why bother with this subject?60 days time card plus 30 days free =90 days!so 90 days is up next month start on this subject next month then it will be proper!

Originally posted by Starpower

Originally posted by Eliandal

Originally posted by BilboDoggins

All I have to do to see this game is rapidly declining is look at my guild where we have 110 members and in the last 20 days only about 30 have logged in. Of those 30 maybe 10 play daily.

I have played many mnay MMO's and SWTOR is just lacking to many damned features, has to mnay bugs, and a boring and poorly designed endgame. I'm not telling anyone they have to dislike SWTOR but it's pretty obvious a TON of people feel the same way about it as me. Outside of the story this game has nothing new or better to offer and story offers little replayability unless you are an altaholic.

 

 

  Ooohh..I can play that game too....Two weeks ago, my guild only had a little overf 100 people on average logging in - but this weekend - we had over 200!

 

  What's your point again?

Well our guild has over 40 people on during prime time where as 3 weeks ago we were like 15 online at any given time.

Check it out. The guild is called "The Legion" On Red Eclipse EU server if anybody thinks I'm BS'ing

 

But I agree comments like these are absolutely pointless one way or another

they are pointless without proof but for me personally If all my friends drop out of a game and the guild I was in had a huge decline after only 1.5 months it says something about this game.. obviously not everyones guild is dropping out and I'm sure some are growing nicely.

I play with a large group of friend and guild mates on ToR, we happened to be discussing the forums the other night on out Vent channel and almost all of us don't post on the offical forums, main reasons seem to be that the time we do get free we try to spend it playing.

Originally posted by sanosukex

Originally posted by Starpower

Originally posted by Eliandal

Originally posted by BilboDoggins

All I have to do to see this game is rapidly declining is look at my guild where we have 110 members and in the last 20 days only about 30 have logged in. Of those 30 maybe 10 play daily.

I have played many mnay MMO's and SWTOR is just lacking to many damned features, has to mnay bugs, and a boring and poorly designed endgame. I'm not telling anyone they have to dislike SWTOR but it's pretty obvious a TON of people feel the same way about it as me. Outside of the story this game has nothing new or better to offer and story offers little replayability unless you are an altaholic.

 

 

  Ooohh..I can play that game too....Two weeks ago, my guild only had a little overf 100 people on average logging in - but this weekend - we had over 200!

 

  What's your point again?

Well our guild has over 40 people on during prime time where as 3 weeks ago we were like 15 online at any given time.

Check it out. The guild is called "The Legion" On Red Eclipse EU server if anybody thinks I'm BS'ing

 

But I agree comments like these are absolutely pointless one way or another

they are pointless without proof but for me personally If all my friends drop out of a game and the guild I was in had a huge decline after only 1.5 months it says something about this game.. obviously not everyones guild is dropping out and I'm sure some are growing nicely.

Lol what do these people want for proof exactly? 30 page subscription reports and spreadsheets? Heck it wouldnt even matter if I had definitive proof because they would just claim it was fabricated and/or I'm trolling. Whats cute is that if someone provided the EXACT same type of info I did but it was the exact opposite these same people here would claim its legit and undeniable how SWTOR is growing (lol) and is the bestest game evar.

All I can do is give my first hand testimonial and report what I have seen which is a huge decline in our guild numbers from launch. LAUNCH being the key word here.

The guilds which are growing are the ones which are picking up people from other guilds which have had too many people leave so the remaining people find one which is more active.

If a guild had 15 people a few weeks ago now has 40 its only because they invited new people. The 70ish people who left our guild didnt join new guilds. They stopped logging in.

All I know is what I personally see during the game.  I see my guild of about 230ish characters with 100 or so actual players considering alts.  The guild has 50 or so characters that are active as in played within the past 10 days.  Of those characters, a fair share are alts considering my knowledge of the people playing and the levels of the chars.  From my calculations, around 50% of the guild with characters on average about level 35 have either quit, moved on to a different character/guild/server, or something else.  I could make an educated guess that 25% have quit based on these numbers and conversations over vent/in game chat.  This is after 1 1/2 months of play.  I do not consider this a good retention rate at all and does not bode well for the longevity of this game.

Originally posted by BilboDoggins

Originally posted by sanosukex

Originally posted by Starpower

Originally posted by Eliandal

Originally posted by BilboDoggins

All I have to do to see this game is rapidly declining is look at my guild where we have 110 members and in the last 20 days only about 30 have logged in. Of those 30 maybe 10 play daily.

I have played many mnay MMO's and SWTOR is just lacking to many damned features, has to mnay bugs, and a boring and poorly designed endgame. I'm not telling anyone they have to dislike SWTOR but it's pretty obvious a TON of people feel the same way about it as me. Outside of the story this game has nothing new or better to offer and story offers little replayability unless you are an altaholic.

 

 

  Ooohh..I can play that game too....Two weeks ago, my guild only had a little overf 100 people on average logging in - but this weekend - we had over 200!

 

  What's your point again?

Well our guild has over 40 people on during prime time where as 3 weeks ago we were like 15 online at any given time.

Check it out. The guild is called "The Legion" On Red Eclipse EU server if anybody thinks I'm BS'ing

 

But I agree comments like these are absolutely pointless one way or another

they are pointless without proof but for me personally If all my friends drop out of a game and the guild I was in had a huge decline after only 1.5 months it says something about this game.. obviously not everyones guild is dropping out and I'm sure some are growing nicely.

Lol what do these people want for proof exactly? 30 page subscription reports and spreadsheets? Heck it wouldnt even matter if I had definitive proof because they would just claim it was fabricated and/or I'm trolling. Whats cute is that if someone provided the EXACT same type of info I did but it was the exact opposite these same people here would claim its legit and undeniable how SWTOR is growing (lol) and is the bestest game evar.

All I can do is give my first hand testimonial and report what I have seen which is a huge decline in our guild numbers from launch. LAUNCH being the key word here.

The guilds which are growing are the ones which are picking up people from other guilds which have had too many people leave so the remaining people find one which is more active.

If a guild had 15 people a few weeks ago now has 40 its only because they invited new people. The 70ish people who left our guild didnt join new guilds. They stopped logging in.

 

 

i agree but people believe just becuase it doesn't happen in their guild people here are lying and have an obvious vendetta against this game or whatever they want to believe.. so far every single person I know who bought this game at launch has quit.. now,  luckily for bioware that "everybody" is only about 30 people but still doesn't say much for the game since the mix of people there was very diverse. I had friends who were brand new to MMOs and many long timers and the game couldn't hold any of them.

OP, don't be ignorant. Look at the Official forums of any game, WoW, EQ2, AoC, CoH, etc. All of them will make you think the games are horrible. Hell, you come here and read the forums and it makes you never want to play MMO's again. I stopped reading the official forums of any games. I only come here to see what game is on the hater list. It was SWTOR for a bit, now it seems to be switching over to TERA.

Here is a bit of advice if you ever want to enjoy a game without bias....DON'T READ OFFICIAL FORUMS.

There you go, it will make you MMO experiences so much better. I stopped reading WoW's forums about 2 years ago, and it made everything better.

Originally posted by dannydeuce

All I know is what I personally see during the game.  I see my guild of about 230ish characters with 100 or so actual players considering alts.  The guild has 50 or so characters that are active as in played within the past 10 days.  Of those characters, a fair share are alts considering my knowledge of the people playing and the levels of the chars.  From my calculations, around 50% of the guild with characters on average about level 35 have either quit, moved on to a different character/guild/server, or something else.  I could make an educated guess that 25% have quit based on these numbers and conversations over vent/in game chat.  This is after 1 1/2 months of play.  I do not consider this a good retention rate at all and does not bode well for the longevity of this game.

Been in two guilds. Left because the on only had me and another player logging in and the other one had a decent amount logging in (low teens) but no one ever grouped together or even chatted much. Was rather pointless really. Not to mention I never saw the gm once so I gather him along with god knows how many others quit or rerolled elsewhere.

Anyways, to me what is really telling are simply the amount of players on planets and fleet. The numbers are simply dwindling down everywhere. Does that mean they're quitting completely? Not necessarily, could be rerolling ona more populated server.

But one thing is clear. I cannot talk for the game as a whole, but I can say my server is dying. Which considering it used to be one of the more populated ones really says something.

Frankly, I think their biggest fuckup is they simply released way too many servers for this game so I get the sense may are quitting out of frustration due to being unable to group or feeling the game is lifeless. This game isn't the best for grouping to begin with because of how people get spread out and thier weakass mechanics. Throw in the fact that some of these servers simply don't have the population to justify having a separate server then it only exacerbates the issue.

It doesn't help when you have dickweeds that constantly dismiss these issues going around saying everything is fine everywhere and constantly downplaying those having these issues. Frankly, anymore I find them as much to blame for these games having retention issues and dragging their feet on fixing things as I do the companies. They're so goddamn stubborn they just muddy the waters, giving false info to new players, and false bravado to the company so some issues take way longer to be assessed and evaluated properly. They cause way more damage to these games than the haters they despise so much.

The irony is most times once their rose colored glasses fall off they either slink away without a word or become one of the bigger complainers on forums about the status of the game and its condition. Never fails...

Originally posted by dannydeuce

All I know is what I personally see during the game.  I see my guild of about 230ish characters with 100 or so actual players considering alts.  The guild has 50 or so characters that are active as in played within the past 10 days.  Of those characters, a fair share are alts considering my knowledge of the people playing and the levels of the chars.  From my calculations, around 50% of the guild with characters on average about level 35 have either quit, moved on to a different character/guild/server, or something else.  I could make an educated guess that 25% have quit based on these numbers and conversations over vent/in game chat.  This is after 1 1/2 months of play.  I do not consider this a good retention rate at all and does not bode well for the longevity of this game.

Theres more factors to consider, such as quality of the guild/leadership.  eople could have just rolled new toons elsewhere.

But 75% retention would be fairly good, I dont think Rift was that high after 6 weeks.  I also dont think SWTOR is that high.

I know people enjoy rubbing peoples face in their wrong predictions, so I'll give you some ammo for the near future.

This game will level off at about 300k subs.

Originally posted by teakbois

Originally posted by dannydeuce

All I know is what I personally see during the game.  I see my guild of about 230ish characters with 100 or so actual players considering alts.  The guild has 50 or so characters that are active as in played within the past 10 days.  Of those characters, a fair share are alts considering my knowledge of the people playing and the levels of the chars.  From my calculations, around 50% of the guild with characters on average about level 35 have either quit, moved on to a different character/guild/server, or something else.  I could make an educated guess that 25% have quit based on these numbers and conversations over vent/in game chat.  This is after 1 1/2 months of play.  I do not consider this a good retention rate at all and does not bode well for the longevity of this game.

Theres more factors to consider, such as quality of the guild/leadership.  eople could have just rolled new toons elsewhere.

 

But 75% retention would be fairly good, I dont think Rift was that high after 6 weeks.  I also dont think SWTOR is that high.

If I were to guess I would say this is likely due to the whole class tree system. A lot of people (myself included) like to try out multiple classes to find out which one they like best in a new MMORPG. Unfortunately SWTOR's tree system means you dont even get to begin trying a new class until you're level 10. You dont get a good grasp of how the class differs from it's opposing branch until level 20~ish. Then you really dont know if you want to stick with the differences until 30-ish.

Those forums were so giddy about December 21st arriving and getting rid of the disgruntled forum posters who obviously weren't going to subscribe.  Things actually got a little better at first but have gone steadily downhill since.

Originally posted by FrodoFragins

Those forums were so giddy about December 21st arriving and getting rid of the disgruntled forum posters who obviously weren't going to subscribe.  Things actually got a little better at first but have gone steadily downhill since.

Eh, they always do that. They somehow think the forums are magically going to change and all the issues will suddenly disappear. Because clearly the only ones with issues, problem, or are unhappy about things must be people that aren't going to sub anyways.

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Originally posted by dannydeuce

All I know is what I personally see during the game.  I see my guild of about 230ish characters with 100 or so actual players considering alts.  The guild has 50 or so characters that are active as in played within the past 10 days.  Of those characters, a fair share are alts considering my knowledge of the people playing and the levels of the chars.  From my calculations, around 50% of the guild with characters on average about level 35 have either quit, moved on to a different character/guild/server, or something else.  I could make an educated guess that 25% have quit based on these numbers and conversations over vent/in game chat.  This is after 1 1/2 months of play.  I do not consider this a good retention rate at all and does not bode well for the longevity of this game.

Been in two guilds. Left because the on only had me and another player logging in and the other one had a decent amount logging in (low teens) but no one ever grouped together or even chatted much. Was rather pointless really. Not to mention I never saw the gm once so I gather him along with god knows how many others quit or rerolled elsewhere.

Anyways, to me what is really telling are simply the amount of players on planets and fleet. The numbers are simply dwindling down everywhere. Does that mean they're quitting completely? Not necessarily, could be rerolling ona more populated server.

But one thing is clear. I cannot talk for the game as a whole, but I can say my server is dying. Which considering it used to be one of the more populated ones really says something.

Frankly, I think their biggest fuckup is they simply released way too many servers for this game so I get the sense may are quitting out of frustration due to being unable to group or feeling the game is lifeless. This game isn't the best for grouping to begin with because of how people get spread out and thier weakass mechanics. Throw in the fact that some of these servers simply don't have the population to justify having a separate server then it only exacerbates the issue.

It doesn't help when you have dickweeds that constantly dismiss these issues going around saying everything is fine everywhere and constantly downplaying those having these issues. Frankly, anymore I find them as much to blame for these games having retention issues and dragging their feet on fixing things as I do the companies. They're so goddamn stubborn they just muddy the waters, giving false info to new players, and false bravado to the company so some issues take way longer to be assessed and evaluated properly. They cause way more damage to these games than the haters they despise so much.

The irony is most times once their rose colored glasses fall off they either slink away without a word or become one of the bigger complainers on forums about the status of the game and its condition. Never fails...

+1 good post

The funniest thing in all of this is that on average the people saying the game is dead and guild is dying are rpublic players, while the everything is fine pop is great! crew is often Empire...

On my server i made an empire just too see how bad it is or if people are over reacting, on rep fleet 34 people on, Empire fleet 207 haha. So ya in these arguments people really need to say what side of the fense you are on cause it makes a huge difference in how you see the game.

edit: just wanted to throw in a p.s that these numbers were taken during est prime time. Cause I know people will demand that info lol

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Originally posted by dannydeuce

All I know is what I personally see during the game.  I see my guild of about 230ish characters with 100 or so actual players considering alts.  The guild has 50 or so characters that are active as in played within the past 10 days.  Of those characters, a fair share are alts considering my knowledge of the people playing and the levels of the chars.  From my calculations, around 50% of the guild with characters on average about level 35 have either quit, moved on to a different character/guild/server, or something else.  I could make an educated guess that 25% have quit based on these numbers and conversations over vent/in game chat.  This is after 1 1/2 months of play.  I do not consider this a good retention rate at all and does not bode well for the longevity of this game.

Been in two guilds. Left because the on only had me and another player logging in and the other one had a decent amount logging in (low teens) but no one ever grouped together or even chatted much. Was rather pointless really. Not to mention I never saw the gm once so I gather him along with god knows how many others quit or rerolled elsewhere.

Anyways, to me what is really telling are simply the amount of players on planets and fleet. The numbers are simply dwindling down everywhere. Does that mean they're quitting completely? Not necessarily, could be rerolling ona more populated server.

But one thing is clear. I cannot talk for the game as a whole, but I can say my server is dying. Which considering it used to be one of the more populated ones really says something.

Frankly, I think their biggest fuckup is they simply released way too many servers for this game so I get the sense may are quitting out of frustration due to being unable to group or feeling the game is lifeless. This game isn't the best for grouping to begin with because of how people get spread out and thier weakass mechanics. Throw in the fact that some of these servers simply don't have the population to justify having a separate server then it only exacerbates the issue.

It doesn't help when you have dickweeds that constantly dismiss these issues going around saying everything is fine everywhere and constantly downplaying those having these issues. Frankly, anymore I find them as much to blame for these games having retention issues and dragging their feet on fixing things as I do the companies. They're so goddamn stubborn they just muddy the waters, giving false info to new players, and false bravado to the company so some issues take way longer to be assessed and evaluated properly. They cause way more damage to these games than the haters they despise so much.

The irony is most times once their rose colored glasses fall off they either slink away without a word or become one of the bigger complainers on forums about the status of the game and its condition. Never fails...

Sounds to me you base your entire argument on you being bad at chosing guilds. First step to remedy that is not to accept random invites

I could be the author of your post 5 years ago on WoWs main forums, back when I made some poor choices joining guilds going nowhere myself

Calling people dickweeds doesn't do much to help your case either. Your a posterboy for poor judgement both ingame and outside of it

Sounds to me you base your entire argument on you being bad at chosing guilds. First step to remidy that is not to accept random invites

Not only did you clearly not read the majority of my post, but you also pretty much proved one of my points. Doubt you even realize it.

Thank you :)

I actually thought it would take a bit longer.

Far as what I said? If the shoe fits...

Plenty of other things you could say. Ignorant, self absorbed, etc. so what difference does it make? I mean why is it perfectly acceptable for them to equate people having problems with the game regardless the issue is somehow their incompetence or personal issue but to hold those accusers in the same light is somehow bad form?

Give me a break...

Least most of them are referring to their personal experience and not everyone as a whole. Unlike some others that make assumptions for everyone. You can chalk it up however you want and find a better word for it that you deem more 'pc' but doesn't change the type of person they come across as being least in relation to these discussions.

Originally posted by Starpower

 

Sounds to me you base your entire argument on you being bad at chosing guilds. First step to remedy that is not to accept random invites

 

I could be the author of your post 5 years ago on WoWs main forums, back when I made some poor choices joining guilds going nowhere myself

many people are playing in guilds are mostly their own friends.. not much you can do when all your friends ditch the game...

Originally posted by sanosukex

Originally posted by Starpower

 

Sounds to me you base your entire argument on you being bad at chosing guilds. First step to remedy that is not to accept random invites

 

I could be the author of your post 5 years ago on WoWs main forums, back when I made some poor choices joining guilds going nowhere myself

many people are playing in guilds are mostly their own friends.. not much you can do when all your friends ditch the game...

Most of my gaming friends started with EQ just like myself. They all long for tha era of gaming of open worlds, camp spots and fun world pvp with consequences. They all quit except 1. All that just shows me I'm part of a group of friends who wish it was 99 again

"Of course I will subb for at least a year...well at least until the 1st April
I think It is really obvious that Swtor is that tasty and great that I will swallow my game DVD."

"Couple of years probably"

"GW2,secret world,Tera and specially Diablo 3 is coming within next few month so not very long."

"Nothing has had more hype than TOR..."

"Have about 4 days left on my first month sub. 
Enjoyed leveling but its waaaaayyyy too linear to do over again.
Probly wont re-sub since all my family decided to quit."

"Would like to stay a long time, maybe it's my server, but the questing in silence and no one ever answering you is getting to me."

"A few more months, no single player RPG could hold me longer than that except those with mods like the elder scrolls games...no amount of online capabilities like this single player game will make a difference.

Yes, I called this a single player game with online capabilities cause that is what it is. To call this an MMORPG is a slap in the face to other MMORPGs. "

"I see myself in game at least through the 6 month mark and probably a lot longer than that. Currently I have a 3-month recurring sub, which ends in April I guess (launch +4 months since month 1 was free), and I will probably at least re-up another 3 monther. I don't have even a single character capped, and I definitely want to play all 8 character slots at least on my main server.

Once all 8 characters are 50, then we will see. But since it has taken me 2 months and I'm not even close to capping character #1 yet (in part due to alt-aholism), that's going to take at least until summer, and probably more like until this time next year. 

That's with the content they have right now. Assuming they put in tons of new content between now and 6-12 months from now, they'll keep me around even longer."

.....did read some answers.