Originally posted by ShakyMo

well actually having a "gameworld" would be a start

you know rather than endless corridors with a bunch of static mobs stood around waiting to be killed.  Its just not imersive in any way whatsoever.

Their entire world isn't corridors... They have jungle, sand, and snow too !

I don't view the game as a bad one actually. It's just missing ingredients or layers that would make it truly come to life.

I committed myself to six updates when I said I'd buy the game, I am still ok with that commitment.

My honest opinion is that one should never play a launch product unless they are willing to see what the community will be and that takes about 6 content updates imo.

Skeptics will play early, leave early, and complain endlessly.  If the game pans out they will either come back in a year and act like they never complained once. Or they will scream, " I told you so" some more and leave again.

Originally posted by Akais

Originally posted by ShakyMo

well actually having a "gameworld" would be a start

you know rather than endless corridors with a bunch of static mobs stood around waiting to be killed.  Its just not imersive in any way whatsoever.

Their entire world isn't corridors... They have jungle, sand, and snow too !

 

I don't view the game as a bad one actually. It's just missing ingredients or layers that would make it truly come to life.

I committed myself to six updates when I said I'd buy the game, I am still ok with that commitment.

My honest opinion is that one should never play a launch product unless they are willing to see what the community will be and that takes about 6 content updates imo.

Skeptics will play early, leave early, and complain endlessly.  If the game pans out they will either come back in a year and act like they never complained once. Or they will scream, " I told you so" some more and leave again.

I quit from boredom, the only planet i encountered that wasn't a that much of a corridor was tattoine, everywhere else was on the rails - maybe hoth is more open I didn't make it that far.  Regardless EVERY zone is lifeless, just cloned characters stood doing nothing, no ambient sound, no critters no animation to the environment, it is probably the least imersive MMO ive played.

i don't go along with some of the other critisism like "worst pvp ever" especially from wowies, SWTOR pvp is better than WOW and especially RIFT PVP.  But all 3 are easily in the bottom half of mmos ive played PVP wise.

The dungeons were pretty good, but then lots of games have good dungeons - wow, rift, aoc, lotr etc..

Nah, WAR was at least interesting.

And who said that LotRO WoW and such have good dungeons? Since when are linear scripted dungeons that take 10 minutes to walk through, and are instanced, considered GOOD?

SWG managed around 300K people pre-nge and it sucked even then with little positives besides crafting and space combat.

Let that sink it.

The SW name alone is a sure 300k alone. 

Hell assuming it loses as many people as RIFT did, You know that game every calls a success? it would still have around 750k subs.

Originally posted by Herodes

WAR was influenced by Mythic, ToR is influenced by Bioware

Is that why the Warhammer dev team is working on TOR?

Originally posted by Snaylor47

SWG managed around 300K people pre-nge and it sucked even then with little positives besides crafting and space combat.

 

Let that sink it.

 

The SW name alone is a sure 300k alone. 

 

Hell assuming it loses as many people as RIFT did, You know that game every calls a success? it would still have around 750k subs.

How cute.

This babby thinks pre NGE was only played because it was Star Wars

Well if it was just because it was Star Wars, why did they all leave after NGE hit? The Star Wars IP should have been able to carry it, like you said.

I love this. After 5 years of hype, SWTOR comes out the gate, falls flat on it's face and all the fanboys can say is "W-well the S-Star wars IP will carry it!"

Which bascially means you're saying "SURE SWTOR sucks! But it's still Star Wars! GIVE BIOWARE YOUR MONEYZ!!"

Originally posted by spizz

There was a thread in the Forum about someone quotes describing about the issues WAR had since parts of the dev team did develope swtor aswell. I did notice some things which you see ingame.

 

 

Quote:

Warhammer was billed as a game that would support huge, large scale battles where you could assault forts, siege cities, and more. Unfortunately, if you got more than 50 to 100 players in the same location, the lag and server performance made the game almost unplayable.

Quote:

Too Much Crowd Control How did EA/Mythic not learn from their own experiences with DAoC? Did they forget the days of Stungard? I remember it vividly, as I played on Midgard Percival and my wife played a Norse healer. Crowd Control (CC) was a major problem in DAoC, and they eventually had to tone it down and give people abilities to break out of it. At least in DAoC most CC broke on damage (like the most common form of CC, mez/mesmerize). WAR on the other hand is dominated by forms of CC that not only disables the opponent but also leaves him/her disabled while taking damage. Stuns, disables, disarms,roots, and more fly around the battlefield constantly. It is not uncommon to spend at least a quarter of your time in battle under the effects of some form of CC. In fact, considering how common AoE Disable + AoE spam "bomb groups" are, you might very well spend 100% of your battle time CCed. Why? Because you won't survive the duration of the AoE disable.

Quote:

In a game dominated by ranged damage, no class could compete with the Bright Wizard. Whether it was overpowered (and sometimes buggy) DoTs at release, or the ridiculous amounts of AoE that dominated the late game, Bright Wizards have always been a brutal subscription killer for WAR. Putting AoE disable on the same class as the highest AoE damage makes no sense. The common defense is "Sorcerors [the Destruction mirror] can do everything Bright Wizards can do!"

Quote:

Lack of Population Balance It is hard to understand how EA/Mythic did not see this one coming. The Destruction character models had dramatically superior art, and pretty much all the "cool" looking avatars. Order had terrible looking dwarves, bald Warrior Priests, red-headed-step-child Bright Wizards, and some very limp looking High Elves. Destruction had the incredibly impressive looking Chosen, the amazing looking Orcs, and some of the sexiest dark elves on any MMORPG. It should come as no surprise that at release, most servers were heavily dominated in population by Destruction.

 

 

 anything "that was learned" in daoc or from daoc was never repeated in an mmorpg.  That's why you will never see a title with 3 realms, 44 classes and 24 races.  I've posted that on forums and people laugh about it, asking if I'm retarded or crazy that I would assume any game could have something like that.  I suppose the last laugh was with EA when they buried the title so that it would not be invested in.

rip dark age of camelot

Originally posted by Garvon3

Nah, WAR was at least interesting.

 

 

And who said that LotRO WoW and such have good dungeons? Since when are linear scripted dungeons that take 10 minutes to walk through, and are instanced, considered GOOD?

/shrug

I thought their dungeons were pretty sweet. Ten minutes to walk through? We talking about newer ones I take it? You sure as hell can't walk through any of those older dungeons in ten minutes.

Pretty memorable battles from those dungeons in my opinion. Some were rather tough too.

How cute.

 

This babby thinks pre NGE was only played because it was Star Wars

 

Well if it was just because it was Star Wars, why did they all leave after NGE hit? The Star Wars IP should have been able to carry it, like you said.

 

I love this. After 5 years of hype, SWTOR comes out the gate, falls flat on it's face and all the fanboys can say is "W-well the S-Star wars IP will carry it!"

 

Which bascially means you're saying "SURE SWTOR sucks! But it's still Star Wars! GIVE BIOWARE YOUR MONEYZ!!"

Alot of people did,

SWG still mantained about 50k subs prior to closing down. It sold 1.2 million copies.

Once again SWG sucked both pre and post NGE, and only managed to mantain 25% of its player base at its peak. Assuming TOR does the same.

It will still have 500k subs assuming that it does not sell a single copy from here on out.

Pre-NGE SWG sucked and more people left then stayed.

Some good points in there.

On the population gap, there's no doubt that Empire is WAY hotter than Republic on the Sith Wyrm server.  There's easily a 10-15% gap there, persistently, in my experience. 

I'm normally someone who picks the goody-goody side in every MMO, at LEAST for the first toon, no matter what.  But guess who my first character to 50 was?  A Bounty Hunter.  In indisputable terms of power balance, and even in the taste-based "coolness" of content, Empire beats Republic hands down, in my opinion.  And the numbers agree with me.

One way or another, they're gonna have to find a way to fix that, or at least marginalize the pop differences.

Originally posted by Snaylor47

Alot of people did,

 

SWG still mantained about 50k subs prior to closing down. It sold 1.2 million copies.

 

Once again SWG sucked both pre and post NGE, and only managed to mantain 25% of its player base at its peak. Assuming TOR does the same.

 

It will still have 500k subs assuming that it does not sell a single copy from here on out.

 

Pre-NGE SWG sucked and more people left then stayed.

What.. I... You... No....

Just... NO.

SWG died BECAUSE IT WAS A BAD GAME. It was successful before NGE because it was a unique MMO, one of the only sandbox MMOs in the world.

Jesus, this is what SWTOR fans have been reduced to? You guys are already willing to "settle" for 500k? What happened to the hype? What happened to the WoW killer?

I've seen this with WAR. All the fans living patch by patch, claiming the next one will "save the game" and it NEVER does.

Originally posted by Jason2444

 How cute.

 This babby thinks pre NGE was only played because it was Star Wars

 Well if it was just because it was Star Wars, why did they all leave after NGE hit? The Star Wars IP should have been able to carry it, like you said.

 I love this. After 5 years of hype, SWTOR comes out the gate, falls flat on it's face and all the fanboys can say is "W-well the S-Star wars IP will carry it!"

 Which bascially means you're saying "SURE SWTOR sucks! But it's still Star Wars! GIVE BIOWARE YOUR MONEYZ!!"

Pretty obnoxious to call someone a "babby".

SWG was bleeding subs long before NGE.  My guild and player city on Sunrunner was becoming a ghost town even before CU.  No company makes radical changes to their game when it's doing well.  They were treading water, they panicked, and the rest is history.

The rest of your post deserves no reply.  Keep living in your bubble, if you must.

"The SW name alone is a sure 300k alone."

but what about the people who could care less if the name is star wars and just want a new mmo.selling a game based on the game just sounds like the company had no intention of the game suceeding and just wanted a quick buck

Originally posted by Jason2444

Originally posted by Snaylor47

Alot of people did,

 

SWG still mantained about 50k subs prior to closing down. It sold 1.2 million copies.

 

Once again SWG sucked both pre and post NGE, and only managed to mantain 25% of its player base at its peak. Assuming TOR does the same.

 

It will still have 500k subs assuming that it does not sell a single copy from here on out.

 

Pre-NGE SWG sucked and more people left then stayed.

What.. I... You... No....

 

Just... NO.

 

SWG died BECAUSE IT WAS A BAD GAME. It was successful before NGE because it was a unique MMO, one of the only sandbox MMOs in the world.

 

Jesus, this is what SWTOR fans have been reduced to? You guys are already willing to "settle" for 500k? What happened to the hype? What happened to the WoW killer?

 

I've seen this with WAR. All the fans living patch by patch, claiming the next one will "save the game" and it NEVER does.

 SWG wasn't particularly successful before NGE. If they had continued improving it instead of gutting it success was possible but who knows?

The only thing they have in common is the failer after selling many copies their sub base goes down like no other game.