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General Discussion  » I don't know why anybody is surprised that this current Xpac failed compare to the others

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44 posts found
  Volkmar

Novice Member

Joined: 3/04/04
Posts: 2503

2/10/12 4:22:09 AM#21
Originally posted by MMOExposed
Cataclysm featured no new classes, no new professions (Archeology doesn't count), and more shallow trees rather than deeper trees. The only content that they gave us was Aesthetic -new zones and new races, but nothing ~Different~ to do in them.


I don't know why anybody is surprised at the results of this xpac. I like WoW for years, but this xpac bore me the most. So many changes went into play, which actually made the game feel worst.

for example, the change that Blizzard made to the PvP zone, right before CAT patch, was a huge killer blow to the players that enjoyed that kind of gameplay from WoW in WoTLK. Now I have to wait in a queue, because my faction has two big of a population. That's a 2+hour wait here people,,, just to do something I may enjoy. The talent trees were made even more shallow.

also what was the point of making brand new zones over the other Vanilla WoW zones, if these zones have no effect at all on max level characters. Most of the new map was for LOW LEVEL CHARACTERS!!! they could have at least added a Level Scaling feature to the game, so high level characters get some kind of enjoyment out of the new lower level areas.

also CAT was suppose to be about the War between the HORDE AND ALLIANCE, yet were are the improvements to the PvP? The new Battlegrounds felt more like revamps of older BattleGrounds rather than the new deal.

new races are nothing when you have nothing new to play with them. Hasn't Blizzard learned this by now from TBC? come on!!!!

Blizzard added nothing new.


it's pretty common sense here. CAT failed because the developers got complacent. If you not going to add anything new with the game, then yeah, they're going to lose millions of Subscribers.

just as well, anyway. Guild Wars 2 looks amazing !! Maybe Blizzard should have copy Anet, now with MoP, or in the near future.


I think you forgot that Blizzard did NOT just revamp the world with Cata, they also revamped ALL classes, adding specs key abilities at level 10 and making each spec much more distinct from the others instead of having to wait until level 40-50ish to call yourself a proper "fire mage" for example.

But I DO agree that Cata zones felt disjointed. Each one was cool on its own, yes and they were connected by the overall cataclysm story, yes.... but there was no unifying theme like Outlands or Northrend had and I think that hurt them overall.

But MoP will bring it back, there is an unifying theme there and a new class... plus a new race and many new play modes, so it seems everyone will get what they want soon

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  Axxar

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/09/08
Posts: 1744

"Go inside. Tell them you are the Avatar."

2/12/12 4:13:59 AM#22

I think Cataclysm was the best expansion yet, because it renewed a lot of the stuff that had grown old and stale, and also managed to bring difficulty and fun back into the game. Unfortunately they completely ruined it, like WotLK, by nerfing the difficulty into oblivion. What's the point of a hard mode dungeon if you're guaranteed to win even if you get a full group of retards?

I was especially disappointed and quit because I felt conned by Blizzard. The main reason I bought the game was because of how Blizzard proudly proclaimed difficulty would be coming back, only to do a complete 180 on thieir word by having all the difficult dungeons nerfed to high Hell a few weeks after I dinged 85 on my Worgen.

Currently playing: FTL, Hearthstone and Reaper of Souls.
Eagerly anticipating: Elite: Dangerous, Legend of Grimrock 2, Warlords of Draenor and Star Citizen.

  ShaunJ1380

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/26/10
Posts: 78

2/21/12 6:53:15 AM#23
Originally posted by Meltdown

 2. Putting difficulty back into a game that you already removed.

I think Blizzard pulled the rug out from under their playerbase by taking them from WoTLK blazing through heroics instances (talking 10 minute runs with a good warrior tank). Then fast forward to Cataclysm and heroics were essentially 5-person raids, stand in the wrong spot and die instantly. If they wanted to appease the hardcore crowds then make a new tier of dungeon running for them under a different name.

 


1000xthis. Blizzard has even admited it. I'm too lazy to find a source. Google, "blizzard admits cata too hard" and you will find it.

I was preaching to the heavens at the start of cata. This is too hard! Was it too hard for me? No, but it was too hard. You have to tune things so captain derp can still fumble his way through an instance. No one, not even those of us who want a challenge, feels like running a heroic for 1.5 hours try to beat a boss. That's what raiding is for. It's why those of us looking for a challenge raid.

I still to this day see groups wiping on heroic GB. Especially the DPS check on the last boss. No Mr. Derp. You really can't do 2k on this boss and expect me to carry you. I have been recently gearing a hunter. It was my 20k to a 2k (how?!?) and a 4k. I just can't carry that. I'm not amazing!

The new HoT heroics were toned down. They seem about right. Just hard enough that Mr. Derp will wipe the group, but not so hard that Mr. Derp can't possible ride my coat tails to victory.

I said all along that those of us with our rose colored vanilla glasses were remembering it wrong. Sure, we have fond memories, but no one stops to think about how horrible it was to spam "LFG!" for 45 minutes, just to have Mr. Derp wipe you over and over because he didn't know how to kite on his shiny new hunter.

I will take Wrath style WoW over any style of WoW any day!

  User Deleted
2/21/12 7:02:06 AM#24

You can't make blizzard stop changing the game. I thought that the throngs of angry quiters would make them see the light or error of their ways. but they don't care they wont stop rebuilding the game each xpac. so when you finally wake up and see that pandas are going to be part of game world you sit back and go well cool then lets see how this goes.

What I want in WoW and what the devs want are very different. they get paid with player money to make the game the way they are told to make it. Right now I love transmog and LFR and have been soling old raid content with my pally. so i'm pretty happy. if they keep allowing me to have options then I will keep playing.

  Loke666

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16023

2/21/12 7:16:44 AM#25

Most MMOs have better and worse Xpacs. If you look on the games with many like EQ you will see that 2/3 is pretty bad and that sounds about right for Wow as well.

It is not really a problem, the problem is that Blizzard make so few expansions compared to many other MMOs that a bad one have to last a longtime. In EQ you know there will be a new expansion 9 months later so you can live with a low level expansion.

Wow is kinda odd, 90% of the game is low level stuff that people play for a few weeks and making a low level expansion that have to last 2 years were a misstake. On the plus side is Blizzard good with patching in new content so it could be worse.

But anyways, I think Blizzard needs to pick up the pace with releasing expansions, it isn´t like they can´t afford to hire in some more people if that is what it takes. One every year is not really that hard.

  tordurbar

Novice Member

Joined: 5/02/10
Posts: 390

2/22/12 12:07:50 PM#26

I too am a casual and I left WOW after CATA (after 6 years of sub). To me the breaking point was the simplification of the Talent system. Not only are there fewer talants to tinker with but you are forced to go with the vision that Blizz had for the class and talent tree. I went to RIFT. After having the ability in that game to be almost whatever you want to be I just can't return to WOW no matter how much nostalgia pushes me. I have gone back to WOW from time to time and created low leve toons but as soon as I hit level 10 and that new talent system I quit. What makes me even sadder is that MOP is going to trim the talent tree even further!!! I really enjoyed WOW for 6 years but seeing where it is now and where it is headed - I am done with it.

  Souldrainer

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/21/06
Posts: 1878

2/23/12 1:47:37 AM#27
Originally posted by expresso

Cata sold more copies in the first month than any of the previous expansion.. yeah real failure.

TBH everyone has an opinion just cus some ones thinks cata failed does not make it true.  I loved cata, but Wrath so far has been my fav expac.

Even if true, this isn't good justification to call it a success, since enough players left to cancel that out, and then some, and they are still leaving at a rate of ~1000 players per day.  People bought it at launch so they could see what it was about, then promptly quit.  Every other expac gained players at an alarming rate.  You're essentially saying "Cata is a success because it took a nose dive."  That is the fact that your claims support.

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  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

2/23/12 1:53:27 AM#28

People on these forums have their own definition of failure. if i go by these forums every MMO is a failure and nothign is worth playing.


Bite Me

  Souldrainer

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/21/06
Posts: 1878

2/23/12 2:06:59 AM#29
Originally posted by Nikkita

People on these forums have their own definition of failure. if i go by these forums every MMO is a failure and nothign is worth playing.

How does this relate to a game losing 1000 players a day?

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  uohaloran

Novice Member

Joined: 11/16/05
Posts: 832

2/23/12 2:16:42 AM#30

Regardless of what people think of the new race, Mists of Pandaria is still going to sell incredibly well and it does introduce some new things to do in the game that aren't related to their ever increasingly boring design philosophies.  Not to mention they've got hot competition now -- if people really think that Blizzard has been sitting on their hands until something came along, I think they're bonkers.  They've had almost 7 years of unquestioned rule (monetary and popularity) over this genre and they're most definitely not going to let go of it with a whimper.

I haven't even played Cataclysm and quit before WotLK ran it's natural course, but it's pretty easy to understand why players are leaving now, too, because the game is basically going to be stagnant until the new expansion; that doesn't mean they'll never return as some people seem to insinuate.

Not to mention, I think Cataclysm was kind of a slow burner.  Sure, veteran players and people who were already at level cap didn't get much out of it, but it revitalized a ton of their old content for new players or simply old players starting over.
 
edit: grammar
  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 4709

2/23/12 2:18:54 AM#31
Originally posted by Souldrainer
Originally posted by Nikkita

People on these forums have their own definition of failure. if i go by these forums every MMO is a failure and nothign is worth playing.

How does this relate to a game losing 1000 players a day?

how does it relate to WoW still having over 10m active subscribers..

  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

2/23/12 2:37:04 AM#32
Originally posted by Souldrainer
Originally posted by Nikkita

People on these forums have their own definition of failure. if i go by these forums every MMO is a failure and nothign is worth playing.

How does this relate to a game losing 1000 players a day?

A 7 year old game is losing players? who would have thought. So i guess that makes it a failure?


Bite Me

  timtrack

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 10/03/06
Posts: 392

2/23/12 2:42:34 AM#33
Originally posted by Souldrainer
Originally posted by Nikkita

People on these forums have their own definition of failure. if i go by these forums every MMO is a failure and nothign is worth playing.

How does this relate to a game losing 1000 players a day?

So in ~8000 days WoW will have lost all it's players! DOOOOOOM!!!111

  Souldrainer

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/21/06
Posts: 1878

2/23/12 3:54:11 AM#34

Three posts in a row not acknowledging that Vanilla, TBC, and WOTLK built the game to 10.5 million, and now Cata has torn the game below that mark and is still declining.  Not only that, but the decline began only weeks after Cata came out.  There is no way Cata can be called a success.  Any game or expansion that ends up taking the IP lower than its starting point is a complete failure.

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  timtrack

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 10/03/06
Posts: 392

2/23/12 4:39:56 AM#35
Originally posted by Souldrainer

Three posts in a row not acknowledging that Vanilla, TBC, and WOTLK built the game to 10.5 million, and now Cata has torn the game below that mark and is still declining.  Not only that, but the decline began only weeks after Cata came out.  There is no way Cata can be called a success.  Any game or expansion that ends up taking the IP lower than its starting point is a complete failure.

Different perspectives. Some call it failure, others do not.

The game is "running on fumes". It's old and out-dated and people hunger for something new. Many will take any reason to try a game that is not WoW simply because they want something that isn't WoW. Blizzard are squeezing out every ounce of their game, and they are still finding new ways to put some more gass in there.

 

Take these variables, look at the state of the game, and still call it a failure:

* The game has been out for 8 years.

* It's graphics are outdated.

* People have higher expectations then they had 8 years ago.

* People hunger for a new game.

State: Still the most successful mmo in the industry.

 

If a game is in a slow natural decay due to being outdated, but still manages to maintain millions of players, i do not see anything even remotley close to what can be called a failure. By some peoples definitons of failure, most games ever released is a failure because almost nobody plays them anymore. How often do you play Pacman these days? No? So it's a failure?

 

And no, i don't think Cataclysm is a failure. In fact, it's a success. The game has had it's peak, and what Blizzard can do at best is to make the decay as slow as possible. And that's exactly what Cataclysm has done. Some "veterans" may have finally given up, while new/long lost players emerge because these new features cater to them. There is only so much you can do to please a certian group of players, and i think they made the right move to maintain as many subscriptions as possible.

 

So the game is in a state of natural decay for various reasons, but is still the most successfull mmo in the world. Failure? Not in my book. It may however have failed to please you, which doesn't make the game or the expansion itself a failure.

The game has successfully done it's job, and will keep doing so for a while to come. When you pull something old out of your fridge which expired so you want to throw it out because it's old and smells - it didn't fail, you simply dont want it anymore. You want something new. Blizzard managed to make people eat that old smelly thing they pulled out of the fridge, and like it -> Success.

  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

2/23/12 4:51:02 AM#36
Originally posted by Souldrainer

Three posts in a row not acknowledging that Vanilla, TBC, and WOTLK built the game to 10.5 million, and now Cata has torn the game below that mark and is still declining.  Not only that, but the decline began only weeks after Cata came out.  There is no way Cata can be called a success.  Any game or expansion that ends up taking the IP lower than its starting point is a complete failure.

Opinion not a fact.


Bite Me

  Lumm

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/09
Posts: 130

2/23/12 4:53:34 AM#37

The fact is the content blizzard releases is so far apart once an expansion launches people know exactly what kind of content there is to play right off the bat. 6 months later a few things might chnage but its not groundbreaking. Cata was a huge failure in the eyes of players, maybe not in the eyes of profit because that will always be there, too many suckers like myself that caved and bought it right away. I just think people are fed up with the same thing over and over. I havn't played the new mists expansion but i can tell you one thing. Ive already played it for the past 5 or so years nothing amazing will come out of it. I actually think Vanguard releases more content updates than blizzard does and they have millions and millions to throw in a fire and burn. You just have to ask yourself this one question.

 

Where does all the money go that WOW produces? Beacause it sure doesnt go into developing things in a timely matter.

Maybe another decade from now when titan comes out we will finally relise thats where its all been going.

  Nikkita

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/25/10
Posts: 830

2/23/12 4:55:48 AM#38
Originally posted by smokedogg311

The fact is the content blizzard releases is so far apart once an expansion launches people know exactly what kind of content there is to play right off the bat. 6 months later a few things might chnage but its not groundbreaking. Cata was a huge failure in the eyes of players, maybe not in the eyes of profit because that will always be there, too many suckers like myself that caved and bought it right away. I just think people are fed up with the same thing over and over. I havn't played the new mists expansion but i can tell you one thing. Ive already played it for the past 5 or so years nothing amazing will come out of it. I actually think Vanguard releases more content updates than blizzard does and they have millions and millions to throw in a fire and burn. You just have to ask yourself this one question.

 

Where does all the money go that WOW produces? Beacause it sure doesnt go into developing things in a timely matter.

Maybe another decade from now when titan comes out we will finally relise thats where its all been going.

Thanks for the nice joke....hahahahaha!!


Bite Me

  ThemePork

Novice Member

Joined: 11/29/11
Posts: 317

Pork, it's like beef but not quite.

2/23/12 5:04:02 AM#39

Old and outdated? They still have the best Gfx engine and combat responsiveness of any MMO I've ever played. However the game started going south way before this expansion - my personal marker is when they added X server PvP and LFD - Cata was just the final nail in the coffin.

  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 10785

2/23/12 9:07:52 AM#40
Originally posted by Zecktorin

To be honest I think this expansion was to make the game more interesting to new players... thats why they mostly just changed the vanilla world. Most people quit WoW before level 10. I mean it did work lots of people who never played before are joining evne today.

to be clear

pre Cata, most TRIAL players quit before 10 -- not players who bought the game

 

70% of WoW Trial Accounts Quit Before Level 10

http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/world-of-warcraft-expansion-3/1068514p1.html

 

Cata is over a year old

Blizzard has not said if Cata helped improve Trial players buying the game

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