I always play MMOs just to be part of a living, breathing world. I love seeing other players around me, doing their thing, whatever it is. I don't care too much about running instances with groups and I don't care about having the best gear in the game. I just want to set my own goals and work/grind towards that.

I guess a sandbox MMO will fit me like a glove, but there are none around that interest me currently. Hope fully Archeage will change that.

So, to make the best of a bad situation I thought I would check out MMOs that have a more complex and rewarding crafting system that games like WoW, SWTOR or Rift. With such a crafting system, I would be able to spend my time grinding for mats, setting my own goals again.

Does anybody have any recommendation of such a MMO? It has to be fairly modern, with graphics and character animation on par with at least WoW. And it has to be fantasy, so that rules out EVE ;)

Thanks!

FFXIV isn't exactly complex (you look up a recipe online, put in the items, and play a little minigame similair to EQ2 to create the item). But crafting in the game serves a big purpose (a crafted item at max level loaded up on Materia is on par with endgame gear for example). Each crafting profession is a class, having tools and gear with special stats (like + Control and + Quality). Gathering is just as in depth, having gear and classes, and each has there own minigame to collect resources. 

EVE is another modern game where crafting plays a big role. Everything in the game is expendable and crafters fuel the wars.

Wurm Online is like a more in depth Minecraft (with much less freedom). It's got a limitless free trial, so you can try it out if your interested.

Sounds like Fallen Earth could be up to the OP's alley. You can make the game evolve around crafting if you want. All the best gear is crafted and available for you to use during lvling if you take the time. And there is no need to group at all if you prefer. It also has a very helpful community. Which I rarely say about any MMO, but this game has a moderated help chat with a lot of players that are very eager to answer questions.

The most grouping in FE happens for PVP, progress towns (PVE where you build defenses untill npcs miniraid that town) and territory control (defending harvesters in a very large PVP area). There is PVE group content, but not that much as far I've seen.

Except for the player base, Vanguard sounds like it might fit.   Fairly complex crafting.  If they can ever figure out how to take it ftp, it should have a decent resurgence.

I loved their diplomacy system as well.  Societal crafting of a sort.

Originally posted by Draron

FFXIV isn't exactly complex (you look up a recipe online, put in the items, and play a little minigame similair to EQ2 to create the item). But crafting in the game serves a big purpose (a crafted item at max level loaded up on Materia is on par with endgame gear for example). Each crafting profession is a class, having tools and gear with special stats (like + Control and + Quality). Gathering is just as in depth, having gear and classes, and each has there own minigame to collect resources. 

EVE is another modern game where crafting plays a big role. Everything in the game is expendable and crafters fuel the wars.

Wurm Online is like a more in depth Minecraft (with much less freedom). It's got a limitless free trial, so you can try it out if your interested.

The game itself is still pretty bad (crosses fingers for 2.0), but there's more to the crafting that that.

There's crafting equipment; primary tools; secondary tools; clothes for every equipment slot.

Crafting/gathering stats that affect different aspects of the craft.

Stability of the synthesis, which affects things like success and durability.

Different synthesis yields and difficulty of the synthesis change depending on which tool you use.

The only problem with it is that because crafting in MMOs is so inherently repetitive, this all gets incredibly boring after 30 or 40 synths.

Originally posted by Arglebargle

Except for the player base, Vanguard sounds like it might fit.   Fairly complex crafting.  If they can ever figure out how to take it ftp, it should have a decent resurgence.

 

I loved their diplomacy system as well.  Societal crafting of a sort.

Yes, I am going to wait for it to go F2P if that ever happens.

A Tale in the Desert probably has the most complex crafting system.  It's semi-historical, so it's not really fantasy, but it's not at all science fiction, if that's what you're trying to avoid.

Uncharted Waters Online has complex everything, including crafting.  I'm not a fan of its crafting system, but if you want something complicated enough that you spend a week banging your head against a wall trying to figure out how to craft an item that really is craftable, then UWO is for you.  That's very much historical-based, and not fantasy, though.

I liked the crafting system in Puzzle Pirates, too.

Originally posted by FrostWyrm

The game itself is still pretty bad (crosses fingers for 2.0), but there's more to the crafting that that.

There's crafting equipment; primary tools; secondary tools; clothes for every equipment slot.

Each crafting profession is a class, having tools and gear 

Crafting/gathering stats that affect different aspects of the craft.

with special stats (like + Control and + Quality)

Stability of the synthesis, which affects things like success and durability.

minigame similair to EQ2

Different synthesis yields and difficulty of the synthesis change depending on which tool you use.

Yes, I forgot this.

The only problem with it is that because crafting in MMOs is so inherently repetitive, this all gets incredibly boring after 30 or 40 synths.

True. I can't think of any game where crafting isn't a grind, sadly. But OP, if you want to give XIV a try, join Wutai. I'm in a friendly linkshell that can help you out.  (Red from my first post)

Originally posted by Arglebargle

Except for the player base, Vanguard sounds like it might fit.   Fairly complex crafting.  If they can ever figure out how to take it ftp, it should have a decent resurgence.

 

I loved their diplomacy system as well.  Societal crafting of a sort.

Agreed. Vanguard has a pretty deep crafting system. Definitely got my blood boiling on several occasions when I would mess up on a recipe... But being able to pull off some of the more complex recipes and getting the reward from doing so was always a treat.

Oh, and creamy mashed potatos...

That's easy.

Mortal Online has something like 10 billion combinations of materials to make different weapons and armor.

I don't know the exact number.  Nasa still hasn't got back to me.

I have to question what 'modern' implies, whether a time-frame or if solely dependent on the level of graphical detail.

MO is a guaranteed mention, but Fallen Earth isn't all that amazing, though, it's resource gathering is probably the best I've seen. ATinD is good too, but the flax man, the flax! UWO is complicated without being overly complicated, but the main issue is that there is a lot of distance between resources. FFXIV was ok, but resource gathering minigames get tired if you do it long enough... still would hop in and do it now if it was free atm.

I would  like to throw in Wurm, but it's not really all that modern anymore, even if it did lead to Minecraft. Also, Ryzom.

Really depends on what you mean by "complex."

I feel Ryzoms offers the most amount of customization, or perhaps MO, but I never really got far enough in that game to get to the crafting unfortunately.

Vanguard and EQ2 probably have the best crafting processes/minigames though.

What exactly makes a crafting system complex and rewarding?  More than 1 resource in a recipe? Item stats that are variable and dependant on resource stats and player equipment  stats?  Does a mini-game add to the complexity?  How about crafting time?  What about cross profession dependencies?  Like needing a crafted component from tailoring to make a blacksmith item or vice versa? 

What do you think about crafting spread and variety?  By spread I mean Hand and Feet require level 31, Waist 33, Legs 35, Shoulders 37, & Chest 39.  Then variety I mean only one crafted choice per slot per level range.  I suppose variety should come from world loot drops.  What do you think about level 40’s items requiring resources surrounded by levels 50’s mobs?  Basically you cant make level 40 gear until you are level 50.

I liked the variety of Fallen Earth and I liked that you could queue stuff up for crafting.  But there was something about resource harvesting,  There just seemed to be to much of it to keep around.

Ryzom and a tale in the desert will blow anything else out of the water. 

Complex crafting...   

Eve Online

Fallen Earth

LOTRO

Mabinogi

Vanguard

EverQuest 2

I have played all these but Vanguard which I only know by reputation.   As a game, I'd stay away from Mabinogi.   Too many mods and hacks allowing people to cheat their way to the top.   And we're talking item duplicaiton, gold duplication, etc.   Game is completely broken by the cheaters.

LotRO

Everquest 2

Fallen Earth

Complex crafting?

Can't decide if stupid, or just troll.

Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Vanguard and EQ2 probably have the best crafting processes/minigames though.

Um, no.  Not even close.  Vanguard only has one crafting minigame.  It has several different skins on it, but mostly it's giving different names to the same underlying formulas--and with the same numbers plugged into the formulas, even.  It's not a bad minigame, really, but it's only one--and the game's horrible grinding means that would-be crafters have to do it endlessly.

If you want better minigames (plural!), then try either A Tale in the Desert or Puzzle Pirates.

You can try Mythos Global. If you're looking for complex, I must say that the crafting system of that game is complex.

You will need to hunt for materials and you have to buy the recipe of the item that you want to craft. What makes this complex though is that you get experience points through crafting. Every time your crafting level goes up, you get 2 crafting skill points. And these skill points can be allocated to the crafting tree of your choice (guns, potions, axe, etc.) and these will help add to the success rate, or additional attributes of your crafted item.

I've never seen a game with such an intricate crafting system if you ask me.

Mortal Online is my fave crafting. Especially if you make one character a miner/extractor and another character an armorcrafter or weaponcrafter. Ive been playing for a while and have basically only a few metals down.

After that.. I would pick any other sandbox.

Of the games I have played more than a few months (in order):

• Vanguard
• Fallen Earth
• EvE