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News & Features Discussion  » World of Warcraft: Cataclysm Quest Design Post Mortem

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23 posts found
  SBFord

Associate Editor - News Manager

Joined: 6/28/10
Posts: 14026

 
OP  2/28/12 1:00:14 PM#1

The Blizzard team has published an in-house interview with World of Warcraft: Cataclysm quest designer Dave "Fargo" Kosak. The interview covers a wide variety of topics including what Kosak feels worked and didn't work in the Cataclysm expansion.

It's a terrific read and worth the time to visit the World of Warcraft site.

Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

  Ozmodan

Elite Member

Joined: 2/27/07
Posts: 6788

2/28/12 1:20:51 PM#2

While he did cover some of the problems with Cataclysm, he really missed the major problem.  The sea area, Vash'jir, was a joke.  There was zero point to it.  Zero reputation gain in that area relegated it to a skip once you had figured it out.  When you relegate a huge portion of the new areas to something everyone ignores, you have a major failure on your hands.

Just don't know how he could have missed this as a big issue with the expansion.

  fivoroth

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 11/10/06
Posts: 2927

2/28/12 1:38:51 PM#3

I think he has addressed most of the major issues with this expansion. The two biggies were phasing (they certainly overdid it) and lack of content for the 80-85. Had they focused all their resources on the 80-85 level range instead of redoing level 1-60, they would have had more subs and most importantly a more varied endgame.

Every time I start reading posts like these about WoW I get all nostalgic. I start remembering all those great moments I had with the game and the urge to resub rises again.

 


 

Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  freston

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/20/07
Posts: 530

2/28/12 1:47:03 PM#4

Main problem is that quest system has become obsolete. It was good enough, seven years ago, but now it wont be able to compete with dynamic events, rifts, invasions, whtever... knowing blizzard i guess theyll adapt and well see some deviations from their usual system next expansion.


  slickbizzle

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/11
Posts: 464

2/28/12 2:00:04 PM#5

I don't think anything was particularily "wrong" with Cataclysm.   I personally didn't like the wash-rinse-repeat style all over again.  I didn't like the guild thing ("First, you've go grind your guild to max level, but you also need to grind your rep in the guild! Are we having fun yet?"). It was a sign that they had no original or fun plans for the game. 

The main thing for me was  the age of the game.  It had become tiring/boring instead of exciting. Not anyones fault. After years of playing it had wore thin.  Towards the end, I didn't even log in, I just played around on the forums and even that became stale. How many times can you read "Rate my mog" and "WoW race stereotypes" and "Thanks Blizz" threads before enough is enough?

 

 

  maplestone

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 3109

2/28/12 2:14:53 PM#6

I feel like cataclysm missed an opportunity to introduce fundementally new gameplay options.  Yes, the old questlines were streamlined and modernized (although sometimes the tone of the remodelled zone did not match the tone of its history - I'm looking at you, Lunk).   But you have more zones than you need now that most of the players have moved on to the high levels.  Most of the characters going up at this stage of WoW's lifecycle are alts, not new players.  Redoing all the quests does give a fresh story, but not really a fresh experience.  I would have liked to see a zone or two being more radically different - more dynamic, more experimental.

  orbitxo

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/06
Posts: 1238

2/28/12 2:23:50 PM#7

I loved the cataclysm expansion CONCEPT- unfortunately the expansion had too many mini games and felt very adolescent , and that i believe is where i see this game heading.


many concepts and zones felt unfinished and dungeons ignored. they should of released zones as full patches- like Trion does.


I was glad they revisited old dugeons and made them Heroics (troll dugeons). a little too late.


ive had awsome years playing WoW- but its time to retire this game for any serious mmorpg gamer.


its something i would give my nephew or niece to start playing.


 


 


  fivoroth

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 11/10/06
Posts: 2927

2/28/12 2:43:31 PM#8

Originally posted by orbitxo



ive had awsome years playing WoW- but its time to retire this game for any serious mmorpg gamer.




its something i would give my nephew or niece to start playing.



Dunno about this. I think people should stop with the stereotypes. There is just so many times you can pull the whole WoW-kiddie-game before it wearing thin. I haven't noticed a huge difference in the communities between MMOs. General chat is crap and shit everywhere! I think the only notable exception I've come across is EVE.


Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  orbitxo

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/06
Posts: 1238

2/28/12 3:36:16 PM#9

to above post what i meant by adolescent  is - i dotn consider saving bears from a tree and jumping off a tranpolin ( mount hijal quest..)-or these holiday events are considered serious gaming. and now with their battle pets on the horrizon.








i was talking about  the game mechanics not the community.
















-and yes eveonline (which i played for 4 years) has a great community.























 










 




 

  Jakdstripper

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/14/10
Posts: 2144

2/28/12 4:16:24 PM#10

why the need for such a HUGE inteview?


what did work? ......the celestial mount.


what didnt work? ......everything else.


there, done.


  arctarus

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/26/06
Posts: 2591

2/28/12 8:23:59 PM#11
Removing of class quest is what saddens me the most. The unique story and quest is gone.

I hope they bring them back some day and expand it till Max.level, something like tor. Each class with their own quest for weapons and stories.

Also too much phasing in cata.

I will play wow 1 last time when panda hits, unless gw2 is seriously flaw or not to my liking, if its still nothing notably new, im really gone this time.

RIP Orc Choppa

  dais

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/18/06
Posts: 94

2/28/12 8:26:55 PM#12
Originally posted by Ozmodan

While he did cover some of the problems with Cataclysm, he really missed the major problem.  The sea area, Vash'jir, was a joke.  There was zero point to it.  Zero reputation gain in that area relegated it to a skip once you had figured it out.  When you relegate a huge portion of the new areas to something everyone ignores, you have a major failure on your hands.

Just don't know how he could have missed this as a big issue with the expansion.

Really?  I had a lot of fun in Vash'jir, was a nice change of pace :)  And you earned Earthen Ring reputation....were we playing the same game?

  joe2721

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/08/07
Posts: 148

2/28/12 8:39:59 PM#13

I really enjoyed cata as a whole. If anything the game itself is older and that makes most  expensions seem to be more of the same.  People in general are very good at saying whats wrong or broken but even if  you fix everything we say theres always going to be something else you need to do better in our eyes. 


  jrworden1976

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/08
Posts: 24

The real problem is not whether machines think but whether men do.
- B. F. Skinner

2/29/12 1:46:52 AM#14

Cata was ok at best.... but it eventually killed the game for me. And now with MoP coming I think I will move on.


  tawess

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/05
Posts: 2088

2/29/12 2:31:31 AM#15

Well i still give them props for trying new stuff, sure things did not work to their fullpotential but at least they did try. I would guess that MoP will be more focused and take the best bits of Vata and combine them with 7 years of knowledge.


 


And just to point out.. EvE's devs did the same thing.. to such an extent that they felt they needed to say "ok we are sorry, dont hate us please" it is all part of the cycle. The  biggest example tho why it is not a smart isea to make radical changes to the core gameplay will always be SWG. Now i am a advocate for that "it was bloody well needed" but it still drow away a lot of people and the game did never really recover from that.


Tomas Soapbox

This have been a good conversation

  Superduper69

Novice Member

Joined: 2/24/12
Posts: 376

2/29/12 2:40:06 AM#16
Originally posted by freston

Main problem is that quest system has become obsolete. It was good enough, seven years ago, but now it wont be able to compete with dynamic events, rifts, invasions, whtever... knowing blizzard i guess theyll adapt and well see some deviations from their usual system next expansion.

Easy there bud..nothing has been proven yet.

  daltanious

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1908

2/29/12 3:19:39 AM#17

Originally posted by Ozmodan

While he did cover some of the problems with Cataclysm, he really missed the major problem.  The sea area, Vash'jir, was a joke.  There was zero point to it.  Zero reputation gain in that area relegated it to a skip once you had figured it out.  When you relegate a huge portion of the new areas to something everyone ignores, you have a major failure on your hands.


Just don't know how he could have missed this as a big issue with the expansion.



 


Hmm.. I have not skipped because I play for FUN. And getting reputation is only small part of it. But I agree there should be also reputation gained as area is awesome.


  daltanious

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1908

2/29/12 3:24:06 AM#18

Originally posted by joe2721

I really enjoyed cata as a whole. If anything the game itself is older and that makes most  expensions seem to be more of the same.  People in general are very good at saying whats wrong or broken but even if  you fix everything we say theres always going to be something else you need to do better in our eyes. 



 


Same goes for me. Expansion was awesome as all predecessors.


Main reason I'm not playing currently wow, having 10 alts 85 and close to this level bunch of Hordes ... is because they killed end game for my taste. I started to love it with wotlk. Despite there were problems, was enough fun to keep me in wow for at least half year more than I would otherwise play. Cata killed this joy and now I'm in wait mode for next expansion. 


Fortunately Rift ans Swtor came along so to be honest for the first time since release of Wow I do not miss it at all. But I can still barely wait for pandas. .-)


  Magnetia

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/07/11
Posts: 975

Any fool can know. The point is to understand.

2/29/12 3:31:08 AM#19

I think Cataclysm had a few good ideas but they ultimately failed in making those ideas into a cohesive experience. I enjoyed many of the new quest types and the new feel of the quests. Killing and collecting were kept to a minimum and the small cut scenes really did it for me. While individually enjoyable experiences they just didn't gel together well enough. The story did try hard to accomplish this but sadly failed to do so.

I can't quite put my finger on why LK felt right. It might be because of the mystery of it all. Each area built towards Icecrown Citadel. The raids were centered around fighting for great power to defeat the Lich King. Our main quests kept us in touch with the enemy, slowly building our grudge towards him and teased us with the hope of redemption. The new dungeons spilled more story and built an epic arc towards your ultimate goal.

Cataclysm failed to achieve this sense of buildup towards Deathwing. The new dungeons were just rehashed old dungeons and failed to keep the player in line with the story. They just felt like gear grinds instead of progression. The raids failed to capture the buildup towards Deathwing. I really didn't care what ogres were doing and the guardians of the elements just seemed out of place. While the Deathwing encounter itself is epic the buildup towards it falls short of expectations.

 

Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  Mors.Magne

Novice Member

Joined: 3/02/07
Posts: 1432

2/29/12 9:01:17 AM#20

I remember finding myself in a green field, with a "kill 10 x" quest, and thinking "No - I can't bear it."


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