Trending Games | World of Warcraft | Elder Scrolls Online | Guild Wars 2 | EverQuest

  Network:  FPSguru RTSguru
Login:  Password:   Remember?  
Show Quick Gamelist Jump to Random Game
Members:2,905,724 Users Online:0
Games:757  Posts:6,296,196
Recent forum postsRSS
Active threads
Cloud view
List all forums
General Forums
Developers Corner General Discussion
Popular Game Forums
Click a status to find game forum
Game Forums
Click a letter to find game forum
A-C
2029 Online 2112: Revolution 2Moons 4Story 8BitMMO 9 Dragons A Mystical Land A Tale in the Desert III A3 ACE Online ARGO Online Aberoth Absolute Force Online Absolute Terror Achaea Adellion Aerrevan Aetolia, the Midnight Age Age of Armor Age of Conan Age of Empires Online Age of Mourning Age of Wulin Age of Wushu Aida Arenas Aika Aion Albion Online Alganon All Points Bulletin (APB) Allods Online Altis Gates Amazing World Anarchy Online Ancients of Fasaria Andromeda 5 Angels Online Angry Birds Epic Anime Ninja Anime Pirates Anime Trumps Anmynor Anno Online Applo Arcane Hearts Arcane Legends ArchLord ArcheAge Archeblade Archlord X Ascend: Hand of Kul Asda 2 Asda Story Ashen Empires Asheron's Call Asheron's Call 2 Astera Online Astonia III Astro Empires Astro Lords: Oort CLoud Asura Force Atlantica Online Atriarch Aura Kingdom Aurora Blade Auto Assault Avatar Star Battle Dawn Battle Dawn Galaxies Battle for Graxia Battle of 3 Kingdoms Battle of the Immortals Battlecruiser Online Battlestar Galactica Online Battlestar Reloaded Beyond Protocol Black Aftermath Black Desert Black Gold Black Prophecy Black Prophecy Tactics: Nexus Conflict Blacklight Retribution Blade & Soul Blade Hunter Blade Wars Blazing Throne Bless Blitz 1941 Blood and Jade Bloodlines Champions Boot Hill Heroes Borderlands 2 Borderlands: The Pre-Sequel Bound by Flame Bounty Bay Online Brain Storm Bravada Bravely Default Bravely Second Brawl Busters. Brick-Force Bright Shadow Bullet Run Business Tycoon Online CTRacer Cabal Online Caesary Call of Camelot Call of Gods Call of Thrones Camelot Unchained Canaan Online Cardmon Hero Cartoon Universe CasinoRPG Cast & Conquer Castle Empire Castlot Celtic Heroes Champions Online Champions of Regnum Chaos Online Child of Light Chrono Tales Citadel of Sorcery CitiesXL Citizen Zero City of Decay City of Heroes City of Steam City of Transformers City of Villains Civilization Online Clan Lord Clash of Clans Cloud Nine Club Penguin Colony of War Command & Conquer: Tiberium Alliances Company of Heroes Online Conquer Online Conquer Online 3 Continent of the Ninth (C9) Core Blaze Core Exiles Corum Online Craft of Gods Crimecraft Crimelife 2 Cronous Crota II Crusaders of Solaris Cultures Online Cyber Monster 2 Cyberpunk 2077 Céiron Wars
D-F
D&D Online DC Universe DK Online DOTA DOTA 2 DUST 514 DV8: Exile Dalethaan Dance Groove Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark Ages Dark Legends Dark Orbit Dark Relic: Prelude Dark Solstice Dark Souls 2 Dark and Light DarkEden Online DarkSpace Darkblood Online Darkest Dungeon Darkfall Darkfall: Unholy Wars Darkwind: War on Wheels Das Tal Dawn of Fantasy Dawntide DayZ Dead Earth Dead Frontier Dead Island Dead Island 2 Dead Island: Riptide Deco Online Deep Down Deepworld Defiance Deicide Online Dekaron Demons at the Horizon Desert Operations Destiny Diablo 3 Diamonin Digimon Battle Dino Storm Disciple Divergence Divina Divine Souls Divinity: Original Sin Dofus Dominus Online Dragon Age: Inquisition Dragon Ball Online Dragon Born Online Dragon Crusade Dragon Empires Dragon Eternity Dragon Fin Soup Dragon Nest Dragon Oath Dragon Pals Dragon Raja Dragon's Call Dragon's Call II Dragon's Prophet DragonSky DragonSoul Dragona Dragonica Dragons and Titans Drakengard 3 Dream of Mirror Online Dreamland Online Dreamlords: The Reawakening Drift City Duels Dungeon Blitz Dungeon Fighter Online Dungeon Overlord Dungeon Party Dungeon Rampage Dungeon Runners Dungeon of the Endless Dynastica Dynasty Warriors Online Dynasty of the Magi EIN (Epicus Incognitus) EVE Online Earth Eternal Earth and Beyond Earthrise Eclipse War Ecol Tactics Online Eden Eternal Edge of Space Einherjar - The Viking's Blood Elder Scrolls Online Eldevin Elf Online Elite: Dangerous Embers of Caerus Emil Chronicle Online Empire Empire & State Empire Craft Empire Universe 3 EmpireQuest Empires of Galldon End of Nations Endless Ages Endless Blue Moon Online Endless Online Entropia Universe EpicDuel Erebus: Travia Reborn Eredan Eternal Blade Eternal Lands Eternal Saga Ether Fields Ether Saga Online Eudemons Online EuroGangster EverEmber Online EverQuest Next EverQuest Online Adventures Evernight Everquest Everquest II Evony Exarch Exorace F.E.A.R. Online Face of Mankind Fairyland Online Fall of Rome Fallen Earth Fallen Sword Fallout 4 Fallout Online Family Guy Online Fantage Fantasy Earth Zero Fantasy Realm Online Fantasy Tales Online Fantasy Worlds: Rhynn Faunasphere Faxion Online Fearless Fantasy Ferentus Ferion Fiesta Online Final Fantasy Type-0 HD Final Fantasy XI Final Fantasy XIV Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn Firefall Fists of Fu Florensia Flyff Football Manager Live Football Superstars Force of Arms Forge Forsaken Uprising Forsaken World Fortnite Fortuna Forum for Discussion of Everlight Freaky Creatures Free Realms Freesky Online Freeworld Fung Wan Online Furcadia Fury Fusion Fall
G-L
GalaXseeds Galactic Command Online Game of Thrones: Seven Kingdoms Gameglobe Gate To Heavens Gates of Andaron Gatheryn Gauntlet Gekkeiju Online Ghost Online Ghost Recon Online Gladiatus Glitch Global Agenda Global Soccer Gloria Victis Glory of Gods GoGoRacer Goal Line Blitz Gods and Heroes GodsWar Online Golemizer Golf Star GoonZu Online Graal Kingdoms Granado Espada Online Grand Chase Grand Fantasia Grepolis Grimlands Guild Wars Guild Wars 2 Guild Wars Factions Guild Wars Nightfall H1Z1 Habbo Hotel Hailan Rising HaloSphere2 Haven & Hearth Hawken Heart Forth Alicia Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft Helbreath Hellgate Hellgate: London Hello Kitty Online Hero Online Hero Zero Hero's Journey Hero: 108 Online HeroSmash Heroes & Generals Heroes & Legends: Conquerors of Kolhar Heroes in the Sky Heroes of Atlan Heroes of Bestia Heroes of Gaia Heroes of Might and Magic Online Heroes of Thessalonica Heroes of Three Kingdoms Heroes of the Storm Hex Holic Online Hostile Space Hunter Blade Huxley Icewind Dale: Enhanced Edition Illutia Illyriad Immortals USA Imperator Imperian Inferno Legend Infestation: Survivor Stories Infinite Crisis Infinity Infinity Iris Online Iron Grip: Marauders Irth Worlds Island Forge Islands of War Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted Jade Dynasty Jagged Alliance Online Juggernaut Jumpgate Jumpgate Evolution KAL Online Kakele Online Kaos War Karos Online Kartuga Kicks Online King of Kings 3 Kingdom Heroes Kingdom Under Fire II Kingdom of Drakkar Kingory Kings Era Kings and Legends Kings of the Realm KingsRoad Kitsu Saga Kiwarriors Knight Age Knight Online Knights of Dream City Kothuria Kung Foo! Kunlun Online Kyn L.A.W. LEGO Universe La Tale Land of Chaos Online Landmark Lands of Hope: Redemption LastChaos League of Angels League of Legends - Clash of Fates Legend of Edda: Vengeance Legend of Golden Plume Legend of Grimrock 2 Legend of Katha Legend of Mir 2 Legend of Mir 3 Legendary Champions Lego Minifigures Online Lichdom: Battlemage Life is Feudal Light of Nova Lime Odyssey Line of Defense Lineage Lineage Eternal: Twilight Resistance Lineage II Linkrealms Loong Online Lord of the Rings Online Lords Online Lords of the Fallen Lost Saga Lucent Heart Lunia Lusternia: Age of Ascension Luvinia World
M-Q
MU Online Mabinogi Maestia: Rise of Keledus MagiKnights Magic Barrage Magic World Online Manga Fighter MapleStory Martial Heroes Marvel Heroes Marvel Super Hero Squad Online Marvel: Avengers Alliance Mass Effect 4 MechWarrior Online Megaten Meridian 59 : Evolution Merlin MetalMercs Metaplace Metin 2 MicroVolts Middle-earth: Shadow of Mordor Midkemia Online Might & Magic Heroes: Kingdoms Might & Magic X: Legacy MilMo Minecraft Mini Fighter Minions of Mirth Ministry of War Monato Esprit Monkey King Online Monkey Quest Monster & Me Monster Madness Online MonsterMMORPG Moonlight Online: Tales of Eternal Blood Moonrise Mordavia Mortal Online Mourning My Lands Myst Online: URU Live Myth Angels Online Myth War Myth War 2 Mythborne Mytheon Mythic Saga Mythos N.E.O Online NIDA Online Nadirim Naviage: The Power of Capital Navy Field Need for Speed World Nemexia Neo's Land NeoSteam Neocron Nether Neverwinter Nexus: The Kingdom Of The Winds NinjaTrick NosTale Novus Aeterno Oberin Odin Quest Odyssey RPG Ogre Island Omerta 3 Online Boxing Manager Onverse Oort Online Order & Chaos Online Order of Magic Original Blood Origins Return Origins of Malu Orion's Belt Otherland Forums OverSoul Overkings Overwatch Oz Online Oz World Pandora Saga Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen Panzar Parabellum Parallel Kingdom Parfait Station Path of Exile Pathfinder Online Perfect World Perpetuum Online Persona V Phantasy Star Online 2 Phantasy Star Universe Phoenix Dynasty Online Phylon Pi Story Picaroon Pillars of Eternity Pirate Galaxy Pirate Storm Pirate101 PirateKing Online Pirates of the Burning Sea Pirates of the Caribbean Online Pixie Hollow Planeshift Planet Arkadia Planet Calypso PlanetSide 2 Planetside Planets³ Playboy Manager Pocket Legends Pockie Ninja Pockie Pirates Pockie Saints Pokémon X and Y PoxNora Prime World Prime: Battle for Dominus Priston Tale Priston Tale II Prius Online Prodigy Project Blackout Project Gorgon Project Powder Project Titan Forums Project Wiki Project Zomboid Puzzle Pirates Quest for Infamy Quickhit Football
R-S
R2 Online RAN Online RF Online ROSE Online Rage of 3 Kingdoms Ragnarok Online Ragnarok Online II RaiderZ Rail Nation Rakion Rappelz RappelzSEA Ravenmarch Realm Fighter Realm of Sierra Realm of the Mad God Realm of the Titans Realms Online Rebel Galaxy Reclamation Red Stone Red War: Edem's Curse Regnum Online Remnant Knights Renaissance Repulse Requiem: Memento Mori Rift RiotZone Rise Rise of Dragonian Era Rise of Empire Rise of the Tycoon Risen 3: Titan Lords Rising of King Risk Your Life Rivality Rockfree Rohan: Blood Feud Role Play Worlds Roll n Rock Roma Victor Romadoria Rosh Online Roto X Rubies of Eventide Ruin Online Rumble Fighter Runes of Magic Runescape Rust Rusty Hearts Ryzom S4 League SAGA SD Gundam Capsule Fighter Online SMITE SUN Sacred 3 Sagramore Salem SaySayGirls Scarlet Blade Scions of Fate Seal Online: Evolution Second Chance Heroes Second Life Secret of the Solstice Seed Serenia Fantasy Seven Seas Saga Seven Souls Online Sevencore Shadow Realms Shadow of Legend Shadowbane Shadowgate Shadowrun Online Shaiya Shards Online Shattered Galaxy Sho Online Shot Online Shroud of the Avatar SideQuest Siege on Stars Sigonyth: Desert Eternity Silkroad Online Skyblade Skyforge SmashMuck Champions Smoo Online Soldier Front Soul Master Soul Order Online Soul of Guardian South Park: The Stick of Truth Space Heroes Universe Sparta: War of Empires Spellcasters Sphere Spiral Knights Spirit Tales Splash Fighters Squad Wars Star Citizen Star Conflict Star Sonata 2 Star Stable Star Supremacy Star Trek Online Star Trek: Infinite Space Star Wars Galaxies Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures Star Wars: The Old Republic StarQuest Online Starbound Stargate Worlds Starlight Story Starpires State of Decay SteelWar Online Stone Age 2 Stormfall: Age of War Stormthrone Storybricks Stronghold Kingdoms Styx: Master of Shadows Sudden Attack Supremacy 1914 Supreme Destiny Sword Girls Sword of Destiny: Rise of Aions SwordX Swords of Heavens Swordsman
T-Z
TERA TS Online TUG Tabula Rasa Tactica Online Tales Runner Tales of Fantasy Tales of Pirates Tales of Pirates II Tales of Solaris Talisman Online Tamer Saga Tank Ace Tantra Online Tatsumaki: Land at War Terra Militaris TerraWorld Online Terraria Thang Online The 4th Coming The Agency The Aurora World The Banner Saga The Black Watchmen The Chronicle The Chronicles of Spellborn The Crew The Division The Epic Might The Hammers End The Incredible Adventures of Van Helsing The Incredible Adventures of Van Helsing 2 The Legend of Ares The Lost Titans The Matrix Online The Mighty Quest for Epic Loot The Missing Ink The Mummy Online The Myth of Soma The Pride of Taern The Realm Online The Repopulation The Secret World The Sims Online The Strategems The West The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt Theralon There Therian Saga Thrones of Chaos Tibia Tibia Micro Edition Tiger Knight Titan Siege Titans of Time Toontown Online Top Speed Topia Online Torchlight Torment: Tides of Numenera Total Domination Transformers Universe Transistor Transverse Traveller AR Travia Online Travian Triad Wars Trials of Ascension Tribal Hero Tribal Wars Tribes Universe Trickster Online Trove Troy Online True Fantasy Live Online Turf Battles Twelve Sky Twelve Sky 2 Twilight War Tynon U.B. Funkeys UFO Online URDEAD Online Ultima Forever: Quest for the Avatar Ultima Online Ultima X: Odyssey Ultimate Naruto Ultimate Soccer Boss Uncharted Waters Online Undercover 2: Merc Wars Underlight Unification Wars Universe Online Utopia Valkyrie Sky Vampire Lord Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Vanquish Space Vector City Racers Vendetta Online Victory - Age of Racing Vindictus Virtonomics Vis Gladius Visions of Zosimos VoidExpanse Voyage Century Online W.E.L.L. Online WAR (Warhammer Online) WAR2 Glory WYD Global Wakfu War Thunder War of 2012 War of Angels War of Legends War of Mercenaries War of Thrones War of the Immortals WarFlow Waren Story Warflare Wargame1942 Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium Online Warhammer Online: Wrath of Heroes Warkeepers Warrior Epic Wartune Wasteland 2 WebLords Wild West Online WildStar Wind of Luck WindSlayer 2 Wings of Destiny Wish Wizard101 Wizardry Online Wizards and Champions Wonder King Wonderland Online World Golf Tour World of Battles World of Darkness World of Heroes World of Kung Fu World of Pirates World of Speed World of Tanks World of Tanks Generals World of Warcraft World of Warplanes World of Warriors World of Warships World of the Living Dead WorldAlpha Wurm Online Xenoblade Chronicles: X Xenocell Xiah Xsyon Xulu YS Online Yitien ZU Online Zentia Zero Online Zero Online: The Andromeda Crisis Zodiac Online Zombies Ate My Pizza eRepublik

MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

General Discussion

General Discussion 

News & Features Discussion  » World of Warcraft: The Role of Utility

2 Pages 1 2 » Search
26 posts found
  SBFord

Associate Editor - News Manager

Joined: 6/28/10
Posts: 14030

 
OP  2/12/12 8:45:43 AM#1

In The WoW Factor today, we take a look at the concept of "utility" in an MMO with specific regard to a recent post by Blizzard's Ghostcrawler. "For MMO purposes we'll just say anything that isn't directly prioritized on fulfilling a roll of the holy trinity of tank, healer, or DPS is utility." Check out what we think about utility and how it can be managed in WoW. Let us know what you think in the comments.

In Ghostcrawler's most recent post the lead system designer addresses the topic of "The Role of Role" and throws around some ideas about how things may be handled in WoW’s Mists of Pandaria Expansion. All in all it is a very interesting write up that shouldn't be missed by anyone who concerns themselves with MMOs, yet I feel Mr. Ghostcrawler left out a bit of desirable discourse on the topic of utility within the role system. Whether this was through intent or with forethought for length and readability I cannot say, nonetheless there is plenty to discuss regarding what I see as the sickly bastard child of the holy trinity.

Read more of Joe Sanicky's The WoW Factor: The Role of Utility.


That is one crustacean with a sharp tongue and a keen sense of purpose.

Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

  77lolmac77

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/14/11
Posts: 498

2/13/12 8:40:54 AM#2
When I played WoW utility = healer class.

Now anyone can do anything, its like the special olympics
  cado

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 2

2/13/12 8:44:24 AM#3

I've been playing MMOs forever (MUDs, EQ,EQ2, WoW, VSoH, Rift and everything in between) and I've prety much always played a utility class. My personnal favortie has always been the bard. Which is one of my main beef with WoW: there is no bard. And the paladin is not very 'bardish'.


It's completely understandable, from Blizzard's POV, to not have much utility-based classes in-game: utility classes aren't 'flashy'. Utility classes are extremely 'second level' in terms of the advantage they provide to a group or raid: only experienced and knowing players appreciate the wide range of skills and goodness that adding a support class can provide. Since Wow, in my humble opinion, is all about bold brushes and crystal clear, black-and-white definition of roles it seems obvious that such sneaky goodness will never come forth in this game.


Personnaly, if i was a game designer, I'd build a whole world around the perfect 'Quad-nity': Heals, DPS, Tank and Support. Six-man groups with a focus on the utility aspect. I rememebr fondly the raids in EQ in the Temple of Ssra (sp). There was a fight you had to off-tank 3 mobs, mezz 3 more and kite 3 others while killing the Boss. It was epic! Required incredible coordination and lots of support class. My job, as bard, was to 'do whatever I could in whatever situation that needed the most pressing attention': kite or mezz or dps or tank (ok not for too long!).


Unfortunately, games around designed from the bottom up nowadays. Hard is not in fashion these days...Risk-vs-Rewards is a joke on the latest MMOs. So is shades of grey and utility classes. One can only hope for better days ahead!


  orbitxo

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/06
Posts: 1238

2/13/12 8:52:39 AM#4

hehe, love how you throw in a lil' KoA in there...Its an awsome game! you get to go around doin everything tank-dps-n heals-rogue and you can switch talents any given time you dont depend on noone!


 


looking foward to G2 too! who also has terrished the mmo 'wow'holy trinity-Game mechanics needs to change nowadays- WoW is an old dinasour-theyve stated the game is co dependent  on 'GROUP' play style , it would take them along time to change that- a little too late imo. It worked back in the the day- But now , one dosent have the time to rely on other peoples (utility) to engage in a game.











 




 

  Neverdyne

Novice Member

Joined: 4/21/08
Posts: 168

2/13/12 8:55:43 AM#5
Originally posted by cado

I've been playing MMOs forever (MUDs, EQ,EQ2, WoW, VSoH, Rift and everything in between) and I've prety much always played a utility class. My personnal favortie has always been the bard. Which is one of my main beef with WoW: there is no bard. And the paladin is not very 'bardish'.


It's completely understandable, from Blizzard's POV, to not have much utility-based classes in-game: utility classes aren't 'flashy'. Utility classes are extremely 'second level' in terms of the advantage they provide to a group or raid: only experienced and knowing players appreciate the wide range of skills and goodness that adding a support class can provide. Since Wow, in my humble opinion, is all about bold brushes and crystal clear, black-and-white definition of roles it seems obvious that such sneaky goodness will never come forth in this game.


Personnaly, if i was a game designer, I'd build a whole world around the perfect 'Quad-nity': Heals, DPS, Tank and Support. Six-man groups with a focus on the utility aspect. I rememebr fondly the raids in EQ in the Temple of Ssra (sp). There was a fight you had to off-tank 3 mobs, mezz 3 more and kite 3 others while killing the Boss. It was epic! Required incredible coordination and lots of support class. My job, as bard, was to 'do whatever I could in whatever situation that needed the most pressing attention': kite or mezz or dps or tank (ok not for too long!).


Unfortunately, games around designed from the bottom up nowadays. Hard is not in fashion these days...Risk-vs-Rewards is a joke on the latest MMOs. So is shades of grey and utility classes. One can only hope for better days ahead!

I understand your point of view, and the desire of playing a class who's entire purpose is utility. But to say WoW's raid encounters need no utility is actually inaccurate. The thing is, every class has some form of utility, so it's true that there are no pure support classes, but many DPS classes also offer some kind of utility.

 

Just an example, on the Magmaw raid encounter, you needed a hunter or two, or a frost mage to constantly kite the little bugs that spawn and keep them away from the group. You specifically needed a ranged class capable of slowing or rooting the bugs, and they also had to know how to do it properly since whenever the bugs hit someone they multiplied so it was crucial to keep them kited. That would enter in the realm of "utility" but that hunter or mage was also capable of doing equivalent DPS on the next raid encounter if utility was not necessary then.

 

So WoW's take is: We do need utility in raid encounters, just we want classes who provide that utility to also be specialized in either DPS, healing or tanking. 

  orbitxo

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/06
Posts: 1238

2/13/12 9:01:09 AM#6







Originally posted by Neverdyne














Originally posted by cado







So WoW's take is: We do need utility in raid encounters, just we want classes who provide that utility to also be specialized in either DPS, healing or tanking. 















 








classic - first they 'borrow' alot of the pvp tactics from warhammer online,  now theyre 'borrowing' concepts from G2 to keep the game fresh- i respect that BUT the one thing they cant do is change the graphics to it. its way dated! other new games will steam roll that!


 






 





 




 

  User Deleted
2/13/12 9:08:17 AM#7

I like lots of varied utility, and lots of reasons to use it.

However I imagine it must be a bitch to balance.

  simmihi

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/11/10
Posts: 525

2/13/12 9:21:17 AM#8

Originally posted by cado

It's completely understandable, from Blizzard's POV, to not have much utility-based classes in-game: utility classes aren't 'flashy'. Utility classes are extremely 'second level' in terms of the advantage they provide to a group or raid: only experienced and knowing players appreciate the wide range of skills and goodness that adding a support class can provide. Since Wow, in my humble opinion, is all about bold brushes and crystal clear, black-and-white definition of roles it seems obvious that such sneaky goodness will never come forth in this game.


That's what i think also. Utility IS nice, but WoW is really a bad example. A recent dialogue i've had in WoW went like this:


-Me (the healer): Avoid standing in the shiz on the ground, it's hard for me to focus healing the tank and also heal you, just move when it pops under you, it's easy


- Him (random Damage Dealer guy): I've been here before with other healers, i've never moved from the black circles under me and they've managed to heal me just fine, i lose DPS if i move, you're a shitty healer!


 


When your content ends up to be often ran by super overgeared people, utility loses it's role. Most likely people will preffer the "power play" methods, where you just ignore the mechanics and compensate by the huge ammount of damage or healing which you can do. This later approach makes the kill much shorter and overall running a dungeon / raid becomes much quicker. In that aspect, utility classes would be marginalised after the point when encounters become trivial.


 


Let's take Rift for example. They've tried "forcing" the utility class in groups and it works like this:


Rift has a standard "dungeon finder" group formed by a Tank, a Healer, two Damage Dealers and a Support (utility) class. In a short description, this support class mostly AoE heals when it does damage and provides serious buffs to the group while debuffing mobs. This support role is really needed when you're doing dungeons while leveling, as the gear level is overall bad. Unfortunately, when it comes to heroic instances at cap level, 90% of the time the support class is asked to "switch to DPS" as the group preffers Power Kills, because the gear (usually people have raid or raid-equivalent gear) allows them to play that way.


 


In the end, "LF people ilvl 380+ for Temple of Four Winds Raid, /w ilvl and achievement" sounds familiar? For the non-WoW players, the guy was looking to form a group with people wearing gear at a quality of 380 for a raid which drops gear with 359 quality (the higher the number, the better the gear). That raid was "planned" for people at level 330-345 to improve gear, and maybe there, utility has a sense. At a 380 level, the encounters become trivial. The whole game is built like that, it's not gear up as you play, it's hit cap level as fast as you can, get the best gear using the easiest ways then start doing the content, which became over-nerfed and much much too easy. Utility in WoW (as the game is now), except very rare and marginal heroic difficulty raid situations, is pointless.


Sorry for the wall of text.


 

  orbitxo

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/06
Posts: 1238

2/13/12 9:29:38 AM#9

ive played BC-WoLK-and early-Cata-and simmihi's post is accurate! - not familiar with Rifts raiding roles,




but you pretty much nailed WoW's current game play state.



 







 




 

  ThaneUlfgar

Novice Member

Joined: 4/14/11
Posts: 288

2/13/12 10:37:29 AM#10

Simmhi's post is pretty much dead on. Remember at the begining for Cataclysm when everyone had to actually use crowd control and such in heroics? Now that everyone is in at least level 378 gear, that has gone back to the wayside.


  heavyhebrew

Novice Member

Joined: 3/29/10
Posts: 313

R.I.P Ass Dan. He ate the dirt, yo.

2/13/12 11:35:26 AM#11

Originally posted by quasi_dead

I like lots of varied utility, and lots of reasons to use it.


However I imagine it must be a bitch to balance.



 


This is WoW, balance has never been a real concern. Take for instance this early spot on documentary on PVP balance by one Rogue.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJWeWMKfa3g


TRUST THE COMPUTER! THE COMPUTER IS YOUR FRIEND!

Stay Alert! Trust No One! Keep Your Laser Handy!

Yellow Clearance Black Box Blues!

  orbitxo

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/06
Posts: 1238

2/13/12 11:59:02 AM#12

maybe theyll get it right the second time around with their MoP  'combat pets'








 








<.<








 








ok ok nough WoW trashin'...i had fun while i played- but i had to move on!








 








 











 




 

  fivoroth

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 11/10/06
Posts: 2927

2/13/12 2:55:19 PM#13

Utility and support classes were always a b**** to balance.


Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  azmundai

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/18/10
Posts: 1424

2/13/12 3:11:47 PM#14

I get a very "empty promises" vibe from the whole thing. I doubt there will actually be any real utility in wow ever again .. because then you have situations where hunters need to kite adds. and quite frankly, most of them wont be able to do it .. the qqing will ensue and the nerf bat will return. in this world of Massively Multi-player Online Solo Adventures with lobby games, utility has no place.

I guess if they bring back CC fights in raids that would be one thing .. but I dont see any real utility being brought back in any real way. Of course they will claim that they have succeeded in bringing back utility just because 1 boss fight requires and add to be cced ..

LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already :)

  sanman7890

Novice Member

Joined: 6/25/11
Posts: 97

2/13/12 4:00:20 PM#15

Originally posted by azmundai

I get a very "empty promises" vibe from the whole thing. I doubt there will actually be any real utility in wow ever again .. because then you have situations where hunters need to kite adds. and quite frankly, most of them wont be able to do it .. the qqing will ensue and the nerf bat will return. in this world of Massively Multi-player Online Solo Adventures with lobby games, utility has no place.


I guess if they bring back CC fights in raids that would be one thing .. but I dont see any real utility being brought back in any real way. Of course they will claim that they have succeeded in bringing back utility just because 1 boss fight requires and add to be cced ..



 


Thats the thing though, wouldn't giving a hunter a bunch of cc make solo adventuring even easier and more empowering, thus appealing to this type of player?


  azmundai

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/18/10
Posts: 1424

2/13/12 4:06:01 PM#16


Originally posted by sanman7890

Originally posted by azmundai I get a very "empty promises" vibe from the whole thing. I doubt there will actually be any real utility in wow ever again .. because then you have situations where hunters need to kite adds. and quite frankly, most of them wont be able to do it .. the qqing will ensue and the nerf bat will return. in this world of Massively Multi-player Online Solo Adventures with lobby games, utility has no place. I guess if they bring back CC fights in raids that would be one thing .. but I dont see any real utility being brought back in any real way. Of course they will claim that they have succeeded in bringing back utility just because 1 boss fight requires and add to be cced ..  
Thats the thing though, wouldn't giving a hunter a bunch of cc make solo adventuring even easier and more empowering, thus appealing to this type of player?

yes, but actually having mechanics where his inability to use those abilities wipes the raid, is too "hardcore" or something.

plus, if there are kite fights, cc fights, mass dispel fights, and dream up 3-4 others ... then how does a 10 man group do all of that and still have 2 tanks and 2 healers?

with 40 man raids, these things were fine. with 10 man raids all of the fights have to require the same small pool of abilities. thus now the main mechanic in most raiding is: dont stand in the fire, and heal the tank.

granted, I havent played since LK .. I hear its better than it was .. but I doubt it will ever be the ball breaking fun it was when you were learning Sartura or even Razorgore. Not to mention the stuff before that in EQ which I unfortunately don't know much about.

LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already :)

  sanman7890

Novice Member

Joined: 6/25/11
Posts: 97

2/13/12 4:51:53 PM#17

The easy answer is to design fights where the mold of 2 tanks, 2 healers, and 6 dps or whatever isn't necessary every.single.time.  Easier said then done yes, but this is the developers dayjobs after all.


  Mors.Magne

Novice Member

Joined: 3/02/07
Posts: 1432

2/13/12 5:28:36 PM#18

But there aren't any utility classes in WoW !

 

This is because in WoW, no classes level using 'utilities'.

 

This is what Wikipedia says about utiity classes:

 

In less simplistic RPGs, a category called utility exists, which is neither Damage or Healing Based. Utility classes often include "Grey Magic" or "Building" functions, such as crafting items useful for weapons, armor, or profit. Grey Magic also includes functions such as transportation and mobility, such as flight and teleportation, or special effects where combat potential is dubious, such as summoning or transmutation. Modern and Future variants include Pilots, Animal Trainers, Engineers, and Scientists whose abilities may have more strategic or plot driven value. """"""     

 

The best example of a ulility class that I can think of is a character in Eve who trades or mines or builds stuff. However, I think Eve must be a rare exception in this regard.

 

I can't think of a single 'career utility class' in WoW - they are all adjunctive skills to Tank / Gank / Healing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  maplestone

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 3109

2/13/12 6:48:17 PM#19

What about designing utility through multiplayer combo interactions?   Lots of  abilities involve combos of individual player actions (where you get a buff on ability B if ability A is active on the target), but what about creating explicitly multiplayer combos where if monster is hit by both effect A and effect B then bonus effect C occurs?  Set it up so one group of classes brings the chocolate and another group of classes brings the peanut butter - but neither is technically the dominent part or the utility part.


By having different combos available and giving each class/sub-class a collection of the puzzle pieces, you could set up just about any arbitrary complexity of roles/sub-roles desired.


  HurricanePip

Novice Member

Joined: 3/07/04
Posts: 169

2/13/12 9:17:18 PM#20

I thought the dominator was a good example of a successful utility class.  I always enjoyed an offender in CoH.  Take a defensive/utility class and focus it on dps, which it wasn't naturally designed for.  It's fun with versaltility.  Kinetics was also cool.  While it was a buff, which isn't necesarily fun, you could see the effect whenever it was up and it was up enough to have a huge effect on the group.  It wasn't Bloodlust where you needed to review the logs to see it in action.  Kinetics caused people to bounce around ike superballs, which was awesome and immediately rewarding.


The lock was probably the closest I found in WoW.  Drain tanking was fun, but it wasn't the same.  There was versatility, but much less utility and that got nerfed /  became lesseffective as time went along.


The comment that I would make for future MMOs actually isn't character related, but content related.  CoH for example promoted that fun, jump in and have it play mentaility.  Attacking large packs of varying mobs is fun.  CoH promoted movement and positioning.  WoW on the other hand was a very standard pull and kill single mobs at a time, which got to be a mind numbing process.  It was very robotic in nature where something like CoH seemed to flow much better.


If you strip away the gear, WoW isn't the most fun game in the world.  It's an old design paradigm that hasn't changed in a long time.  Maybe the KoA MMO uses some of the mechanics from the WRPG game because that system is fantastic.  If they fix the camera, it would be even better.


If you don't worry about it, it's not a problem.

2 Pages 1 2 » Search