Trending Games | Elder Scrolls Online | ArcheAge | EverQuest Next | WildStar

  Network:  FPSguru RTSguru
Login:  Password:   Remember?  
Show Quick Gamelist Jump to Random Game
Members:2,856,863 Users Online:0
Games:742  Posts:6,242,277
Recent forum postsRSS
Active threads
Cloud view
List all forums
General Forums
Developers Corner General Discussion
Popular Game Forums
Click a status to find game forum
Game Forums
Click a letter to find game forum
A-C
2029 Online 2112: Revolution 2Moons 4Story 8BitMMO 9 Dragons A Mystical Land A Tale in the Desert III A3 ACE Online ARGO Online Aberoth Absolute Force Online Absolute Terror Achaea Adellion Aerrevan Aetolia, the Midnight Age Age of Armor Age of Conan Age of Empires Online Age of Mourning Age of Wulin Age of Wushu Aida Arenas Aika Aion Albion Online Alganon All Points Bulletin (APB) Allods Online Altis Gates Amazing World Anarchy Online Ancients of Fasaria Andromeda 5 Angels Online Angry Birds Epic Anime Trumps Anmynor Anno Online Applo Arcane Hearts Arcane Legends ArchLord ArcheAge Archeblade Archlord X Ascend: Hand of Kul Asda 2 Asda Story Ashen Empires Asheron's Call Asheron's Call 2 Astera Online Astonia III Astro Empires Astro Lords: Oort CLoud Asura Force Atlantica Online Atriarch Aura Kingdom Aurora Blade Auto Assault Avatar Star Battle Dawn Battle Dawn Galaxies Battle for Graxia Battle of 3 Kingdoms Battle of the Immortals Battlecruiser Online Battlestar Galactica Online Battlestar Reloaded Beyond Protocol Black Aftermath Black Desert Black Gold Black Prophecy Black Prophecy Tactics: Nexus Conflict Blacklight Retribution Blade & Soul Blade Hunter Blade Wars Blazing Throne Bless Blitz 1941 Blood and Jade Bloodlines Champions Boot Hill Heroes Borderlands 2 Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel Bound by Flame Bounty Bay Online Brain Storm Bravada Bravely Default Bravely Second Brawl Busters. Brick-Force Bright Shadow Bullet Run Business Tycoon Online CTRacer Cabal Online Caesary Call of Camelot Call of Gods Call of Thrones Camelot Unchained Canaan Online Cardmon Hero Cartoon Universe CasinoRPG Cast & Conquer Castle Empire Castlot Celtic Heroes Champions Online Champions of Regnum Chaos Online Child of Light Chrono Tales Citadel of Sorcery CitiesXL Citizen Zero City of Decay City of Heroes City of Steam City of Transformers City of Villains Civilization Online Clan Lord Clash of Clans Cloud Nine Club Penguin Colony of War Command & Conquer: Tiberium Alliances Company of Heroes Online Conquer Online Conquer Online 3 Continent of the Ninth (C9) Core Blaze Core Exiles Corum Online Craft of Gods Crimecraft Crimelife 2 Cronous Crota II Crusaders of Solaris Cultures Online Cyber Monster 2 Céiron Wars
D-F
D&D Online DC Universe DK Online DOTA DOTA 2 DUST 514 DV8: Exile Dalethaan Dance Groove Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark Ages Dark Legends Dark Orbit Dark Relic: Prelude Dark Solstice Dark and Light DarkEden Online DarkSpace Darkblood Online Darkest Dungeon Darkfall Darkfall: Unholy Wars Darkwind: War on Wheels Das Tal Dawn of Fantasy Dawntide DayZ Dead Earth Dead Frontier Dead Island Dead Island 2 Dead Island: Riptide Deco Online Deepworld Defiance Deicide Online Dekaron Demons at the Horizon Desert Operations Destiny Diablo 3 Diamonin Digimon Battle Dino Storm Disciple Divergence Divina Divine Souls Divinity: Original Sin Dofus Dominus Online Dragon Age: Inquisition Dragon Ball Online Dragon Born Online Dragon Crusade Dragon Empires Dragon Eternity Dragon Nest Dragon Oath Dragon Pals Dragon Raja Dragon's Call Dragon's Call II Dragon's Prophet DragonSky DragonSoul Dragona Dragonica Dragons and Titans Drakengard 3 Dream of Mirror Online Dreamland Online Dreamlords: The Reawakening Drift City Duels Dungeon Blitz Dungeon Fighter Online Dungeon Overlord Dungeon Party Dungeon Rampage Dungeon Runners Dungeon of the Endless Dynastica Dynasty Warriors Online Dynasty of the Magi EIN (Epicus Incognitus) EVE Online Earth Eternal Earth and Beyond Earthrise Eclipse War Ecol Tactics Online Eden Eternal Edge of Space Einherjar - The Viking's Blood Elder Scrolls Online Eldevin Elf Online Elite: Dangerous Embers of Caerus Emil Chronicle Online Empire Empire & State Empire Craft Empire Universe 3 EmpireQuest Empires of Galldon End of Nations Endless Ages Endless Blue Moon Online Endless Online Entropia Universe EpicDuel Erebus: Travia Reborn Eredan Eternal Blade Eternal Lands Eternal Saga Ether Fields Ether Saga Online Eudemons Online EuroGangster EverEmber Online EverQuest Next EverQuest Online Adventures Evernight Everquest Everquest II Evony Exarch Exorace F.E.A.R. Online Face of Mankind Fairyland Online Fall of Rome Fallen Earth Fallen Sword Fallout Online Family Guy Online Fantage Fantasy Earth Zero Fantasy Realm Online Fantasy Tales Online Fantasy Worlds: Rhynn Faunasphere Faxion Online Fearless Fantasy Ferentus Ferion Fiesta Online Final Fantasy Type-0 HD Final Fantasy XI Final Fantasy XIV Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn Firefall Fists of Fu Florensia Flyff Football Manager Live Football Superstars Force of Arms Forge Forsaken World Fortnite Fortuna Forum for Discussion of Everlight Freaky Creatures Free Realms Freesky Online Freeworld Fung Wan Online Furcadia Fury Fusion Fall
G-L
GalaXseeds Galactic Command Online Game of Thrones: Seven Kingdoms Gameglobe Gate To Heavens Gates of Andaron Gatheryn Gauntlet Gekkeiju Online Ghost Online Ghost Recon Online Gladiatus Glitch Global Agenda Global Soccer Gloria Victis Glory of Gods GoGoRacer Goal Line Blitz Gods and Heroes GodsWar Online Golemizer Golf Star GoonZu Online Graal Kingdoms Granado Espada Online Grand Chase Grand Fantasia Grepolis Grimlands Guild Wars Guild Wars 2 Guild Wars Factions Guild Wars Nightfall H1Z1 Habbo Hotel Hailan Rising HaloSphere2 Haven & Hearth Hawken Heart Forth Alicia Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft Helbreath Hellgate Hellgate: London Hello Kitty Online Hero Online Hero Zero Hero's Journey Hero: 108 Online HeroSmash Heroes & Generals Heroes & Legends: Conquerors of Kolhar Heroes in the Sky Heroes of Bestia Heroes of Gaia Heroes of Might and Magic Online Heroes of Thessalonica Heroes of Three Kingdoms Heroes of the Storm Hex Holic Online Hostile Space Hunter Blade Huxley Icewind Dale: Enhanced Edition Illutia Illyriad Immortals USA Imperator Imperian Inferno Legend Infestation: Survivor Stories Infinite Crisis Infinity Infinity Iris Online Iron Grip: Marauders Irth Worlds Island Forge Islands of War Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted Jade Dynasty Jagged Alliance Online Juggernaut Jumpgate Jumpgate Evolution KAL Online Kakele Online Kaos War Karos Online Kartuga Kicks Online King of Kings 3 Kingdom Heroes Kingdom Under Fire II Kingdom of Drakkar Kingory Kings and Legends Kings of the Realm KingsRoad Kitsu Saga Kiwarriors Knight Age Knight Online Knights of Dream City Kothuria Kung Foo! Kunlun Online Kyn L.A.W. LEGO Universe La Tale Land of Chaos Online Landmark Lands of Hope: Phoenix Edition LastChaos League of Angels League of Legends - Clash of Fates Legend of Edda: Vengeance Legend of Golden Plume Legend of Katha Legend of Mir 2 Legend of Mir 3 Legendary Champions Lego Minifigures Online Lichdom: Battlemage Life is Feudal Light of Nova Lime Odyssey Line of Defense Lineage Lineage Eternal: Twilight Resistance Lineage II Linkrealms Loong Online Lord of the Rings Online Lords Online Lords of the Fallen Lost Saga Lucent Heart Lunia Lusternia: Age of Ascension Luvinia World
M-Q
MU Online Mabinogi Maestia: Rise of Keledus MagiKnights Magic Barrage Magic World Online Manga Fighter MapleStory Martial Heroes Marvel Heroes Marvel Super Hero Squad Online Marvel: Avengers Alliance MechWarrior Online Megaten Meridian 59 : Evolution Merlin MetalMercs Metaplace Metin 2 MicroVolts Middle-earth: Shadow of Mordor Midkemia Online Might & Magic Heroes: Kingdoms MilMo Minecraft Mini Fighter Minions of Mirth Ministry of War Monato Esprit Monkey King Online Monkey Quest Monster & Me Monster Madness Online MonsterMMORPG Moonlight Online: Tales of Eternal Blood Moonrise Mordavia Mortal Online Mourning My Lands Myst Online: URU Live Myth Angels Online Myth War Myth War 2 Mytheon Mythic Saga Mythos N.E.O Online NIDA Online Nadirim Naviage: The Power of Capital Navy Field Need for Speed World Nemexia Neo's Land NeoSteam Neocron Nether Neverwinter Nexus: The Kingdom Of The Winds NinjaTrick NosTale Novus Aeterno Oberin Odin Quest Odyssey RPG Ogre Island Omerta 3 Online Boxing Manager Onverse Order & Chaos Online Order of Magic Original Blood Origins Return Origins of Malu Orion's Belt Otherland Forums OverSoul Overkings Oz Online Oz World Pandora Saga Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen Panzar Parabellum Parallel Kingdom Parfait Station Path of Exile Pathfinder Online Perfect World Perpetuum Online Persona V Phantasy Star Online 2 Phantasy Star Universe Phoenix Dynasty Online Phylon Pi Story Picaroon Pirate Galaxy Pirate Storm Pirate101 PirateKing Online Pirates of the Burning Sea Pirates of the Caribbean Online Pixie Hollow Planeshift Planet Arkadia Planet Calypso PlanetSide 2 Planetside Planets³ Playboy Manager Pocket Legends Pockie Ninja Pockie Pirates Pockie Saints PoxNora Prime World Prime: Battle for Dominus Priston Tale Priston Tale II Prius Online Project Blackout Project Powder Project Titan Forums Project Wiki Project Zomboid Puzzle Pirates Quest for Infamy Quickhit Football
R-S
R2 Online RAN Online RF Online ROSE Online Rage of 3 Kingdoms Ragnarok Online Ragnarok Online II RaiderZ Rakion Rappelz RappelzSEA Ravenmarch Realm Fighter Realm of the Mad God Realm of the Titans Realms Online Reclamation Red Stone Red War: Edem's Curse Regnum Online Remnant Knights Renaissance Repulse Requiem: Memento Mori Rift RiotZone Rise Rise of Dragonian Era Rise of Empire Rise of the Tycoon Risen 3: Titan Lords Rising of King Risk Your Life Rivality Rockfree Rohan: Blood Feud Role Play Worlds Roll n Rock Roma Victor Romadoria Rosh Online Roto X Rubies of Eventide Ruin Online Rumble Fighter Runes of Magic Runescape Rust Rusty Hearts Ryzom S4 League SAGA SD Gundam Capsule Fighter Online SMITE SUN Sacred 3 Sagramore Salem SaySayGirls Scarlet Blade Scions of Fate Seal Online: Evolution Second Chance Heroes Second Life Secret of the Solstice Seed Serenia Fantasy Seven Seas Saga Seven Souls Online Sevencore Shadow Realms Shadow of Legend Shadowbane Shadowrun Online Shaiya Shards Online Shattered Galaxy Sho Online Shot Online Shroud of the Avatar SideQuest Siege on Stars Sigonyth: Desert Eternity Silkroad Online Skyblade Skyforge SmashMuck Champions Smoo Online Soldier Front Soul Master Soul Order Online Soul of Guardian Space Heroes Universe Sparta: War of Empires Spellcasters Sphere Spiral Knights Spirit Tales Splash Fighters Squad Wars Star Citizen Star Sonata 2 Star Stable Star Supremacy Star Trek Online Star Trek: Infinite Space Star Wars Galaxies Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures Star Wars: The Old Republic StarQuest Online Stargate Worlds Starlight Story Starpires State of Decay SteelWar Online Stone Age 2 Stormfall: Age of War Storybricks Stronghold Kingdoms Styx: Master of Shadows Sudden Attack Supremacy 1914 Supreme Destiny Sword Girls Sword of Destiny: Rise of Aions SwordX Swords of Heavens Swordsman
T-Z
TERA TS Online Tabula Rasa Tactica Online Tales Runner Tales of Fantasy Tales of Pirates Tales of Pirates II Tales of Solaris Talisman Online Tamer Saga Tank Ace Tantra Online Tatsumaki: Land at War Terra Militaris TerraWorld Online Thang Online The 4th Coming The Agency The Aurora World The Banner Saga The Black Watchmen The Chronicle The Chronicles of Spellborn The Crew The Division The Hammers End The Incredible Adventures of Van Helsing The Incredible Adventures of Van Helsing 2 The Legend of Ares The Lost Titans The Matrix Online The Mighty Quest for Epic Loot The Missing Ink The Mummy Online The Myth of Soma The Pride of Taern The Realm Online The Repopulation The Secret World The Sims Online The Strategems The West The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt Theralon There Therian Saga Thrones of Chaos Tibia Tibia Micro Edition Tiger Knight Titan Siege Titans of Time Toontown Online Top Speed Topia Online Torchlight Total Domination Transformers Universe Transistor Traveller AR Travia Online Travian Trials of Ascension Tribal Hero Tribal Wars Tribes Universe Trickster Online Trove Troy Online True Fantasy Live Online Turf Battles Twelve Sky Twelve Sky 2 Twilight War Tynon U.B. Funkeys UFO Online URDEAD Online Ultima Forever: Quest for the Avatar Ultima Online Ultima X: Odyssey Ultimate Naruto Ultimate Soccer Boss Uncharted Waters Online Undercover 2: Merc Wars Underlight Unification Wars Universe Online Utopia Valkyrie Sky Vampire Lord Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Vanquish Space Vector City Racers Vendetta Online Victory - Age of Racing Vindictus Virtonomics Vis Gladius Visions of Zosimos VoidExpanse Voyage Century Online W.E.L.L. Online WAR (Warhammer Online) WAR2 Glory WYD Global Wakfu War Thunder War of 2012 War of Angels War of Legends War of Mercenaries War of Thrones War of the Immortals WarFlow Waren Story Wargame1942 Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium Online Warhammer Online: Wrath of Heroes Warkeepers Warrior Epic Wartune Wasteland 2 WebLords Wild West Online WildStar Wind of Luck WindSlayer 2 Wings of Destiny Wish Wizard101 Wizardry Online Wizards and Champions Wonder King Wonderland Online World Golf Tour World of Battles World of Darkness World of Heroes World of Kung Fu World of Pirates World of Speed World of Tanks World of Tanks Generals World of Warcraft World of Warplanes World of Warships World of the Living Dead WorldAlpha Wurm Online Xenoblade Chronicles: X Xenocell Xiah Xsyon Xulu YS Online Yitien ZU Online Zentia Zero Online Zero Online: The Andromeda Crisis Zodiac Online Zombies Ate My Pizza eRepublik

MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

General Discussion

General Discussion 

General Gaming  » Mass Effect 3 Reviews! question to the community

3 Pages « 1 2 3 » Search
47 posts found
  Ceridith

Novice Member

Joined: 11/24/09
Posts: 3001

The more you hype an upcoming game in your mind, the more it will fail to meet your expectations.

3/08/12 12:18:26 PM#21
Originally posted by Toxia
Originally posted by Ceridith
Originally posted by laserit

As long as people find ways to crack copy protection, companies will try to find new ways to fight it. It's a never ending circle. Remember when the first type of copy protection was having to keep the disc in your rig?

 

It sucks, but blame the right people for it. And just like everything else you buy , a decent percentage of the cost is to fight and make up for fraud and theft.

 

The people who are getting things for free is costing you, whether you like it or not.

It's only costing us because companies continue to assume that piracy is major problem. It's not, it's a very minor problem that has minimal impact on sales. Most people that pirate would never have paid a cent in the first place, and many people who do pirate end up purchasing the game anyways if they enjoy it.

There are several developers and publishers that have done away with all but basic and non-intrusive copy protection, and they're doing just fine. The problem are the few big name companies that think they're losing considerable sales due to piracy, when the reality is poor sales have far more to do with having a crappy product people are unwilling to pay the retail price for.

Fun fact, the games that have been the most pirated are also the same games that generated the most profit.

The issue of piracy as a problem has been blown out of proporation due to it being used as scapegoat for the industry to explain away poor sales of shitty games.

If anyone was around to read my ME2 rant post a few days ago, they know i was very very agaisnt even looking at ME3. After talking with some friends, however, they convinced me to at least give it a TRY before judging it based on ME2's performance for me.

It worked. I like the game alot, though i'm not very far in. I'll say that i DO feel some sort of disconnect from the events of ME2 though. I left me2 on cerberos' team, and came back for the alliance again, with no explanation of the in between parts. I also didnt import my save game from me2, and that could be where the disconnect is, i dunno yet.

To the part in green , though, i will admit i pirated ME3 to try before i bought, since me2 left such a bad taste in my mouth. I have bought it since then, because i think it is a worthy game. Still, the torrent i was using had 60 THOUSAND people downloading at the same time...

60k x 60 bucks(Standard edition) = about 3.5 million dollars. That Isn't minimal, and that was just for one torrent ^_^

Not that i'm opposed to pirating or whatever, as i said, i did 'try' it before i bought it myself.

But how many of those 60k downloads were also people trying the game, getting cracked versions to bypass origin, or simply would have never paid? Or how many of those are people that will still end up buying the game later when it drops to a more reasonable price? Or how many of those were people who bought the base game for $60, and are downloading the cracked version because they want the DLC without having to pay the extra $10 because they feel it should be part of the base game?

The problem is that there is no context to the download numbers, so assuming that one download is one whole lost sale is not realistic.

  Toxia

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/25/09
Posts: 1297

3/08/12 12:27:33 PM#22
Originally posted by Ceridith
Originally posted by Toxia
Originally posted by Ceridith
Originally posted by laserit

As long as people find ways to crack copy protection, companies will try to find new ways to fight it. It's a never ending circle. Remember when the first type of copy protection was having to keep the disc in your rig?

 

It sucks, but blame the right people for it. And just like everything else you buy , a decent percentage of the cost is to fight and make up for fraud and theft.

 

The people who are getting things for free is costing you, whether you like it or not.

It's only costing us because companies continue to assume that piracy is major problem. It's not, it's a very minor problem that has minimal impact on sales. Most people that pirate would never have paid a cent in the first place, and many people who do pirate end up purchasing the game anyways if they enjoy it.

There are several developers and publishers that have done away with all but basic and non-intrusive copy protection, and they're doing just fine. The problem are the few big name companies that think they're losing considerable sales due to piracy, when the reality is poor sales have far more to do with having a crappy product people are unwilling to pay the retail price for.

Fun fact, the games that have been the most pirated are also the same games that generated the most profit.

The issue of piracy as a problem has been blown out of proporation due to it being used as scapegoat for the industry to explain away poor sales of shitty games.

If anyone was around to read my ME2 rant post a few days ago, they know i was very very agaisnt even looking at ME3. After talking with some friends, however, they convinced me to at least give it a TRY before judging it based on ME2's performance for me.

It worked. I like the game alot, though i'm not very far in. I'll say that i DO feel some sort of disconnect from the events of ME2 though. I left me2 on cerberos' team, and came back for the alliance again, with no explanation of the in between parts. I also didnt import my save game from me2, and that could be where the disconnect is, i dunno yet.

To the part in green , though, i will admit i pirated ME3 to try before i bought, since me2 left such a bad taste in my mouth. I have bought it since then, because i think it is a worthy game. Still, the torrent i was using had 60 THOUSAND people downloading at the same time...

60k x 60 bucks(Standard edition) = about 3.5 million dollars. That Isn't minimal, and that was just for one torrent ^_^

Not that i'm opposed to pirating or whatever, as i said, i did 'try' it before i bought it myself.

But how many of those 60k downloads were also people trying the game, getting cracked versions to bypass origin, or simply would have never paid? Or how many of those are people that will still end up buying the game later when it drops to a more reasonable price? Or how many of those were people who bought the base game for $60, and are downloading the cracked version because they want the DLC without having to pay the extra $10 because they feel it should be part of the base game?

The problem is that there is no context to the download numbers, so assuming that one download is one whole lost sale is not realistic.

Again, i'm the first to say i don't know the reasons for others pirating it. not bucking your point atall, just throwing another light on it.

As i said, that was for ONE torrent, and i saw at least 6....as for the 'They were downloading the dlc because it was tooo much" arguement, that isn't true. if they bought the legit game, and intend to play multiplayer and not crack the game to get away from origin, they cannot pirate just the dlc, as origin checks that too each time you connect. Just throwing that out there, and its not my opinion lol. I own Omegastreamers.com, and we tried just that ^_^.

You are right, again, in that there is no context to why people pirate, or if they'll buy it later and such.

Just figuring, ASSUMING, in other words, that HALF of them will never buy the game, the numbers are still staggering.

The Deep Web is sca-ry.

  Unlight

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 2586

3/08/12 12:34:15 PM#23
Originally posted by Toxia
Originally posted by Ceridith
Originally posted by laserit

As long as people find ways to crack copy protection, companies will try to find new ways to fight it. It's a never ending circle. Remember when the first type of copy protection was having to keep the disc in your rig?

 

It sucks, but blame the right people for it. And just like everything else you buy , a decent percentage of the cost is to fight and make up for fraud and theft.

 

The people who are getting things for free is costing you, whether you like it or not.

It's only costing us because companies continue to assume that piracy is major problem. It's not, it's a very minor problem that has minimal impact on sales. Most people that pirate would never have paid a cent in the first place, and many people who do pirate end up purchasing the game anyways if they enjoy it.

There are several developers and publishers that have done away with all but basic and non-intrusive copy protection, and they're doing just fine. The problem are the few big name companies that think they're losing considerable sales due to piracy, when the reality is poor sales have far more to do with having a crappy product people are unwilling to pay the retail price for.

Fun fact, the games that have been the most pirated are also the same games that generated the most profit.

The issue of piracy as a problem has been blown out of proporation due to it being used as scapegoat for the industry to explain away poor sales of shitty games.

If anyone was around to read my ME2 rant post a few days ago, they know i was very very agaisnt even looking at ME3. After talking with some friends, however, they convinced me to at least give it a TRY before judging it based on ME2's performance for me.

It worked. I like the game alot, though i'm not very far in. I'll say that i DO feel some sort of disconnect from the events of ME2 though. I left me2 on cerberos' team, and came back for the alliance again, with no explanation of the in between parts. I also didnt import my save game from me2, and that could be where the disconnect is, i dunno yet.

To the part in green , though, i will admit i pirated ME3 to try before i bought, since me2 left such a bad taste in my mouth. I have bought it since then, because i think it is a worthy game. Still, the torrent i was using had 60 THOUSAND people downloading at the same time...

60k x 60 bucks(Standard edition) = about 3.5 million dollars. That Isn't minimal, and that was just for one torrent ^_^

Not that i'm opposed to pirating or whatever, as i said, i did 'try' it before i bought it myself.

EDIT to add that the multiplayer is really fun too. I really dont care for FPS multiplayer, with alll the hackers and 12 year olds screaming curse words at me just because they know them, but i really like the co op against the enemy, instead of each other. my first fps multiplayer i like ^_^

How many of those 60k bought the game just like you?  How many weren't going to buy it regardless?  How many are downloading it multiple times?  They are all being counted as lost sales by these companies, including you. 

That's why they can throw around these gigantic numbers to support their anti-piracy antics, while still showing healthy, if not enormous, profits.  Your story is the exact reason many of us fight against DRM tooth and nail, and why we scoff at the piracy figures that companies quote at us to justify ever more intrusive measures.

Now combine this with the idea that companies are well-aware that they are inflating these numbers to justify siphoning more money from your pocket.  As a consumer, you should be outraged.  Gamers however, are the ideal consumers from the corporate standpoint.  We tend not to question and ignore anything we don't want to hear.  We are consumate navel-gazers who, while handing over our wallets, are closing our eyes and sticking our fingers in our ears.  We're the perfect suckers.

  fenistil

Novice Member

Joined: 9/22/11
Posts: 3016

3/08/12 12:39:01 PM#24
Originally posted by laserit
 

 

As far as pricing goes: I've finally seen an increase in price lately, for the first time since the 80,s. Considering the production cost's of games now compared to back then, I'm surprised it took this long.

 

This is really simple.  

While cost per box have not increased , amount of boxes you sell increased dramatically.

Every half decently marketted game published by big (and some smaller) company have 1 mil + sales.

2-4 mil sales are nothing exceptional.  

There are games that are breaking 10 millions.

+ digital distribution allows for some comapnies to increase the profits ALOT if they sell game themselves. 

 

So that's why.

 

Game companies revenues & profits are MUCH bigger than in 80'ties. Cause gaming is much much more popular nowadays and audience is alot bigger. 

  laserit

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/10
Posts: 1460

Confusius say: Man who go to bed with itchy bum wake up with stinky finger

3/08/12 12:39:45 PM#25
Originally posted by Ceridith
Originally posted by laserit
Originally posted by Ceridith
...

 I have no idea what the actual numbers are for theft and piracy. It is a serious problem in every medium there is. It's a huge cost for business, governments, and the public period

 I cant stand DRM as much as anyone and I dont believe software companies do it for fun. They have real number's... we dont...

 ...

That's the problem though...

They don't actually have numbers with any tangible meaning with regards to making a real assessment of how much money is being "lost".

Yes, they have their sales figures, and where they can they also scrape a general estimation of downloads via checking torrent servers.

What they don't know however, is of how many of those people who downloaded the game, how many of those people still bought said game. There are people who re-download a game because they lost their disc, and even those who download a game to try it and end up buying it after deciding they like it. There are also countless people who would have never paid a cent for the game regardless if the download was available or not.

The misconception by the various IP industries is that they see these download numbers and just assume that every single one of those downloads is a "loss" in revenue. They simply do not have any context to actually prove that one download actually equals a lost sale.

I personally have re-downloaded an album via torrents that I actually bought the CD for, six times. The reason was because the original CD cracked, and I had to re-acquire the MP3s of said album over the years due to PC rebuilds and HD wiping. Even though I still paid for the album, the music industry would count that as six lost sales.

 It's just like any business, they have to find a way to minimise it. Just like stores find ways to minimise shop lifting, all the scanners and video survielance etc. etc.

 

If people were stealing from you, you would come up with ways to try  to stop them. It wouldnt matter how many or how much they stole from you.

 

DRM is the price we pay, because of the pricks stealing... pure and simple.

 

I hate paying for my gas upfront when I refuel my vehicle and being under video survielance when I do. But I dont blame the gas station or the oil company's for that.

Zenimax kicked my dog

  Zaltark

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/25/06
Posts: 430

3/08/12 12:41:32 PM#26

What happened to the days when you bought the full game and not a subscription to the game? I mean these arent MMOs, right? They dont make 'expansion packs' or 'sequels' anymore. They give you half a game then charge you for the other half. Its dumb :( Ive NEVER bought those DLC packs for any game Ive purchased.

  fenistil

Novice Member

Joined: 9/22/11
Posts: 3016

3/08/12 12:43:24 PM#27
Originally posted by laserit
Originally posted by Ceridith
Originally posted by laserit
Originally posted by Ceridith
...

 I have no idea what the actual numbers are for theft and piracy. It is a serious problem in every medium there is. It's a huge cost for business, governments, and the public period

 I cant stand DRM as much as anyone and I dont believe software companies do it for fun. They have real number's... we dont...

 ...

That's the problem though...

They don't actually have numbers with any tangible meaning with regards to making a real assessment of how much money is being "lost".

Yes, they have their sales figures, and where they can they also scrape a general estimation of downloads via checking torrent servers.

What they don't know however, is of how many of those people who downloaded the game, how many of those people still bought said game. There are people who re-download a game because they lost their disc, and even those who download a game to try it and end up buying it after deciding they like it. There are also countless people who would have never paid a cent for the game regardless if the download was available or not.

The misconception by the various IP industries is that they see these download numbers and just assume that every single one of those downloads is a "loss" in revenue. They simply do not have any context to actually prove that one download actually equals a lost sale.

I personally have re-downloaded an album via torrents that I actually bought the CD for, six times. The reason was because the original CD cracked, and I had to re-acquire the MP3s of said album over the years due to PC rebuilds and HD wiping. Even though I still paid for the album, the music industry would count that as six lost sales.

 It's just like any business, they have to find a way to minimise it. Just like stores find ways to minimise shop lifting, all the scanners and video survielance etc. etc.

 

If people were stealing from you, you would come up with ways to try  to stop them. It wouldnt matter how many or how much they stole from you.

 

DRM is the price we pay, because of the pricks stealing... pure and simple.

 

I hate paying for my gas upfront when I refuel my vehicle and being under video survielance when I do. But I dont blame the gas station or the oil company's for that.

Well there are companies and games released without DRM or with very 'light' DRM and they can do it.

So I can support them.

 

Thing is DRM does NOT help , 99% of DRM's are cracked instantly sometimes even before premiere and then DRM only punish LEGIT customers.

 

So yea I blame companies.

  laserit

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/10
Posts: 1460

Confusius say: Man who go to bed with itchy bum wake up with stinky finger

3/08/12 12:46:11 PM#28
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by laserit
Originally posted by Ceridith
Originally posted by laserit

As long as people find ways to crack copy protection, companies will try to find new ways to fight it. It's a never ending circle. Remember when the first type of copy protection was having to keep the disc in your rig?

 

It sucks, but blame the right people for it. And just like everything else you buy , a decent percentage of the cost is to fight and make up for fraud and theft.

 

The people who are getting things for free is costing you, whether you like it or not.

It's only costing us because companies continue to assume that piracy is major problem. It's not, it's a very minor problem that has minimal impact on sales. Most people that pirate would never have paid a cent in the first place, and many people who do pirate end up purchasing the game anyways if they enjoy it.

There are several developers and publishers that have done away with all but basic and non-intrusive copy protection, and they're doing just fine. The problem are the few big name companies that think they're losing considerable sales due to piracy, when the reality is poor sales have far more to do with having a crappy product people are unwilling to pay the retail price for.

Fun fact, the games that have been the most pirated are also the same games that generated the most profit.

The issue of piracy as a problem has been blown out of proporation due to it being used as scapegoat for the industry to explain away poor sales of shitty games.

 I have no idea what the actual numbers are for theft and piracy. It is a serious problem in every medium there is. It's a huge cost for business, governments, and the public period

 

I cant stand DRM as much as anyone and I dont believe software companies do it for fun. They have real number's... we dont. All I know is I'm totally fed up with all the pricks in the world constantly hacking, conning, frauding and stealing. Think DRM is bad? you should see some of the draconian piracy protection and service plans on proffesional software, they give DLC a whole new definition.

 

I'm not defending or for DRM in any way. It's just another example of the shitty direction our society has gone and is going. Just like back in the old days when you could leave your door unlocked... then you had to lock it... then you needed an alarm system... then needed a monitored alarm.... then you needed video survielance... and on and on and on...

 

Now I'll go play my game so I can forget about all the A-holes in the world for a couple hours.

 

cheers

 

 

isnt it ironic that the reason that quite a few games are pirated, is because the drm is so intrusive. when you take into consideration the cost of including the drm in the first place, then the fallacy of drms effectiveness from a sales point of view, is even more exposed, drm isnt really about game piracy.. what its really about is stopping people giving games they have bought, to their friends so they can play the game. 

I would argue that Origin and Steam make that more convenient then ever. 

Zenimax kicked my dog

  laserit

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/10
Posts: 1460

Confusius say: Man who go to bed with itchy bum wake up with stinky finger

3/08/12 1:03:15 PM#29

Fact: Tens of thousands of people downloading cracked versions of games through torrents.

Fact: People argue that gaming companies have no idea what is being stolen and what is being used as a demo etc. etc.

Fact: People that argue that gaming companies have no idea, have no idea themselves.

Fact: DRM is here to stay because of cracked copies being torrented.

Fact: If DRM dosnt work then software companies will move on to something else, which will probably be worse then DRM.

Fact: If people didnt crack and pirate software we probably wouldnt be having this conversation.

Zenimax kicked my dog

  Ceridith

Novice Member

Joined: 11/24/09
Posts: 3001

The more you hype an upcoming game in your mind, the more it will fail to meet your expectations.

3/08/12 1:57:05 PM#30
Originally posted by laserit

Fact: Tens of thousands of people downloading cracked versions of games through torrents.

Fact: People argue that gaming companies have no idea what is being stolen and what is being used as a demo etc. etc.

Fact: People that argue that gaming companies have no idea, have no idea themselves.

Fact: DRM is here to stay because of cracked copies being torrented.

Fact: If DRM dosnt work then software companies will move on to something else, which will probably be worse then DRM.

Fact: If people didnt crack and pirate software we probably wouldnt be having this conversation.

Fact: No matter how invasive of DRM becomes, it will always be cracked and made irrelevant.

Fact: The more invasive DRM becomes, the more it deters legitimate users from using purchased software than it is doing to prevent piracy.

Fact: Companies spend millions of dollars over years trying to develop DRM that is cracked within weeks if not days or even hours in some cases.

Most companies have long since gone overboard on DRM. There are several existing avenues that do decent enough mitigation of the issue. There are also even companies that have completely forgone using any DRM yet are still doing quite well in sales

I do not condone piracy, but at the same time I have absolutely no sympathy for companies that ruin their products for legitimate customers by forcing ineffective and draconic DRM down their throats. The industry has reached a point where in many cases the pirated version of a game is superior because it expressly bypasses any DRM that would otherwise cripple the game for a legitimate user.

The way for the industry to compete against piracy is to ensure that the purchased product is worth the price they're asking for. If they're offering something that's overpriced and hampered by excessive DRM, then it just encourages people to pirate instead. Right or wrong, it's human nature.

  laserit

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/10
Posts: 1460

Confusius say: Man who go to bed with itchy bum wake up with stinky finger

3/08/12 2:01:32 PM#31
Originally posted by Ceridith

The way for the industry to compete against piracy is to ensure that the purchased product is worth the price they're asking for. If they're offering something that's overpriced and hampered by excessive DRM, then it just encourages people to pirate instead. Right or wrong, it's human nature.

 Good games that are worth the price of admission are always pirated the most. It's the crappy ones that people couldnt be bothered pirating.

Zenimax kicked my dog

  fivoroth

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 11/10/06
Posts: 2736

3/08/12 3:48:41 PM#32

I just started playing the game. I think I am about 3 hours into it which is basically the first 2 missions. I am lovin it so far. I don't see why people hate it so much. The story and presentation is just as great as ME1/2. The graphics are much better. Nothing groundbreaking but their are very pleasing to look at. The gameplay is very similar to ME2. It has been slightly improved with some really nice additions which make the combat much more engaging.

 

My advice to anyone who is considering buying the game is to NOT read reviews. If you enjoyed Mass Effect 1 & 2, there is ABSOLUTELY NO reason why you shouldn't like ME3. If you loved ME1 and 2, you will love ME3.

If you didn't like Mass Effect 1 & 2, then ME3 is NOT going to change your mind. It stays true to the series.

If you have never played Mass Effect, then don't buy ME3. Start with ME1 then ME2 then ME3. Mass Effect 3 is not a game which you can just pick up without playing the prequels. It's not only slight nuances which you will not  be able to appreciate. You will simply not understand what the game is about. It really doesn't have the same impact if you just picked up ME3 without playing the previous games.

Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  iceman00

Novice Member

Joined: 5/04/05
Posts: 1367

Kevin Tierney

3/08/12 6:11:40 PM#33
Originally posted by DarkPony

"Should one really let something like a business decision to sell DLC on first day, price politics and digital retail optionsbe part of the Games Review?"

Well, yes, when many games are made like snacks nowadays, with an intense but limited experience in scope and size. In this case there have been reports of people saying the game offers only a third of the gameplay its predecessor offered. So the Day 1 DLC is kind of adding insult to injury and seems like a shameless money grab because the vanilla game could have done with some more oomph in the first place.

Personally I think the industry's move towards DLC as a whole is a bad thing. It's something different than extensive expansions released after a year or so; it stimulates releasing games like a car without a wind shield and only a 10 gallon fuel tank; low on content and missing certain appealing features which people would pay money for.

Big companies are cashing in on their own and their big IP's reputations by forgetting about the ideal of "releasing the best game possible in its genre" towards a more clever marketing focussed approach with additional premium offers.

Saying ME3 only offers a third of play that ME2 offered, someone really doesn't know what the hell they are talking about.  The "main quest" you might be able to finish in 10-15 hours, just like you could in ME2.  Yet you wanna know what?  Just like in ME2, your going to get wiped.  You won't have any war readiness, your chances of the assault will be almost nil, and your ending will be crap.

If you are playing the game that way, then you are doing it wrong.  The whole point of ME3 is to build up a war effort.  I would say that for the completionist, ME3 is bigger.   I've done around 12 hours right now, and I am only just past the first act.

My beef with the Prothean DLC isn't that it was day one DLC, but that it was 10 bucks.  Honestly, having the character in the game, outside of 30 seconds of initial interesting story dialogue..... if you didn't have the character, you honestly won't notice.  The car is still functioning.  This just adds chrome rims on it.  hardly neccessary, in no way detracts from the car, but some cosmetic stuff.

  iceman00

Novice Member

Joined: 5/04/05
Posts: 1367

Kevin Tierney

3/08/12 6:15:17 PM#34
Originally posted by Krasnij

If you look at Mass Effect 3 and Review it, what does really matter to make the score!

Should one really let something like a business decision to sell DLC on first day, price politics and digital retail optionsbe part of the Games Review?

Isnt that the kind of information that doesnt matter for a review? Prices change after time, the game itself will be cheaper at some  point anyway. What does really matter to you as a gamer if you read a review?

For Example for me:

story, presentation (graphics, audio), gameplay, fun factor, game lenght and replayability

Retail strategys and prices by publisher are not of  concern imho, they are subject to constant change and do not reflect the fun i could have with a product.

looking forward to read what you think!

best regards

Kras

On the PC Origin absolutely matters.  If you are having internet trouble, you may not be able to play the game.  That's something to take into consideration.

It falls under accessibility.  A Single player game, accessibility matters a ton.

Pricing, that should be taken into the stock.  Especially for things like the CE.  It's a fair question whether or not ME3 is worth 70 dollars, considering what the CE includes/doesn't include.  It is a fair debate.

  Yizle

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/10
Posts: 530

3/08/12 6:49:17 PM#35

This is based on the xbox 360 so not sure about pc or ps3 but I will assume its the same as the CE wording seems to be the same when you compare the products on Amazon.

 

The best part of this is all the whiners who complain about the day one DLC. You do know that the Ashes DLC is just extra missions/member/content that came for free in the CE? Hence if you bought the CE there is no day one DLC unless you want some junk for your avatar.

  MadnessRealm

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/02/09
Posts: 2705

Ignorance is Bliss.

3/08/12 6:49:48 PM#36

Pricing is a very important part that needs to be considered, but that the majority of players prefer to ignore. This is exactly why the industry has shifted from making entire games with lots of content and adding large expacs, to making a short game and selling part of it as DLC.  To buy the game AND the day 1 DLC is telling Game Developers and Publishers that splitting a game into parts than selling those parts seperately is fine. It is not. There is absolutely no reason why one should have to pay $60 for a game that's not even complete, and spend an additional $10-20 for a "DLC" that was taken out of the game and sold at the same day as release. It's an utterly despicable method, and people are buying into this. Ridiculous.

 

 

As for Piracy, Gabe Newell said it best.

"In general, we think there is a fundamental misconception about piracy. Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem. For example, if a pirate offers a product anywhere in the world, 24 x 7, purchasable from the convenience of your personal computer, and the legal provider says the product is region-locked, will come to your country 3 months after the U.S. release, and can only be purchased at a brick and mortar store, then the pirate's service is more valuable. Most DRM solutions diminish the value of the product by either directly restricting a customers use or by creating uncertainty."

------
Your daily dose of common sense since 2009!

  fivoroth

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 11/10/06
Posts: 2736

3/09/12 1:52:24 AM#37
Originally posted by Yizle

This is based on the xbox 360 so not sure about pc or ps3 but I will assume its the same as the CE wording seems to be the same when you compare the products on Amazon.

 

The best part of this is all the whiners who complain about the day one DLC. You do know that the Ashes DLC is just extra missions/member/content that came for free in the CE? Hence if you bought the CE there is no day one DLC unless you want some junk for your avatar.

Don't try to reason with them .I've been trying to explain this several times now but people just don't want to listen. They are on their self-righteous crusade to rid the gaming world of evil companies like BioWare. They would praise the games of old and will make wild unfounded generalisations about the state of the gaming industry at the moment. If you don't hate on BioWare they will just say that because of people like YOU the industry is in this state.

 

Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  Krasnij

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/20/04
Posts: 39

 
OP  3/09/12 3:38:52 AM#38

I think i just made a good deal , i  ordererd ME3 per amazon, i live in europe, i payed 45euros for it, the dlc cost me 6 euros, which ibought, so i came to a price of 51 euro in total, origin wants to sell me ME3 without from ashes for 56 euros, so i made a better deal and am currently playing the game. so far, i like it.

best regards

Kras

  Pivotelite

Novice Member

Joined: 1/19/12
Posts: 2193

3/09/12 4:01:50 AM#39
Originally posted by fivoroth
Originally posted by Yizle

This is based on the xbox 360 so not sure about pc or ps3 but I will assume its the same as the CE wording seems to be the same when you compare the products on Amazon.

 

The best part of this is all the whiners who complain about the day one DLC. You do know that the Ashes DLC is just extra missions/member/content that came for free in the CE? Hence if you bought the CE there is no day one DLC unless you want some junk for your avatar.

Don't try to reason with them .I've been trying to explain this several times now but people just don't want to listen. They are on their self-righteous crusade to rid the gaming world of evil companies like BioWare. They would praise the games of old and will make wild unfounded generalisations about the state of the gaming industry at the moment. If you don't hate on BioWare they will just say that because of people like YOU the industry is in this state.

 Makes sense, you get the DLC "FREE" when you pay $20 more. Wow, we sure are hard to reason with, how didn't I realize the dlc was free, derp.

  moosecatlol

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/25/10
Posts: 1175

3/09/12 4:11:43 AM#40

There are very few human beings on this planet who are willing to not purchase something in order to send a message.

 

*Edit*, gonna rip this from reddit

"Think of a hot chick(BF3/ME3) with AIDS (Origin/DLC/etc) - dealbreaker no matter how hot she is."

 

Another stated piracy is cure for AIDS, I'd say it's more of not spreading it around.

3 Pages « 1 2 3 » Search