can zip to the location of the event once it starts.  This is how Rift worked, and it really helped people find where the Rift events were.

So what do you all think?  Is it a good idea to have active events pop up on your map?  Or will this hurt the feeling of exploration too much?

EDIT:  I put minimap up there previously...that was an error, I meant the big map.  Minimap only goes out a short distance from your character.

I dislike the heart system on so many levels for this very reason.  Ive even seen it being commented on so many times in the press beta events where they described the Dynamic Event system as not being that good or not having a long chain.......WELLL NO DUHHH YOU DUMBTWIT, you are doing nothing but the heart quests.  People are so accustomed to being told where to go and what to do that I believe Anet should of totally gone away from the approach and forced players to have to explore their surroundings t oget to the content.  But thats just me.

 

 

Completely agree.

My two biggest fears with GW2 right now are the trait system because it has the potential to pigeonhole people into specific roles, and the hearts system because it has the potential to make "WoW-esque quest grinding" a viable leveling strategy.

I'm big on exploring and the unknown. Most likely I will not talk to the scout and have the heart icons turned off and any other quest notifications off.  It gives me more of a sense of adventure. Especially with all the hidden areas like caves that have lore items you can collect.

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by Creslin321

I've watched a lot of gameplay videos from the beta and one thing I've noticed is that players tend to go to a scout, run to a hearts task location, finish the task, move onto the next location, just like you would in a quest-grind MMORPG.  The problem with this is that the whole point of the hearts tasks are just to get players in the vicinity of a dynamic event that may happen.  But since players just burn through these tasks so fast and then move on, they often seem to miss the actual dynamic event.

Without anything to tell the player that there is an active event going on, I worry that many people will just blaze through GW2 like any other quest-grind MMORPG.  Filling up heart after heart and very rarely encountering an actual event.

So I was thinking that it may be a good idea to have active dynamic events show up on a player's map, so they can zip to the location of the event once it starts.  This is how Rift worked, and it really helped people find where the Rift events were.

So what do you all think?  Is it a good idea to have active events pop up on your map?  Or will this hurt the feeling of exploration too much?

EDIT:  I put minimap up there previously...that was an error, I meant the big map.  Minimap only goes out a short distance from your character.

I dislike the heart system on so many levels for this very reason.  Ive even seen it being commented on so many times in the press beta events where they described the Dynamic Event system as not being that good or not having a long chain.......WELLL NO DUHHH YOU DUMBTWIT, you are doing nothing but the heart quests.  People are so accustomed to being told where to go and what to do that I believe Anet should of totally gone away from the approach and forced players to have to explore their surroundings t oget to the content.  But thats just me.

 

 

Completely agree.

My two biggest fears with GW2 right now are the trait system because it has the potential to pigeonhole people into specific roles, and the hearts system because it has the potential to make "WoW-esque quest grinding" a viable leveling strategy.

Agree again and those are pretty much my only two issues so far. But more so with the heart system I mean all through this games development we here about how this game is gonna be a different leveling experience because DEs were supposed to be the way to level. Then we have this heart system, which is essentially a quest hub that moves you throughout a zone.  

Now sure I might be able to avoid this system all together by doing DEs/wvw but as Creslin said people will go the path of least resistance. I really don't want to get into a situation where I feel like I'm soloing de's. Because the heart system is more effecient or whatever execuse the masses come up with to avoid having to wait for a de to potentially pop.

Sure the "major" ones might get people there regardless, but what about those out of the way ones. The ones that might be off the beaten path. 

Originally posted by evicton

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by Creslin321

I've watched a lot of gameplay videos from the beta and one thing I've noticed is that players tend to go to a scout, run to a hearts task location, finish the task, move onto the next location, just like you would in a quest-grind MMORPG.  The problem with this is that the whole point of the hearts tasks are just to get players in the vicinity of a dynamic event that may happen.  But since players just burn through these tasks so fast and then move on, they often seem to miss the actual dynamic event.

Without anything to tell the player that there is an active event going on, I worry that many people will just blaze through GW2 like any other quest-grind MMORPG.  Filling up heart after heart and very rarely encountering an actual event.

So I was thinking that it may be a good idea to have active dynamic events show up on a player's map, so they can zip to the location of the event once it starts.  This is how Rift worked, and it really helped people find where the Rift events were.

So what do you all think?  Is it a good idea to have active events pop up on your map?  Or will this hurt the feeling of exploration too much?

EDIT:  I put minimap up there previously...that was an error, I meant the big map.  Minimap only goes out a short distance from your character.

I dislike the heart system on so many levels for this very reason.  Ive even seen it being commented on so many times in the press beta events where they described the Dynamic Event system as not being that good or not having a long chain.......WELLL NO DUHHH YOU DUMBTWIT, you are doing nothing but the heart quests.  People are so accustomed to being told where to go and what to do that I believe Anet should of totally gone away from the approach and forced players to have to explore their surroundings t oget to the content.  But thats just me.

 

 

Completely agree.

My two biggest fears with GW2 right now are the trait system because it has the potential to pigeonhole people into specific roles, and the hearts system because it has the potential to make "WoW-esque quest grinding" a viable leveling strategy.

Agree again and those are pretty much my only two issues so far. But more so with the heart system I mean all through this games development we here about how this game is gonna be a different leveling experience because DEs were supposed to be the way to level. Then we have this heart system, which is essentially a quest hub that moves you throughout a zone.  

Now sure I might be able to avoid this system all together by doing DEs/wvw but as Creslin said people will go the path of least resistance. I really don't want to get into a situation where I feel like I'm soloing de's. Because the heart system is more effecient or whatever execuse the masses come up with to avoid having to wait for a de to potentially pop.

Sure the "major" ones might get people there regardless, but what about those out of the way ones. The ones that might be off the beaten path. 

 

Good to hear there is someone here who is just as concerned about the hearts system as I am.

I created a thread a while back to discuss how the hearts tasks are similar to WoW's quests, and how this could change the GW2 leveling experience.  And there was much scoffing and dismissing of my concerns lol :).

Despite that though...I still have my concerns.  After watching video after video of the press players just do a heart and then move onto the next one ala WoW...it definitely has me worried.