For me it was in beta, when I stepped into the world, especially since Coruscant and saw this huge lifeless world with almost zero sound effect, and I felt like in a museum. Even now I am so letdown when I am in some jungle or city and there is total silence and nothing going on around me.

A red flag was certainly also the constant attitude of Bioware, like "neener neener we don't tell" for YEARS; and then Bioware's devs always being totally opaque against suggestions and critique with STUPID brush-off answers like "this isn't about Uncle Own" and "people can't identify with freak races". Like they all knew better, and hubris usually is a bad sign.

Originally posted by BadSpock

Originally posted by Cecropia

Originally posted by jdnewell

Originally posted by BadSpock

When I hit the low-mid 30's on my Jedi Consular... and just lost all motivation.

Then made a Jedi Knight and played till like 27... then lost all motivation.

Then got my motivation back and got my Consular to 50... then lost all motivation to log onto her again after I finished my class story line.

Made a trooper and had a good time playing till about 17... then lost all motivation.

Hmmm...

Not being rude at all, but were you not the guy defending SWTOR against even constructive critics? Going to play every class for the story alone, yielding 1000's of hours of gameplay? Defending the choices they made that were obvious mistakes?

Not that you were every overly rude but you were close at times with people who pretty much voiced the exact same things you are saying now. It just took them a week instead of 2 months I guess.

LOL like I said not being rude to you, but it is amusing to see such a turn around about ToR in what? 6 weeks?.

Maybe want to play that next game for a month or two before shooting people down for stating flaws of your new shiny game. Just a thought =)

Amusing indeed. Half the fun of these forums is observing overly hyped individuals deflate right in front of your eyes. One of the reasons I tend to avoid defending unreleased games that I have never played ;) 

What do you want me to say?

Yeah you were right?

You weren't.

I had a great, great, great time with this game for about 2 months. My experiences in beta and during early access and right after launch were amazing.

I'm sorry I'm not psychic and can predict how I'm going to feel and react after 6 weeks?

I'm glad it only took other people 2 weeks to figure out some of this stuff. I'm also glad some people still enjoy the game immensly despite what many of us consider to be its flaws.

I was honest in what I thought at the time based on my experiences and am honest now based on my experiences.

I don't think anyone has the right to say "I told you so" on either side of the fence.

When my pre-paid time runs out, I'll make the decision as to whether or not I'll continue to subscrube, and that decision will be based upon what updates and additions and fixes they've made etc.

=)

I am not calling you out, asking for an apology, or saying I told you so. I honestly dont care what your spend your time or money on either.

I am saying that before you call people trolls, haters, moron, idiot or whatever about a game maybe you should give it more than a week or two of play. Forming your own opinion on a game is fine, we all do. Even defending a game that you like is fine against unjust or inaccurate information being given.

But maybe take a minute and look at your own post history for SWTOR and some of the comments to people you made. Many with the exact same issues you have with the game now, only difference is for them the new car smell wore off a bit quicker.

Maybe dont be so quick to call others out just because they dont like or feel different about a game. Disagreement is fine and what forums are about. But just have to face the facts that at times you were pretty much an asshole to people who had problems with TOR.

Thats what I am saying. Take that for what its worth.

Originally posted by fony

Originally posted by BadSpock

Originally posted by BadSpock

When I hit the low-mid 30's on my Jedi Consular... and just lost all motivation.

Then made a Jedi Knight and played till like 27... then lost all motivation.

Then got my motivation back and got my Consular to 50... then lost all motivation to log onto her again after I finished my class story line.

Made a trooper and had a good time playing till about 17... then lost all motivation.

I was honest in what I thought at the time based on my experiences and am honest now based on my experiences.

 [Mod Edit]

I never saw a major bug in Beta or in the first few weeks except for the tiny-tiny Sateele Shaan bug (which was hilarious) and the mouths not moving bug.

I never have to this day experienced ability delay issues or performance FPS issues - until I hit Illum (again after like 6-8 weeks)

I didn't experience all of the loading screen issues till must later on because you don't really start experiencing them till well into the high 20's and 30's with the planets that have the orbital stations.

The world did NOT feel dead at all in the beginning because it was full of players at all levels, it was easy to find groups for Heroic quest and I saw tons and tons of players all the time in the early days.

So yes, I stand completely 100% by what I said - I did not notice these things till much, much later.

And now I do.

Again, sorry I'm not psychic and couldn't forsee things happening that I wasn't seeing at the time?

Oh I forgot one :

- The devs use the official forums in their iteration process. (global cooldown changes poll lol)

Wow, some of you posters in this thread either had their accounts hacked by complete strangers or have legendary short memories. To see some of the people writing in this thread with their comments considering what they had to say only a short time ago.

I mean I can understand getting to endgame and feeling let down but some here are acting like they knew it was jacked from the start. Certainly not what they were saying just a short time ago.

Funny stuff.

Game hasn't even been out that long. Can't wait to see what some have to say at the three to six month marks.

I had no idea while leveling that the story would end so mediocre - because I hadn't got to the ending yet..

I had no idea the choices I was making wouldn't have any effect later on.. because I hadn't gotten to the later on yet..

I didn't know how grind heavy and repetitive the PvP would be, because I didn't PvP much at all.

I had no idea Illum and open world PvP was so bad, because it took me a long while to get to that level...

So again, I'm sorry I'm not psychic?

Originally posted by BadSpock

Originally posted by fony

Originally posted by BadSpock

Originally posted by BadSpock

When I hit the low-mid 30's on my Jedi Consular... and just lost all motivation.

Then made a Jedi Knight and played till like 27... then lost all motivation.

Then got my motivation back and got my Consular to 50... then lost all motivation to log onto her again after I finished my class story line.

Made a trooper and had a good time playing till about 17... then lost all motivation.

I was honest in what I thought at the time based on my experiences and am honest now based on my experiences.

[Mod Edit]

I never saw a major bug in Beta or in the first few weeks except for the tiny-tiny Sateele Shaan bug (which was hilarious) and the mouths not moving bug.

I never have to this day experienced ability delay issues or performance FPS issues - until I hit Illum (again after like 6-8 weeks)

I didn't experience all of the loading screen issues till must later on because you don't really start experiencing them till well into the high 20's and 30's with the planets that have the orbital stations.

The world did NOT feel dead at all in the beginning because it was full of players at all levels, it was easy to find groups for Heroic quest and I saw tons and tons of players all the time in the early days.

So yes, I stand completely 100% by what I said - I did not notice these things till much, much later.

And now I do.

Again, sorry I'm not psychic and couldn't forsee things happening that I wasn't seeing at the time?

There is a difference in " not noticing'  things and being a D**K to the people that did. Just because you did not notice does not mean it is not happening. Maybe you can use your superior intellect to ponder that?

As a person who used to work in game development business I still have many friends who work with people from EA. I've heard horror stories about this game while in development and problems that they had with it but I simply could not believe it - god damn such a huge budget. Unfortunately it all came true and we have an excuse of an MMO with us today...I'm really sad to see BW go down the drain as a fine single player game developer - I hope that at least that gossip is made up. I guess we will see very soon.

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Wow, some of you posters in this thread either had their accounts hacked by complete strangers or have legendary short memories. To see some of the people writing in this thread with their comments considering what they had to say only a short time ago.

I mean I can understand getting to endgame and feeling let down but some here are acting like they knew it was jacked from the start. Certainly not what they were saying just a short time ago.

Funny stuff.

Game hasn't even been out that long. Can't wait to see what some have to say at the three to six month marks.

lulz.

Hindsight is 20/20.

Tatooine and Hoth were very wide open and a lot of fun, I had no idea that the later planets were back to the cooridor closed off garbage (Corellia was terrible.)

I still don't think I said anything I didn't believe at the time based on my play experiences.

Sorry I'm not omniscient?

I knew Bioware was going downhill after Dragon Age 1 and 2.  While playing DA1, I enjoyed most of the story, but it was deceptively linear. Choice was a facade. What's worse was the combat was meh and the quests were MMO type quests of "kill 10 rats" or "Get to the tower . . . by killing the 10 rats in your way!" Bah.

Then DA2 came out, and I just shook my head at what had become of the great Bioware. They now have to re-earn their reputation, Baulder's Gate was a long time ago.

Originally posted by jdnewell

I never saw a major bug in Beta or in the first few weeks except for the tiny-tiny Sateele Shaan bug (which was hilarious) and the mouths not moving bug.

I never have to this day experienced ability delay issues or performance FPS issues - until I hit Illum (again after like 6-8 weeks)

I didn't experience all of the loading screen issues till must later on because you don't really start experiencing them till well into the high 20's and 30's with the planets that have the orbital stations.

The world did NOT feel dead at all in the beginning because it was full of players at all levels, it was easy to find groups for Heroic quest and I saw tons and tons of players all the time in the early days.

So yes, I stand completely 100% by what I said - I did not notice these things till much, much later.

And now I do.

Again, sorry I'm not psychic and couldn't forsee things happening that I wasn't seeing at the time?

There is a difference in " not noticing'  things and being a D**K to the people that did. Just because you did not notice does not mean it is not happening. Maybe you can use your superior intellect to ponder that?

If I believed everything people said on MMORPG.com I'd never play any MMORPGs ever.

Every single game has haters and fanbois.

I rely on personal experiences to make my judgements.

And you know what? My personal experiences with TOR at the time were good! *shocker*

And it wasn't until much later in the game and more recently (like this past weekend) that I really started to see the faults.

Me burning out in the mid 30's and then coming back to it and having FUN getting to 50 were more personal than anything - I know if I play a single game non-stop for weeks I get burned out no matter how good the game is. Same thing happened with Skyrim.

Originally posted by BadSpock

Originally posted by jdnewell

I never saw a major bug in Beta or in the first few weeks except for the tiny-tiny Sateele Shaan bug (which was hilarious) and the mouths not moving bug.

I never have to this day experienced ability delay issues or performance FPS issues - until I hit Illum (again after like 6-8 weeks)

I didn't experience all of the loading screen issues till must later on because you don't really start experiencing them till well into the high 20's and 30's with the planets that have the orbital stations.

The world did NOT feel dead at all in the beginning because it was full of players at all levels, it was easy to find groups for Heroic quest and I saw tons and tons of players all the time in the early days.

So yes, I stand completely 100% by what I said - I did not notice these things till much, much later.

And now I do.

Again, sorry I'm not psychic and couldn't forsee things happening that I wasn't seeing at the time?

There is a difference in " not noticing'  things and being a D**K to the people that did. Just because you did not notice does not mean it is not happening. Maybe you can use your superior intellect to ponder that?

If I believed everything people said on MMORPG.com I'd never play any MMORPGs ever.

Every single game has haters and fanbois.

I rely on personal experiences to make my judgements.

And you know what? My personal experiences with TOR at the time were good! *shocker*

And it wasn't until much later in the game and more recently (like this past weekend) that I really started to see the faults.

Me burning out in the mid 30's and then coming back to it and having FUN getting to 50 were more personal than anything - I know if I play a single game non-stop for weeks I get burned out no matter how good the game is. Same thing happened with Skyrim.

LOL

Ok my last post about this. I understand what your experiences were at the time, and that they have changed now.

That Sir is not the point. The point is....Dont be such an ASSHOLE when people disagree with you. Maybe.. just Maybe... people are not idiots, haters or trolls. They may actually have insight and knowledge that you dont have. It may actually benefit you to listen some. Not to everything but at least put it in perspective.

Somehow I doubt you even got that point, seems like your too busy admiring yourself and defending your behavior.

Good Day Sir.

Originally posted by BadSpock

Hindsight is 20/20.

Tatooine and Hoth were very wide open and a lot of fun, I had no idea that the later planets were back to the cooridor closed off garbage (Corellia was terrible.)

I still don't think I said anything I didn't believe at the time based on my play experiences.

Sorry I'm not omniscient?

Next time you listen to what Uncle Elikal says. =)

Nah, j/k. I understand we all have different things we see flawed in SWTOR. Even now I can't 100% say in every case. The only people I *really* blame is Bioware, because many of the flaws were SO OBVIOUS, that I wonder how the heck could they make that?

Originally posted by BadSpock

Originally posted by jdnewell

I never saw a major bug in Beta or in the first few weeks except for the tiny-tiny Sateele Shaan bug (which was hilarious) and the mouths not moving bug.

I never have to this day experienced ability delay issues or performance FPS issues - until I hit Illum (again after like 6-8 weeks)

I didn't experience all of the loading screen issues till must later on because you don't really start experiencing them till well into the high 20's and 30's with the planets that have the orbital stations.

The world did NOT feel dead at all in the beginning because it was full of players at all levels, it was easy to find groups for Heroic quest and I saw tons and tons of players all the time in the early days.

So yes, I stand completely 100% by what I said - I did not notice these things till much, much later.

And now I do.

Again, sorry I'm not psychic and couldn't forsee things happening that I wasn't seeing at the time?

There is a difference in " not noticing'  things and being a D**K to the people that did. Just because you did not notice does not mean it is not happening. Maybe you can use your superior intellect to ponder that?

If I believed everything people said on MMORPG.com I'd never play any MMORPGs ever.

Every single game has haters and fanbois.

I rely on personal experiences to make my judgements.

The problem is most of you can't tell the difference between haters and sincere opinions. Its hard when you're blinded by the hype but over time, after enough disappointments, you learn to be cautiosly optimistic in the future. Then newer gamers will call you hater and troll for bringing up concerns about their beloved games.

My biggest complaint with the leveling up aspect of the game actually is the combat.

Levels 1-20, maybe 25 you still feel pretty OP and the balance is just right so it doesn't feel grindy and you have enough class story content with more challenging encounters with Elites (gold star).

But after that, it's like the power curve drops off flat and every single fight becomes a chore unless you can heal and have a way to regenerate your resources.

Maybe I just the wrong class?

Also, I thought going in that having less story content as you leveled up would be a good thing, more open world more MMO feeling right?

Well you don't figure out till the late 20's early 30's when the class story starts to become less and less that all the open world stuff isn't very good and is quite repetitive.

I still say 1-25 or so I probably still one of the best MMO experiences out there, and considering that was all I was able to play in beta and in the first few weeks, yeah I thought the game was pretty BA.

Does that mean I drank the coolaid and was a victim of the hype?

I don't think so, not at all!

Is it "bad" game design to make the first 1/2 of the game great and the 2nd 1/2 kind of shitty? Yep.

If you really want to check my post history and blog over the past 8 years you can see what kind of games I really want to see made (hint: UO post-Trammel was the best MMO ever made.)

Originally posted by jdnewell

...Good Day Sir.

I'm with Marcy on this one. They have a point albeit put more bluntly than I would have.

Still though least he's honest about it. Kind of being a little harsh don't ya think? At least he's willing to admit it unlike some others around here that have apparently suffered from their tenth bout of mmo amnesia.

Originally posted by jdnewell

Originally posted by BadSpock

If I believed everything people said on MMORPG.com I'd never play any MMORPGs ever.

Every single game has haters and fanbois.

I rely on personal experiences to make my judgements.

And you know what? My personal experiences with TOR at the time were good! *shocker*

And it wasn't until much later in the game and more recently (like this past weekend) that I really started to see the faults.

Me burning out in the mid 30's and then coming back to it and having FUN getting to 50 were more personal than anything - I know if I play a single game non-stop for weeks I get burned out no matter how good the game is. Same thing happened with Skyrim.

LOL

Ok my last post about this. I understand what your experiences were at the time, and that they have changed now.

That Sir is not the point. The point is....Dont be such an ASSHOLE when people disagree with you. Maybe.. just Maybe... people are not idiots, haters or trolls. They may actually have insight and knowledge that you dont have. It may actually benefit you to listen some. Not to everything but at least put it in perspective.

Somehow I doubt you even got that point, seems like your too busy admiring yourself and defending your behavior.

Good Day Sir.

You are right about one thing - I am cocky and I am stuck up.

I've been playing games in this genre for almost 13 years so I think I've got a pretty good perspective on the genre.

That being said, I can appreciate a variety of things for the bits they do right - it's hard to see the flaws when they hide them so well in the early game.

And yeah, I am distrusting - I never listen to anyone who is a hater on these forums simply because most of the time they have such bias and negativity I can't stand reading it.

I also can't stand the use of catch phrase buzz words like WoW-clone and the way a lot of people use words like Hardcore and Themepark etc.

So I am sorry I'm an asshole, but it is true that I am certainly much smarter and better looking than most people.

(that was a joke, FYI even though in my head I tell myself it probably is true regardless) :)

There are some good things about the game, along with a lot of obvious flaws. Just to respond to the original question, my warning bells started to sound pretty quickly into the first hour of play as a Jedi. The  Jedi "newb" zones are horrible. The zone design is about as bad as I've seen in any AAA MMO, but even worse was the very early understanding that the primary goal of the zone design was to maximize travel related time sinks at all costs. When the game then went on to introduce me to the green/red forcefield gateways to instanced content, I should have just uninstalled and cancelled my pre-order right then and there.

In retrospect, I could kick myself for allowing the i.p. to influence my emotional decision to go ahead and buy the box. It shouldn't have been any surprise to me that I only lasted three weeks after launch before I just couldn't bring myself to log in anymore. Times are tight and wasting $55 on this game, for so little return, is something I regret.

At the end of the day after all of this I can really only sum it up one way -

Bioware's patented story based game play works much, much better for a single player game and trying to force it into the MMO genre was a bad idea - it just doesn't fit.

The problem with the quests in TOR aren't with the VO that gets annoying, the VO is great and 1000x times better than reading meaningless walls of text.

The problem is the quests themselves - the MMO genre needs to be DONE with this style of content - static quests need to GO, completely, from the genre.