Originally posted by Metentso

WoW is the closest you can have to an open world.

i bet you haven't played Darkfall then to know what is an open world...

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by Vaultar

f2p games by Perfect World Entertainment are very much would you would call open worlds. Main one being Perfect World itself where you can go anywhere without any loading screens. Completely seamless open world.

Has it got instanced dungeons?

We get your point of view about Open Worlds, if it has any loading screens or instances its not. Good for you! Now move along please and stop repeating yourself in every other post.

There is no default definition what an open world game is, hey wiki lists the GTA Series as an Open World game, but it has loading screens! NOOOOOO *vader*.

If the OP states that WoW felt "open world" to him, then this is an open world game for him, it might not be for you, respect his views.

"Open World" in my definition is a world where as many zones as possible are seamlessly passable by your character.

If you take all the games in recent history you would end up with a list like this:

5. SWTOR (lol Loading screen nightmare)

4. TERA (quite open, some tunneling though)

3. Perfect World (huge world)

2. WoW (already discussed in previous posts)

1. Lineage II (see below)

This is just a list out the top of my head, why I picked Lineage2 in first spot you may ask. While I've never played it beyond about 20hrs of gametime, I remember it having a feature where the end raids were in caves and stuff that were open to everyone, you could get pvp'ed while trying to finish off that raid boss.

cheers

EDIT: (darkfall excluded, never really played it)

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by tixylix

WoW had a great open world when I played before they ruined it with battlegrounds and the ability to enter instances from anywhere. Before all this you had to travel to an instance which took up real world space and you had to enter a structure or cave that lead to the instance. So that is why WoW's instances felt acceptable to me and the fact the rest of the world was seamless.

I dunno what it is like now but when I left it was going down the shitter.

Yeah i was there before Battlegrounds but WOW always had instances and loading screens between islands,no other way to get across the sea unless you load.

That's why WOW was never a seameless open world MMO.

I think you're nit picking.  Sure you load into instances and have to load between the two (now four major) land masses but thats cus theres a huge ocean or time/portal/wavey thing in the way, I can run,walk,fly from booty bay in the south of the eastern kingoms isle to the plaguelands in the north without a loading screen.. depending on the route I take I would pass by a dozen or more zones without a loading screen.  The Eastern kingdons Isle is estimated to be 100km/s in total that I can run around in without a loading screen.. I would consider that open world and any game that behaved similar would IMHO be open world.

It's all relative anyway. For example, compared to EQ2, WoW IS an open world. You can go from the top of a continent to the bottom (minus the Blood Elf area in the EK, which had to have a loading screen to "gate" it from people who didn't purchase BC), and through a variety of landscape types without seeing a loading screen. EQ2's areas, on the other hand, are all divided up. 

I can't read the OP's mind, but I think S/He was referring to games that allow you to traverse a large overworld without loads, which is exactly what WoW has, minus going from one continent to another and gated sections added by expansions. 

Really, there's no reason to keep beating the semantics drum over this.

Originally posted by expresso

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by tixylix

WoW had a great open world when I played before they ruined it with battlegrounds and the ability to enter instances from anywhere. Before all this you had to travel to an instance which took up real world space and you had to enter a structure or cave that lead to the instance. So that is why WoW's instances felt acceptable to me and the fact the rest of the world was seamless.

I dunno what it is like now but when I left it was going down the shitter.

Yeah i was there before Battlegrounds but WOW always had instances and loading screens between islands,no other way to get across the sea unless you load.

That's why WOW was never a seameless open world MMO.

I think you're nit picking.  Sure you load into instances and have to load between the two (now four major) land masses but thats cus theres a huge ocean or time/portal/wavey thing in the way, I can run,walk,fly from booty bay in the south of the eastern kingoms isle to the plaguelands in the north without a loading screen.. depending on the route I take I would pass by a dozen or more zones without a loading screen.  The Eastern kingdons Isle is estimated to be 100km/s in total that I can run around in without a loading screen.. I would consider that open world and any game that behaved similar would IMHO be open world.

Seriously i'm not nit picking,a MMO world is totally open or it isn't,you cant have it both ways.Nearly being open is not the same as being open.

I play football and sometimes i nearly score a goal but i miss,so that means i didn't score,their is no inbetween.I do the lottery and i had 5 numbers,you need six for the jackpot but five nearly gave me the winning prize but it didn't because i didn't have six numbers.

In WOW you can go from one area to another on said island but to cross a sea or do i dungeon i have to enter an instance or load a screen to cross the sea.

In vanguard i go to the dungeon and it's part of the open world and i can find other people using the same dungeon because it's a open world.I need to go from qalia to thestra,sure i can use a riftway but i can also fly,ride or sail their,i'm not forced to use a loading screen because it's an open world.

You see the differance from Vanguard and WOW,would you call LOTRO an open world MMO?

People here can get the hump all they like but the fact remains that games like WOW and LOTRO and any game with instances are not true open world MMO,that was the question of the OP.

Perhaps the next true open world MMO will be AA but it's not Tera and it never was WOW.

mortal online is open world if they had some money and an actull talented coding team it could be an awsome game even tho i hear that they have some better coders now jus tnot alot fo cash flow is hurting them who knows

Originally posted by Teala

ArcheAge will be the next seamless world.

This.

Originally posted by fenistil

Originally posted by Teala

ArcheAge will be the next seamless world.

This.

+1

Originally posted by Teala

ArcheAge will be the next seamless world.

I don´t think so, at least not in English. Even if they actually find a western publisher today I don´t see it release this year.

TERA is the next releasing MMO with a open world (at least if you count OPs definition). It will be out in april.

Originally posted by Loke666

Originally posted by Teala

ArcheAge will be the next seamless world.

I don´t think so, at least not in English. Even if they actually find a western publisher today I don´t see it release this year.

TERA is the next releasing MMO with a open world (at least if you count OPs definition). It will be out in april.

Well I 'counted' my definition heh

True it won't be out this year for sure.

Ofc if you count 'almost seamless' worlds like WoW (not seamless but much more seamlessly than Swtor for example - well at least in vanilla cause now it is lobby instance game practically)  then yeah TERA propably.

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by expresso

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by tixylix

WoW had a great open world when I played before they ruined it with battlegrounds and the ability to enter instances from anywhere. Before all this you had to travel to an instance which took up real world space and you had to enter a structure or cave that lead to the instance. So that is why WoW's instances felt acceptable to me and the fact the rest of the world was seamless.

I dunno what it is like now but when I left it was going down the shitter.

Yeah i was there before Battlegrounds but WOW always had instances and loading screens between islands,no other way to get across the sea unless you load.

That's why WOW was never a seameless open world MMO.

I think you're nit picking.  Sure you load into instances and have to load between the two (now four major) land masses but thats cus theres a huge ocean or time/portal/wavey thing in the way, I can run,walk,fly from booty bay in the south of the eastern kingoms isle to the plaguelands in the north without a loading screen.. depending on the route I take I would pass by a dozen or more zones without a loading screen.  The Eastern kingdons Isle is estimated to be 100km/s in total that I can run around in without a loading screen.. I would consider that open world and any game that behaved similar would IMHO be open world.

Seriously i'm not nit picking,a MMO world is totally open or it isn't,you cant have it both ways.Nearly being open is not the same as being open.

I play football and sometimes i nearly score a goal but i miss,so that means i didn't score,their is no inbetween.I do the lottery and i had 5 numbers,you need six for the jackpot but five nearly gave me the winning prize but it didn't because i didn't have six numbers.

In WOW you can go from one area to another on said island but to cross a sea or do i dungeon i have to enter an instance or load a screen to cross the sea.

In vanguard i go to the dungeon and it's part of the open world and i can find other people using the same dungeon because it's a open world.I need to go from qalia to thestra,sure i can use a riftway but i can also fly,ride or sail their,i'm not forced to use a loading screen because it's an open world.

You see the differance from Vanguard and WOW,would you call LOTRO an open world MMO?

People here can get the hump all they like but the fact remains that games like WOW and LOTRO and any game with instances are not true open world MMO,that was the question of the OP.

Perhaps the next true open world MMO will be AA but it's not Tera and it never was WOW.

You just can't let anyone have the opinion that WoW is open world to them, can you?  Guess what, you lose in that respect.  No matter how hard you try to convince us, those of us who feel WoW is "open world", like myself, will continue to do so.  Now, do I feel Vangaurd is "more" open? sure.  Do I really care about a small difference?  NO.  I only care when the game is butchered into instance oblivion like Vindictus or EQ2.  That's when I would be "nitpicking" at this very RELATIVE and SUBJECTIVE issue.

Anyway, along the lines of "feeling" open world and seamless, up and coming I believe ArcheAge and Tera will fit that bill.  Also, while GW2 sports loading screens between zones, they say the zones are fairly massive and can feel "open world"

Another game that used loading screens per zone but always felt like a massive living world, was FFXI.  So, go figure.

Originally posted by fenistil

Well I 'counted' my definition heh

True it won't be out this year for sure.

Ofc if you count 'almost seamless' worlds like WoW (not seamless but much more seamlessly than Swtor for example - well at least in vanilla cause now it is lobby instance game practically)  then yeah TERA propably.

My feeling after trying tERA was that at least it was a lot more seamless than Wow. 

And rumors say that even Archeage is supposed to have 3 instanced dungeons in it, few games have no instances whatsoever.

My feeling after reading the OP was that Tera is probably what he is asking for. We can surely argue exactly what "seamless" means (is phasing OK for one thing?) but OP asked us a question and I think we should try to answer him what he want to know instead. :)

I can´t believe that you have not talked about Ultima Online, the only seamless MMO in the world. Instances, houses, continents... all that without a single load screen...

Originally posted by elocke

You just can't let anyone have the opinion that WoW is open world to them, can you?  Guess what, you lose in that respect.  No matter how hard you try to convince us, those of us who feel WoW is "open world", like myself, will continue to do so.  Now, do I feel Vangaurd is "more" open? sure.  Do I really care about a small difference?  NO.  I only care when the game is butchered into instance oblivion like Vindictus or EQ2.  That's when I would be "nitpicking" at this very RELATIVE and SUBJECTIVE issue.

Anyway, along the lines of "feeling" open world and seamless, up and coming I believe ArcheAge and Tera will fit that bill.  Also, while GW2 sports loading screens between zones, they say the zones are fairly massive and can feel "open world"

Another game that used loading screens per zone but always felt like a massive living world, was FFXI.  So, go figure.

Wow is kinda seamless. Each continent is a zone  so even if it you don´t count dungeons, battlegrounds and phasing it isn´t completely seamless.

But frankly is that not so important. I think OP mostly didn´t want a game were zones are small and you don´t have the feeling that they just show a small area of the gameworld with teleporting between them like in AoC and EQ2.

i personally will experience GW2 pretty zoneless due to my SSDs, since all zones hangs together and are huge and that actually makes things a lot different fromn AoC where the zones have huge gaps between them. That blows no matter how fast you can load.

Originally posted by Urborgein

I can´t believe that you have not talked about Ultima Online, the only seamless MMO in the world. Instances, houses, continents... all that without a single load screen...

Yeah, it is because UO was unlike earlier games like Meridian 59 and the Realm not in 3D graphics. It is a lot easier to make a zoneless game like that.

Still, it was a great game but not really what OP asked about.

Originally posted by elocke

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by expresso

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by tixylix

WoW had a great open world when I played before they ruined it with battlegrounds and the ability to enter instances from anywhere. Before all this you had to travel to an instance which took up real world space and you had to enter a structure or cave that lead to the instance. So that is why WoW's instances felt acceptable to me and the fact the rest of the world was seamless.

I dunno what it is like now but when I left it was going down the shitter.

Yeah i was there before Battlegrounds but WOW always had instances and loading screens between islands,no other way to get across the sea unless you load.

That's why WOW was never a seameless open world MMO.

I think you're nit picking.  Sure you load into instances and have to load between the two (now four major) land masses but thats cus theres a huge ocean or time/portal/wavey thing in the way, I can run,walk,fly from booty bay in the south of the eastern kingoms isle to the plaguelands in the north without a loading screen.. depending on the route I take I would pass by a dozen or more zones without a loading screen.  The Eastern kingdons Isle is estimated to be 100km/s in total that I can run around in without a loading screen.. I would consider that open world and any game that behaved similar would IMHO be open world.

Seriously i'm not nit picking,a MMO world is totally open or it isn't,you cant have it both ways.Nearly being open is not the same as being open.

I play football and sometimes i nearly score a goal but i miss,so that means i didn't score,their is no inbetween.I do the lottery and i had 5 numbers,you need six for the jackpot but five nearly gave me the winning prize but it didn't because i didn't have six numbers.

In WOW you can go from one area to another on said island but to cross a sea or do i dungeon i have to enter an instance or load a screen to cross the sea.

In vanguard i go to the dungeon and it's part of the open world and i can find other people using the same dungeon because it's a open world.I need to go from qalia to thestra,sure i can use a riftway but i can also fly,ride or sail their,i'm not forced to use a loading screen because it's an open world.

You see the differance from Vanguard and WOW,would you call LOTRO an open world MMO?

People here can get the hump all they like but the fact remains that games like WOW and LOTRO and any game with instances are not true open world MMO,that was the question of the OP.

Perhaps the next true open world MMO will be AA but it's not Tera and it never was WOW.

You just can't let anyone have the opinion that WoW is open world to them, can you?  Guess what, you lose in that respect.  No matter how hard you try to convince us, those of us who feel WoW is "open world", like myself, will continue to do so.  Now, do I feel Vangaurd is "more" open? sure.  Do I really care about a small difference?  NO.  I only care when the game is butchered into instance oblivion like Vindictus or EQ2.  That's when I would be "nitpicking" at this very RELATIVE and SUBJECTIVE issue.

Anyway, along the lines of "feeling" open world and seamless, up and coming I believe ArcheAge and Tera will fit that bill.  Also, while GW2 sports loading screens between zones, they say the zones are fairly massive and can feel "open world"

Another game that used loading screens per zone but always felt like a massive living world, was FFXI.  So, go figure.

You can have your opinion,i have no problem with anyones opinion,so where you get this 'i lose' from is beyond me lol.

Let's get down to facts, no matter how you see WOW, the fact remains it's not an open world MMO,this is a 100% fact,sorry to bust your bubble but truth is truth.

Feeling like a massive world does not means it is an open world.

The OP ask people to correct him and i have done.

You don't care about the small difference but we are not talking about whether elocke cares,we are talking about what makes a MMO a true open world.

I don't need to convince anyone because what i'm saying is true.

Does WOW have open dungeons like Vanguard and EQ had before LDON,does WOW force me to use a loading screen to get from one island to another?

Yes or no..

Originally posted by elocke

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by expresso

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by tixylix

WoW had a great open world when I played before they ruined it with battlegrounds and the ability to enter instances from anywhere. Before all this you had to travel to an instance which took up real world space and you had to enter a structure or cave that lead to the instance. So that is why WoW's instances felt acceptable to me and the fact the rest of the world was seamless.

I dunno what it is like now but when I left it was going down the shitter.

Yeah i was there before Battlegrounds but WOW always had instances and loading screens between islands,no other way to get across the sea unless you load.

That's why WOW was never a seameless open world MMO.

I think you're nit picking.  Sure you load into instances and have to load between the two (now four major) land masses but thats cus theres a huge ocean or time/portal/wavey thing in the way, I can run,walk,fly from booty bay in the south of the eastern kingoms isle to the plaguelands in the north without a loading screen.. depending on the route I take I would pass by a dozen or more zones without a loading screen.  The Eastern kingdons Isle is estimated to be 100km/s in total that I can run around in without a loading screen.. I would consider that open world and any game that behaved similar would IMHO be open world.

Seriously i'm not nit picking,a MMO world is totally open or it isn't,you cant have it both ways.Nearly being open is not the same as being open.

I play football and sometimes i nearly score a goal but i miss,so that means i didn't score,their is no inbetween.I do the lottery and i had 5 numbers,you need six for the jackpot but five nearly gave me the winning prize but it didn't because i didn't have six numbers.

In WOW you can go from one area to another on said island but to cross a sea or do i dungeon i have to enter an instance or load a screen to cross the sea.

In vanguard i go to the dungeon and it's part of the open world and i can find other people using the same dungeon because it's a open world.I need to go from qalia to thestra,sure i can use a riftway but i can also fly,ride or sail their,i'm not forced to use a loading screen because it's an open world.

You see the differance from Vanguard and WOW,would you call LOTRO an open world MMO?

People here can get the hump all they like but the fact remains that games like WOW and LOTRO and any game with instances are not true open world MMO,that was the question of the OP.

Perhaps the next true open world MMO will be AA but it's not Tera and it never was WOW.

You just can't let anyone have the opinion that WoW is open world to them, can you?  Guess what, you lose in that respect.  No matter how hard you try to convince us, those of us who feel WoW is "open world", like myself, will continue to do so.  Now, do I feel Vangaurd is "more" open? sure.  Do I really care about a small difference?  NO.  I only care when the game is butchered into instance oblivion like Vindictus or EQ2.  That's when I would be "nitpicking" at this very RELATIVE and SUBJECTIVE issue.

Anyway, along the lines of "feeling" open world and seamless, up and coming I believe ArcheAge and Tera will fit that bill.  Also, while GW2 sports loading screens between zones, they say the zones are fairly massive and can feel "open world"

Another game that used loading screens per zone but always felt like a massive living world, was FFXI.  So, go figure.

I feel that my brown desk is blue. So im gonna say its blue, but its really brown. But it makes me feel better to call it blue. Does that make my desk blue?

Sometimes it's not really a matter of opinion, it's a matter of fact.

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by elocke

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by expresso

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by tixylix

WoW had a great open world when I played before they ruined it with battlegrounds and the ability to enter instances from anywhere. Before all this you had to travel to an instance which took up real world space and you had to enter a structure or cave that lead to the instance. So that is why WoW's instances felt acceptable to me and the fact the rest of the world was seamless.

I dunno what it is like now but when I left it was going down the shitter.

Yeah i was there before Battlegrounds but WOW always had instances and loading screens between islands,no other way to get across the sea unless you load.

That's why WOW was never a seameless open world MMO.

I think you're nit picking.  Sure you load into instances and have to load between the two (now four major) land masses but thats cus theres a huge ocean or time/portal/wavey thing in the way, I can run,walk,fly from booty bay in the south of the eastern kingoms isle to the plaguelands in the north without a loading screen.. depending on the route I take I would pass by a dozen or more zones without a loading screen.  The Eastern kingdons Isle is estimated to be 100km/s in total that I can run around in without a loading screen.. I would consider that open world and any game that behaved similar would IMHO be open world.

Seriously i'm not nit picking,a MMO world is totally open or it isn't,you cant have it both ways.Nearly being open is not the same as being open.

I play football and sometimes i nearly score a goal but i miss,so that means i didn't score,their is no inbetween.I do the lottery and i had 5 numbers,you need six for the jackpot but five nearly gave me the winning prize but it didn't because i didn't have six numbers.

In WOW you can go from one area to another on said island but to cross a sea or do i dungeon i have to enter an instance or load a screen to cross the sea.

In vanguard i go to the dungeon and it's part of the open world and i can find other people using the same dungeon because it's a open world.I need to go from qalia to thestra,sure i can use a riftway but i can also fly,ride or sail their,i'm not forced to use a loading screen because it's an open world.

You see the differance from Vanguard and WOW,would you call LOTRO an open world MMO?

People here can get the hump all they like but the fact remains that games like WOW and LOTRO and any game with instances are not true open world MMO,that was the question of the OP.

Perhaps the next true open world MMO will be AA but it's not Tera and it never was WOW.

You just can't let anyone have the opinion that WoW is open world to them, can you?  Guess what, you lose in that respect.  No matter how hard you try to convince us, those of us who feel WoW is "open world", like myself, will continue to do so.  Now, do I feel Vangaurd is "more" open? sure.  Do I really care about a small difference?  NO.  I only care when the game is butchered into instance oblivion like Vindictus or EQ2.  That's when I would be "nitpicking" at this very RELATIVE and SUBJECTIVE issue.

Anyway, along the lines of "feeling" open world and seamless, up and coming I believe ArcheAge and Tera will fit that bill.  Also, while GW2 sports loading screens between zones, they say the zones are fairly massive and can feel "open world"

Another game that used loading screens per zone but always felt like a massive living world, was FFXI.  So, go figure.

You can have your opinion,i have no problem with anyones opinion,so where you get this 'i lose' from is beyond me lol.

Let's get down to facts, no matter how you see WOW, the fact remains it's not an open world MMO,this is a 100% fact,sorry to bust your bubble but truth is truth.

Feeling like a massive world does not means it is an open world.

The OP ask people to correct him and i have done.

You don't care about the small difference but we are not talking about whether elocke cares,we are talking about what makes a MMO a true open world.

I don't need to convince anyone because what i'm saying is true.

Does WOW have open dungeons like Vanguard and EQ had before LDON,does WOW force me to use a loading screen to get from one island to another?

Yes or no..

 

Its not fact because there is no true official definition of open world or true official set of rules to check it on. Sylvarri unless you can get everyone on board with your definition and make it official then his interpretation is just as valid as yours. I mean how open must your world be

For instance lets for a second theorise that back in Classic they divided EK and Kalimdor for computer memory reason which they probably did but anyway made them both seemless and open. Would you cut them some slack or not? Then they add dungeons oooh but now they've crossed the line in the sand sorry! Even though they did it for a gameplay reason.

How open must you be?

How abstract does my art have to be to be abstract art?

Also who are you to draw that line in the sand? Sorry I get to decide on that! :P

Sorry but they are not facts.

Lets not forget Fallen Earth, I think you pretty much can travel all over the world without ever seeing a loading screen, right?