Originally posted by Sanctum

Originally posted by Kuppa

Originally posted by Sanctum

I hope no one thinks the illusions will actually confuse people much

I think they might, take LoL for example. When fighting a Shaco to the death and he does his little clone thing its a matter of luck picking the right one, or just try to kill em both 

these die in one hit not to mention you can tell which one is real by the way they move a moba is very different

The game is not final, all Im saying is that if they want them to be used for confusion they can pull it off easy. But I don't know what Anet's purpose is for them, simple distraction or full on confusion.

You guys do understand that the memsmer highly picked class because everyone asked for tons of mesmer videos right?  a lot of the beta testers were asking what people wanted to see, and since mesmer hasnt been in conventions a lot of people wanted to kno about it.

Originally posted by drbaltazar
Mesmer in gw1 were fun and dangerous.in gw2.they arent mesmer anymore.any that met a mesmer in gw1were scared .in gw2 they wont even notice them.it is sad.

Um...yeah, you don't know that. Hell, most of the players in videos i've watched didn't even bother shattering any of their clones, which is a major mechanic of the profession. I only saw one person so far swap a weapon, most just stuck with one weapon and spammed the first ability. Considering alot of the footage i've seen, the majority of the players are using the greatsword (the  long range weapon), and weren't even really attempting to kite/stay at range, in order to maximize the damage of the beam. In other words...it is WAY to early to make the above claim. Let a skilled PvPer get their hands on that class for a few months and then we'll see.

I'm still not convinced with the illusions. The only way you can "hide" in the shadow of your illusions is if you either run to the enemy or only use your skill 1. At least this is what I observed.

Phantasms on other hand looks useful, with more health and special attacks.

Developers seem to consistently underestimate how powerful certain abilities are.  Blizzard said, after Warcraft 2, that they would be extremely careful with invisibility, because they previously did not realize how powerful it was.  Then they released the Rogue in World of Warcraft.  *sigh*.  Many, many patches and many, many nerfs to the Rogue later, they finally got Rogues to the point that they were balanced in PvP.

Likewise with clones.  Riot has had a very difficult time balancing Shaco, not just because of his invisibility ability, but also because of his clone (also because of his fear ability - another one that is very difficult to balance, ask Blizzard about fear-chaining Warlocks).  I'm not sure what Riot was thinking putting invisibility, cloning, and fear in the same Champion . . .

Based on the skill set I can see for Mesmers, I see a lot of those abilities that could easily be overpowered - mass invisibility, really?  I suspect that the developers may be underestimating how powerful the Mesmer is, and it may take them some time to get the profession balanced.  That, combined with how unique the profession is, and that the graphic designers have, shall we say, taken a special interest to the female Mesmer clothing sets, and well, there could be a *lot* of players playing Mesmers . . .

Originally posted by Gudrunix

Developers seem to consistently underestimate how powerful certain abilities are.  Blizzard said, after Warcraft 2, that they would be extremely careful with invisibility, because they previously did not realize how powerful it was.  Then they released the Rogue in World of Warcraft.  *sigh*.  Many, many patches and many, many nerfs to the Rogue later, they finally got Rogues to the point that they were balanced in PvP.

Likewise with clones.  Riot has had a very difficult time balancing Shaco, not just because of his invisibility ability, but also because of his clone (also because of his fear ability - another one that is very difficult to balance, ask Blizzard about fear-chaining Warlocks).  I'm not sure what Riot was thinking putting invisibility, cloning, and fear in the same Champion . . .

Based on the skill set I can see for Mesmers, I see a lot of those abilities that could easily be overpowered - mass invisibility, really?  I suspect that the developers may be underestimating how powerful the Mesmer is, and it may take them some time to get the profession balanced.  That, combined with how unique the profession is, and that the graphic designers have, shall we say, taken a special interest to the female Mesmer clothing sets, and well, there could be a *lot* of players playing Mesmers . . .

I think their complexity will drive away a fair amount of players. I get what you're saying about the clones, but I think distraction is a kind of secondary effect of them. With certain traits, upon being destroyed your clones will inflict your opponent with conditions. Of course, if your opponent doesn't destroy them...they'll likely get shattered in their face. Seems to me the class is all about putting your opponent between a rock and a hard place. In my opinon, it'll take clever, savvy players to push the envelope with the Mesmer. 

I'm really starting to believe that Mesmer clones are far less about trickery, and far more about putting opponents in tough positions.

Originally posted by crewthief

Originally posted by Gudrunix
...

I think their complexity will drive away a fair amount of players. I get what you're saying about the clones, but I think distraction is a kind of secondary effect of them. With certain traits, upon being destroyed your clones will inflict your opponent with conditions. Of course, if your opponent doesn't destroy them...they'll likely get shattered in their face. Seems to me the class is all about putting your opponent between a rock and a hard place. In my opinon, it'll take clever, savvy players to push the envelope with the Mesmer. 

I'm really starting to believe that Mesmer clones are far less about trickery, and far more about putting opponents in tough positions.

This make it much easier to play. You say clones are either killed or they survive and the mesmer shatter em.

Originally posted by Lobotomist

It used to be that rogues/stealth classes are bane of PVP.

Not saying that they are the best in every game. But definately the most complained about.

 

I think that GW2 mesmer is going to take this flag.

 

I am unsure how much damage it brings to the table. Or how good it is 1vs1

But judging from the videos , i can only see "Oh shit , its a mesmer" moments happening over and over

 

From player trying to run or defend his life against 6 attackers, totally confused to see which one is mesmer, illusion and elementalist that joined.

To complete failure to lock down an kill mesmer that wants to escape the fight.

 

Now...

From one side i am tremendosly happy about this, because i always played mesmer (in GW1) and from day 1 , it was my choice class.

But I can see everyone and their dog , playing mesmer in PVP

And i hate to lay flavor of the month class ;(

Just like in GW1, there will be a difference between playing a Mesmer and playing a Mesmer well.  It's a complex profession and always was.  Not everyone will be able to comfortable enough with it to excel.  I'm looking forward to the mindfuck extravaganza.

Can - not - wait.

Originally posted by crewthief

I'm really starting to believe that Mesmer clones are far less about trickery, and far more about putting opponents in tough positions.

What I have been trying to say is:  players are much better at making use of certain abilities than developers give them credit for.  On the top of that list are abilities that have multiple effects.  Basically, the more degrees of freedom a player has, the better they will make use of them, in ways the developers may not have anticipated.

Again, going back to Riot and Shaco, what Riot did not anticipate is that players would find so many ways to use Shaco's abilities.  His boxes are used, not just for damage output and their fear effect, but for warding, for farming minions, for setting up ambushes, for anchors that other Champions could jump or teleport to.  His invisibility was used, not just for setting up ganks, but for escapes, for hopping barriers, for re-engaging after pretending to leave a combat, and so forth.

Players like playing characters that have extremely flexible abilities, for that reason - they give the player a lot of options, a lot of control.  And developers routinely underestimate how powerful those characters are - which only increases the number of players who want to play them.

I watched this http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-z7Sh1geKYcposted by the OP  that was suppose to be a engineer getting killed by a meser. Now the first couple of fights seem like a 1v1 but it was really a 1v2 against the engineer. Through the end of the video the engineer is finally able to get the mesmer into a 1v1 and does fine against him.

protect the mesmer at all costs, if you are grouped with one that is!

Looking at the mesmer traits a few stands out . And some leaves questions

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/List_of_mesmer_traits

I have been pondering on the first "illusion of vulnerbillity" that causes a 5 second vulnerability when you interrupt a foe.

Is it that you  interrupt your foe , when summoning a clone and by doing that break targeting while an opponent use a skill while having you as target. If thats right every clone used in such a manner is an interrupt, and then clones have alot more potential. Did anyone actual see a mesmer interrupts ?

Originally posted by aguliondew

I watched this http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-z7Sh1geKYcposted by the OP  that was suppose to be a engineer getting killed by a meser. Now the first couple of fights seem like a 1v1 but it was really a 1v2 against the engineer. Through the end of the video the engineer is finally able to get the mesmer into a 1v1 and does fine against him.

As its sopposed to be.

In GW1 Mesmer was probably the weakest class, damage wise. Actually if you didnt know how to play it proper, the damage was laughable.

But when player knows how to play. You had one mistake against mesmer, and its just cascade of pain after that.

And in groups, if mesmer was not under focused fire. He would shut down opponents and turn them into cannon fodder.

Here in GW2 its even more

You bring so much confussion, debuffs, stealth - with good support (preferably elementaist)

It will be huge mindfuck pain in PVP

Just as in GW1, where mesmer was the first to be targeted by opposite team - here will be the same !

Can not wait ;)

Originally posted by Gudrunix

Originally posted by crewthief

I'm really starting to believe that Mesmer clones are far less about trickery, and far more about putting opponents in tough positions.

What I have been trying to say is:  players are much better at making use of certain abilities than developers give them credit for.  On the top of that list are abilities that have multiple effects.  Basically, the more degrees of freedom a player has, the better they will make use of them, in ways the developers may not have anticipated.

Again, going back to Riot and Shaco, what Riot did not anticipate is that players would find so many ways to use Shaco's abilities.  His boxes are used, not just for damage output and their fear effect, but for warding, for farming minions, for setting up ambushes, for anchors that other Champions could jump or teleport to.  His invisibility was used, not just for setting up ganks, but for escapes, for hopping barriers, for re-engaging after pretending to leave a combat, and so forth.

Players like playing characters that have extremely flexible abilities, for that reason - they give the player a lot of options, a lot of control.  And developers routinely underestimate how powerful those characters are - which only increases the number of players who want to play them.

I do get what you're saying, I just think mastering a Mesmer will be a bit more difficult due to the complexity of the class. At the end of the day, alot players want easy mode, and I don't think the Mesmer fits that criteria. Having a low health pool and paper for armor, they don't posess an overt defense, like the Warrior for example. Because of this, timing your abilities and understanding what each do, for each weapon set you have, will be vital to your survivability. I think the learning curve will keep the profession from being FotM. Hey, I could be wrong...at any rate, it may be a bit early to call anything OP at this point. Most all of the classes look quite powerful in some videos that we've seen.

Originally posted by Lobotomist

Originally posted by Games888

hmm I think that class only work good for pve, for pvp everyone will know whos the real player and go for it right away. 

Ye ?

check out this vid

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-z7Sh1geKYc

(engie getting pwned by mesmer)

min

6:50

mesmer getting pwned by engie

I played a Mesmer for at least 100 hours of Guild Wars 1 PvP.  There are certain classes that they can just eat alive, or pester, or shut down.  Specifically most healers, but because of that over time everyone instinctually focused down the mesmers and they are squishy.  They have some decent escape mechanics but if you use them you hurt your damage output.  It got kind of annoying where the real fun of the class was only with organized groups, but it was a cool class.

Really in Guild Wars from my experience every class can be beast when used right against the right foes.  It is a group PvP game for the most part.  I know WvWvW may have some 1v1 fights, but most of it will likely be based around group dynamics.