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News & Features Discussion  » DOTA2: Blizzard Suing Valve Over Trademark

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254 posts found
  Newfr

Novice Member

Joined: 10/11/06
Posts: 126

2/11/12 7:16:03 AM#201

As far as i know Blizzard did exactly nothing about helping IceFrog or DotA community. And they were asked about it. Constantly. Like "why we have to share out money this some guys?" So now their claims that they care about community and game looks pathetic to me. Why the hell you care just now when big moneys involved? No, i'll never belive in that after they became super greedy Blizzard/Activision with that Kotick guy in charge.

While Valve hire successful mod-makers and publish their games. That happened with Team Fortress, Counter-Strike, Day of Defeat. And they going to publish DotA 2 now. And for that i respect Valve. They give to mod-makers what they rightfully deserve. And about Team Fortress. That was a very popular Quake mod at first, but Valve hired mod devs and made Team Fortress Classic. And ID software wasn't like "it's been used exclusively by ID and its fan community so you can't use Team Fortress name".

So I hope Valve will win this one.

  IceAge

Novice Member

Joined: 8/23/05
Posts: 997

2/11/12 7:55:10 AM#202

Originally posted by Newfr

As far as i know Blizzard did exactly nothing about helping IceFrog or DotA community. And they were asked about it. Constantly. Like "why we have to share out money this some guys?" So now their claims that they care about community and game looks pathetic to me. Why the hell you care just now when big moneys involved? No, i'll never belive in that after they became super greedy Blizzard/Activision with that Kotick guy in charge.



While Valve hire successful mod-makers and publish their games. That happened with Team Fortress, Counter-Strike, Day of Defeat. And they going to publish DotA 2 now. And for that i respect Valve. They give to mod-makers what they rightfully deserve. And about Team Fortress. That was a very popular Quake mod at first, but Valve hired mod devs and made Team Fortress Classic. And ID software wasn't like "it's been used exclusively by ID and its fan community so you can't use Team Fortress name".


So I hope Valve will win this one.



 


Yes, they never care! They never care to provide to IceFrog every tools he need. They never care to promote DOTA ! They never care to hold and promote championship's of DOTA! They never care to fund championship's ( and because of this, IceFrog won some big money ) ! They never care to re-configure their servers to hold more players to battle in DOTA over battle.net ! They never care about VALVE DOTA, when they announced it. They never care about the community now, when they are fighting to keep the DOTA name free of use.


Right..


Reporter: What's behind Blizzard success, and how do you make your gamers happy?
Blizzard Boss: Making gamers happy is not my concern, making money.. yes!

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 1995

2/11/12 8:08:08 AM#203
Originally posted by Loke666

That seems a bit odd, while dota was a mod it wasn´t really made by Blizzard.

They could possibly sue because the game more or less look like WC3 though but if you can sue for that we would see plenty of MMOs in trouble.

Meh, I never got this American idea hat you should sue people for as many things as possible (like spilling hot coffee in your own lap and crap), I hope Blizzard loses this one.

DOTA was a wonderfully made mod and the right to the name and mod specific things should be to Eul and  Guinsoo.

I would agree with this argument more if they were suing for money.  They basically just don't want the name DOTA trademarked.  My guess is that they are just doing this to make sure they can market their own DOTA product with DOTA in the name without paying valve royalties.  They aren't saying that valve can't use the name DOTA they are simply saying that they shouldn't be allowed to trademark that name.  This really isn't that big of a deal, and it happens in the movie business quite a bit over movie titles that are too similar to one another.  The one that pops up in my head is from the late 90s when the movie Scream was released after a movie called Screamers had been released, and the makers of Screamers tried to keep Scream from being released because of the similar name.  Blizzard isn't even going that far they just don't want it trademarked.

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 1995

2/11/12 8:10:52 AM#204
Originally posted by Ozmodan

Don't really see what a big deal this is, especially on this site over FPS game at that.  Problem with trademarks, they far too easy to get and way too expensive to fight.  I know one company was trying to sue anyone using "Scrolls" in their game name when it is obvious the legality of such is extremely weak.   

As to DOTA, they obviously did not do their homework when they named the game.  Really stupid if you ask me when it is so easy to search for such on the net.  Really does not matter if Blizzard has a right to the trademark or not,  The name was already taken.

Blizzard doesn't own the trademark on the name, nobody does.  That is what they are trying to prevent.  They don't seem to care if Valve uses DOTA in their title, but they don't want them to trademark it so that nobody else can use it either.

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 1995

2/11/12 8:13:07 AM#205
Originally posted by nilden
Originally posted by expresso

If Valve win no one can use the term DOTA in their game without the risk of getting sued by Valve.

If Blizzard win the term DOTA is free for any one to use in any context.

Who are the bad guys?

Wait so if Blizzard wins Valve can just call it DOTA 2 anyway since you said free for anyone to use in any context.

Or maybe Blizzard is saying they have the rights to DOTA trademark.

Seriously clue in people.

If you read it, Blizzard is not claiming that they have a traidmark.  They are not claiming that Valve can't use the name DOTA.  They are saying that they don't want Valve to be able to trademark the name DOTA.  If valve succeeds then nobody else could use the name DOTA without getting agreement from Valve.  This is what Blizzard is trying to prevent.

  moosecatlol

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/25/10
Posts: 1175

2/11/12 8:19:20 AM#206

Fun fact, DOTA is and never has been the IP of Blizzard. If anyone has the right to sue it'd Eul, I remember he was generally upset about Guinsoo stealing the map, though not so much at Icefrog, as Icefrog added the much needed balance, polish, and optimization.

 

Though AoS was way before the time of DotA and similar in concept, I'd still say that DotA earned its right to be unique through its structural complexity in comparison to Aeon of Strife.

 

All in all, seems like another scrolls BS stunt by Blizzard's legal team. At least I'd hope so, can't fathom thought of someone with intellectual capacity thinking that this was a good idea. Unless said person's take on a good idea was too open all the port holes to let more water in.

  Gravarg

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/24/06
Posts: 3140

2/11/12 9:11:01 AM#207



Originally posted by wormywyrm



I feel strongly that Blizzard is in the right to do this.  When players create maps using blizzards program and use blizzards bnet service to send them to other players and blizzards service to play with them for years and years on end under a EULA that clearly gives rights of user-created content to blizzard then blizzard should have exclusive rights to that content...  ESPECIALLY bad if another company tries to copyright the name that blizzard has been authorizing for years now on its services.  Thats just too far.  I think blizzard would have had a case to stop a rip off of its game (DOTA) from being released entirely, and at the least to stop someone from copyrighting the name.











 




Every game then would be owned by the makers of Oracle, Delphi, C++, DOS then...that doesn't make sense to me.



 


Next, Blizzard is going to sue Heroes of Newerth, League of Legends, and the million other MOBA games out there, since they're all basically the same game.

  Timacek

Novice Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 182

2/11/12 9:48:44 AM#208

Originally posted by Lambon

Blizzard is the bad guy here.




DOTA is Icefrogs adopted baby. He has been working very hard on it for MANY years.




Eul and Guinso left it in his hands and he has been doing an amazing job ever since. Valve is offering this man an opportunity to make money from all the hard work he has done, but Blizzard being the asinine greedlocks they are; continue to embarass themselves and the gaming industry as a whole. I can only wish that people see this company under the monopolizing shadow they cast. 





 


 


  Scalebane

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 2240

2/11/12 10:01:04 AM#209

wow so many morons here.

don't even bother trying to explain it people.   these posters hate blizzard so much they want to see everything they do as evil.

screw valve for trying to take a name that should stay free to the gaming community, i'll be boycotting all their products if they win this.

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."
- Lewis Thomas

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 1995

2/11/12 10:03:30 AM#210
Originally posted by Timacek

Originally posted by Lambon

Blizzard is the bad guy here.




DOTA is Icefrogs adopted baby. He has been working very hard on it for MANY years.




Eul and Guinso left it in his hands and he has been doing an amazing job ever since. Valve is offering this man an opportunity to make money from all the hard work he has done, but Blizzard being the asinine greedlocks they are; continue to embarass themselves and the gaming industry as a whole. I can only wish that people see this company under the monopolizing shadow they cast. 





 

 

This doesn't make any sense, since Blizzard isn't trying to trademark the name themselves.  They are simply trying to stop Valve from doing so.  If valve gets to trademark DOTA then nobody else can use it, thus monopolizing it.  They aren't even trying to stop valve from using the name themselves, they are simply trying to stop them from trademarking the name, which would prevent others, including Blizzard from being able to use the name.  

  Ozmodan

Elite Member

Joined: 2/27/07
Posts: 6669

2/11/12 10:46:10 AM#211
Originally posted by Timacek

Originally posted by Lambon

Blizzard is the bad guy here.


DOTA is Icefrogs adopted baby. He has been working very hard on it for MANY years.


Eul and Guinso left it in his hands and he has been doing an amazing job ever since. Valve is offering this man an opportunity to make money from all the hard work he has done, but Blizzard being the asinine greedlocks they are; continue to embarass themselves and the gaming industry as a whole. I can only wish that people see this company under the monopolizing shadow they cast. 

 

 

You just don't get it, do you?  All Blizzard is doing is saying it is not trademarkable, at least not by Valve. The only bad guy here is Valve trying to trademark something they have NO right to.

  Hycoo

Novice Member

Joined: 6/14/11
Posts: 208

2/11/12 11:01:04 AM#212

I understand Valve for wanting to trademark Dota. Here you have this game thats been developed by some freetime modder the last years. Anyone can decide to invest in the game and support it the way it deserves. Blizzard had so many years to do this, the community really wanted them to do it, but they never supported it. Instead Valve decides to invest in the game, using resources to build it up from a small community to giving it to the world under a whole new engine and team (lead by Icefrog) behind it. For instance having a 1 000 000 Euro price for first price in a Dota 2 tournament last august while it was in early beta just to showcase it (which was the biggest pricemoney in a e-sport tour ever at the time).


Now sponsors are flocking in on the game with money (founding Dota teams and tournaments), something that wasnt possible before Valve invested in the title. It has basicly given Dota a new start and the name is worth so much now because of Valve. If i was Valve i wouldn't want anyone to come by later and use the name DOTA to profit, when it doesnt have anything to do with Dota in the first place.



 

  RainBringer

Novice Member

Joined: 4/04/11
Posts: 163

Airstrikes - verb: to campaign against hikes in rocket and/or missile fuel prices.

2/11/12 11:03:03 AM#213

There are just too many tools in this thread who are running their mouth without knowing anything even remotely close to what Blizzard are planning here, some even speaking on the company's behalf like self entitled PR pricks. What are the odds many here dont even know what DotA stands for or have even seen the game map leave alone play it, but are commenting on it like they know every last detail down to the legality of the matter regarding trademark infringement?


 


Here is a simple example for all those simple minded people:


Think about the children's book series, Harry Potter. After its release, there has been a whole array of fanfiction centered on that storybook setting, even some fiction that do not use any of the notable JK Rowling characters and some that do not use any chracters or trademarked terms from the original stories at all.


Now in case someone wrote a fanfiction called "101-ways to cook chicken" using the storybook's setting but without using Any characters, terms, trademarked names, etc and then went on to publish Another book called "102-ways to cook chicken" BASED on the popularity of the previous fanfiction using a whole new setting, lore and characters that had nothing to do with Harry potter series. 


So now do you think JW Rowling has the rights to sue this guy for "stealing" something he created using a storyline that was involved with her books at one point but who's final content is nothing similar to the books she wrote? Think and think again before answering. The guy who wrote the fanfiction here is IceFrog, the new publishers for his book are Valve and the JK Rowling who is trying to monopolize anything that it can touch is Blizzard here.


 


The fact is DotA was never a RTS game that War3 was, the game that Blizzard created or intended to make and own. It never had any features that is associated with any RTS game, ie army control, resources generation and management, kill objectives or quest plots, etc. The only thing that even remotely attaches it to War3 is that DotA was a whole new kind of game made using that editor, something that Blizzard played absolutely NO role in. Now they want to claim this title for "Themselves" because they will sooner or later publish a Blizzard-Dota and trademark that name for themselves and the momentum it will gather among gamers with that name alone. Anyone who think Blizzard will not monopolize the DotA trademark is either lying to themselves or are fools. They are the good guys here? That joke isnt even remotely funny, they just want to make money even if its at IceFrog's, Eul's or Valve's expense (not Guinsoo because he played the wise businessman card and made his own game from the DotA concept to earn him those dollars that Blizzard cant get its grubby paws on. ie LoL).


 


So whats next, Blizzard is going to trademark all the popular War3 usermade maps? LOAP,  arena champions, The black road, 3-corris, Defiance, Resident evil themed survival maps, Vampirism and everything else? Maybe not yet since it wont get them enough money, but when it gets popular enough they might just claim it to be their own creation, name and all.


Gullible are the fanboys; How blind is their sight!

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 1995

2/11/12 11:10:18 AM#214
Originally posted by RainBringer

There are just too many tools in this thread who are running their mouth without knowing anything even remotely close to what Blizzard are planning here, some even speaking on the company's behalf like self entitled PR pricks. What are the odds many here dont even know what DotA stands for or have even seen the game map leave alone play it, but are commenting on it like they know every last detail down to the legality of the matter regarding trademark infringement?


 


Here is a simple example for all those simple minded people:


Think about the children's book series, Harry Potter. After its release, there has been a whole array of fanfiction centered on that storybook setting, even some fiction that do not use any of the notable JK Rowling characters and some that do not use any chracters or trademarked terms from the original stories at all.


Now in case someone wrote a fanfiction called "101-ways to cook chicken" using the storybook's setting but without using Any characters, terms, trademarked names, etc and then went on to publish Another book called "102-ways to cook chicken" BASED on the popularity of the previous fanfiction using a whole new setting, lore and characters that had nothing to do with Harry potter series. 


So now do you think JW Rowling has the rights to sue this guy for "stealing" something he created using a storyline that was involved with her books at one point but who's final content is nothing similar to the books she wrote? Think and think again before answering. The guy who wrote the fanfiction here is IceFrog, the new publishers for his book are Valve and the JK Rowling who is trying to monopolize anything that it can touch is Blizzard here.


 


The fact is DotA was never a RTS game that War3 was, the game that Blizzard created or intended to make and own. It never had any features that is associated with any RTS game, ie army control, resources generation and management, kill objectives or quest plots, etc. The only thing that even remotely attaches it to War3 is that DotA was a whole new kind of game made using that editor, something that Blizzard played absolutely NO role in. Now they want to claim this title for "Themselves" because they will sooner or later publish a Blizzard-Dota and trademark that name for themselves and the momentum it will gather among gamers with that name alone. Anyone who think Blizzard will not monopolize the DotA trademark is either lying to themselves or are fools. They are the good guys here? That joke isnt even remotely funny, they just want to make money even if its at IceFrog's, Eul's or Valve's expense (not Guinsoo because he played the wise businessman card and made his own game from the DotA concept to earn him those dollars that Blizzard cant get its grubby paws on. ie LoL).


 


So whats next, Blizzard is going to trademark all the popular War3 usermade maps? LOAP,  arena champions, The black road, 3-corris, Defiance, Resident evil themed survival maps, Vampirism and everything else? Maybe not yet since it wont get them enough money, but when it gets popular enough they might just claim it to be their own creation, name and all.

Don't accuse people of being tools, and then turn around and show that you don't understand what is actually going on.  Blizzard is not trying to trademark anything.  They are trying to keep valve from trademarking DOTA.  If valve successfully trademarks DOTA then nobody else will be able to use DOTA in their title.  Once again, Blizzard isn't trying to trademark DOTA if they wanted to do that, they could have done it 8 years ago, but they chose not to.  Now Valve wants to trademark DOTA and Blizzard is trying to stop them.

  illorion

Novice Member

Joined: 6/05/08
Posts: 476

2/11/12 11:13:22 AM#215

Blizzard snoozed when It came to copywriting the Name DOTA. Now Valve wants to use it for a game and Blizz is all up in arms about it... I say tough titty.

Blizz has no write to claim copywrite for the term DOTA. At one it point.. yes it was a mod for Warcraft 3. But now it simply refers to a genre of game. League of legends is a DOTA game. 

The is the same thing that happened when team fortress came out.. it was a great mod... however, instead of waiting 7 years to try to claim a copywrite valve copywrited the name right off the bat and made thier own updated version.

So Blizz need to STFU, they waited to long to say anything... now they should just sit their and accept the lesson... 

"Don't mistake a fun game for a good game... Checkers is fun to play but its not exactly the highest point of gaming design... and definatly not worth $60 plus $15 a month"

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 1995

2/11/12 11:22:30 AM#216
Originally posted by illorion

Blizzard snoozed when It came to copywriting the Name DOTA. Now Valve wants to use it for a game and Blizz is all up in arms about it... I say tough titty.

Blizz has no write to claim copywrite for the term DOTA. At one it point.. yes it was a mod for Warcraft 3. But now it simply refers to a genre of game. League of legends is a DOTA game. 

The is the same thing that happened when team fortress came out.. it was a great mod... however, instead of waiting 7 years to try to claim a copywrite valve copywrited the name right off the bat and made thier own updated version.

So Blizz need to STFU, they waited to long to say anything... now they should just sit their and accept the lesson... 

They are not claiming copyrite, they don't want anyone to copyrite it.

  Scalebane

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 2240

2/11/12 12:42:56 PM#217
Originally posted by illorion

Blizzard snoozed when It came to copywriting the Name DOTA. Now Valve wants to use it for a game and Blizz is all up in arms about it... I say tough titty.

Blizz has no write to claim copywrite for the term DOTA. At one it point.. yes it was a mod for Warcraft 3. But now it simply refers to a genre of game. League of legends is a DOTA game. 

The is the same thing that happened when team fortress came out.. it was a great mod... however, instead of waiting 7 years to try to claim a copywrite valve copywrited the name right off the bat and made thier own updated version.

So Blizz need to STFU, they waited to long to say anything... now they should just sit their and accept the lesson... 

why would blizz need to stfu, they want the DOTA name to be free for the mod community to use.  valve wants to be greedy and take it away.  valve does not need to screw the mod community over by taking it away from those that created it, yes they have that one guy working for them but there were plenty of others helping make DOTA possible and they want it to stay open for everyone, too bad that guy that went to work for valve became greedy.

"The great thing about human language is that it prevents us from sticking to the matter at hand."
- Lewis Thomas

  Hycoo

Novice Member

Joined: 6/14/11
Posts: 208

2/11/12 1:34:34 PM#218



Originally posted by Scalebane






Originally posted by illoriontheir and accept the lesson... 



why would blizz need to stfu, they want the DOTA name to be free for the mod community to use.  valve wants to be greedy and take it away.  valve does not need to screw the mod community over by taking it away from those that created it, yes they have that one guy working for them but there were plenty of others helping make DOTA possible and they want it to stay open for everyone, too bad that guy that went to work for valve became greedy.







 




You obviously dont know the dota community. Valve decided to help the dota/mod community to develope dota into a standalone game. Now Valve is the mod community. You won't see any other Dota game come out, that is Dota. You can call it Dota (like Blizzard calling it's game Dota), but it doesnt have anything to do with the original Dota, it's modders or community to do. (Except for being a moba like Dota is).





 

  Otomox

Novice Member

Joined: 6/12/07
Posts: 312

2/11/12 4:06:29 PM#219

Gabe lets go smash them back in the right place.


  Kost

Newshound

Joined: 1/15/10
Posts: 1993

In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro.

2/11/12 5:15:59 PM#220

Bottom Line: Valve should have known better.


Lesson learned.


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